taken from there in a straitjacket. >> his childhood with an abusive mother and troubled father. why did you feel differently about your father? >> i think because he -- he tried. >> this is "piers morgan tonight." good evening. it's been a long two years for michael jackson's family, but now with the conviction of dr. conrad murray on involuntary manslaughter, they're speaking out and they're angry about a documentary about michael's doctor. jermaine jackson is michael's older brother. jermaine, the family, understandably, pretty innocenced by the revelation that conrad murray has been cooperating with this documentary for several years now, apparently. tell me how you all feel. >> we're very angry. we're angry because dr. murray is a liar and he had his chance in court, he was tried by 12 jurors and they found him guilty. so anything he says is really irrelevant. he had his chance to stand up. he is a coward. he's a liar. he didn't stand up in court. plus, this had to be for money, because that's -- he must have been paid big to do this. >> there are lots of different reports. apparently, officially, he got paid $1 to do this. but apparently the networks have been asked to put up as much as a million dollars for the footage. so clearly the truth hasn't quite emerged yet about who's paid what. >> see, stuff like this, this is why i wrote the book. i wrote the book because i want people to remember michael, the human being, and not all the negative things about his death. but for conrad murray to -- i can't believe -- we're going to court, waiting for a verdict, he was doing a documentary. that is ridiculous. >> cynics will say, you know, who maybe are not massive fans of michael jackson, will say, come on, jermaine, you're doing a book about your brother. he's entitled to have his say. >> wait, wait, wait. >> what would you say to that? >> i can't believe they gave me stick for writing a book that's the truth and i stopped before the verdict. i stopped before the trial. i'm telling the truth about my brother. i'm defending my brother. what's coming out of conrad murray's mouth is lies. he had his chance in court. he should have stood up. he's a coward. he's a liar. and the fans shouldn't even worry about this because 12 jurors unanimously found him guilty. so whatever he says is irrelevant. we don't care. we want to move on and focus on the person, the beautiful person that michael was. that's why this book was written. >> the family has written to nbc, i believe, today demanding clarification of exactly how much money they paid for the documentary. if it turns out that conrad murray has made large sums of money or is intending to, what will the family do about this? >> who cares about the money? the money is not important. what's going to come out of his mouth is lies. the money is not important. what's going to come out of his mouth is lies. he had his chance. he had his chance in court, and he did not stand up. he is a coward, piers. he's a coward. he's a liar. we don't care. >> is there a part of you, jermaine -- obviously, we had this very emotional interview before about six weeks ago, when you didn't know how the trial was going to go. you feared the worst. you feared your brother's reputation would be smeared. i'm not sure the worst fears were realized, but certainly your conviction then that conrad murray had effectively caused death of your brother has been borne out by the verdict. >> i think conrad murray got what he deserved. i don't like the charge. if you ask me the question how do i feel after the verdict, i feel the same way before the verdict. i just -- because i feel that conrad murray is the finger to a bigger hand. and the fact that he did not care for my brother, he got what he deserved. but the charges should have been much greater. the charges were weak. i mean, you can go into a hospital and steal propofol and probably get more time than he got. >> should any network, nbc or anybody else, be airing this documentary? do you think? >> no. no, because here's a guy who's a liar. the jury, the system has found him guilty. why would they want to -- says a lot about the networks. this is msnbc. i'm sorry. this is trash. this is bull crap. it should not -- listen, i really don't want to give that much light to it because it's not important what he says. it's irrelevant. it's irrelevant. he's found guilty. 12 jurors unanimously found him guilty. >> is there a part of you, jermaine, or your family, curious to hear what he has to say that he didn't say in court? >> not at all. not at all. how do you order four gallons of propofol and say you're trying to wean my brother off of it? how do you say, well, maybe it was an accident. why didn't you call 911? so what's going to come out of his mouth? >> we asked nbc for comment they declined to comment about this many i would imagine they're considering, i guess, the reaction from the family. >> this is wrong. it's wrong. i really don't want to bring that much light to it because it's not what's important. what's important is that we celebrate michael's life and we remember the good things, the good things that he's contributed to the world. >> what sentence do you think he should get? obviously the maximum is four years. >> put it like this -- if they gave him all the time in the world, it's not going to bring my brother back. it's not. >> i want to play you a clip from the moment that he was convicted, because most the family were there. i want to see what you all were feeling in that moment. watch this. >> we, the jury in the above-entitled action, find the defendant, conrad robert