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probation officer all right 5:00 a.m. here in washington alive. look at capitol hill on this monday morning. good morning. everyone in kasie hunt, it s wonderful to have you with us. new details this morning about the israeli military operation that rescued four israeli civilians held by hamas this new video edited and provided by the israeli military appears to show some israeli soldiers escorting the rescued hostages toward military helicopters on a beach in gaza. these for israelis now reunited with their families and just beginning to recover from their months of captivity. among those rescued 26-year-old noa argamani, who is abduction during the october 7 attack was captured on tape. noa screamed for help as she was forced by hamas members onto the back of a motorcycle. and driven into gaza. the idf raid also resulting in the deadliest day of the war in six months. at least 274 people killed according to gazan health officials the idf disputes those numbers, saying that the number of casualties was under 100 cnn cannot independently verify the death toll and we don t yet know how many of those killed were hamas fighters and how many were civilians. but we do know that the hostages were being held in residential homes in a densely populated area cnn also learning this morning that some idf soldiers disguise themselves as hamas fighters and displaced palestinians to conduct the raid. joining me now to discuss, is cnn political and national security analyst david sanger. david, good morning. i m very grateful to have you here for folks just tuning in after the weekend. a very dramatic time for the israelis here at with this raid. how do you see the fallout here as we see these hostages reunited with their families, but we also try to figure out to count the dead among the palestinians good morning, casey. and i think you ve captured it right? it was an incredibly dramatic weekend. and i think there are three salient points about the rescue. the first is the operation itself was a miracle of terrific intelligence, great covert work, and getting in there and getting them out. then certainly something to be celebrated. there are more than 100 hostages left, but this was clearly a big win on saturday morning when when this all took place. the second is at once again, it came at a great human cost as many israeli operations in gaza have and this is the sort of brutal calculus of this, which is maybe it was under 100 pounds justinian s dead. maybe it was over 200 is a palestinian say, but the fact of the matter is that we saw a huge number of palestinian deaths in order to accomplish the long-sought release of these four and that seems to sum up much of what s happened during the war. i think the third thing we re discovering as monday morning rolls in here, is that after this dramatic weekend, the rescue did very little to change the fundamentals of the problem that is real faces benny gantz, the former defense minister and, and head of idf took a day off or pushed an extra day because of the rescue but resigned from the war cabinet shattering that view of unity and he did so saying that prime minister netanyahu who does not have a plan for the day after four administering gaza yeah, david, in fact, let me pause you there because i did want to get to that next with you and we have a little bit from gantz over the weekend and what he said, how he explained why he was leaving the war cabinet. let s watch sorry. can you regrettably netanyahu is preventing us from advancing toward true victory, which is the justification for the ongoing and painful cost of war that is why we are leaving the emergency government today with a heavy heart, but with full confidence i call on netanyahu, set an agreed election date. don t allow our people to get torn apart so david, he said there that netanyahu is preventing us from advancing towards true victory what does he really getting at here? because he also seem to suggest that netanyahu was unnecessarily prolonging the war right? this has been a long-held view, including among american officials that prime minister netanyahu knows that once the war is over, or at least a ceasefire takes place at the active fighting is done the investigations into october 7 begin in earnest. the intelligence failures israel obviously had a good deal of intelligence. this would happen that it did not respond to the idf s failures. that israeli defense force in responding that day. he assumption is that prime minister netanyahu couldn t not survive that and of course, one of the beneficiaries could well be benny gantz himself, who ran against the prime minister a few years ago, laws. but today is doing well enough in the polls, but it s not inconceivable that he could emerge victorious. also, not certain but what we re seeing now is the united states with benny gantz s help, tried to get the israelis to commit to what president biden called and israeli proposal for ceasefire and prisoner exchange and get hamas most importantly to agree to it may be difficult, more difficult it was difficult before the rescue. it may be more difficult now. and overnight, casey, the us has finally decided to go to the united nations security council with a ceasefire and hostage exchange proposal basically the one the president laid out ten days ago and try to get their approval of it to up the pressure on both hamas and israel very interesting set of developments here. david, very, very briefly does this move by gantz not pushed netanyahu farther into the arms of the right-wing and israel it does he s got a very narrow majority s holding onto. he didn t need gantz s party to stay in. he needed kansas credibility to some degree that deal with the us and the rest of the world. but if netanyahu agrees to the israeli plan which came out of the war cabinet, not out of the political atmosphere and the coalition. he s put together those right wingers have threatened to leave the government. that would bring about a government collapse all right. david sanger forces morning, david, very grateful to have you kicking us off today. i really appreciate it great to be with you coming up next here. french president emmanuel macron calling for new elections after the european union takes a hard shift to the right will explain plus a shooting and wisconsin rooftop party leaves ten people injured and donald trump, but his first campaign rally since becoming a convicted felon the most anticipated moment this election and the stakes couldn t be higher. the president and the former president, one stage moderated by jake tapper and dana bash, the cnn presidential debate thursday june 27th, nine live on cnn and streaming unmatched. i got this thousand dollar camera for only $41 on deal that deal dash.com online auctions since 2009, this playstation five sold for only $0.50. this ipad pro sold for less than $34, and this nintendo switch sold for less than $20. i got at this kitchen aid 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right, two months free. all the best reliable nationwide coverage make this switch today awkward question is you re going to be anything leftover. oh, absolutely my kids don t know what they want. you know, who knows what she wants? we ve empowered, we get all of our financial questions answered. so you don t have to worry, empower. what s next? we re you stationed working or living at campbell as yoon between 1953 and 1987, if you or a loved one have suffered from a severe illness, you may be eligible for a settlement no offer ranging from 100,000 to $550,000 without a court filing. morgan and morgan has already helping over 15,000 veterans and their families families, and the fight towards justice. for more information, call the number on your screen or visit www. dot www.kappelerzhuninjury.com i m melissa bell in paris. and this is cnn all, right welcome back. after four days of european parliamentary elections being held across 27 countries we re seeing a major shift to the right in europe. the center-right european people s party now projected to be in the majority. protesters taken to the streets in paris sunday after the far right in france, scored an unprecedented 31 31.5% of the road. and the french president emmanuel macron dissolved parliament, called for snap elections situ in situation. one like it is a situation to which i cannot resign myself. the rise of nationalists and demagogues is a danger not only for our nation but also for our europe and for francis place in europe and the world. they don t all right, joining us now is cn an international anchor, max foster who joins us now, live from london max, good morning to you. this is a bit of a complicated situation for folks in the us who don t necessarily follow the ins and outs of the european parliamentary elections. but big picture is that we have seen kind of a across the continent these far right parties surging in a way that has really concerned the sort of center right? majority governing parties. and it so much so that you saw emmanuel macron take this pretty significant action. it s a risk for him to do this. why is he doing it and how does it help explain the big picture of what we re seeing here? hi, a lot of people quite baffled because off the back of a european election where in france at least the far-right, did extremely well he s now going into another election. he called it and it s going to benefit the right. many would argue because they can ride on that momentum, but he is effectively saying he wants to hand it over to the french people who he believes are generally moderate. and of his point of view. so he can prove that the european election, which is often a protest vote for european voters, won t actually hold in a national election. so a massive risk, and i think even the people closest to them realize that, but we ll see he, how marine le pen does out of that steadily over recent years she s been increasing in authority and power and she s doing what many of the european parties are doing, which is focusing on immigration. and ukraine and also environment. but on this basis that really resonates with a lot of people, which is that the cost of living is getting worse and worse inflation s going up. we can not afford to do all of those things. we have to hunker down a look at nationalism. and i think if you look at the overall parliamentary picture, then the moderate still hold it. but in the key country, the big economies, france, germany, and italy, the far right? excelled. so it s going to have a huge influence. yeah, we can put up on the screen for people to kind of see in color the way that this broke down in france. so let s set aside the yellow that s other, but that red piece which is clearly the most significant one for a named party, is the national all rally. those are the right wingers that 15% purple that you see the renaissance party, purple, blue. that s macron s party. and max, to be clear, we saw something similar play out in germany and in italy can you talk a little bit about how this strengthens the more right-leaning leaders who are in office in europe well you know, it s already got a right-wing prime minister. so she s empowered and marine le pen, as i say, he s been climbing steadily in germany. a lot of people would view that party. now the second most powerful party in the country as traditionally a very far right party. so it has huge influence because germany and france and italy are the three countries that have most influence over the european union i was interviewing a us expert based here in the. uk earlier on, and she was talking about how this will empower trump effectively. a lot of the wright was rising in europe before trump, but chump managed to popularize a messaging and they ve adopted a lot of that. so he certainly added energy to the rise of the right here in europe and it also means that the more senior these right-wing politicians become, the more contacts and power he has within europe. so it s very empowering to him and his foreign policy. he creates alliances specifically for him within countries which were traditionally us allies. so it has a it will have a big impact on trump if he gets into power and it will cause a problem for biden if it gets into power bi, it s going to be much less supportive of him and his policies going forward. yeah it s an interesting way to think about it. and i also think one of the things that donald trump has done that we remark on it, but i think perhaps not enough. and that is to normalize things that previously were considered out of bounds. and the politics and the way we re thinking about politics. and you can really see that in some of these right-wing up pushes, bringing things in that previously were considered to be verboten are not acceptable on our stages. max foster for us in london, max. thank you. always grateful to have you alright, coming up next cleveland police trying to uncover the origins of a cyber incident that s forcing them to close city hall plus president biden preparing celebrate juneteenth with a little help from some friends sirens are going off and playing the tornado here. i m thinking i m going to die. and i thought that was it. while and earth with liev schreiber, sunday at nine on cnn. we have a new home. what s that? we have of garage door that doesn t lift and we have a gate doesn t open. so i went on. angie took me just a handful hello, minutes. the vendors who came through energy, you were more knowledgeable. they did higher-quality work. they wanted us to be happy with the work done as well. we felt like we got the most value i have a contracted that we chose. it is a beautiful ghraieb. connect with skilled professionals to get all your home projects done well, get started today at andy andy.com there are giant so mug they are the minute woman building or daibes next generation submarines. de are giants and what they do because they work in a place we re, 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godmother of soul patty lewbel at the juneteenth concert on the south long today, other artists attending include gladys knight, charlie wilson, and brittney spencer and oppressive heat ramping up across the west today while drought stricken south florida braces for rain and flooding this week are weatherman derek van dam is here and he is tracking all of it for us. derek, good morning. yeah. good morning. casey. we ve got las vegas sin city. it has had its hottest start in the month of june since records began, that s since 1937, 11. yes, that s not a typo consecutive days where the mercury in the thermometer has reached 100 degrees or more. that is why we have our heat warnings in place for this area. and you know what it s not just inclusive of las vegas checkout, much of arizona and into the central valley of california. the heat continues. we know it was hot last week, but it s going to ramp up through the course of this week as well. if you re in phoenix, i was just there. we could go. yeah. it was sizzling as i stepped off the tarmac and this is 14 consecutive days temperatures above 100 degrees is all thanks to that heat dome. remember that s an area of high pressure that really reduces cloud cover in the sky. so you get maximum exposure from the sun, doesn t take much to heat things up, and we start to see this triple-digit heat blanket. the southwestern us. now the other big story that we have on the docket for today is the flood threat that s going to be ongoing this week across the state of florida, particularly across the southern portions of the peninsula. watch this. there s a cold front approaching an abundant amount of tropical moisture moving in off the gulf of mexico that will bring wave after wave of heavy rainfall starting today. but ramping up through the week, look at tuesday, wednesday, into thursday. we know that it doesn t doesn t take much to flood the streets of miami. well, guess what? more rainfall. we re talking up to locally, ten inches of rain through this week for portions of the southwestern florida peninsula that could bring some localized flooding to the area. so from heat to heavy rain, we ve got it all covered today for you today on monday all right. are weatherman, derek van dam, derrick. see you next hour. thanks very much. all right coming up next new details about israeli soldiers in disguise to pull off a derrick, hostage rescue, plus brand new polling are more voters turning to biden because they just can t vote for trump this election season, stay with cnn with more reporters on the ground. and the best political team business follow the voters, follow the results follow the facts, follow. cnn over 13 million americans were affected by identity theft in 2022. and the threats go way beyond just credit card fraud today s identity thieves can use your information in ways that are easy to miss by just monitoring accounts and credit like opening loans, transferring home titles, even committing crime i 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hamas fighters. and palestinian civilians during the operation the operation did come at a great human cost. scores of palestinians dead, just how many? we don t know. gaza s health ministry says the numbers, at least 274. israel says it s fewer than 100. i am joined now by joel rubin. he is the former deputy assistant secretary of state in the obama white house. joel, good morning to you. wonderful to see you this morning let s start with the raid for people who are two doubt on a summer weekend, just waking up to this news, these four hostages rescued this clearly was something that i mean israeli families of hostages have been increasingly more and more upset about the fact that their loved ones have remained in captivity. what does this mean for them? yeah, it was a dramatic rescue without a doubt and have very high costs as you described with a palestinian loss of life what it means is that the israeli defense forces for a day for a moment, restored confidence in the israeli public about their capacity to deliver and to get their people out. but in the big picture, the best way to get israeli hostages out has been through deals, through a cease fire for hostage exchange, like one that we saw back in november. so a good day for israel, a unity didn t last long. obviously, the politics in israel very, very dicey with benny gantz. now exiting the coalition government. but it was something that the israeli public has been demanding. and now they want more action. they want to see the prime minister lean-in on getting a deal to get these hostages out. of course the toll here was very high in terms of palestinian life. it all so served to highlight some of the tactics that hamas uses talk a little bit more about where these hostages were found. and why there was perhaps so much collateral damage. obviously, much of it should be laying at the feet of the israeli forces that invaded here. but that s not the only thing at play, not at all. the case you re right, it was despicable. display of how hamas d values palestinian life. so many very clear these hostages were held in private civilian homes they were there for months and they were in the midst of what everyone in those areas new was a civilian areas. so israel, by finding these individuals, by rescuing them, it was clear that there were going to be civilian casualties. hamas doesn t care about palestinian civilian life. i i know we ve talked about this before, but this is perhaps one of the most a stark examples of that. if they cared about palestinian civilian life, they would be agreeing to the ceasefire proposal that has been out there and discuss secretary blinken s going out to the region to try to push for this, but in the meantime, hamas is embedding hostages in civilian areas with the clear understanding, this will cause palace let s see any civilian lives for a propaganda bonus may be for hamas, but i don t see how this is a real bonus for anybody in the middle of this conflict. they clearly are not looking at civilians as something to protect inside of gaza. so let s talk big picture for a second. you mentioned benny gantz, of course, announcing over the weekend and he s going to leave the war cabinet. he is, of course, someone that the us has really relied on in the course of these negotiations in this push for a ceasefire that president biden actually announced on a recent i ve friday. here s what jake sullivan, the national security adviser, had to say over the weekend. let s watch keith thinks the best way to get all of vestiges home is in a deal where they re brought out diplomatically, where there