would find true love? >> i always thought about that. but michael seemed happy. he found a lot of joy in his children. >> on the talent that michael hid from the world. >> michael loved art a lot. he loved paintings. he loved water clorz. he loved even the crayons. >> and her explosive theory about conrad murray. >> he did a terrible thing, and it might have been others involved. i don't know that. but i feel that. >> katherine jackson. an extraordinary hour. the "piers morgan" interview starts now. tonight, an extraordinary look at michael jackson's private life through his deeply personal artwork. he started drawing when he was a child. the pictures among new revelations about the iconic singer. much of it kept in a secret location at an airport hangar in los angeles. some of it is here in the studio with me tonight. joining me now in an exclusive interview is michael's mother, katherine jackson. and his mentor and good friend accuracyist brett livingston strong. welcome to you both. >> thank you. >> we're surrounded by this incredible art, most of which has never been seen, that your son michael did. what i'm struck by, i love this picture, katherine, which is -- how old is he there, michael? >> he's about 9 or 10 there. >> and he's clutching his own work of art. he painted that. >> yes. >> i don't know what's more impressive, the art or the fantastic hat he's wearing. very stylish. but clearly, from an early age he loved art. tell me about that side of michael. >> michael loved art a lot. he loved paintings. he loved watercolors. he loved even the crayons. and he would always draw. and when he was even in school he would draw pictures and they took one of his drawings and put it on the front of the yearbook. >> was he self-taught? did he teach himself? >> and he taught himself. >> amazing talent. >> just a talent that he had. and i can't say too much about him. only his father -- his father was an artist, too. he loved to paint and draw. so i thought maybe he might have picked it up from him. but he had a natural talent for it. michael did. >> and did he always paint? i mean, throughout his life. was he always painting secretly without people really being aware of it? >> yes. yes. because when he was just a child, when we moved to hayvenhurst before we remodeled it had a little house in the back and he took that little house and he made it out of an art studio for himself. >> what do you think the art brought him? painting and stuff. what did it give him? >> well, you know what? i really don't -- i really can't answer that question. but sometimes when he's not doing anything he would go and start painting. and i think that just -- it's a way of him just relaxing. >> a bit of escapism? >> yes. >> brett, you got to know michael 25 years ago. tell me how you met, and tell me about this art collection because it's something people really don't know much about. >> we first met about 1979, through mayor bradley of los angeles and also through lawrence welk. two different occasions. and the first time that i had a chance to talk to michael he says, now, you're a sculptor. and i says yes. what type of sculptor? i said i build monuments. he said wow, i've never met a monument builder before. and i said to him, thinking i know who michael is. i said what do you do, michael? and he says, oh, you love life. and i'll always remember that. he said i love life. and i said, wow, that's a great job. i love life, too. and he says i'm an artist too, and i like to draw things that inspire my life. and -- >> and this collection. how many pieces are there in it? >> well, i have -- we have 98 pieces. other people have some. and there's about -- maybe there's about 20 of those pieces he did artwork on the other side. i made the paper for michael in the 1980s, special paper so if anybody got it they couldn't, you know, counterfeit it. and so he -- he ran out of the paper. that's when he started doing artwork on the reverse side. >> some of the pieces here, the martin luther king picture, abraham lincoln, apparently he paint a lot of -- or drew a will the of former presidents. he loved to do that. >> he loved abraham lincoln. he loved freedom. he loved the whole aspect of people being free. artists being able to create, you know, beautiful things, to inspire people like he wanted to create his music. >> and katherine, he had a strange obsession with the number 7 and with chairs. now, tell me why those two things recur in the pictures all the time. >> well, michael was a seventh child. his name had seven letters in it. he would always talk about that. and you know, seven, the number 7, it means completeness. in the bible it tells us. so -- >> it was like a lucky number for him. >> for him. >> and what about the chairs? why did he like drawing or painting chairs? >> he just had an obsession with chairs. the chairs that -- not just a plain chair but chairs that you see had a lot of art in it. a lot of curves. a lot of other things like that. and he would draw. >> there's one very prophetic picture, which is of a little boy sitting on his own in a corner. and we're just seeing it now on the screen. what's so poignant is that michael had written next to this in his own handwriting, "before you judge me, try hard to love me, look within your heart, then ask, have you seen my childhood." what do you think he meant by that, katherine? >> you know what? i couldn't tell you. but that is a picture. i have