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pretty ridiculous. >> harris: if they had written about the crisis of the southern border, if she was going to jump on a plane and go where something was on fire. separate fact from fiction, go ahead. >> gerri: right, and you quoted curriculum correctly on this idea of slaves getting skills during that period they used later. that is in the curriculum, it is more than that. i didn't read all 260 pages of this, i did read some and give example of what is more even-handed. entire module entitled resiliency and contributions of african american from the colonial era to the westward expansion. there is more going on here. we have to tell the story from various points of view. if you study history, you know it is complicated and nuanced and have to tell everybody's point of view and make it clear
after that decision came out, in 303 creative, and the supreme court, i predicted we would see a number of different challenges across jurisdictions, because the way the ruling was issued was very vague and technically, harry and nuanced. and as far as i am concerned, reading that, and making the comparison is apples to automobiles. you are talking about someone who is a state employee. she is a government employee. so, she is not a -- >> she is not a web designer. >> -- correct, like the web designer. number one, that's important to understand. so, the laws that govern that there are very, very different. and then you are also talking about a first amendment analysis in a 303 case versus a state law in texas that you are trying to apply, to basically expand out far beyond anything the united states supreme court actually said. so, in terms of the pathway that she has legally to get where she wants to go, 303 creative does not apply in those cases are not relevant in that way. in terms of principle, even
filing. she clearly sees an opportunity based on the ruling in dobbs. >> sure. >> is she right to see an opportunity? >> she's not right, but she is not surprising in this way. after that decision came out, in 303 creative, and the supreme court, i predicted we would see a number of different challenges across jurisdictions, because the way the ruling was issued was very vague and technically, harry and nuanced. and as far as i am concerned, reading that, and making the comparison is apples to automobiles. you are talking about someone who is a state employee. she is a government employee. so, she is not a -- >> she is not a web designer. >> -- correct, like the web designer. number one, that's important to understand. so, the laws that govern that there are very, very different. and then you are also talking
proposed by china. it is more nuanced... proposed by china. it is more nuanced- - -— proposed by china. it is more nuanced... ., ., ,, ., nuanced... india has abstain five times from _ nuanced... india has abstain five times from condemning - nuanced... india has abstain five times from condemning the - nuanced... india has abstain five - times from condemning the invasion of ukraine at the un. his host, this week, president macron, has been very critical of countries sitting on the fence. accusing them of complicity in russia's new imperialism. d—link is going to work on prime mr modi while he is set in paris? i on prime mr modi while he is set in pafis? ~ on prime mr modi while he is set in paris? ~ . . on prime mr modi while he is set in paris? ~ ., . ., , on prime mr modi while he is set in paris? ~' ., . ., , ., , paris? i think france, as well as other european _ paris? i think france, as well as other european countries, - paris? i think france, as well as other european countries, has l other european countries, has certainly been bringing up ukraine with new delhi, and this issue will be mentioned again, i think. i do believe that india has been quite openin believe that india has been quite open in discussing its position with european politicians as well as policymakers, so, there is some form of understanding, but there is definitely a push to make sure that it aligns more with the west. i it aligns more with the west. i mean, the indians, in some way, are benefiting from this war. they have increased the imports of cheap russian oil, which of course, i'll price caps on the global sanctions.
charged. >> so to pick up on that point, sir, the president was asked about the recent spat of whatsapp text messages from 2017 between hunter biden and a chinese business associate of his. take a listen how the president responded a couple days ago. >> president biden, how involved were you in your son's chinese shakedown text message? were you sitting there? were you involved? were you involved? >> i -- >> were you? >> no. >> gillian: what do you make of that response? >> well, if i asked him if he was involved in a shakedown, i'm sure he would say no to me, too. but the reality is, the white house had earlier said that there was no communication, now that there's been an evidence of communication between hunter biden and president biden what they now are saying is a little more nuanced of i wasn't
horrific treatment throughout the years, this isn't exactly a demographic group who has been embraced throughout american history. what do you say to asian-american students and asian-american parents this morning who say, "okay, finally, my kids are going to get an equal chance and stop being minused, stop being zeroed out on the personality scores because of affirmative action"? >> so, joe, i think your comments are smart comments, and they point to how difficult and nuanced of a problem this is. because when you talk about college admissions, it is inherently a zero sum game. some students are admitted, other students are not admitted. the central question here is whether there's a legitimate interest that survives strict scrutiny in ensuring that black students are admitted, that the historic impacts of slavery and of discrimination don't continue into the modern era.
for 50 years was taken away. the notion people would rally the way they did around women's rights in that case, you could see the straight line. affirmative action has always been more complicated because it affects different groups differently, and the application of it is much more subtle and nuanced. there are groups who you would think would be allies who won't be on the politics for this. i'm curious whether this is another giant explosion in politics and will affect 2024, or rather, as i think, there's so much complexity around this issue, it's not likely to cut in as deeply and clearly as the abortion decision did. >> i think that the politics of this is it will cut deeply into black and brown voters. when you look at the decision, saying that we, in effect, are ending affirmative action, but not in military schools. you can go to the bunker but not the board room, someone wrote, through being educated properly.
understood it going back to 2003. to the extent there are schools not accused of discriminating like that, but do take into account race in a nuanced, wholistic, individualized, nonmechanic, nonquota-based way, i think there is some room there. again, going to largely depend on who is the court when that gets teed up. remember, they had been at this for quite a while. the group that filed this, by a conservative financier, has been at this for decades. this is his life's work to go after affirmative action. and they managed to get it at a point in time where the makeup of the court is particularly sympathetic to it. >> extraordinary. we have another voice to add to this conversation, joining us right now is lonnie chen, the stanford university director of domestic policy studies as well as a research fellow at the hoover institution. so highly regarded. really revered on the campus. your initial reaction to the ruling today, expected, shocked,
and there was pressure from an industry group for him to submit this new sub to a certification organization that would have put a bunch of regulations and limits on what he was doing, and he didn't want that. his line to me was, when you think outside of the box, people still inside the box think you're nuts. but it is a little more nuanced. i was really impressed by the safety protocol. i mean, look, stockton rush is a princeton trained aerospace engineer. he built and flew his own airplanes. he had built previous submersibles. the guy who signed on as a science adviser also died in the sub, one of the most dived titanic veterans in the world. he had captained five different titanic submersibles and he approved the structure. he wouldn't have gone on if there was something wrong with it.
this scheduling order is about security clearances and a reminder how sensitive the information in this case is. we have a graphic just reminding people the kind of information that could come up in a potential trial. and while this seems sort of nuanced and procedural, the fact of the matter is even these little scheduling orders, these little deadlines, these all add up over time, and the timing of this case, when this goes to trial has enormous consequences potentially for this entire country. >> certainly does. paula, where does this case fit in with the other legal challenges trump is facing? >> well, the former president certainly has a lot of legal jeopardy he's facing. first of all, we have this case incredibly serious national security, full prosecution on its way to a potential trial. but the same special counsel jack smith also investigating whether the former president or any of his allies were involved in the events leading up to january 6th and his efforts it to interfere with the election