s no need for military operations to get every last hostage out. what we would much prefer to see is a ceasefire where the hostages come out peacefully. that is available. israel has said yes to it. now hamas needs to say yes to it. that s where president biden full effort, energy and attention is so bottom line, draw what s the holdup? while the holdup is hamas? the holdup is that hamas is i want to agree to a ceasefire that essentially pushes them out of the power. and that s the genius of this proposal, which is that it lays out a roadmap for preventing at the end state of resurgence of hamas in the gaza strip. and now that, that is, of course, very frustrating as well to the white house, because what we re seeing is the far-right ministers in israel s government rejecting that proposal as well. and now with ben against leaving the coalition it gives them a little more power in the near term, but it also puts the question to the israeli public. and i think this is why the president did go public with his proposal to get the israeli public to recognize the stakes, to put it back in the political arena. this question about how to end this war in a manner that we don t see a hamas resurgence in gaza and so the holdup right now is that hamas understands this proposal is against their interests and that s why we see the secretary going out. that s why it s frustrating that it s not yet done. but hamas, they re hoping for more days of violence, like on saturday where they don t have to make this agreement. and that means more palestinian lives are put at risk. machel rubin for us this morning, joel, always appreciate your experiments for being here all right, let s go now to politics. donald trump, tried to win over voters in nevada. a key swing state with his first official campaign rally since he was convicted on felony charges i tell you what? no third world country has weaponization, where they go after political candidates, like we have either this guy can get elected anything without cheating. the only way he can get elected is to cheat so all of those folks in during triple digit temperatures as trump rally them in an outdoor event in las vegas, nevada. of course, one of a handful of states that could help to decide the presidential election this fall, a new cbs poll shows trump in a virtual tie and a head-to-head race with president biden, both nationally and in these key swing states. today, trump is scheduled to have a hearing with his probation officer ahead of his sentencing next month in new york, cnn s learned. today s interview will be virtual with his attorney, todd blanche president trump me now to discuss nicholas johnston, the publisher of axios nick. good morning. great to hear so yeah, probation hearing for a presumptive sentencing name. you d sentenced you just read off the teleprompter there, i think speaks to the kind of interesting election where in, where that sentence one interest hide across as the country tied and state sentenced to one of the candidates will have a virtual interview with his probation officer. today yeah that s seen as pool. actually interesting because it s one of the first things, places where we seem to see maybe a little bit of movement. obviously the official way we talk about it is that it s tied. there s no clear leader, but there is a little bit get over movement toward biden compared to where this pole previously was. what does that tell you? it s pretty clear across the board that again, within the margin of error is and all of these poles we ve seen a slight polling bump four biden, and then a lot of the surveys were the vast majority of people say that conviction won t have any impact. there is 20, 30% of republicans who say it well, and remember, we ve been talking about for months and months it s in a month. this is a very tight election for donald trump to win. he needs to get more voters and he needs to get the last time. and so far, being convicted of a felony in new york is not leaving more voters for that. but again, all of these are the margin of error. it s like going from trump up to two biden up one that is essentially a coin flip election still. yeah, it is yes. very, very, very close. so let s listen a little bit to some of what trump had to say in this rally over the weekend because is there are a couple of things that stood out to us, including how the former president talked about, well, i mean, he he always uses very often inflammatory language about joe biden. but in this case, he was talking about suicide as well let s watch this du are there this is a front row joe. he said everyone this guy wouldn t it be incredible. he s gone to 250 if he voted for biden, even for by now, i don t think so. i think it would be suicide before by dry a bit extreme i don t know how a front row you thought about that. i think we re seeing that this is trump being trump, like they re even though there s a big conversation a lot about how much will they stick to the issues there s pulling out over the weekend that shows what a strong conjugation issue the economy is as opposed to conviction. and so can trump come out and just talk about the economy and immigration for the next six months. i think that little snippet shows that will been a challenge for some of the president s former president s advisers. they gotta to do that. yeah, let s talk about nevada specifically for a second at trump also was up there. this is sort of a typical line, but he said it in front of it. a crowd. again, it s a very heavily hispanic at stateless watch. what trump had to say about hispanic and african-american voters joe biden is also weighed. you re going all out war on the workers have america, especially african americans and hispanic in america i spanish americans and african americans are the ones suffering most with his incredible illegal alien group that s coming in so this is, this is pretty typical for how trump talks about this kind of thing. but i think what s going on in nevada is particularly interesting. i will say i have okay to a lot of sources recently who think that it actually may go for trump. this time around and it s part of it s part of the reason is because of some of the themes that he is talking about. there, there are a lot of workers that tourism economy, cassino workers, who in the past had gone for democrats who may actually go republican this time you hear this was a big, i mean, again, this is a point-slope election. there s a lot of things happening that people don t really understand because this is such a different election than ones previously. and i think one of the ones that republicans are trying to capitalize as those capitalizes, in row on minority voters with hispanic americans or african americans, as well. that s clear on the polling data that donald trump is doing better with those groups in previous republican candidates. and i think his campaign, his advisers, he, that is a huge, massive opportunity. again, the same way that if a small amount of those republican voters are moved by the conviction, if a small amount of minority voters are moved by some of the present former president s economic arguments that the election right, they re all on the line. all right. nick johnson for us, nic, always great, to have you. thank you all right. come on up next and update on the condition of those just four rescued israeli hostages plus caitlin clark rebounding how she s trying rejection into motivation silent burst with liev schreiber sunday at night on cnn i m getting vaccinated and pfizer s pneumococcal pneumonia vaccine syllabi because i m at risk for pneumococcal pneumonia already gotten pneumonia vaccine. but i m asking about the added protection of krever 20 if you re 19 or older with certain chronic conditions like asthma, diabetes, copd, or heart disease, or are 65 or older, you are at increased risk for pneumococcal pneumonia, prevnar 20 is approved in adults to help prevent infections 20 strains of the bacteria that cause pneumococcal pneumonia in just one dose, don t get prevnar 20 if you ve had a severe allergic reaction to the vaccine or its ingredients adults with weekend the immune systems may have a lower response to the vaccine. the most common side effects are pain and swelling at the injection 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publish it for you. have you written a book page publishing can help you through the process. we cut through the confusion of the publishing world to make it easy for you call 800 630741 all right, welcome back. eight months of prayers for for families. finally answered this weekend as the israeli mannose military managed to pull for hamas hostages from two locations to safety one of the hostages were rescued noa argamani. she was kidnapped by hamas from music festival and was seen on video being forced onto the back of a motorbike? know his father said that the reunion that she had with her family was difficult. her mother has late-stage brain cancer and was unable to express her feelings professor hagai levine is the head of the health team at the hostages and missing families forum and joins me now from tel aviv, professor, thank you so much. for being here at noaa is being treated at the same hospital as her mother is. what are the primary concerns for her as she tries to recover after spending eight months and kennedy e-tivity when of course it s very motion to be back in his word to meet their mother. unfortunately, my there is very very sick and i m not even sure if she understood that noise here. that s the bet. that s shows that when the camo send people were kidnaps, also the families were kidnapped. and we see and we also almog father yossi meir funeral was last night and he did not he just died. a few hours because he received before the news that design is about no, i cannot disclose personal information, but i can say is that also in general and she s in a much better shape than what we were well, concern. there are not only psychological, but also physical issues related to captivity. i bought her personally the. last says that she needed for eight months where she had to use contact lances. obviously, it s not good for eyes and it s now she has struggled because, you know, a massive is so sick so with the joy, joyfulness of coming back home, and she cannot be completely happy and with friends, 120 the hostages, including friend, had been done while still in captivity can you give us a sense for the others who also were rescued, what their physical condition was like, what their mental state was like, and what the coming months you re going to look like for them so i ll morgue and why and shlomi, were together for long period of times. i must say this zero resilience and zero support of each other. i ll remarkable. it s really showed us what the human spirit can do. and, you know the stress anytime in captivity could be your last moment it sometimes it s the small anecdote as they talked each other languages. and andrei i taught them rushing and zealand the some arabic. i m saying together with all the physical and mental and other assaults, it s also very they re showing in a sense to see how they will able to cope with the situation. which reminds me, you know, the story is about cml gut with the student at the hebrew university where i teach 42 or therapy. and she provided yoga lessons for foil mates in captivity. we don t know what is going with her right now. it s clear they will need a very long recovery process shlomi cannot return to his home up in the nose because there is well, when gonzaga and is home is attacked and it will take months and the ears, it s also for the house. the other families. it s great joy, but the concern is enormous. they cannot really the release hostages. they cannot really full when they know that their friends are still there. and i must say with some void because because today in the israeli parliament, the families of the hostages were attacked by the extreme right-wing members of the parliament, which in a way told them that they should be sacrificed i m sorry to say that and we we know that the only way to get all the 120 hostages back dead or alive is by a deal. there was a deal that was put on the table by president biden, and i think it s all of us and i m through your show, i want to deliver to the world. we must put the pressure on the hamas and it s allies to accept the offer and to stop the bloodshed and released all those just because all of them are entitled to go back home. all right a professor hagai levine for us this morning, sir. thanks very much for your time. i really appreciate it thank you very much case. all right. time now for sports, the boston celtics. now just two wins away from a record-breaking i think 18th nba championship. after rallying and then holding off the dallas mavericks in game two of the nba finals coy wire has this morning splits your appoint coin. good morning. thanks up of the morning to uk s see the celtics faced pressure all season of past play off failures and being the league s best team. but it looks like they have what it takes this time around masdar luka doncic pre-game was all wrapped up in ice and up was potentially going to miss game to with everything from his chest to his knee banged up, but he did go any did register struck triple, double, 32 points, 11 rebounds, 11 assists for the celtics, just too much. one of the unsung heroes, jrue holiday clamped down deif calls himself for utility guy, but it leaves a team in scoring last night with 26, he was nine for nine in the paint and watch this effort. maths have a chance to bring it within three with under a minute to go. but jaylen brown and derrick white hustle block the shot. brown finished with 21 white and tatum 18 celtics take a 2-0 series lead with a 10598 when here s a two-time awesome an olympic gold medalist holiday, or what makes this year celtic so special i think when you sacrifice together, you do something together brings you closer i think being able to go through wins and losses and to build something it means a lot. i think the best with this team has done from from one to 15, somebody sacrifice something. so it s been great in the journey has been awesome, but i ve been in the day the judge and scottie scheffler has been through it all over the past month. de and his wife, meredith, welcoming their first child his arrest at the pga championship in louisville, then having the charges dropped yesterday, he found themselves back on top winning the memorial tournament, finishing eight under its fifth win in his last eight starts, his first wins is baby bennett, though. scheffler, full of emotion after the win that s pretty fun it s one he s getting sunburned out, looks like but it s this tournament is a very special to us and it will be for a long time because this the future of tennis is in good hands with 21-year-old carlos alcaraz, who rally from being down two sets to one to claim his first french open title. he s now the youngest man to win a grand slam on all three surfaces running around like the tasmanian devil, bewildering alexander zverev on the famous play algorithm, falling to the ground and victory then had gone over to give mom and dad of big o hug. he said he s been dreaming of winning the french open since he was 5-years-old. finally, caitlin clark park is commented on not being picked to play for team usa at the paris olympics next month, the indiana fever rookie phenom, who has helped shatter women s hub s viewership and attendance records so being left off the roster will only make her better listen honestly, no disappointment. i think it just gives you some them something to work for. you know, that s a dream hopefully one day i can be there and i think it s just a little more motivation. you remember that and, you know, hopefully in four years when four years comes back around, i can be there. i m going to be written commando it to win gold i was a kid that grew up watching the olympics. so, yeah, it ll be it ll be from the washington or fever coach christie sides said the kaitlan, texas sinner about not being selected, casey and she said they woke a monster. the us women are seeking an h street gold at the olympics and they don t have any players currently on the roster under 26. katelyn, just 22, plenty of time to still get some of that red, white, and blue she does have plenty of time. we ll all be pulling. well, i ll be pulling farm coy thanks. i really appreciate it coming up next here. more details on how four israeli hostages were rescued in a deadly operation in gaza, plus oh. my god. oh, my god. oh my god oh my god. beachgoers on high alert after two shark attacks leave three people hurt in florida alder chains it s cold, calculating, cynical, and needs the money. not only was the cia compromise, he also was compromised secrets and spies. a nuclear again, sunday at ten on cnn or your cooking on a black stone, you get a better experience. you ll have bigger adventures it but part of that outdoor cooking revolution with your blackstone doula, every breakfast lunch, and dinner, you create from fast and font it s a low and slow, good. anything anytime, anywhere go to your nearest black stole retailer or blackstone products.com. now and 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Geopolitics of the cold war through the lens of two double agents who were pulling the strings behind the scenes threatening, did he stabilize diplomatic efforts? all right i always i think the early version, at least from the agency who really had a pretty good understanding of how the kgb worked there are no other the powers our everyday was so for little black he d write these studies. everybody would read them and say, oh, that s really great work, rick and then that would. be the end of it. you know, they didn t really send it anywhere and all new episode of secrets and spies, a nucleus and now, the hbo original series, real time with bill maher . how are you doing? how are you doing? thank you very much. i appreciate it. thank you, people. thank you very much. i appreciate it. all right. good to see you. thank you. please, there s so much to get to. oh, wow. i feel great about that. yes, the big news this week is hunter biden s trial. let s get right to that. it led to absolutely fucking nothing, but let s get right to it. i know the republicans they are like, if you take down trump, we are going to take down hunter biden and the democrats are like, knock yourself out, we barely care about joe biden. [ audience reacts ] but, this trial is only about one thing in america which is very important, you cannot mix drugs and guns! seriously, we don t take a lot seriously in this country, but this is one we are very serious about, and hunter biden was buying a gun on crack i mean, at the moment, he was literally on crack and buying a gun, he almost had the gun in his hand. so, the prosecutor gets up and says, no one is above the law in this country, it doesn t matter who you are or what your name is and all the republicans stood up and fist pumped and went, yeah. and then they went oh, wait. yeah, that s [ audience reacts ] that s not what they were saying last week, was it? interesting. in april, they took a survey, 17% of republicans said it was okay only 17% okay for a felon to be president. now, they took the survey again, 58% said it is okay for a felon to be president. gosh, what happened? usually, to change this drastically in the space of two months, hormones are involved. i [ laughter ] but, if hunter biden does get convicted, this will be a historic first. it will be the first time republicans ever objected to somebody buying a gun. [ audience reacts ] and there was testimony from hallie biden, because she was married to hunter biden s brother, who sadly died, beau biden. and then, hunter went out with her. so, she is the ex-girlfriend and the widow. i know. she is she testified that when he was with hunter, she got her into crack, and she is ashamed and embarrassed about that part of her life. really? [ audience reacts ] you bang your dead husband s brother and the part you are embarrassed about is the crack? okay. but [ audience reacts ] she said she found hunters going at one point, she knew she couldn t have it, so she took it away and threw it away in the supermarket dumpster, perfectly. [ laughter ] so, when hunter throughout found out she threw away his gun, he called her insane, called her stupid, said, are you on crack? if you are, can i have some? we all saw this stuff from hunter biden s laptop, right? they did a reality show about hunter biden, it would be called naked and afraid of running