murray, guilty of the crime of involuntary manslaughter. >> in that moment, what did you all feel? >> what i was feeling, i felt the same, because this is just a process we're going through. there's a lot of questions that the family had before this trial started, and we were hoping to get answers. there's still a lot of answers -- questions that needs to be answered. >> the key thing, jermaine, i think, if i can just throw something at you which i think is really, really fascinating that came out today, one of the jurors went public and said there were three reasons that they convicted him unanimously, as you said, all 12. one was his failure to call 911 immediately. second, his failure to have backup medical equipment. and thirdly for leaving the room. she said that the combination of these things almost certainly meant that michael died when he could have been saved. now that's a pretty dramatic thing for the jury to say. that's directly saying his actions killed michael. >> yes. so why are they interested in hearing what he has to say in a documentary? i'm just livid because i can't believe that while we were going home during the trial he was filming a documentary and it had to be for money. but to -- i think the jurors are right. they made the right decision. his negligence, his inability to take care of my brother. at the same time, he's the finger to a bigger hand. and there are lot of questions that we need answers to. >> there were two things that happened in the trial which i would imagine from the family's point of view were deeply distressing. one was the issuing of the photograph of michael after he died. how did you -- how did you react to that when you knew that was happening? >> i felt for my mother. i felt for my mother because to see your son dead on the bed, i thought it was crazy to even show these photos. what was he thinking to tape michael during the time when he was sedated and for people to think, well, he's an addict because of the way he's talking? michael was sedated. and still he's thinking about children, building a children's hospital, and for those who had questions whether he was this child molester, which is so ridiculous to think that, his intentions were to take care of children. >> you mentioned that the recordings -- i want to play a little bit of that recording because it was very shocking, i mean, to me, to his fans, to the family to hear michael like this. "my performances will be up there helping my children and always be my dream. i love them. i love them because i didn't have a childhood. i had no childhood. i feel their pain." >> piers, that's someone who's sedated. to play this, i don't know whether it was the prosecution's decision to play this, but what came out of this is to show his feelings for children. >> had you ever heard michael like that? >> never heard him like that. >> had any of the family ever -- >> never, ever, ever. >> i was so shocked when i heard this. >> never. what was his intention to tape this? >> what did you think? >> he was probably going to use it. >> why would anyone tape him like that? >> because he's a liar. he's a -- why? look at what he's done. >> well, jermaine, i wish you all the very best, you and your family. it's been an incredibly difficult few weeks for you. i'm glad you got some kind of justice even if you feel probably not enough. >> yes. thank you. >> thank you, jermaine. hollywood is buzzing tonight over the news that eddie murphy is dropping out as host of the oscars. murphy's buddy, producer brett ratner, quit under fire over his public use of an anti-gay slur over the weekend. the academy said he'll be replaced by brian grazer. i talked to him just a few days ago. you're doing the oscars. >> i'm producing the oscar, yes. >> and you're hosting the oscars. >> yes, yes. >> a recipe for comedic carnage. >> brian's a good friend and i said if you were producing the oscars, what would you do? and brian said, well, think about in the past, the best host, the three best hosts that have ever existed have been bob hope, johnny carson, and billy crystal. so basically he was saying to me, go get a comedian. >> i certainly agree. >> i happened to be looking at eddie murphy every day working. >> was ben -- >> no. this was after he wrapped the movie. ben's busy filming multiple movies. >> yeah, and also eddie is -- i mean, he is a brilliant stand-up comedian who hasn't done stand-up for 20-something years. and -- >> yes. >> a big job. >> one of the great comebacks of all time. >> right. we think it will be. >> i saw the interview he did with you. it was very funny, saying it's going to be the worst oscars ever. you know, sort of saying i'm going to urinate over everyone. well, members of the academy, i'm available. in fact, my schedule just cleared a bit because i can exclusively reveal that i'm leaving "america's got talent." i've been a judge six years and loved every single second. but i've discovered juggling to my surprise is a bit more difficult than i thought. so i'm going to focus on what will be a huge year at cnn with the upcoming election. i'd like to thank nbc, free mantle and my great friend simon cowell for giving me an amazing opportunity on that wonderful show. and i want to congratulate sharon, howie, and mick, who will doubtless be very relieved to learn they no longer have to work with me. coming up after the break, my white house interview with a member of the inner circle. what are the president's frustrations and what are his chances for being re-elected? daddy, come in the water! 