government functions. division has a name that you probably heard at this point. project 2025, and they are detailed in a monstrous 900 page book title mandate for leadership, a conservative promise. it was published by the conservative heritage foundation. christianity would be at the center of u.s. government and society by turning a biblical worldview into federal law. a national abortion ban could also be enforced by restating the comstock act to eliminate access, track, and eliminate medication for abortion. it would be harsher than ever before and executive authority would be used deport as many people as possible by expanding a deportation process called expedited removal to cover the entire country. don't forget a plan to overhaul the doj and re-created in trump's image. tens of thousands to be written placed in an effort to do away with what he has dubbed, the deep state. in fact, steve bannon echoed that very part of the plan at this week's far right turning point usa conference just this weekend yesterday. >> we are also going to start the pick and shovel work to take apart the administrative state, the praetorian guard, the deep state where the use the rule of law to come after you and hold you accountable. november 5th is judgment day. january 2025 is accountability day. >> you would think this dangerous of a plan, as big of a threat to our democracy, would have democrats shouting from the rooftops, warning americans of its very real implications. but there hasn't been much of a coordinated action plan to prevent the agenda from taking hold until now. this week, house democrats launched a task force. it is being led by democratic congressman jared hoffman and includes about half a dozen lawmakers. he said, quote, we need to see it coming well in advance and compare ourselves accordingly. one could argue we are on the verge of too late here. we have known about the full scope of project 2025 since way back in april of last year. but better late than never, right? according to the associated press, this is what we know about the plan so far. hold a forum on capitol hill and inform voters about its dangerous ideas and policy proposals. so democrats say they are getting on the offensive and stepping up to the plate to fight this unprecedented far right playbook. but we are halfway through june, less than five months away from the election, that will determine whether project 2025 sees the light of day. we know the architects. peter navarro, ben carson are serious about getting mr. kony and plan off the ground. the question is, are democrat serious enough about stopping it? judy hsu of california is a member of the congressional task force to counter project 2025. thank you so much for making time. what motivated you and some of your colleagues to start this task force now? >> i think now is the first perfect time to do this task force. they are people in the united states that are not focused on the presidential election. they are only now thinking about biden versus trump, and what we want to do is to make sure that people know what the united states would look like if donald trump were in fact elected as president. project 2025 leaves nothing to the imagination as far as what this road map would be like. he would see supreme power. he would greatly expand and centralize his power, he would reduce the oversight of congress. there would be no balance. he would immediately fire 50,000 federal civilian employees, and replace them with applicants who have to pass a test of loyalty to trump to ensure that christian nationalism is embedded in every federal agency. and then he would eliminate the wall between him and the department of justice so that he could use them for legal retribution against whomever trump decides to investigate. >> i wanted to talk about some concrete actions here. there's been talk of forums and forming the voters out of election day, trying to break federal lawmakers. what will that look like in real terms? is this fighting fire with fire? is this what project 2025 supporters are trying to do? >> yes. it is a very long document. 900 pages. there's quite a bit of detail on what they would do with every federal department. we need to break it down, and be able to educate our colleagues, for one thing, but also everybody across the united states as to what they want to do. and we -- we are at the perfect time to do this, when people are getting now to the realization that, yeah, it could be a trump america. and if so, then we would see reproductive rights, lgbt rights removed. we would see a rescinding of all actions on climate change. we would see a deportation of so many, and elimination of the department of education as well as a replacing of secular public education with christian education in schools. we would see un-american that we never could've imagined under trump and we need to raise the alarm bells. >> congresswoman, is there anything that can be done legislatively to prevent some of the project 2025 policy these are could have been done the last couple of years? i know it only came to light about a year ago, and certainly, republicans control the house. but other enough republicans now to get on board with some of these issues that could have shored up our democracy in the last year or so before the election? >> well, we just went through the national defense authorization act. it was voted on this past week, and many of these kind of culture war amendments were similar to this. similar to what is in project 2025. and yet, all the republicans voted for them. it was alarming and it was sickening, actually. i hope that all of those will be stripped out when they go to a conference committee. but i don't have much hope for republicans actually standing up to donald trump and this project 2025. >> how about just standing up to do the right thing, even if that wasn't something to do with donald trump? congresswoman judy hsu of california. thank you so much. >> thank you. >> i want to bring into the conversation my panel now. democratic strategist and former obama campaign adviser, msnbc political analyst, and james