out of crack. and it s just [ audience reacts ] and it is just bad optics for the president. the jury is looking at sex tapes of hunter biden and the rest of us are worried about if his father can walk all right. kidding. well, actually, joe was doing the d-day thing. you saw that yesterday? he did very well. i thought he did very well. he was over there commemorating the 80th anniversary of d-day. in america, you know what they did? non-congressman oh, gosh nine congressman dressed up as military people. world war ii, you know, vintage stuff, and jumped out of a world war ii vintage plane to commemorate d- day. sadly, they were wearing parachutes. [ audience reacts ] [ laughter ] and george santos you know, when i do dress up, you bitches make a whole thing out of it. well, yes, it is pride month again, and the spirit of pride [ audience reacts ] so, listen to this. this is a pride month story, five dry greens in philadelphia did a children s books reading as they do, made a guinness book of world records for the fastest way to get trump re- elected. [ audience reacts ] not that there aren t still bigots in this country, but did you see this? this is the head of the colorado republican party sent out an email saying, calling gay people godless horrors, which in california is not even an insult. i get my hair cut at a place called godless groomers. we have a great show. we have matt welch, abigail shrier, but first up, the democratic senator from the great state of pennsylvania, john fetterman! welcome back, it s been too long! good to see you. welcome back to the show. it s been 13 years. it s an honor to be here. i am a fan boy, so right back at you. i have been badgering my staff for a long time now to get you on this show, and i will tell you why i have been badgering them, and eyeglass i guess they badgered you. when i have seen you the last couple of years, you speak so freely. you speak like politicians who i get on this show who aren t in politics anymore, the ones who are out of office, and they can be honest, that is the way you speak now, and it is a beautiful thing. [ audience reacts ] well, honestly and this is true you speak for a lot of democrats that are afraid to say a lot of that stuff. it is a lot of release for a lot of democrats who are like, thank god, somebody is actually platforming like that. no, i think we are very much on the same page. but, it is very rare i don t have to worry about being re- elected, except by the audience. [ audience reacts ] it is, i think, even more brave for you to do it. the question i want an answer to is, is this connected to some of your health issues? when you have gone through what you have, both physical and mental health issues, does it give you a freedom? like, what can you yeah, absolutely. there is a line from the first batman, joker is like, i have been dead once already, it is liberating. that is not reckless, that is really just freeing. it is just freeing, in a way. and i think after being all of that, i would just be able to say the things that i really believe in, and not be afraid if there is any kind of blowback. and what about mental health in america, at-large? what is the prescription for this? because we are going to talk about it on the show to a degree tonight. it is certainly a big issue in this country. we have, what, 50,000 suicides in the last year? absolutely. this is an outstanding number, i think. what are your thoughts on this? well, actually, after i signed myself in to walter reed to get help, with depression, it is not really a big clinical winter, to talk about depression. and when i started to have that conversation, i realized that if i started to be honest, i have to talk about self-harm, you know, harming myself, because you pointed at the 50,000 americans who took their lives, and i started talking about that and said, hey, i have been in that place. i now tell people, i promise you, i am begging you, please, don t harm yourself. stay in the game. now, i am being contacted by people on the regular saying, hey, thanks to hearing this, i got help, or it even saved my life. i never thought that would resonate and that is why i decided to have that conversation, because i was lucky i got help and got better, and now i want to be the kind of guy that can say something, that could have helped someone like me, who was in that situation. [ applause ] so, let s talk a little politics here, because that is your game. pennsylvania is going to be probably, could be, come down to three states, pennsylvania will definitely be one of them. i have always said, pennsylvania picks the president and there really is no legitimate path for the president if he doesn t win, and i believe he will win, actually, because trump was able to flip pennsylvania and that helped deliver his first victory. but, joe biden carried it in 2020 because he has a really strong connection thereto pennsylvania and i believe he will again, but it will be close, and that is the same conversation i have been having with pennsylvania, that it is going to be very close, because trump has a strong connection in pennsylvania and it will be very competitive and all of that. i have also been saying, i don t think that whole trial is going to be anything meaningful with people who have already decided, that is my guy. i will never understand why somebody would say, i love that, or i want four more years of that. but, i do believe joe biden is going to carry pennsylvania and he is going to win. [ audience reacts ] but, as he was as he has not, yet, officially been nominated by the democratic party, is he really the best one to put forward? joe biden? yeah. yeah. he is actually the only american that has ever beat trump in an election, and i do honestly believe that he is actually the only democrat that could win. and let me just say this let me just say this, i know it might be provocative but the last time there was a hotshit governor with $2 million, thought he was going to beat trump, then trump through him in the wood chipper and he finished third in his own state, in florida. and again, trump is pretty tough, and that is what the republicans want and i can t imagine why how he is feeling right now, but trump has a very and i do believe joe biden has that ability to win, and we have a great bench. it is a distinct kind of situation right now. i m surprised at that, but i will move on. i m sorry, i m not on the same page there, but okay. it is probably going to be joe biden and i will vote for him. but, you mentioned desantis. this is very curious to me, desantis wants to ban fake meat in florida, and you agreed with him. i don t get this? really, it is not so much about making it illegal, but it is also just talking about i really wanted to stand with american farmers and ranchers, and those kinds of things, and i don t believe it is helpful, and that is the direction i want to move in that. but, if somebody wants to consume that, that is okay. but, i think there are going to be states that are going to decide, i don t want to ban this, or i really want to invent and create that time, so the product stays the same. i wouldn t eat it either, quite frankly, but i wouldn t ban it. that is what desantis wants to do, so you can t get it. i thought that was the freedom part of this freedom country. if people want to have fake meat or fake anything, fake tits, fake anything. it is los angeles. [ audience reacts ] i don t yeah, i don t know about that, either, but i don t know if that is going to solve anything other than i don t get why that would appeal to anybody. you have been very up front about legalizing weed, marijuana. yeah, of course. i ve heard that from you, too. [ audience reacts ] i heard that, john, that is just a character i play on television. never in my life look, i heard you once say, or maybe read it, a tweet, you said once, i am not a progressive, i am a democrat. what does that mean? because i don t think i have used the word progressive, i think i have said woke. i know that word triggers a lot of people because it has a great beginning as a meaning, but words migrate and it went to something else. i think there is a difference between an old-school liberal and woke person, you say old- school democrat, how do you describe this? look, i agree and i have been saying that for years, actually. i didn t leave the label, it left me on that front. and after that happened on october 7th, i really knew that the whole progressive stack would be blasted apart and they are not going to have anyway for the democrats to reply to that, or respond to that, and i really decided early on that i was going to side with israel throughout all of that, and i knew that democrats would continue to peel away and kind of walk away from standing with israel on that, but that is where i decided how do you explain that, if you can, that the people who considered themselves the most liberal have abandoned israel which was always a liberal drawing for the terrorist organization, for the people who outwardly say that they want a genocide, who outwardly are the one side of this who is against the two state solution. so, now that they wound up with then, why do you think that is, and will this split the democratic party? well, it does, because there is an appeal there. and you talked about it, last week, you really hit it with the gender apartheid. talking about some of these issues, some of the most progressive and left parts of the democratic party are standing for the kind of side that has organizations like hamas, or these kinds of nations where there are no rights for women and they certainly don t embrace the lgbtq lifestyle, and even in philadelphia, the queers for palestine blocked the pride parade in philadelphia, and i never saw that on the bingo card. but [ audience reacts ] all right, well, it may seem lonely out there sometimes when you are brave like you are, but you have a lot of fans. you have a lot of fans here and a lot of fans all over the country. when i told people you were coming on, a lot of them were really excited that you are here, but they all have one question they wanted me to ask you, which is, what is the deal with the wardrobe? [ audience reacts ] people are very curious. it doesn t involve me, i m just saying, people are saying, p please ask him. last year, i know this, you had a great joke, you really nailed it, you put up a picture of me, you said, she dresses like a guy where the airline lost his luggage. and it s true! it s funny, because it s true. and i know i dress like a slob and i am not making a statement or anything, but, i am into comfort, it is just comfort, and it is kind of like i don t have to iron, and [ audience reacts ] but, it is kind of hard to find suits and all of those things. but, i never understood why anybody thought that was interesting. and i want to be clear, i wasn t behind the changing of the dress code or anything, i really wasn t. but, more people seemed more concerned about me wearing a hoodie on the floor, as opposed to, we have senators taking bribes from foreign entities, and [ audience reacts ] but, i m learning. i m learning. i m still a freshman. you seem like you are in a really good place. oh, well, i m sitting across from a great person. but you know, having a near- death experience and going through that kind of a blowtorch of $100 million and attack acts and all of those kinds of things to emerge on a side where i am grateful to be sure, both with you and back with my kids, my family, everything, and i just decided, i really want to be the kind of voice that is consistent, and has a moral clarity on issues that may not be controversial for democrats, but i am not sure why any of that is democrat controversial for democrats, whether it is about israel, or the border, or because people just want to bitch these days, john. everything is controversial to everybody, but you keep doing what you are doing. i appreciate it. [ audience reacts ] all right. see you again, john fetterman. hi! all right, here is the editor at large at reason magazine, met matt welch is back with us. a journalist and author of the new york times best-selling book, bad therapy , abigail shrier. great to see you. okay, so, this is the week where we celebrated the greatest generation saving democracy so we can learn about hunter biden smoking crack. i feel like that has been this week in a nutshell. i feel like this is one of those stories where both sides have a lot of wrong in their handling. i remember when the laptop came out, the left-wing media would not even admit it was a thing, it just had to be a hoax, or it had to be russian disinformation, it just didn t exist. they went right about it, that was wrong. and the right is wrong to pretend it means something, except possibly about joe biden s parenting. the question i want to ask because i know your book is about it, you have written about parenting okay, why do all of the political families have this fuck-up family dynamic? is it just because they are famous, and if we went into every family that had a billy carter, a roger clinton george bush himself was the ne er-do-well. since the beginning of time, we have learned that children basically need three things, and these are essential. they need parental authority, they need to hear no, they need independence, and loving community. kids with high profile families often get none of those. no one is willing to tell them no, they don t get independence because they don t want anyone to make them look bad, and they don t have loving community they are raised in a political battlefield. unfortunately, too many american kids today also don t have those. the way you describe it, it sounds like everyone is from a prominent family, because i read in your book when kids go off to college and they have never heard the word no, or the word wait, then that s right. kids today are under a microscope, they are under a microscope, literally, because of the projection of social media and whatnot, but also because their parents are so afraid of traumatizing them, they have been told by mental health experts that saying no, can be punishing and traumatizing, so they don t assert their authority. we basically have a generation raised with these kids that are miserable. and a link with your d-day tie in, which is that we understood that generation and others, but especially that one, to have a sense of stoicism. like, you are going to go through some bad stuff, you are going to fail, there is going to be unfair things that happen to you. the question is, what are you going to do with that? a 15-year-old and a 9-year-old, they are not teaching a lot of stoicism in the public school system, last time i checked. at some point, she starts to use it as an excuse to get out of chores. like, that is not my journey. [ audience reacts ] [ laughter ] it doesn t make sense to fold the laundry, so they are making fun out of it, but there is something to that. but also, when you think about the greatest generation, they probably could have used a little bit more therapy than they got, right? yes, there is a happy medium. you mentioned d-day, but i couldn t help but think of it because the new york times said ptsd among adolescents is surging. ptsd. the fact that we have so [ audience reacts ] my father was in that campaign, he wasn t in omaha beach, but he was on that campaign. anyone who would allow kids to think they have ptsd? that s right, they don t have ptsd. kids raised gently in suburbs don t have ptsd. but, combat those our combat vets sometimes do have ptsd and they need treatment when they have it. always. it is real. but, that is not what kids that universities have. what they have, what i call in my book, bad therapy , they have emotional hypochondria. they have focused so much on their own bad feelings that they magnify these feelings, they make them an organizing principle of their lives, then they have trouble escaping them. so, here is my thing, we had a reckoning of my sex in 2017, a racial reckoning in 2020. i feel like there is a parenting reckoning coming. a lot of rollback, pushback on gentle parenting. i think people are realizing that this kind of stuff has raised a lot of fucked-up kids who have [ audience reacts ] another statistic, but 49.5% so, let s just say half of adolescence, at some point have a mental health disorder. so, half of the kids in the country are diagnosable? either they really are that fucked-up, or we are over diagnosing. it is the latter. we are way over diagnosing them. this generation has had more mental health intervention in schools, more mental health treatment, 40% of them have been in therapy, they have had therapeutic parenting, and it is making them worse. these kids don t need therapy, they need less therapy, they need to be told, i love you, you will live, now get out of my house and have an adventure. [ audience reacts ] and it is worth pointing out that this generation, let s say 15 to 22, they got banged up during covid pretty bad and the more you were in places with schools and society bogged down, the more banged up you got, and also that is tied up with social media, and what you are doing on your phone all the time, like john hyde talks about. so, i think there is a legitimate mental health thing going on with teenagers, and especially teenage girls in this country. the question is, are we teaching them to get out of it, and also to have fun, and take some kind of initiative in their lives? or, are we encouraging them to think of themselves as victims? and i hope it is not the latter because you are not going to get much past your 18th birthday walking around and saying that it is somebody else s fault. [ audience reacts ] so, this is so obvious and we all agree, who is still defending this? i think the trauma industry is. the trauma industry? right. you are right. that is basically what we have now, we have convinced this generation any stress is trauma, now you have a disability and you have to live with that forever, and these kids are behaving like mental patients. right. [ laughter ] right. i mean and they are medicated, then. that, to me, is when it really goes off the rails, because a lot of them are on whatever psychiatric drugs they put them on. you know, when i think about the two big ones that i see always talked about that are now pathologist, shyness which is social anxiety disorder, as we pathologist isaac. and depression i mean, that is just being bummed out. my whole adolescence, my whole childhood, past college, was about those two things. i just had tons of both of those things and drugging me would not have helped. i discovered part when i was 19, that drug helped. organically. but, yeah, okay. so, i read about sel, and for those that don t know what this is, this is social emotional learning. this takes front and center this explains a lot to me, one, why they are so stupid. because this is the priority above learning, is that right? that is right. and what is obviously, it sounds like it is? reportedly, it is supposed to teach kids like things like emotional regulation, which we want them to have. but, how do you teach kids to handle bad emotions? because we are not worried about them having too much joy, we are worried about them having too much sadness, regret, bad feelings, so it always goes negative, it becomes a kind of group therapy, and it forces kids to ruminate, to pathologically focus on their bad feelings, on their pain, and those are the number one symptoms of depression. and it is interesting, 70% of very liberal students, they say this is from the american enterprise institute, so they are a little right- leaning reports feeling anxious 52% of conservatives. but, it does seem like the liberals are more in their own head, and are suffering from this. is that right, and why? i have seen that statistic and looked, the reason why i think so, that might be, is because those are the parents, in general, who are getting their kids more therapy, they are highly educated, and they are more anxious because they are highly educated, they are more anxious themselves, they are pushing their anxiety onto their kids. we know you can communicate anxiety. parents need to be tougher for their kids. they need to set an example here and they need to stop obsessing over kids happiness and start worrying about making kids strong. [ applause ] all right. so, parenting is also involved in the other book you ll wrote, that book you wrote that was banned, irreversible damage, which is about gender reassignment, as we have called it. now, we have the cast review from england which says, you must feel