one, too, like that. are they showing it on tv? >> yes. we're looking at it now, yeah. it's a very -- the boy looks i guess -- >> he looks sad and he looks -- you know, i think it's because michael always said he missed most of his childhood. >> yeah. >> and he loved to run and play. he loved children. and i think this is what this picture stands for. >> i've interviewed a lot of people about michael. many of your family, your children. i've interviewed janet and latoya. jermaine. all say the same thing, that michael was such a happy child, he loved playing pranks on people and that kind of thing. do you ever feel the regret as his mother that he did lose the childhood really to superstardom? i mean, if you had your time again, would you want the kids, especially michael, to go into that crazy world? >> well, to a certain extent. none of my children really were just loose. my husband was sort of -- i should say very strict about things like that because where we came from there was a lot of crime. and we cared about our children. we didn't want them out there on the street running around, breaking in cars and doing like -- like most of the children did back then. and we did things with them in the house. and that's when they started the singing. but as far as having a good time and all, they were in the little league and things like that. then they learned to play the music. and michael always said he didn't have a childhood but he enjoyed what he was doing. >> i think that's true, isn't it? you talked about his father being tough with them. was he too tough or not, do you think? did he have to be that tough? >> i didn't think he was too tough. but in -- back in those days everybody raised their children about the same. if you did something wrong that was terribly wrong, you got a scolding for it and you also got a licking, as they called it. today you can't do that. so michael looked back at those times and he said he was abused. well, they call it abused, but sometimes if it wasn't for the strap what would this world be like today? >> do you think the world has gone a bit soft in terms of discipline? >> i think it's gone a bit too soft. i really do. and then they have too much things out there for our children to do. and they're too open with a lot of things. things that we weren't open years ago about. i just feel bad because i know that the world is -- i think it's doomed. >> do you? >> the bible tells us the world will be destroyed. so i think. >> when you look at america, modern america now, where do you think people are going wrong? especially in bringing up children. >> well, i think society is sometimes the fault of it because they tell the children to call 911. and in some cases maybe they need to do that. but then some cases some people -- some parents are afraid of their children. and some children tell their parents, well, if you do this to me i'm going to call 911 or i'm going to call the police or whatever the children -- what are the parents to do? >> it's interesting. when i talk to your children, all of them have said at various stages of their lives, well, we had these really tough upbringing, our father was really strict, but they all as they got older, and in some cases had their own kids, they've begun to realize that maybe it was the kind of tough love that they needed. it's been interesting for me to talk to them. now they're a bit older. >> mm-hmm. >> it must be -- for thank you must be an interesting experience, too, to hear their views change as they get older. >> they do. children change. for instance, tito. he was one of them that said -- excuse me. that said, i'm going to raise my children just like -- they call their father joseph. just like joseph raised me. because he always said my children don't get in trouble or anything like that. all these terrible things they laid on michael, he didn't do these things. it's just there are wicked people out there, and they accuse you of them. but -- >> it must have been very hurtful for you as his mother. some of the things that michael was accused of, the court cases he had to fight and so on. >> mm-hmm. >> how did you feel as his mother? >> oh, my gosh. it almost destroyed me in a way. you know, when i say it just hurt. because i know michael didn't do those terrible things. but then there are so many wicked people. why are they doing this to him? >> just hold that thought for a minute, katherine. when we come back, i want to talk to you about michael's life and what his will go cy should be. [ male announcer ] every day thousands of people are choosing advil®. here's one story. pain doesn't have much of a place in my life. i checked the schedule and it's not on it. [ laughs ] you never know when advil® is needed. well most people only know one side of my life. they see me on stage and they think that that is who i am. singer, songwriter, philanthropist, father, life's a juggling act. when i have to get through the pain, i know where to go. [ male announcer ] take action. take advil®. save on advil® with our special coupon in select newspapers this sunday. i'm back now with michael jackson's mother, katherine, and his long-time friend brett livingstone strong. did you ever try and advise michael that his own behavior -- you know, i interviewed michael a few years ago, and he had a very child-like quality to him. but did you ever feel concerned that he was allowing himself to get put into positions, you know, when