mcdonald, distinguished professor at princeton university. jared hoffman, the congressman leading it, that project 2025 would hit, quote, like a blitzkrieg. do you think the approach they are taking is enough to fight this opposing blitzkrieg on our country? >> it is a rightful and much- needed approach, but there also needs to be more understanding by the american product public. i know that we talked about it on the show before and we saw a few others carry it as well. however, the majority of voters don't know what that is. i think there has to be a lot more concerned around outcomes of what project 2025 could look like, but also full-scale approaches at this point. equity base groups, obviously congressional hearings. but paying attention to what this could mean for the erosion our democracy as we know it. because we talked about trump fashioning himself out dictators. we talked about trump taking cues from mein kampf. this is a radical and very quite frankly upsetting move that the republicans want to take america down with the full support of former president trump, with a written copy from the heritage foundation which has already passed along a lot of what they passed around this country to restrict rights and access. this is then going full-scale and eroding our democracy. >> i may have just lost our connection. we are trying to get that back. professor, your thoughts as well? part of this effort from democrats was to inform voters. it is safe to say -- i certainly believe that, we think the voters are not aware project 2025 in the alarming way that they should be. the congresswoman says we are still a few months out and they want to do their best to raise awareness. if they do become more aware, how much more of an influence will they have? will people to get seriously? >> i hope they will. i it's important for us to understand the scope and nature of the threat to american democracy. donald trump had no ideological core. but what we see with project 2025 is a kind of ideological coherence and attempt to generate some kind of consensus across the republican party with how they would govern. this is not something new. we saw the mandate for leadership in 1979 and how it guided the reagan revolution in this regard. we need to understand its implications for the way in which he will govern, and also for us understanding that it's not just donald trump. it's the republican party at south. >> in previous attempts, those were ideological policy platforms, if you will. this is a fundamental remaking of america. what do you think the democrats strategy should be when it comes to this moment? i feel like over the last three years -- this is not to be critical of democrats -- and opportunities they could've had to shore up parts of our democracy, they weren't able to do that. heart of that objection is from republicans in the senate as well, but not enough done in the last four years to shore up our democracy. >> i am going to take this moment to be critical of democrats, because i feel this happens every four years. this is more than just donald trump. this is republican led state legislatures. this is republican attorney generals. we have to be very serious about our democracy being at stake and what that means, because they will not just stop at donald trump. donald trump loses in november, they will still push forward and look for their next viewer to make it happen. i think that we have to be very attentive to that and democrats have to not only focus on the four-year presidential. they have to focus on what's happening in the states as well, because republicans are eyeing erosion of democracy and authoritarian regimes and they been doing it for some time. they did come up with the document overnight for the trump presidency. this is something they have been working on for decades, and i think at this point, we have to take it seriously and the democratic party has to take it seriously. not just of the federal level, but also in states across the country. >> if we thought we were dodging a bullet by not electing donald trump in 2020, we now sees coming back with a vengeance and we are seeing the extreme right in this country using him as a vehicle to really transform this country. if it's not with him, they will find somebody else to do it, right? >> absolutely. remember, we want to understand the nature of this public particular threat at the foundations of our democracy. but wiggin was rightly characterized in the 1970s as somebody would bring about world war iii. his economic facility was considered voodoo economics. and remember, he change the fundamental foundation of american political life. jane the very framework of our politics for 50 years. so this is not simply a one-off gesture just to support donald trump's presidency. this is an attempt to change the very framework of the game. let me say this. it's not enough to heighten fears. the democrats have to put forward a positive agenda. not just simply a critique of project 2025, but what is their vision for 2025? are we going to simply regurgitate the new deal? what is the democratic party's counter to this 900 page document aimed at undermining democracy? you have to do both, it seems to me. >> such an important point to offer a vision. please stick around. we have a lot more to discuss with you. tomorrow, dr. anthony fauci will sit down with my colleague, rachel maddow. he will discuss new details about working in the trump white house and what it for faculty to remain any number one to many republicans. be sure to watch the rate up maddow show tomorrow right here on msnbc. after the break, we have to talk about trump's wild pitch at a church in detroit, and the crowd in attendance. crowd in a. with breztri, things changed for me. breztri gave me better breathing. starting within 5 minutes, i noticed my lung function improved. it helped improve my symptoms, and breztri was even proven to reduce flare-ups, including those that could send me to the hospital. so now i look forward to more good days. breztri won't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. it is not for asthma. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. don't take breztri more than prescribed. breztri may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. can't afford your medication? 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x marks the spot. now you can add the new xfinity streamsaver™ that includes netflix, peacock, and apple tv+. that's xfinity streamsaver™ for just $15 a month. all your favorites. all in one place. only from xfinity. for more watching and less spending... x marks the spot. do it all on the network made for streaming, and bring on the good stuff. >> look, the crime is most rampant right here in african- american communities, and more people see me and they say, sir, we want protection. we don't want to get robbed and mugged and beat up or killed because we want to walk across the street to buy a loaf of bread. but the black population wants law enforcement or than any other population. >> donald trump actually said that yesterday at a black church in detroit. most people who showed up to the event were actually not black. that's probably why the ex- president's depiction of black communities as dangerous and crime-ridden prompted cheers from the audience. critics are now accusing trump a filling a historically black church with white supporters and even staging the event to show a robust crowd. false claims of rampant crime rates is no surprise and not rooted in reality. in fact, new fbi statistics point to a historic drop in crime in the first quarter of this year. community leaders are now calling out trump about how transparent his intentions are. detroit pastor james perkins said, quote, the reality is, he doesn't care. every time trump opens his mouth to talk to black folks, he demonizes us and makes empty promises he will never keep. amisha and eddie are back. professor, i will start with you and trump's approach to yesterday's event in detroit. the points he is making in an attempt to do what he describes as connecting with black voters and appealing to black voters in these, what i would argue, racist tropes. >> what is so fascinating is that you know he is gas lighting us. you know he doesn't really believe or care, believe in or care about black communities. there was something strikingly familiar about his rhetoric. you know, there is this appeal in black communities for safety. we saw it in the call for law and order in the '80s and '90s. out of the mouth of eric adams, the mayor of new york. there is a sense in which this appeal, to save people, he comes the justification for coney and laws that have devastated our community. james forman jr., a professor of law at yale university, wrote a book in 2017 entitled, locking up our own. where our desire for safety initially led us to embrace policy. so what trump is doing in a very clumsy way is trying to appeal to that very sensibility. but he can't do it in an effective way, because he doesn't really believe it. he doesn't really have any concern for the black community. i also want us to understand the nature of the appeal, as i hear the same thing coming out of eric adams mouth. >> what you think the strategy behind this event was? do you think they thought it would work the same way trump trying to sell sneakers or selling his mug shot on a teacher would appeal to black voters because he tries to project that, you know, they like that kind of stuff? >> i don't think trump is worried about this rocking. quite frankly, donald trump sees avenues where he doesn't need the black vote to even be competitive. we are watching him push and have these conversations where he has gotten people in, the overwhelming majority not being black. where white people are the predominant -- the predominant people there. we are also watching him attack black people at every corner, whether it is agreeing with comments and stating himself negative things about graduates, wanting to reduce funding for black owns all businesses, wanting to ensure that there are more and heavier crime tax six that were visible those what we fought against just a few years ago in terms of use of excessive force. this is not someone who stands by and wants to protect black people and wants to see black access and communities. he is also doing all of these things, meanwhile, and in the same time supporting turning point usa, where he was today, where we have a valid white supremacist nick went has speaking. were you have guys like charlie kirk, who lead that organization, who said the black people are smaller planes. it was argued that we do not need to be doctors, because of black people become doctors, people die. this is a guy who is a known racist and whose propagated racism and policy after policy. it does not compute. donald trump doesn't care about black people. what he cares about is running the media in circles, and he does that well. >> he certainly does. let me play for you both this moment during trump's remarks yesterday. watch. >> your biggest threat are the illegals. we have threats as to security because so many of them come from prisons and jails, from mental institutions, and even insane asylum's. the first community -- this is open knowledge that is being very effective is the black community, because they are taking your jobs. >> professor, it's a classic divide and conquer. what you make of this apparent attempt to pin black supporters against immigrants? >> well, i can't say what i really feel. it angers me, but it is an appeal to kind of nativist impulses within black community. it will appeal to this idea that the country has failed to actually live up to its promise in relation to black folk, and now it's putting its thumb on the scale for immigrant populations. so it's actually an appeal to the ugly underbelly of communities. we have to understand that that may have some traction for some people. but in the end, it reveals, to my mind, the ugliness that drives trump's campaigns. he is always appealing to people's lesser angels. and in this case, he's doing it in black communities as we struggle with our own economic issues. it is just his playbook, and it's disgusting, and it reveals h