somewhat vindicated by this because america is now an outlier country with this. the scandinavian countries that were doing it, england that was doing it, they all pulled back. the cast report says the evidence of using puberty blocking drugs and other hormonal medications is remarkably weak. why is america so behind? usually, when we look at those countries, we say, this is what the liberals are doing, so we are just going to no, we are alone on this. yes, we are. two reasons, england had national, centralized healthcare, so they got into this faster, and they were also able to shut it down faster, and because our healthcare is obviously decentralized, it is harder to shut bad medicine down in this country, but there is something else but i have to say. they had something really special in england, they had a j.k. rowling, and she helped gender critical feminists pry away from the progressive left on this issue and stand up to the bodily integrity of girls, and stand up for the integrity of medicine. [ applause ] i think as part of that peer pressure element, it is worth pointing out to the extent that your audios audience might not, that abigail s book was targeted by people who work for the aclu saying, it will be the highest thing to do, to block the distribution of this book. it speaks to a kind of aggressive, illiberal conservative that takes place. not just on this issue, but many other issues, dealing with covid. i think it is kind of a new thing. the last 10 years, especially, there has been a semi-deranged moment, were people who were involved with journalism, or academia, or whatever, have said we have created a new taboo, you are on the wrong side of the taboo, we must attack this person, other people who have been working in this. yes, it hurts their careers, but we don t necessarily have to cry to them she is on bill maher, so she is doing okay. but, it hurts them. that is what people don t get. when you block off the information that is coming in, particularly on a contested subject, particularly that is affecting kids in life and death situations, and you are blocking off the information by enforcing a taboo, you are hurting yourself. it is one thing to critique, it is another thing to say, nobody should even be able to look at this, to even read it, as if you are some sort of crazy person. i will just say one thing, in the three or four years it took between the time i wrote my last book and talked about the same risks that are in the cast report, two until the mainstream media worked up the backbone to actually do some reporting, tens of thousands of american children were harmed. and what you are saying i certainly wouldn t be the one saying that there aren t trans folks who, we do need some transitioning, sometimes. what you were just saying is, there are no guardrails on desperate and these are children. this is not the bodies of adults, they can do whatever they want with their bodies. using children as cannon fodder in their culture wars, is what it looked like to me. i don t want you to move. i m gonna miss you so much. you realize we ll have internet waiting for us at the new place, right? oh, we know. we just like making a scene. transferring your services has never been easier. get connected on the day of your move with the xfinity app. can i sleep over at your new place? can katie sleep over tonight? sure, honey! this generation is so dramatic! move with xfinity. i see this week s google has been caught doing something why did the tech companies do this? they have been caught collecting and sometimes leaking personal data of users, so you might want to erase that browser history. but, we thought it would be a good time because of this to do one of our favorite bits on the show, called revealing google searches. [ audience reacts ] we believe here at real- time, that when you look at somebody s google search, it does look a lot about them. for instance, melania trummp google, two felony convictions violate a prenup? rfk jr., where does brain work brain worm go? nick cannon, how many kids does nick cannon have? elon musk, baby names that sound like license plates. oh, justice samuel alito googled fit flags that mean not fascist, just pussy- whipped. richard dreyfus googled safe amount of opiates to take before a public appearance. wow. ben affleck googled divorce lawyers that accept batman memorabilia. kanye west googled, what to say when woman asks if anyone else at the party will be naked. rupert murdoch, name of woman who recently married rupert murdoch. and lauren boebert, could you get an std on your hand? terrible. terrible, terrible. [ applause ] all right, airlines configure these first-class seats that feature a for curve the 22 inch screen for a cinematic experience but only if they are paired with those double-decker seats in economy. [ laughter ] on a new carrier called inequality airlines yes, inequality airlines there is something special in the air, it is just not you. [ applause ]. don t bring your kid to the office if your office is the united states congress. tennessee representative john rose did just that while making a furious speech denouncing trump prosecution, and look what happened? someone acted [ audience reacts ] yeah, someone acted like a goofy, childish more on, and this poor kid had to sit through it. [ laughter ] new rule, let s stop rewarding every family that has too many kids with a reality show on tlc. [ applause ] the latest one is the baldwin s. seven kids born in a 10 year span. wow. guess there were no blanks fired in that house. [ audience reacts ] well, they shouldn t prosecute him. that is the serious point. they should not. , now that a remote amazon tribe has connected to elon musk s starlet styling internet and become addicted to , i say, congratulations. oh, sure, the liberal inclination is to promote the encroachment of modernity on such an innocent, unsettling people, but that is not what the amazon tribes themselves are saying. they are saying, thanks, elon, it sure beats jerking off to this tree. [ laughter ] new rule, now that researchers say marijuana use has surpassed alcohol as america s drug of choice, they have to answer this [ audience reacts ] you re welcome. they have to answer this question. if alcohol use is declining, why is it still not safe to eat at a waffle house? i mean not to always be the marijuana advocate, but do you know what the stoners are doing while the fight is going on? eating their waffles! [ audience reacts ] and finally, new rule, someone has to look into the puzzling paradox of why it is that rape jokes are completely unacceptable, unthinkable, and totally out of bounds, but raped-in-prison jokes, fucking hilarious! never a bad time to do the one about how you drop the soap in the prison shower, better not bend over for it. and look, with all the talk now about trump possibly going to jail, we have all been doing it, i mean, it is not just trump. given the opportunity, it is natural to want to imagine him getting fucked in the ass. [ audience reacts ] i m just saying, maybe we shouldn t. if not for him, then for the nearly 2 million people behind bars at any given time during this country. that is more people than 12 states. they should have their own two senators, and one can be bob menendez. america has a higher incarceration rate than russia, or china, or almost any of the other evildoer countries who we are always shitting our pants over, and for someone, everyone everything at walgreens is still locked behind plexiglass. but, for some reason, americans simply accept that not only do we lock up way more people, but that if you are a criminal of any time, yes, sodomy is the appropriate comeuppance. they say, if you want to survive prison, the first thing you do when you get there, what you have to do, is go up to the biggest, baddest guy, and punch him in the face, which i find also works if you are a passenger on delta. [ audience reacts ] as a prisoner here in america, you will either be alone, in solitary which drives you out of your mind or, completely on top of everybody else heard inmates in america are routinely forced to sleep on the floor and to fight for access to toilets and showers. of the world s 25 most dangerous prisons, four are here in the u.s., the san quentin, the super max in colorado, and the state pen in new mexico. where, for $45, oh, yes, you can tour the cellblock, where 33 inmates were killed in one of the worst prison riots in history. so, bring the kids, and don t forget to get that salt for the gas chamber. [ audience reacts ] here in california, the prison in dublin made headlines because it is where they sent lori loughlin after her college cheating scandal, but have since closed. why? because the rape club that the guards had going was so impervious and ingrained it was just easier to shutter the whole place. and prison in america is a place that forces the people in it forces them to become racists. if you are black, you are with the brothers, if you are white, you have to join the aryans in it. there is no leave me out of it, i like everybody. let s just all get coexist tattoos on our knuckles. yeah. i mean [ audience reacts ] what kind of society is cool with all of this? we call them correctional facilities, but that is like calling the nfl a brain development program. and look, i am not saying that it is not okay to lock people up. it is. of course it is. diddy does it all the time. [ audience reacts ] but, it is not okay to deliberately violate the eighth amendment s prohibition of cruel and unusual punishment. fake tough guys think, hey, if prison is bad enough, it will incentivize people to stay out of trouble after they get out, but they are long. it actually does the opposite. within a year of released, around 40% of prisoners are rearrested. within 10 years, it is 82%. and i don t think they want back in because they miss the toilet one. if we are trying to make inmates into criminals for life, it is working, because prisoners like linkedin for lowlifes, you can t beat the networking. it is a taxpayer-funded criminal mentorship program. but, here is the thing. around 95% of all inmates eventually to get out, so the question becomes, who do we want returning to society? some hapless broke dude goes in for selling drugs or passing a bad check and if you years later, he comes out a sexual predator with white power written on his neck. and we sort of just accept that light, that is how prison words. you go in bad, you come out worse. if you are lucky, when you get out, we will let you work the carnival, or the toll booth, or date britney spears. [ audience reacts ] jesus. it almost makes stealing catalytic converters not worth it. but, it doesn t have to be this way. we could change. there are even places in the world that offer a model as to what that would look like. norway s recidivism rate is 20%. prisoners there do yoga, they learn a trade, there is a playground for their kids when they visit, and the guards aren t maniacs who failed the police psych exam. and it is a place that looks less like our prisons and more like what you would find on an american college campus only, of course, with less anti- semitism. [ audience reacts ] of course, the big difference is that unlike here, scandinavian countries don t have private, for-profit prisons. that is what we have here. and corporations, it turns out, don t run prisons to improve society, they run them to make money, which means putting more people in the system, and the more prisoners, the more profit. this is why they lobby congress with three strikes rules and keeping weed illegal. they don t want them rehabilitated. they want to return customers. all right. that is our show. if you enjoyed this editorial we have more just like it for you, right up there! if that is not a father s day press, i don t know what is! june 21st and 22nd, with the music hall in boston june 26th. thank you, matt welch! now, we are going to watch overtime on youtube. thank you.
Norman, bad news. i never graduated from med school. what? -but the good news is. xfinity mobile just got even better! now, you can automatically connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go. plus, buy one unlimited line and get one free for a year. i gotta get this deal. i know. faster wifi and savings? .i don t want to miss that. that s amazing doc. mobile savings are calling. visit xfinitymobile.com to learn more. doc? colostrum it before to provide super food nutrition, your body cre, by primal origins at walmart today, close captioning brought to you by i grew la la, iconic brands up to 70% off retail at roulette law.com, rubella you never faithful sees the deals on top before there shopper today it s hard to imagine the power of mother to be during a tornado. for those one, two, three minutes when everything is falling apart around you, it s chaos. storm chaser: that is one of the [indistinct] tornado. storm chaser: oh my god. back up. narrator: and you re just at the mercy of mother nature. it really is a terrifying experience to go through. storm chaser: run it back oh, that s a trailer house. [theme music] welcome to violent earth. i m liev schreiber. 2023 set an all time record for weather and climate related disasters in the us. 28 events with losses over $1 billion. wildfires, hurricanes, and floods are more frequent than ever. the earth is changing. tonight, we delve into one of the most powerful natural hazards in the world, tornadoes. terrifying vortexes unleashed from thunderstorms that can cause unimaginable destruction. few examples of their power are more definitive than the 2011 twister that hit joplin, missouri. categorized as an ef5, the highest level possible, with maximum winds over 200 miles per hour, the tornado cut right through the center of the city. storm chaser: oh my gosh. oh my gosh. jim riek: late may is the bull s eye in the midwest for tornadoes. joplin was under a risk of a tornado, but not a great risk. storm chaser: that is a tornado, people. there was a complex of storms that came toward the city. oh my gosh. the tornado formed just outside of the joplin city limits. storm chaser: listen to it! jim riek: and then it just started racing into joplin. [indistinct shouting] all the alarms are going off on my computer, and here it comes. storm chaser: there! storm chaser: i see it. i see it. just straight through the heart of joplin, missouri. storm chaser: oh gosh, that is a monster tornado. i couldn t really see anything because it was obscured by rain. jim riek: it was rain rain. i think that s why so many people died. they did not realize that what they were seeing was the tornado. in this case, an ef5 tornado that is catastrophic. and by the time they did, it s too late. jeff piotrowski: as the tornado went by, everything was gone. it was like a bulldozer, and it leveled everything in its path. kat piotrowski: i just couldn t believe what i was seeing, the millions and millions of pieces of debris. jim riek: the tornado was on the ground for 32 minutes. storm chaser: the sirens are going. jim riek: it hits a convenience store on east 20th street. they had locked it just so the door wouldn t fling open. jim riek: listen to the audio. [screaming, rain pounding] jeff piotrowski: as the tornado entered the center part of the city, it hit the high school, and that s where the max damage occurred. jim riek: that surveillance video from the high school is no more than a hundred yards from amber munson s house. donna kerry: in 2011, amber was 40 years old. amber has always been amber, just always generous and kind and hospitable and just fun to be around. amber was home that afternoon. she wasn t aware that the tornado was coming. she didn t have her tv on and no indicators that it was gonna be that severe. i had spoken to her. she said, oh, it s just turned really dark here. and then she said, um, now the sirens are going off. and that s when i said, you know, go take the quilt off the top of your bed and get in your bathtub. i said, and then call me back. very few houses in joplin, particularly in the path of what turned out to be this tornado, had basements. so the best place to go is either a closet or in your bathtub. harold brooks: you wanna get as low as you can and put as many walls between you and the tornado as possible. storm chaser: oh gosh. i was concerned when she said the sirens were going off. i wouldn t even have imagined the magnitude of what was gonna come. jim riek: amber munson, probably 15 seconds before the tornado hit, realized just how bad it was going to be. and bang. the tornado hit. for tornadoes to form, you have to have a certain set of ingredients. first of all, you have to have moisture available for thunderstorms to develop. you have to have a source of lift or a trigger for those thunderstorms to get going. you have to have unstable air, which is temperatures that get colder with height and that allows the thunderstorm to rise and develop vertically. the most important ingredient is you have to have wind shear, which is changing of wind direction with height and also changing wind speeds with height. there s all sorts of different shapes tornadoes can take. we have a stovepipe, which is kind of like a straight up and down type tornado. we have obviously a cone. that makes sense. it s a cone shape. another one is the wedge, and that s usually the most intense. different tornadoes have different smells. when a tornado is going through a densely wooded area, you can smell the fresh cut wood, the fresh cut pine, whatever the tree is. paul markowski: the typical widths are anywhere from probably 25 to 50 yards across on the low end to, on the high end, a mile wide. tim marshall: the largest one i ve ever seen was the el reno, oklahoma tornado, and that was over two miles wide. kim klockow mcclain: the joplin tornado became a mile wide wedge right on the edge of town. kat piotrowski: the tornado was massive. it was chewing up everything in its path. there was no mercy at all. er: breaking news here at cnn. joplin, missouri, suffering the devastation right now of a very powerful tornado. jim riek: amber lived in what i would call a very middle class area of joplin. jeff piotrowski: this beautiful, quaint subdivision, and now it s level. kat piotrowski: it was just total devastation. our phone rang, and it was her, and she was screaming, mother, my house is on top of me. that s when i said, amber, that s not funny, because we would always kid back and forth. and she said, no, mom, my house is on top of me. and then her phone went dead. so there s a lot of myths that have been passed down through the years. reporter: doors and windows on the north and east sides were open. trent okerson: whenever i was growing up, i heard you ve got to open up the windows to equalize the air pressure. well, pressure is not what will cause damage to a home. it s wind getting up under the roof, blowing the roof off. another big misconception is if you re out in a vehicle, that an overpass is a great place to take shelter. that is not a good place to go. scientists have realized that being in that overpass creates a bit of a wind tunnel effect, that the wind is blowing through a smaller area so it can actually accelerate the wind speeds. so you re putting yourself in greater danger. kim klockow mcclain: there s a really popular misconception that mobile homes are like tornado attractors, and what s behind that is undoubtedly that people hear about mobile homes getting hit more because that s where people die. harold brooks: roughly half of the deaths in tornadoes occur in mobile and manufactured homes. they re much more vulnerable to a tornado and tend to turn into debris quicker. there are myths that tornadoes can t cross bodies of water. oh, tornadoes can t go through cities. jeff piotrowski: but there are no rules when it comes to tornadoes. they go where they wanna go. harold brooks: the deadliest tornado in us history is march 18, 1925, the tri-state tornado that went across southeastern missouri, southern illinois into southwestern indiana, and it killed 695 people over about a two and a half hour long period. generally, after the tri-state tornado, we see, like, a 10-fold decrease in the fatality rate from tornadoes as compared to 1925. we think there are a lot of things that could be going on behind that. there was the emergence of radio and people downstream could hear about it immediately. radar has had something to do with this, increases in our understanding of storms, and now the ability to push warnings to people on their cell phones. harold brooks: but the may 22, 2011 tornado at joplin, missouri, was