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>> i think we are headed for a very close, hard-fought election, and the thing is i would have said the same thing to you about how close this election would be the week that bin laden was killed or we created 200,000 jobs a month as i would say now when we're having a tougher economic situation. it's a polarized country, we've been through some of the toughest times, so it's going to be a close election. but i'm confident the president will win. >> one thing extraordinary about the president is his demeanor. as all around is in chaos, the president has always maintained a confident and assured demeanor. does he know something we don't? or is he just quite cool under pressure? >> well, he is quite cool under pressure. it's one of the reasons he got elected, because when the financial system was on the verge of collapse late in the 2008 campaign, he demonstrated his capacity to deal with difficult issues with a clear, steady approach. i think that's benefited him as he's made some very tough decisions here in the white house, whether it's domestic decisions about taking the unpopular decision to stave auto industry, the decisionmaking he had to make the night he ordered the operation to get bin laden, the decisions about the iraq war, the afghanistan war, that's benefited him. and he has a great confidence in the american people's capacity to understand the challenges we have everyone the approach we need to do. more of the politics in the moment but what's in the long-term interests of the country. >> despite all that, you're still getting whacked around by the media and the public. there are protesters down the street at wall street and throughout america. there's a lot of dissatisfaction out there. how much can you blame on george bush? and how much do you guys have to take it on the chin for the actions you've taken? >> it's important to understand the mess this president inherited, to understand we didn't get into the mess overnight, we're not going to get out of it overnight. it's not just the financial crisis of 2008. it's been a decade-long economic crisis for the middle class. wages have stagnated, college has gotten more expensive, health care has gotten more expensive. the american people have been suffering for a long time. people need to understand what we inherited. they have to understand this president's plan to get us out of this. that's what he's articulating with this jobs act. and that's what this next campaign is going to be about. >> he seems disappointed he hasn't been able to do more in the first term. >> of course. they've been caught up in partnership, gridlock. he wishes there are more things we could be doing to help people get jobs and help middle class families. he wishes he could do those things. dealing with, you know, comprehensive immigration reform, things we've pushed for and he wants to do we haven't been able to get through, which is why it's important he get re-elected. there's more work to do. the project we started in 2008 isn't going to be over in four years. we have more work to do. >> president clinton has been out and about this week promoting his new book. he has a firm plan there to get america back to work. is it helpful to have a former democrat president who's so popular out there giving his version of having america back to work, or would you rather he kept it quiet a bit, say it privately to the president? >> he does it privately and publicly, and it's helpful in both cases. if you look at what's in president clinton's book, there is essentially 95% to 99% agreement with the agenda president obama is putting forward, whether it's putting construction workers back to work building schools, putting construction workers back to work making buildings more energy efficient, cutting tacks for the middle class. all those things president clinton and president obama agree with. i think it's helpful, although the press like to focus on the 1% to 5% difference between the presidents, the hangover of the 2008 campaign, i think it's helpful because it shows you have president clinton who presided over unprecedented prosperity in this country, creating 22 million jobs, president obama who's promising to put forth policies that president clinton did, uplifted the middle class, created a more fair economy p.m. i think it's helpful. >> do you think the election will almost certainly now be fought not just on the economy but specifically on jobs? do you think that if the job figures come down significantly between now and then your chances are dramatically higher of getting re-elected? and conversely, if they go up from where we are now, if they go much higher than, say, 9.5% or something, that you'd be in real trouble? >> well, they say the economy -- the better the economy is, the better it is for the income ben incumbent president. that's always been true. and it's jobs -- if the unemployment rate goes significantly down, that will be helpful to this president. if it goes up, obviously, that would be unhelpful. but politics is art, not science. i saw this article in "the new york times" magazine which put in an equation saying if gdp is this and the president's approval is this and the outcome will be "y." >> that was obama's toast. >> yes. >> where i come from, that isn't good. president clinton also made a point in his book saying if the american public genuinely believe, but one of the reasons why president obama has not been able to achieve more is because of the intransigence of the republicans and their deliberate policy of obstruction at every turn, then actually that would be a vote for president obam