he had all these young boys come round to stay and so on, did you ever say as his mother, michael, i think you should be careful here, the rest of the world may not see this in the innocent way that you do? >> i've talked to him about it. i've never told him to stop you having children around. but he did stop having a lot. most of the children that were around michael was his own relatives. and i can remember that my sister-in-law, she walked into the store and she saw this -- one of these tabloids. and they had something ugly to say in them -- in the headlines. and she just went ber berserk. those are my grandchildren, michael's cousins, why are they saying this about him? >> do you think all the allegations, accusations, the trials he had to go through, do you think it all contributed in the end to his physical condition and his early death? i mean, do you think that all the drugs he was taking for the anxiety, for the lack of sleep, the painkillers and so on, was it all connected, do you think, in the end to the pressure that he felt and the tension and the stress? >> you know what? i think a lot of that was exaggerated, about the different things that he was taking. because i've been to my son's house unannounced and i've been there announced. i have never seen him in that way. i know he was taking painkillers because he got burnt on top of his head. very painful. but all this other stuff they added to it, i don't know if that was the truth or not. but i don't think that had anything to do with the way he died. >> what do you think as his mother caused his death? >> i don't know. all i know is they used propofol and they shouldn't have used it and they were using it on the wrong setting. that's all i know. and that's what caused his death. >> what are your feelings towards dr. conrad murray? do you blame him? >> you know what? i can't even describe the way i feel about him. he did a terrible thing. and it might have been others involved. i don't know that. but i feel that. i'd rather not answer that question. the only thing he didn't -- for a person's life, four years in jail is not enough. i'll never see my son again. but he can get out. and he'll enjoy his children. but -- >> michael trusted him. >> yes, he did. he did. >> and he trusted a lot of people. >> he trusted everybody. >> did you meet conrad murray? >> never met him. still to this day i have never met him. >> has he ever tried to contact you? >> i don't think so. >> he's never written to you or anything? >> no. >> it's a devastatingly awful thing to happen. you lose this son of yours. he's just 50 years old. i mean, it's half a life really. >> yes. >> will you ever get over this, katherine, do you think? >> never. every morning. all through the day i think about michael. if i wake up through the night, my mind is there. but -- >> what do you think when you think of him? >> i just miss him. but being a christian and believing in the resurrection, i feel that i'll see him again. i'm sorry. i just -- >> it's perfectly understandable. you're his mother. it's -- i can't imagine a worse thing. i'm a parent myself. to four kids. i can't even imagine how horrendous it must be to lose a child. >> i know. >> it's so unnatural, isn't it? >> yes, it is. and i've -- and it should be -- >> lots of people say, katherine, that michael in the build-up to his death was working too hard, was too tired, he couldn't sleep, all that kind of -- you've heard all this. is that true? because i've also heard from people who were working with him on the tour and everything that he was pretty fit, that he was enjoying it and he was having a good time and he was excited. what's the truth? >> what's the -- excuse me? what's -- >> how did you think he was in the build-up to his death? physically. >> you know, we have a trial going on, and i'd rather not say. i've talked a lot already about it. >> but were you concerned about him? >> oh, yes. oh, yes. because when they told me that he had 50 shows going on i was concerned about those shows. i thought it was a little bit too much. because michael hadn't been on stage for about ten years. and i called him, and i told him. because the way they had it structured they said every other night that he would be working. on a night, off a night. on a night, off a night. and he was used to working at least once or twice a week. and i just kept calling him, telling him they had to change that schedule because i didn't like the way it was going. i thought it would be a little too much for him. >> did he listen to you, michael? or -- >> oh, yes. >> did you feel that there were bad people around him? >> yes, i do. >> enabling, i guess is the word you would use. people that were just allowing him to. >> it was -- i just don't want to answer those questions right now. but i do feel that it was. they didn't care about him. all they cared about was money. >> it was all about money, you think? >> yes. >> let's take a short break. when we come back, i want to talk more about this incredible art. i also want to talk about how michael's children are doing. you're raising them now. >> yes. >> i think people are fascinated by that. and how they're getting on. they seem to be getting on great, which is good news. >> yeah, they are. >> we'll come back in a moment. >> okay. dude you don't understand, this is my dad's car. look at the car! my dad's gonna kill me dude... 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