the deadliest tornado in decades in the united states. being the seventh deadliest in us history. jim riek: on that day, it didn t matter what type of forecasting skills you had, what technology. the tornado won. [dramatic music] jeff piotrowski: everything basically was a three foot, four foot pile of debris everywhere as far as the eye could see. just debris everywhere. there s really nothing standing. donna kerry: in her immediate neighborhood, there were 16 people that perished. jim riek: jeff piotrowski sees a lady who is hysterical, has no idea what has happened to her. and that s amber munson. you could hear amber before you saw her, and that s what i remember more than anything is hearing her cries out. amber munson: can i use your phone? jeff piotrowski: what? kat piotrowski: and coming towards us. jeff piotrowski: yeah, all the phones are jammed. kat piotrowski: jeff jumped out of the car immediately and raced towards her. i m ok. i m ok. jeff piotrowski: come here. come here. hello? hello? how did she survive? amber munson: once the tornado sirens went off and the lights started flickering, i grabbed a pillow and a blanket and my phone and i jumped into the bathtub. i decided to roll over on my right side and i kind of got into a fetal position and covered myself up. but as the pressure started coming, the bath started bouncing. so it was very minor at first, not realizing that you re gonna get sucked out of your house. after the tornado hit, i remember hearing the glass shatter, but i don t remember flying in the tornado. amber munson went flying, ended up in someone else s yard. amber munson: when i woke up, i just remember being upside down, buried within the rubble. i knew i was alive, but i still questioned whether or not i was gonna survive because of the stuff that was falling on me. i think just wanting to survive kicked in for her. i kind of wiggled myself out so that i could get up, and that s when i got out of the hole. i had twisted my knee and i had a puncture wound in my back. but she s alive. it was a miracle. amber munson: the joplin tornado, having lived through it, made me realize that people don t take them serious enough. you see people that go stand on the front porch wanting to capture these things, not realizing how risky they really can be. storm chaser: oh, we got lightning. her uncle s unhappy. i m sensing an underlying issue. it s t-mobile. it started when we tried to get him under a new plan. but they they unexpectedly unraveled their “price lock” guarantee. which has made him, a bit. unruly. you called yourself the “un-carrier”. you sing about “price lock” on those commercials. “the price lock, the price lock.” so, if you could change the price, change the name! it s not a lock, i know a lock. so how can we undo the damage? we could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that s uncalled for. trent okerson: storm chasing has gotten extremely popular over the past couple of decades. storm chaser: get the best footage. harold brooks: people do it, in large part, for the thrill and for the excitement of seeing the event. storm chaser: tornado number one. tornado number two. the original tornado is still on the ground. tim marshall: once you get out there and you see a storm in the open plains and the amazing structure that it has, it s mesmerizing, and it can become even addicting. storm chaser: my goodness. that is a thing of beauty and violence. max olson: there s a side to it that s almost like a hunter, because you re trying to narrow down where in the country this relatively rare phenomenon is gonna take place. storm chaser: come on. tim marshall: now there are thousands of people who do this. there s even tour groups nowadays, and you can get in a van and go with a group of fellow enthusiasts and drive out onto the plains and see the majestic skies. allison chinchar: in the united states, we average more than 1,200 tornadoes per year. that is number one in the world by a long shot. the second closest is canada, which only gets 100 per year. you could actually add canada, australia, and all european countries combined, and we still see more than they do. tornadoes are most common in the midwest. max olson: we also have another area that s really prone to tornadoes in our southeastern states. harold brooks: the tornado season depends on where you are in the country. in the plains, tornado season is typically over a relatively short period of time in the springtime. in the southeastern united states, tornadoes are more likely to occur at any time of the year. tornadoes actually can and do strike all over the country. tim marshall: tornadoes have been known to be in every state of the us. they have been in the highest of mountains, beaches, and offshore. harold brooks: over the last 50 years, what we ve seen has been an increase in the number of tornadoes in what we think of as the mid-south. it looks like it s associated with physical changes in the atmosphere, but we don t have a real underlying reason of why that s occurred. reporter: a rare sight in the skies over japan. a powerful twister ripping across the eastern part of the nation. tornadoes occur worldwide. jeff piotrowski: europe has tornadoes. south america has tornadoes. australia, japan. trent okerson: but the united states has a unique combination of geographical features that can lend itself to a lot of tornadoes. the gulf of mexico, that provides the very warm, humid air. then you also get cooler, drier air that s either coming down from canada or off the rockies. there s really no other place in the world that has the exact combination of ingredients like we do here in the united states. storm chaser: zoom in. storm chasing has definitely evolved into this kind of social media era. storm chaser: where are we? northeast nebraska? max olson: and people wanna be seen. they wanna be, you know, the chaser that everybody thinks of, doing the live streams, posts in front of a tornado and whatnot. trent okerson: storm chasing is a double edged sword. it s very valuable when it comes to learning more about the science behind storms, but it can also be dangerous if you re not 100% sure of what you re doing. the biggest danger of storm chasing has always been the driving. storm chaser: let s go back. we re going back. we re going back. you tend to judge where the tornado is going, but that doesn t always happen. there are so many people who chase now on some storms that traffic is actually a serious problem. when i m chasing out in the plains, i m apt to see dozens of other chasers. when i began storm chasing, there were no other chasers. tim marshall: david hoadley, whether he likes it or not, is the father of modern day storm chasing. max olson: david hoadley is the first person to truly go out and seek tornadoes, driving long distances, attempting to come up with some sort of formula to see tornadoes. he holds the record for the longest consecutive years of storm chasing. i ve been storm chasing 66 years, and i ve seen 265 tornadoes. i saw my first tornado in 1958. i think this is one of the things that appealed to me was the element of, really, mystery. what causes these storms? there was so much that was unknown. 2023, i saw david hoadley out chasing. the man s 85 years old. he s been doing it for most of his life, and he s still out there doing it every single year. david hoadley: it s not like spelunking or surfboarding. you can return to the ocean. you can climb the mountains again and again and again. but that one tornado, that one storm, once it s gone, it s out. it s history. to have a picture of it, have a video or anything else of it, is to say that i ve captured something that will never happen again. tornadoes are most common 4:00 to 8:00 pm. because that s when the atmosphere is warmest, you get the sunshine, heats things up, creates the most instability. that instability is fuel for thunderstorms. mason lillard: may 22, normal sunday. we went fishing for a little bit and we were getting ready to take my cousin lage home. i was 10 and lage was 14, and my grandpa was like, hey, i need some wiring for my garage at home depot. i would say probably around 5:00, 5:15-ish, the sky s starting to get a little kind of weird looking. my grandpa went inside of home depot and my cousin, my grandma, and myself were all sitting in the truck. we heard the sirens go off, but we just ignored them like normal. and then all of a sudden it went from kind of dark to, like, midnight black, almost. we were trying to open up the doors of the truck and the winds were just going too fast. and then my cousin, he was like, whoa, the truck s tearing up. and then at that moment, the truck flipped on its side and got sucked into the vortex. we could kind of hear everything, like the hail hitting the truck and stuff. it felt terrifying to be in that tornado. you see, like, the wizard of oz, and it s almost like that. but in real life, it s loud and you don t know what s going on. lage was sucked out of the truck. i felt like i was slipping out of the truck. i was holding on to my grandma s hand, and then i felt the truck land, like, the tires bounce. and i was like, ok. i m alive, at least. all i felt was, like, my ribs were broken. i realized that something was actually in me. most people are killed in tornadoes by flying debris. storm chaser: that s the most violent motion. kim klockow mcclain: tornadoes consist of anything the tornado brings into the air. so often a lot of dust and dirt and plants, branches. and then if it s a more violent tornado, that can include debris like planks of wood, shards of glass. mason lillard: i hear my grandma. lage, lage. and i was like, mama, i hear him. he was outside of the truck. it wasn t like a, i m here, or i m ok. it was moaning. storm chaser: oh, no. there are the lines. oh my god. oh my god. look at that. harold brooks: one of the things about a tornado is that it s producing a lot of small pieces of debris that are flying at, you know, 150 miles an hour. and even ordinary objects, dinner plates, two by fours, become really, really deadly at those kinds of high speeds. jim riek: i knew after joplin how destructive a tornado could be. it was moving so slowly that it was like a blender. everything on the ground was getting totally mixed together. and it just hits you again and again and again and again. i saw a piece of cardboard that actually penetrated into the exterior insulation finish system on a school. at the hospital, they had $1 million helicopter. all of the rotors are gone. if a rotor of a helicopter is flying by at 100 miles an hour, what is that going to do to a human body? paul markowski: how far the debris goes is going to depend on essentially how heavy it is. the heavier stuff gets centrifuged out, so big chunks of structures or automobiles. lighter debris, though, like a piece of paper, that won t get centrifuged out. that ll instead go up through the funnel, can end up reaching altitudes of 40, 50,000 feet, and there certainly testimonials out there, people finding pieces of paper or photographs 50 to 100 miles from their origin in the wake of a tornado. mason lillard: we thought it was only, like, 20 minutes before help arrived. it ended up almost being two hours. jim riek: when the paramedics came, they spotted lage first because he s outside. they carried lage out on a two by four, and they brought him to the ambulance, and the paramedic jumped out and said he s not gonna make it. the other ones were trying to cut me out. i had a one inch piece of angle iron go through my right shoulder, break seven ribs, puncture my lower lung, and come out my back. a fourth inch away from my spine and a fourth inch away from my liver. they ended up having to use an electric saw. it felt like 5,000 bees stinging me at one time. and i had arrived sitting on the stretcher, sitting up. once they took my cousin to the hospital, they black tagged him and put him in the morgue. left him for death. a nurse came in and she touched his arm and he let out a horrifying scream, and she grabbed a doctor, said, i think we can save him. two hours later, he was in the or. after the tornado, i had 13 surgeries in total over the course of three years. lage was on the ventilator for at least two weeks. he has a brace on his leg and he can t really use his right arm. but he did survive. the may 22, 2011 tornado killed 158 people directly, and there were three indirect deaths. we did not know that we could experience tornadoes this deadly in modern times. harold brooks: nighttime tornadoes are more dangerous than the same tornado in the daytime, for a lot of reasons. we ascribe this to the fact that people are just less aware at night. [ominous music] i was chasing that day. what was that? oh, i think i see it. i start to see the shape of the tornado come into view. i know this is a significant tornado. oh, wow. that is huge. holy [bleep] ok. ok. ok. we got it. and then i just see the tornado, an absolute beast marching off to the northeast. ah, man, it s moving towards populated area now. it was headed from one small community to another small community, and we knew, based on where this was going, if you draw a line, it s coming right to mayfield. the mayfield event was moving at the upper end of tornado speeds, 60, 65 miles an hour. this was something that is very high end. harold brooks: speed certainly can play an impact on how dangerous a tornado is. a faster tornado is gonna give you less time to react. the speed at which the tornado is going to move along is going to roughly match the speed that the parent thunderstorm s moving along. in some cases, we ve seen storms move as fast as 60, 70, 80 miles per hour because they re embedded in very strong winds. allison chinchar: there is one example of a man in illinois back in 2013. he s filming a tornado that is off in the distance, but he quickly realizes it s actually headed right towards him and his home. man: all right. i got to go. i m coming, honey. woman: [screams] man: aw, man. woman: oh my god! allison chinchar: about 45 seconds later, he gets the look at the scope of the damage that s been done to his house. man: oh my god. our house is freaking destroyed. kim klockow mcclain: the survivors i ve spoken with, they just experience what feels like a building dissolving. one minute i was in a building and the next minute i just wasn t. like a bomb has hit it. it s obliterated. [ominous music] derek vaughan: so at its maximum intensity, the peak winds were up to 190 miles per hour. that s enough to just destroy anything in its path. nothing can stand up to that. you knew people were gonna lose their lives that night. once the tornado approached mayfield, it came in from the southwest side of town. derek vaughan: i had a few officers on shift with me that night. we had decided that we were gonna go ahead and meet at the police department. the services all started going down suddenly. the power in the entire town went off. and of course, when that happened, we knew that it was probably about to hit. i remember officer simpson went to the front window and he just yelled, there s debris coming in. and as i watched him turn and run towards us, the whole front of the building just exploded inward on us. you almost couldn t even tell which way it was up, there was much wind and debris. it was almost like being underwater. trent okerson: mayfield water and electric, their facility was just on the edge of the worst damage path. even there, you saw the massive amounts of debris that was blowing, pieces of wood flying through the air like missiles, and they weren t even directly in the core of that tornado. one of the buildings that was close to the police department that got hit real hard was the f&b bank right there on the court square. and all of a sudden, boom. the tornado hits. it s that fast. trent okerson: the candle factory is a major employer in mayfield. this was right before christmas, and a lot of people that were working extra hours trying to do overtime, and their facility was packed that friday night. autumn kirks: i was working at mcp, the candle factory, that night. me and joe did work together at the factory. usually they try not to put couples together, but for some reason, we ve always made it work. he was so goofy. he d do anything to put a smile on anybody s face. kim klockow mcclain: the night of the storm, the couple were sheltering together when the tornado hit the candle factory. i didn t hear a single thing at all. all i heard was people talking. and then all of a sudden someone said, take cover. brad copeland: the best way i can describe it would be a war zone. i remember thinking the amount of force that could have caused that, you know, how could anybody survive what i was looking at. autumn kirks: joe and i were 10 feet from each other when it first hit. trent okerson: kyanna parsons was an employee there at the candle factory, and kyanna goes on facebook live that night to try to get help from the outside. storm chaser: there s two of them. in 2011, we saw one of those generational tornado outbreaks that doesn t happen in our country but every couple decades. storm chaser: oh, dude, that looks wild. storm chaser: oh, it s right there. that s that tornado right there. storm chaser: [bleep] harold brooks: april 27, there end up being a number of storms that produce tornadoes from central mississippi eastward through alabama. and many of those storms produced multiple tornadoes. just in the state of alabama there were 62 tornadoes that hit that day. seems that every hour that passes today, the news out of the south just gets worse. kim klockow mcclain: after the alabama outbreak, there was kind of a renaissance in our field because we hadn t experienced an event that deeply catastrophic in so long. there were hundreds of fatalities, and we hadn t lost that many people in a tornado outbreak since 1974. storm chaser: oh my god. harold brooks: one of the silver linings of the april 27 outbreak was an understanding that we need to do a whole lot more work on social science with respect to forecasting. i describe myself as a tornado epidemiologist. it s really someone who tries to understand the circumstances that lead someone to be injured or die from something. what are the factors that explain fatalities, and what kinds of interventions can we design, whether in our communication system or structurally in our communities, to help mitigate that threat? among the things studied was the amount of time given to warn the public about tornadoes. a tornado warning is issued when a storm is either actively producing a tornado or it looks really likely to. and we re starting to explore what is the right amount of lead time to give people. what they figured out was there is such a thing as too much lead time. if you give people too much time, say, it s going to be 20 minutes before the tornado arrives, many people will look out their window and see that it s still blue skies. the storm hasn t gotten there yet, and either they think they have more time than they do or they think the storm isn t really going to hit them. so there is such a thing as too much lead time. also what they re studying is how people react to the warning they re given. kim klockow mcclain: fear is a really challenging component of this entire equation. there has been no example i ve seen that is clearer of this fear effect than what happened in oklahoma in 2013. on may 20, we had the tornado that went through oklahoma city and moore and killed 24 people, including several children at a school. and after that, we had just days and days of storms and everyone was just on edge. and when may 31, 2013, a two mile wide tornado hit el reno just west of oklahoma city, we saw spontaneous mass evacuation ahead of that tornado. highways were clogged for over 30 miles. they found out because of fear, people actually did the opposite of what they re supposed to do. they fled their homes. they fled their businesses, places that normally would have been safe. when that happens in mass, that becomes very dangerous. you end up getting stuck in traffic as a tornado hits. reporter: and we re still waiting to hear word on what happened to the 110 people who were inside this candle factory. derek vaughan: once we were able to get down there and assist, i saw that this whole building was just gone. so one of the things that you ll notice if you see kyanna s facebook video was how resilient she was and her efforts to stay positive. kyanna parsons: i was under the rubble approximately about three hours. i see one of the rescue people, and i m crying. i m like, please don t leave me. he says, no, no, no, we re not gonna leave you. a trooper that was at the top grabbed my arm and he pulled. and so got out, and every step i made, there was someone grabbing my hand, someone grabbing my hand, and just there for me. autumn kirks: it felt like a wall on top of me and the three girls next to me. and i don t know who it was, but somebody came and lifted it up and got us all out. the minute i actually got out, i fell to my knees and just broke because i had no idea where joe was. i wanted to go back and look for him. i was told i was not allowed. it hit friday night, and at 9:30 monday morning his mom called me. she s like, autumn, they found him. i m like and i had hope for all of two seconds. she s like, autumn, he didn t make it. i wish i could go back to not knowing because there was hope that, hey, they might still find him. i just i pray that nobody else has to go through this. trent okerson: we have so much technology, we have the ability to control so much in our lives these days. you still can t control mother nature. you can t control a tornado. you can t control what it does. and no matter how prepared you may be, you re still at the mercy of what these storms decide to do. autumn kirks: i have a very healthy respect for mother nature and tornadoes and what they can do. it can ruin your entire life. it can destroy everything you know. in 2011, after the joplin tornado, amber munson had lost her house, most of her possessions,
we re talking about cashbackin. not a game! we re talking about cashbacking. we re talking about. we re not talking about practice? no. cashbacking. word. we re talking about cashbacking. cashbacking. cashbacking. cashback like a pro with chase freedom unlimited. how do you cashback? american democracy after the hardest of things. it to believe that you are part of something bigger than yourself. we have never had a significant anniversary of d- day where democracy and western democracy felt as under threat and as fraught as it does this year. both in europe and at home. what do you make of donald trump s threats to jail his political opponents? i will talk you in about three years from now. you have to take donald trump at his word. i think there is nothing that will stop him from doing such things. the jury in hunter biden s trial was just dismissed for the weekend after emotional testimony from hunter s daughter. will wait to see whether hunter biden will testify in his own defense on monday. will you accept the jury outcome, their verdict, no matter what it is? yes. and have you ruled out a pardon for your son? yes. i just went to a riggs trial in new york. s first public campaign stops and says guilty convictions. if we don t win this country is finished. i really believe that, i think it is finished. i simply refuse to believe that america s greatness is a thing of the past. good evening once again, i am stephanie ruhle. we are now 151 days away from the election, and the contrast between the two presidential candidates could not be any clearer. this week president biden took action to close the border, and then traveled to france for the 80th anniversary of d-day where he stressed u.s. support for our allies. at donald trump, on the other hand, rallied against his guilty verdict, the judicial system, and then threatened to seek revenge with any possible person who has slighted him. let s bring in our nightcap and discuss all this. my friend, steve liesman is here. lizz winstead, cocreator of the daily show. she is also the cocreator. pablo torre, host of the public toray podcast. and to ray, host on thegrio. we look at this week you have president biden talking about freedom and the fight against tyranny, both 80 years ago and today, and then you have donald trump talking about how revenge is justified. liz, talk to us about where these two campaigns are and where they appear to be headed? tyranny of the past and tyranny of the present is basically what we are talking about. where are they heading? sometimes i honestly look at these two things and i think will the selection simply come down to will trump have more disillusioned people that won t show up or will biden have more dissolution people that won t show up? and that scares me. because i feel like for those of us doing the work, in the streets every day defending people s freedoms, if trump wins again, what we are facing is no dissent. and with no dissent we cannot challenge any of it. but, if he wins again there is no surprises about who donald trump is. in 2016 you can make the argument. people don t realize who he is. remember, he had all these people like no, no, you don t realize what you are in for. america knows exactly what they re in for. you say no. you know, there seems to be a lot of delusion. we hear a lot about the trump era was great, the trump administration was great. as if coven just did not happen. as if there was some reason why those last two years just don t count against his record. i don t remember covid but i definitely remember infrastructure week. infrastructure week was every week. i feel like trump is the most selfish person in the world, and everything revolves around me personally. every political issue comes back to me, myself. this woman asked him, this reporter asked him, katie from alabama wants to know what is your relationship with god? and he said i do very well with the evangelicals. that is not the question you were asked! and biden, to me, seems very outward. he is thinking about others. how can i help other people? think about the key moment of his life, losing a major chunk of his family in one horrific moment, as a relatively young man. who learned empathy, and to think about others and the importance of family. and this other person, who every bad characteristic we don t want our children to have, he has. i think what you said, you know, what is the question being asked and what are we trying to answer as instructed to what the biden campaign, i believe, should be trying to do? framing this even beyond needing to pay attention to the newsday today. more choice between extremism and not. i just wonder why we are not generally describing trump more as an extremist. forget about, again, let s not forget about the issues, people on the ground doing good work. when it comes to what are we expecting out of this, do you want someone who feels like they are attacking every institution, who is, again, do we need to recite the litany of felons and felonies? let s just talk about not being that. okay, but here is possibly why i think this is playing out. because, though they shouldn t be, president biden is focusing voters on democracy and on freedom. and these are fundamentally important things, but somehow they get viewed as kind of lofty ideals, and trump goes straight to the gut and grievance. because people don t know what it is like not to have it. i lived in russia for six years. they didn t understand democracy. they didn t know what it was like to not be, sort of the possibility of randomly being arrested and otherwise having appeal. but can i just go back to the beginning of the show? did all that stuff in this montage happened just this week? and there is 151 days, which means 21 weeks if my math is right. i m wondering if i have the stamina to make it through this, if this is just one week s worth of stuff. i really think this is going to be rather a dramatic, caustic, and i think biden is going to have to really bring home what is the absence of democracy, which is a very tough thing, whereas trump has only to say look, we can do all these things, everything can be great, and full of wall is not a sinitic and thing people think about. trump is a great salesman for his diseased ideas. biden has not yet shown himself to be a great salesman of his ideals, of what he has done. and there is a very significant and real and honest critique of biden from the left. that he has not done enough on what is going on in gaza. and there are a lot of people who would be democrats otherwise who will not support him because of that. i hear you. what s the conversation to have with that voter about what former president trump will do with the situation in gaza? was it not nikki haley a few weeks ago, when she went over there and said it is the job? you know, what lizz said about the margins is important. don t think about the potential, the imaginary hypothetical biden trump voter. i don t think that person really exist. there are a couple, but not many. there is a lot. know, the election is going to be about can trump get people who will say it is either trump or stay home? and can biden get people who say it is either biden or i stay home? the election is going to be won on those margins. and biden does have this significant issue, that a lot of people. there is agoing around on it tiktok . i don t know if using it. tiktok, home of misinformation central. we can talk about tiktok later. but they asked with man, gun to your head, would you vote for biden or trump? and he said the gun would go off . it is a meme that has been shared by people who are saying i will not go with any of them. this is my point about extremism or not. biden should also be as popular as the field broadly. do you want trump or anybody else? we are at a point where trump is not just specifically dystopian in the ways that we may remember or not, based on our experience during the pandemic. he is also just clearly against the will of all is the concept. so i think the question of democracy is how do you make this a tangible, scarier thing? because currently i think talking about democracy as a concept is a little pie-in-the- sky. the thing about democracy dying in darkness did not really work as a slogan for the washington post. it this week, with the remembrance of d-day, it was not just the stark contrast between president biden and donald trump. it was also between donald trump and ronald reagan. ronald reagan gave one of the most important speeches of his presidency in normandy. he stood against russian aggression, he stood with his nato allies. so isn t there question to ask of all republican voters, where has your party gone? because the current gop and what donald trump represents bears almost no resemblance to ronald reagan. correct. it is why you saw joe biden looking almost like reagan and referencing him while he was in france this week. i mean, i am just not going to go down that path, because i am somebody who doesn t have friends who are alive because of ronald reagan. so when i think about waxing back to the people who laid the foundations for this evolution, trump did not come to us in a vacuum. trump came to us because people laid foundations for hatred and bigotry and sexism. and i feel like i don t want to go back to the party that i could recognize of ronald reagan. but what i do want to say is people that we are leaving out of this conversation are the voters. i am constantly saying to people the election is not the end game. it is the starting game. you get the democracy you want and you get the democracy you participate in. and who do you want to fight? that is my whole thing. who do you want to fight? do you want to fight a madman? or do you want to fight somebody who might listen to you where you can get the needle move? because these other people. i do not think the election is going to be won by biden if he is taking democracy his issue. i think it has to be the economy. all of our polling shows people are most concerned about inflation, most concerned about jobs, most concerned about the economy. democracy should be like the sprinkles you get with the ice cream cone, if the ice cancun is the economy. but without a functioning democracy you can throw your economy out the window. that the economy is always the number one issue. finish your thought. i was just going to say that if he does not win it on the record that he is running on which is a strong one. which is a pretty strong one , and a vision of the future, i don t think he wins it by saying i am the democracy guy and that guy isn t. we are talking two different languages as far as the folks who may vote for biden and the folks who may vote for trump. i mean, this is not about issues at all. this is about personality. this is about who you believe. and the people on the right, like joy reed talks about earth one and earth two. the people on the right live on earth two. and we can sit here and believe the nothing that you believe is factual. we can go on and on. january 6, climate change, the election, the trial. but they are affirmed in their miss belief constantly, and they think we don t know what is reality. this is why i feel like the whole felonies thing should and hopefully does cut through to a silent majority, not to evoke reaganism s, but a silent majority of people who are like i am in earth one resident that i am just not that proud of it. it is, for me, a bridge too far, when we have a convicted felon surrounded by felons being again in the white house. i feel like i just want to simplify it down to do you want the felony guy or anyone else? that is a great question. donald trump wanted more than his face, wouldn t he be doing everything possible to court the nikki haley voter? he disrespected nikki haley in every possible way and still she endorsed him. if she actually wanted to win, it wouldn t he say she is my running mate, let s go for the gold? he hasn t, instead it is president biden who is putting together a coalition to try to go to for those voters and risking losing progressive voters in the mix. i wonder when we say nikki haley voter, i would wonder if they were not so psyched about nikki haley, or if they were just like i don t want trump. i am not like everything about nikki haley is just awesome. people weren t saying that. i feel like him going for that voter after he saw emma we saw the numbers after iowa. was it 28% of those people who said if nikki haley is not the nominee i could possibly vote for biden? i think when trump doesn t go out and try to expand his base he never has. but let me finish. why is even doing that? that should be the sign to everybody, he is not trying to expand past due. he is not looking at a world for you. can i do some reporting here with lizz ? i might be messing up the order of your show here. but when roe was first overturned we saw abortion rise up to the top of issues. since then we have seen it fall down. and i know the democrats are making a big deal of the abortion issue. do you think it is something that motivates voters? i don t think it is going to be democracy, and i am wondering if it is going to be abortion as something that trumps the economy, for lack of a better term, and becomes a real motivating issue. well, i am the right person to ask. no, no, only because you might not know this, i am on the ground all the time talking to people. and this is where democrats are actually making a mistake. i do think abortion, abortion polls better than politicians. in these ballot initiatives we are seeing in over a dozen states were initiated by the people, not by politicians. by the people. people who held their abortion stories to themselves for years, saw this as a time, and this isn t a couple people. you have to get 200, 500 in florida, 900,000 validated signatures to get it on the ballot. the question is will people vote for biden and the initiative, what we saw in kansas, the very first one, that people voted overwhelmingly for their abortion initiative and still voted for some of the people who created the laws in the first place. what? so, what we should carefully be looking at is these initiatives, i think, are going to greatly help down ballot. they are going to help senate races and places that will be surprising. congressional races. and will people say i am going to vote for everybody but biden? that is the question somebody needs to answer. we can do that in the next poll. we can ask about that. please do. the president took pretty aggressive action on immigration this week. it has been a vulnerability for him. republicans are going to say it is too little too late. how do you think it is going to play out? and just to be clear, republicans have done nothing on immigration, and thanks to donald trump, blotch doing anything legislative. this is how the republican party has shifted the overton window in their direction. we talked about the border, and about immigration. immigration is not a central issue in american life. it is not the source of crime, it is not changing the economy. republicans have made it this central issue. and people believe it. whether it actually is an issue in daily life are not is somewhat irrelevant, because republicans have been successful in convincing the american people. that s what i m saying, they have made us think about it when it is not as important as they wanted to be. i think this is the frustration for anybody who is not trump, joe biden specifically. your running election campaign, and administration based on it, i think, a practical execution of hopefully reasonable and increasingly moderated policies, and donald trump is running on vibes. it is a vibes based campaign. and the question, fundamentally, returns to turnout. vibes is too polite award for a period anger, resentment, ancient nightmares awake into the bloodstream of people who feel like they re being threatened by non-threats. i m sorry, i have a different view on this. i want to see the person advising biden on the politics of immigration fired. i think he has been behind the curve on this. he has let the republicans take this to a place where it shouldn t go. from a narrative perspective, but not a policy perspective. what have they done on the policy front? from a narrative perspective, if he is doing what he is doing now, why couldn t he have done that months ago? okay, fine. but hold on. you can argue with when he did it, but now he is doing it. now he is doing it. what have republicans done? nothing. they have objected to a deal that was apparently done that was agreed to, but the second thing i wanted say they want to continue to set this up as a problem. the second thing i want to say is there are some issues where you want to take on the lack of facts and the misdirection had on. this issue of immigration, i think, should be one that should be approached with much more sympathy for the people who are afraid and scared, and i think rather than head on white, which people? the immigrants? the people in montana who are worried about people crossing the border in xcode. you don t make it to montana. never make it to montana. so we should worry about what people in montana and west virginia should think about it? we already do. this is what is motivating them. and i think there is a way to address this in a way that is more understanding and less in- your-face. more understanding of what white people in montana think? exactly. here s why, because they vote. i don t think steve is saying because they are white. hold on a second. i don t think it steve is saying that person in montana is right. i think what he is saying is they vote. at the very least you have to acknowledge who that person is, where they are, and speak to them. the issue has already coddled them immensely by wrapping them in this notion of the demonization, i mean, so many americans would think of immigration and think of somebody getting murdered by an immigrant. but that is not the core of our relationship with immigrants in this country. and the right has made it that. yes, but the most important word that you said right there is made. because they made it that. because they solidified this falsehood, you have to at least address it and try to start solving for them. and you understand how people are scared? but who is scared? white people? white people. but we are continuing to be asks to be sensitive to the fears of white people? that are not real fears. it does not matter if they are real fears. they vote. i guess it is my question. genuine human empathy is being considered anybody s peers. i think we are trying to do empathy but also cold calculus about getting their votes. we are trying to disabuse them of the lies and ways that damages them in terms of their sense of security and sense of self. but before we get back in, i just want to ask what does it take to coddle the abstract montana and that is afraid that someone in mexico is coming over to take their job? there is a community i know in wyoming. they had no people from south america. all of a sudden they had 12 people. this was a huge change for them, and everybody, all of a sudden they had to teach esl. great, and guess what? that town in montana or wyoming had jobs for those people. they absolutely did, and those people added to the jobs and there were not people to do the jobs they were doing. all that is good stuff. i am just saying the change, the challenge makes people uncomfortable. i am wondering before we take them head-on if there is a way to talk to them. in an understanding way. last point. this is bigger than the immigration. because this is the republican pattern. create a fear that is not real, pass legislation that only harms other people, then the fear stopped because it never existed. and they think they won. they have done it with abortion, they have done it with lgbtq, trans people. there s kids who are pooping and cat boxes in schools! no, there isn t. if they were kids pooping in cat boxes in schools, high school kids would have put it on instagram. so, to me, it is a microcosm of the playbook and how do we dismantle that playbook to stop having that fear, and stopping the bs around it? we have to go to commercial, but i don t actually think you and steve disagree. i don t. no, i am not prioritizing the feelings of white so we do disagree. but i think that all steve is trying to say here is these people and their fears, he is not saying let s appeal to them. but if we simply ignore it then we are sending this people into trump s arms. we can practically see the statue of liberty when we walk outside this building. we are supposed to be a nation that welcomes immigrants. i mean, none of us were born here, right? but now we have this very hateful, xenophobic approach to a certain kind of immigrant. it is disgusting, and the notion that we should kowtow to the fears that have been grading these people. i am not saying you are kowtowing to anything, but if you don t at least speak to that person you are sending them into the arms of donald trump and going wild are that these people voting for donald trump? because they are getting it to work. and i am not saying they should be coddled. i am saying shouldn t we at least acknowledge them and get a basis of truth back to the center? this is part of what we are talking about when the new york times does what is going on in the world? we ask trump voters. they don t care, we don t care what they think. we don t have to be constantly checking in with what they think. i also think it is the responsibility of white people to educate white people. it should not be placed on lichen brown people and immigrants. i would like to know what it would take to achieve the persuasion that immigrants are not so scary. i would like a practical proposal before i decide to sort of center the feelings of people who are fed lies. what if you didn t reject the fears? and by the way, i am wanting to correct the record. i m not talking about coddling the fears of white people. i feel like there 20 a black and brown people concerned about immigrants coming over the border, taking their jobs. no one is taking anyone s jobs, we have a labor shortage. you have been there could be a rainbow coalition of people who believe that there isn t. i think we acknowledge the people have a right to have fear and be concerned, and not dismiss those fears. besides the four of you, someone else is screaming at me and it is the producers. we have to go to a commercial. there s five people yelling. when we return, the last four years have been great for the wealthiest americans. so i want to know why so many of the richest of the rich are opening their wallets, their hearts, their minds, and buying into his propaganda and pushing donald trump. i need some answers to this. and later, phenom caitlin clark gets hip checked and starts a bigger conversation about women s basketball when our nightcap and the 11th hour continues. s. no other complete hiv pill uses fewer medicines to help keep you undetectable than dovato. detect this: marnina learned that most hiv pills contain 3 or 4 medicines. dovato is as effective with just 2. if you have hepatitis b, don t stop dovato without talking to your doctor. don t take dovato if you re allergic to its ingredients or taking dofetilide. this can cause serious or life-threatening side effects. if you have a rash or allergic reaction symptoms, stop dovato and get medical help right away. serious or life-threatening lactic acid buildup and liver problems can occur. tell your doctor if you have kidney or liver problems, or if you are pregnant, breastfeeding, or considering pregnancy. dovato may harm an unborn baby. most common side effects are headache, nausea, diarrhea, trouble sleeping, tiredness, and anxiety. detect this: you could stay undetectable with fewer medicines. ask your doctor about dovato. craig here pays too much for verizon wireless. so he sublet half his real estate office. you could stay undetectable with fewer medicines. [ bird squawks loudly ] to a pet shop. meg s moving company uses t-mobile. so she scaled down her fleet to save money. and don s paying so much for at&t, he s been waiting to update his equipment! there s a smarter way to save. comcast business mobile. you could save up to 70% on your wireless bill. so you don t have to compromise. powering smarter savings. powering possibilities. in the week since donald trump was found guilty of 34 counts in a new york courtroom, some of the wealthiest americans have come out to announce their support for him. steve, i really, really want to talk about this. because just in the last week donald trump has this new crop of not even your average wall street is disguised. i mean the top of the top most successful. coming out, throwing parties for him, supporting him, and even making arguments that are not true. in the last 24 hours i have heard some of these guys say well, when joe biden asked that last covid relief, which, you know, killed us in terms of inflation. unemployment had already completely recovered. that is a lie. and an uninformed voter might not realize that. but i am talking about the most informed voters, the most successful guys in business are pushing trump lies on their, in a field that is their own expertise. why is this? the corporate tax cuts are going to be on the table in 2025. if you end up supporting trump you are most likely to keep those corporate tax cuts and lower tax brackets, because, by the way, i don t think trump is going to address the deficit at all, either. the record shows that perhaps some of the fiscal spending had a part in the inflation, but it was more about supply shocks, the inability to get stuff into the country, the reduction in the ability to spend on services, so all this money to buy patio furniture and stuff like that, all of the sudden that shot up and all of a sudden we had problems with some food distribution. and that has come off in a very big way. there has been extraordinary progress on the inflation rate but has not brought down the inflation level. and don t overstated, biden has plenty of very, very wealthy supporters. but you are right to point out how extraordinary it is that some of these folks, especially in tech land, are the ones who are out there saying i am going to vote for trump or support trump. and to read, for example, david sachs tweet today on the economy is just to be amazed that a guy with that much money . here s the thing. i get that inflation is difficult. these people who are now supporting donald trump have had extraordinary, extraordinary last few years. bill ackman this week, what is it announced? he is worth $8 million. think of everything president biden has done for electric vehicles. a huge win for elon musk. yet they are railing against this disastrous economy, when it has been a perfect one for them. i think, first off, taxes, let s start with that. and then get to realizing that for these guys, in silicon valley especially, shame feels like a market inefficiency. wait, hold on, if i don t have to care about the judgments of people who are paying attention to the news, maybe i can do the thing that donald trump offers uniquely, in my memory, of american presidents. which is the ability to dictate actual policy. the ability to get favors. i feel like this is the other part of the trump administration that goes underrated because we are talking about the bed of nails that is every single scandal. he is for sale. look at the adelson family. go down the risk of donors and what you get. if you are tech billionaire, ceo, philosopher, king. that is what these guys want to be. they know better. they may think trump is an idiot, and i think they do, but they also think they can puppeteer hemenway s, and they can help run the country. and that is something that joe biden does not offer them. the white house is for sale. and in some way, is this like re-creating putin s oligarchs, but here? you know, i have been listening to you, and i can t believe we are here, again. and a real chance that he might win. and something i ve read the criminologist talk about, the reason why jail does not work as a deterrent. because a lot of people do a stint in prison and they come out and they go oh, i can do that. now i m going to go back to the street, because that wasn t that bad. and for a lot of people they are like we survived trump. it wasn t that bad. covid does not count on his record, for some reason. and they are like we could do this again. and it doesn t make any sense. and i get a footnote to the oligarch story? a lot of those guys ended up exiled and dead. i don t know that all the people who are supporting trump understand the final end result of kleptocracy. okay, because you are asking for people to have something beyond short-term. it works for a little bit. but, see, we are talking about hugely successful masters of the universe who believe well, that will never happen to me. you know that is the way they all think. i think that is right. they re not thinking it through. i think they are also missing, getting back to the first conversation we had, the essential connection between democracy and free markets. what makes free markets work is the rule of law, and if the rule of law is something that is on the whim of the president you have a real problem with your free markets. lizz, let s talk about sort of these loud, influential voices were suddenly backing former president trump. why they would be doing it. i understand, inflation is a really difficult. you want to buy a house, rent an apartment, get any insurance, things are really difficult. but suddenly this group of people backing the former president, it does not really make sense from a policy perspective. why do you think it is happening? well, when you look at how many of them are feel adjacent, this is not my will house. but i d do see and have met and have been hit on by very, very, very rich and powerful men. and all those zeroes don t add inches, and somehow i think they do. and if that stays in the show i am proud of you. i promise you it will. because honestly, i don t have an answer. we are on life. is a family show until now. but honestly, what is the thing you are missing? what is the emotional thing you are missing? you are talking about the intellect of these individuals, and so much of it is about the performance of this analogy that trump offers, the ego. and if you have a massive ego, one of these masters of the universe, wall street, silicon valley, i completely understand why you rock with trump. because that ego seems to be like that is my guy, that s the guy want to be with. i am also just not convinced that they actually like him. that s correct, they don t. they think he is a puppet. i think that they are unbothered by the performance that trump does, which is a key, visceral distinction that i have with these people. but also, i think, what they want is power. trump offers them power. these guys right now believe they can purchase a bat phone into the oval office if donald trump wins. and it was funny, somebody on tv said to me the other day, yeah, but what if donald trump turns on them? what if he doesn t deliver than that? he might, though. and joe biden definitively will not. so they will roll the dice. i think we make a mistake in this country, that because you made a lot of money here you must be smart about things over here. we do it all the time on cnbc, and it is something that i disagree with. but like we will have a billionaire and asked him what he thinks about healthcare. and unless he made his billions in healthcare i am not really sure i care. it s a great point. it s interesting, but it is not essential. it is interesting as we talk , that the pronoun hymn has been used to bunch. because we ve been talking a bunch about men. and even when you said because they make money here they don t do it over there, when you think of somebody who is a billionaire, like the woman who invented spanks. sarah blakely. people are not going to sarah blakely, what do you think about what is going on over there? i don t anybody is asking these guys. these guys have realized they can become business celebrities. do you think somebody a year and half ago said what does bill ackman think about anything other than investing? no one asked him. but now he is posting tweets. it became a twitter personality. so the adrenaline addiction is real. they are all addicted to dealmaking, and now they have become business celebrities. this is a part of capitalism. the people who succeeded the most and capitalism must be the most intelligent people in the country. trump succeeded in capitalism. soon enough, he did not. he did! he took a big chunk of money from his dad. lost a bigger chunk. right, we think of him, he is so dumb. he is proof that you can be wealthy and done at the same time. is also not a successful business person. everyone is staying right here. when we return, fans love her. but caitlin clark is getting a mixed reception from the players in her first year of going pro. why one foul has people talking when the 11th hour in the nightcap continues. introducing new advil targeted relief. the only topical pain reliever with 4 powerful pain-fighting ingredients that start working on contact to target tough pain at the source. for up to 8 hours of powerful relief. new advil targeted relief. - so this is pickleball? 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(vo) new and existing customers get iphone 15 on us when they trade in any iphone. verizon it s time to get away and cash in at cache creek casino resort. to rock and to roll. to go all out or go all in with four stars and rising stars. northern california s premier casino resort is the perfect place to do as much. or as little as you want. make your getaway now and cache in at cache creek casino resort. basketball star caitlin clark continues to crowd the spotlight as her wnba career kicks off. but it is a foul against her from nearly a week ago that is still in the headlines. pablo, she got body checked by another player. so why are people still talking about it? walk us through what happened in the line of all these new threads. on some level it is a simple story. it was a hard foul, should have been called a flagrant. wasn t, had to be assessed as such retroactively. but the reason it has continued is because it fits into this larger story, which is less and less about caitlin clark, and is a through line for today s show, perhaps, and more and more about us, the voters, so to speak. because it is a perfect culture war story. uninformed voters versus informed voters. and it is about vibes. so i want to address the feelings, because these are sincerely held. it is more than just the great white hope. it is more than just a minority group in this sport actually being a majority outside of it. wnba famously is 60% black women. so you have this star who is bringing attention, record ratings, real business for the first time in the history of the sport. and simultaneous to that you have a lot of people who pre- existed in this sport, who built this sport, who are saying we have not felt the advantages of being the majority group in a business that now everybody cares about. and so, a lot of people have a point, is my point here. caitlin clark is a great player. she deserves the conversation and the height and the attention and the money. and at the same time, those are advantages that are not granted to others because there is a novelty, as well as the substance to it. it is an endless culture war story which everyone can get mad at everyone for a very long time. i think i feel also the resentment of the women who are already there, who are like oh, you think this college kid is going to come in and dominate us? and at the time it seemed you guys are being rude and resentful. and no, actually, it is very hard to move from college to the pros in any sport, even if you are, maybe, one of the best, the best college players ever. we are going to do this entirely differently. we are stronger, faster, more experienced. it is going to be hard for you. so slow down, don t think you re going to walk in and take over. i have nothing to say. remember how i said that i didn t think rich people should be talking about healthcare? i am pretty sure the economics reporter should not be talking about sports. but how is there so much confusion here? suddenly the wnba has all these new fans, and they are watching a game. a game, a rough game that is played year after year. but suddenly the first game they have ever seen, the player who they love, they are seeing get pushed around and they are going, i mean, there was a republican lawmaker who was complaining about this. where you are going this is just how the game is played. yeah, would they feel that way if it was angel reese who got knocked to the ground like that? no. she did get knocked to the ground like that, and nobody cared. this is the other part of the story. sports are supposed to be fueled by hatred. by bad blood. by feuding. this is stuff that is great. part of the reason why i want to buy stock, business metaphor, buy stock in the nba is because people are actually invested in it emotionally, and that comes from having bad blood. the thing that is dystopian, lizz, which movie you can appreciate on this level, too. i love dystopian. yes, we are talking not so much about the story, and more about how everybody hates everybody else because they see themselves in it. and for me it becomes a culture war story, and when i say it is an endless forever war of a culture war story i mean it is because, in sports, we are still arguing about whether lebron james or michael jordan is better. we have been doing that for decades upon decades. some precincts have been reporting that it is jordan. but the point is this is not a thing that can be solved this positively by play. it is going to be, again, about how you feel. and being a minority group in a majority female, black sport that outside of that sport affords you advantages that track with the money and the attention and the privilege, it is like it is fair to object to all of this and it is fair to also say you are making too much of it, because isn t she just a basketball player? and this i will also say. i think it is also fair to say that caitlin clark knows the game that caitlin clark is in. caitlin clark is not saying anything. it is like taylor swift, when the whole taylor swift beyonce feud was happening, they were both like there ain t no feud. this happens in this sport. i just feel like caitlin clark is not screaming. there is a whole lot of pundits speaking, there is a whole lot of things. and what you said is real. the pundit point is important. because race is always a part of sports, we don t always talk about it, but it is always there. and not just what happens on the floor, but also because the vast majority of people who cover sports are white, and male , and generally they are covering, especially in basketball, covering a lot of black people. so, in this situation you see the white girl who is supposed to be the new star, who is changing everything, and she gets thrown to the ground by somebody. the white pundits especially are like oh my god, how could you do that to her? but it is not just about race. it is a lot about the fact that these sports analysts are men. as i have seen black sports analysts this week go on and on, shocked by this saying these girls out there are being mean girls to each other. in the same sports analysts watch football year after year, they watch rookies get the crap kicked out of them going that is on the game is played. but when it comes to women doing it they are like look at these mean girls up in here. and that is bull nonsense. and i agree with you. overwhelmingly it is not that the rest of the wnba is jealous and deceiving like this is a high school cafeteria over caitlin clark. but there are a couple of people who feel that way. if you were to tell me watch this clip of angel reese celebrating caitlin clark falling to the ground i can t convince you objectively that she is not taking some enjoyment. now, does that rise to the level of jealousy and mean girl stuff? i am not going to categorize it as such. but i believe in that he and bad blood can coexist. it is just a we over characterize it as this is a sport where this should not happen, all sports are fueled by this. this is my observation. i want to know if this is true. is less contact countenanced in the wnba than the nba? is even more physical. we have to take a commercial. it s more physical? yes. does ladies know how to get it done. what i want to know is all this talk about the wnba, is it helping the game? we don t know yet. everybody is staying put. when we come back are nightcap returns with our mvps of the week. you do not want to miss it when the nightcap continues. e night kisqali is a pill that when taken with an aromatase inhibitor helps delay cancer from growing and has been proven to help people live significantly longer across three separate clinical trials. so, i have the confidence to live my life. kisqali can cause lung problems or an abnormal heartbeat, which can lead to death. it can cause serious skin reactions, liver problems, and low white blood cell counts that may result in severe infections. avoid grapefruit during treatment. tell your doctor right away if you have new or worsening symptoms, including breathing problems, cough, chest pain, a change in your heartbeat, dizziness, yellowing of the skin or eyes, dark urine, tiredness, loss of appetite, abdomen pain, bleeding, bruising, fever, chills, or other symptoms of an infection, a severe or worsening rash, are or plan to become pregnant, or breastfeeding. long live life and long live you. ask your doctor about kisqali today. welcome to the wayborhood. and long live you. with wayfair, finding your style is fun. 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[ music stops ] i m sorry, carl. this is me in chair form. i don t see you. -oh, come on. this one s perfect for you. but you. love it. i told you we should have done a piñata. i explained it so many times. um-hum. they re not sitting. -and it rocks. you need to sit down. wayfair. every style. every home. i don t know how long it s been there. long enough to produce eggs, it seems. it would appear that it has begun moving towards us! visionworks. see the difference. are nightcap is still here with the mvps of the week. who had the biggest we can your mind? one of my heroes, peppermint patty murray from washington state who took on an antiabortion physician who spoke in front of the senate and actually lied about that iuds were actually an abortion, and patty murray called her out on it. it is a public service to everybody. an iud prevents implantation of a fertilized egg. you cannot have a pregnancy unless the fertilized egg is implanted in the uterus. that is a fact. and this doctor, who is somebody s doctor, lied in front of the senate. and patty murray was like smacked down today. go, patty. another yelling at me because we are going to run out of time, but we should just think about this for a second. that person who sat there and told that lie with a political agenda is somebody s doctor. who is your mvp? i wanted to go in a different direction. corey harris, who became viral out of driving to his resume hearing about driving with a suspended license. hold on, walk us through. because people are not going to know this name but everyone saw this video. he drove to his resume hearing with the judge on his suspended license hearing. and everybody is like oh my god, what an idiot. and surely he made some bad decisions. and it came out that he has actually never had a driver s license. but the end result of all of this is that he ended up in jail for a nonviolent offense. he was not even intending to hurt anyone, and it is easy to look at an individual and say you should have behaved differently. more important to look at the systems and the institutions and say you should behave differently. why are we using jail as a corrective for something like this? a nonviolent offense like this? we are over incarcerating nonviolent offenders way too much in this country. and this is a prime example of somebody who should not be in jail. there are many, many other ways to make the situation work. cindy eldon is the clerk for esmeralda county in nevada. and she is undergoing a withering criticism at a recall petition. she is a republican from supporter, and there are people in that county the believe that there was problems with the election because trump only one of the county of about 700 people by 82%. and this wonderful story in the new york times about this clerk who is being criticized by her neighbors and all the people she has known for life is a reminder that democracy is not a mountain. it is not a building. it exists because of local officials, and the reason why the 2020 election was not overturned is because of these actions by these local officials . these people, i think, democrats, republicans, non- partisans all our heroes that make democracy still exist in this country, and don t take it for granted. and i am on a bipartisan crusade of my own. good luck with that. red panda is somebody that you may know if you have seen a basketball game. she happens to be the greatest halftime performer of all time. red panda is the older chinese woman and immigrant to this country who gets on a unicycle, elevated many feet in the air, balances holes on her foot, and kicks them off to her head repeatedly. and the crusade i launch after watching her perform in game one of the nba finals yesterday is simply this. at the basketball hall of fame has never inducted a halftime performer. it should be red panda, and i want to address america, the world, on my various social media platforms i have a change.org petition. this is a real thing. all of you guys at this table need to sign it. i am begging you. we need to demonstrate that this person, read anda, is a part of history and should be remembered to me as such. right on. we are ready to sign it. my mvp, the families from the sandy hook elementary school in newtown, connecticut. if you remember, talkshow host alex jones spread lie after lie of what happened in that elementary school in connecticut. the families of those children, those five and six-year-old children who were killed sued this man for defamation and they won nearly $1.5 billion in damages. but all sorts of cynics out there, me included, thought they are never going to see the money. a guy like this is going to move his assets, put them under family members names or friends, it will never happen. on thursday, yesterday, alex jones filed for chapter 7 bankruptcy, basically liquidating all of his assets. why? for the families who face the most devastating loss and then had to hear the lies that he pushed. this was all made up, and these families have said the money is not the most important thing. the most important thing is that he stops doing this. that might not ever happen, but we are one step closer to these families having one ounce of justice, and i welcome it. thank you all for being here. it was a pleasure to have you all. have a great weekend. thank you, thank you, thank you. we are going to be right back. the virus that causes shingles is sleeping. in 99% of people over 50. it s lying dormant, waiting. and could reactivate. shingles strikes as a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. and it could wake at any time. think you re not at risk for shingles? it s time to wake up. because shingles could wake up in you. if you re over 50, talk to your doctor or pharmacist about shingles prevention. hi. my name is kim and i am 41 years old. i ve been given the opportunity to work from home, so that means lots of video calls. i see myself more and i definitely see those deeper lines. i m still kim and i got botox® cosmetic. i wanted to keep the expressions that i would normally have, you know, you re on camera and the only person they can look at is you. i was really happy with the results. i look like me just with fewer lines. botox® cosmetic is fda approved to temporarily make frown lines, crow s feet, and forehead lines look better. the effects of botox® cosmetic may spread hours to weeks after injection, causing serious symptoms. alert your doctor right away as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems, or muscle weakness may be a sign of a life-threatening condition. do not receive botox® cosmetic if you have a skin infection. side effects may include allergic reactions, injection site pain, headache, eyebrow, eyelid drooping and eyelid swelling. tell your doctor about your medical history, muscle or nerve conditions, and medications, including botulinum toxins, as these may increase the risk of serious side effects. see for yourself at botoxcosmetic.com. sup? -who are you? as these may increase the risk i m your inner child. get in. listen. what you really need in life is some freakin torque. [ engine revving ] oh yeah man, horsepower keeps you going, but torque gets you going. [ engine revving ] oh now we re torquin ! - i love car puns! oh, i know. pppp-powershot! [ engine revving ] [ laughing ] the dodge hornet r/t. the totally torqued-out crossover. norman, bad news. i never graduated from med school. what? -but the good news is. xfinity mobile just got even better! now, you can automatically connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go. plus, buy one unlimited line and get one free for a year. i gotta get this deal. i know. faster wifi and savings? .i don t want to miss that. that s amazing doc. mobile savings are calling. visit xfinitymobile.com to learn more. doc? [crowd cheering] it may not seem like it, but this, is actually progress in play. a shell energy 100% renewable electricity plan lighting every soccer match at shell energy stadium. we re moving forward with the houston dash. because we re moving forward with everybody. shell. powering progress.
that s it for me. thanks for watching. tune in tomorrow where i am speaking with congressman jerry connelly. plus, senior adviser and spoke s person for president biden s campaign, adrienne elrod joins us to talk importance of border security to voters ahead of november s election tomorrow at 6:00 p.m. eastern on msnbc. follow us on social media using the handle, at weekend capehart. listened every episode of our show as a podcast for free. scan the qr code on your screen to follow. but, keep it right here. a frightening film about a serial killer. robert barnsley: .he d say, when you re turning the blade, grit your teeth and really really show that you re enjoying it. we had talked about how would you kill somebody and get away with it. i had dark thoughts and shared them with the serial killer. it was supposed to be a movie, a frightening film about a serial killer. you grit your teeth and really show that you on bare enjoying it. but, was it really just pretend? eels get down on the ground and took out duct tape. i have never in my life felt fear like that. a rising young film director filming a murder, or actually committing one? he told me well, you liked dexter. when you take a step back you realize this is a real man who has been murdered. the script was darker than anyone knew. like holy mackerel. who are you, really? everyone was on the edge of their seat. and underground parking garage, you are watching a violent attack caught on tape. who was this? what is happening? or, did it happen at all? movies, like that one, are by design, deceptive. make-believe worlds, but have you noticed maybe it is all the technical doodads and digital cameras. some stories that claim to be true or not. anybody can manipulate reality, sometimes what they say is true is it. sometimes, fiction turns out to be fact, and then there are stories, just a few, and which fact and fiction fuse and that is where we are going tonight, a twilight zone world of illusion and deception and deceit. follow the howling wind north across a vast prairie through brief, brilliant summers and winters as frigid as any on earth to a metropolis canadians call the gateway to the north, the city whose police department stays very busy. this is detective bill clark. the city is edmonton, canada. today i got a call from a family whose son was killed in december. nothing in a career so strange as the case of a man who went missing and bill clark found himself in another world between fantasy and illusion. have you ever seen a case like this before? never in my life. when it started out, it seemed perfectly simple, a missing man, some guy just dropped out of sight, the kind of thing that tends to sort itself out once the so-called victim sobers up. i m not thinking much is going to come of this. after clark s decades of service in the city with the highest murder rate in canada, you can hardly blame them for getting a little picky. we don t usually go to missing person. unfortunately, for us to come out you ve got to be dead and it had better be criminal. if the patrolman doesn t know it s criminal, don t bother calling us. yeah, you got enough to do. which explains perhaps why some of the locals have taken to calling their city, deadmonton. our concern is, do we have a foul play. the missing person in this case is a man by the name of john altinger. 39, single, worked in the oil industry, liked to ride motorcycles. unlucky with women, yet, a wide circle of friends who are now telling the police altinger seem to have dropped off the face of the earth except the strange emails he was sending. i ve left with a woman, i m going to costa rica. one of the recipients of those old emails, his old friend, debra taichrob. i received several of them. i received six altogether, but in runs of three. the exact same message? hi there, i ve met a wonderful girl named jen. i m going to costa rica and i will keep in touch and call you when i get back after the holidays. johnny. almost formal, and away, suddenly like somebody you didn t really know was sending you an email. absolutely, and i was like that s really odd, it doesn t sound like john. it was odd, and even more so when another friend of altinger s received exactly the same message word for word and altinger s facebook status change from single to in a relationship. i think it was the following day, i was on msn messenger and johnny popped on mine, so i thought oh, he must not have left on his vacation yet, and it said johnny, his name, and then in quotations beside his name, who says i ve got a one- way ticket to heaven and i m never coming back. later that same day, debra got a call from the same friend who told her john altinger seems to be missing. it s surreal, you know. you don t expect your friends to go missing. soon, altinger s friends got together, unsure of what to do, really but before going to police, they decided to try to get into his condo, to see if they could find a clue what happened to get the guy in the break-in, actually. everything looked fine. nothing out of place, no sign of any struggle. the only things missing were his wallet, his keys and his red mazda coop, so it was as if he had gone out for a drive and could be back any minute. there were no answers to anything, like he just vanished out of thin air. except for those strange emails he had supposedly sent about falling in love and coaster rica, which to the cops, said clark, seemed perfectly reasonable. not hard to imagine that a lovestruck man might want to leave the snow and ice of edmonton behind and skip off to the tropics. the sky send these emails to his friends and we are going well, that strange, but maybe he did go to costa rica. stranger things have happened. you never know. that is how clark felt before he stepped through the looking glass. coming up, detective clark is about to follow john altinger s trail into a strange place of make-believe , and up-and- coming directors makeshift movie studio. it s a suspense thriller, actually. it s a short film. as soon as they called me on the phone, i got this weird chill. when dateline continues. with wegovy®, i lost 35 pounds. and some lost over 46 pounds. and i m keeping the weight off. wegovy® helps you lose weight and keep it off. i m reducing my risk. wegovy® is the only fda-approved weight-management medicine that s proven to reduce risk of major cardiovascular events in adults with known heart disease and with either obesity or overweight. wegovy® shouldn t be used with semaglutide or glp-1 medicines. don t take wegovy® if you or your family had medullary thyroid cancer, multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if allergic to it. stop wegovy® and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, or an allergic reaction. serious side effects may happen, including pancreatitis and gallbladder problems. wegovy® may cause low blood sugar in people with diabetes, especially if you take medicines to treat diabetes. tell your provider about vision problems or changes, or if you feel your heart racing while at rest. depression or thoughts of suicide may occur. call your provider right away if you have any mental changes. common side effects like nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea may lead to dehydration, which may cause kidney problems. with wegovy®, i m losing weight, i m keeping it off. and i m lowering my cv risk. that s the power of we. check your cost and coverage before talking to your health care professional about wegovy®. you re the one that i want nexgard® combo is the only monthly topical that protects against fleas, ticks, tapeworms, and more. use with caution in cats with a history of seizures or neurologic disorders. nexgard combo,. you re the one that i want .the monthly one-and-done you want. introducing new advil targeted relief. the only topical pain reliever with 4 powerful pain-fighting ingredients that start working on contact to target tough pain at the source. for up to 8 hours of powerful relief. new advil targeted relief. [coughing] copd isn t pretty. i m out of breath, and often out of the picture. but this is my story. ( ) and with once-daily trelegy, it can still be beautiful. because with 3 medicines in 1 inhaler, trelegy keeps my airways open for a full 24 hours and prevents future flare-ups. trelegy also improves lung function, so i can breathe more freely all day and night. trelegy won t replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. do not take trelegy more than prescribed. trelegy may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. what a wonderful world [laughing] ask your doctor about once-daily trelegy for copd because breathing should be beautiful, all day and night. condominium, as you can see, looked like anything because breathing should be beautiful, but a crime scene. there were no signs of a struggle, no blood. it was like he just stepped out for a few minutes, could be back anytime. where was he? johnny s friends were convinced something awful had happened to him. so, day after day, they prodded the police; john altinger s condominium looked like anything but a crime scene. there were no signs of a struggle, no blood. it was like he just stepped out for a few minutes and could be back anytime. where was he? and johnny s friends were convinced something awful had happened to him, so day after day, they prodded the police and finally, seven days after johnny went missing, the cops agreed to open an investigation. we just started with the basics. i said with got to start out by finding out if we can find him first so let s find the car. since john altinger s email said he had taken off for costa rica, officers went to the airport to look for that red mazda. they searched every parking lot. it wasn t here. they come through airline passenger lists. he was not on any of them. johnny s friends, meanwhile, went back to the apartment for another look and found, stashed away among his important papers, his passport. they re going oh, not getting out of the country without your passport. seemed like he had to be within driving distance but what direction where? just as the police were contemplating that puzzle, one of altinger s friends came up with another email. this one, johnny had received from a woman he met online. janet was her name, the same woman with whom he had supposedly scampered off to costa rica. they had a date and were going out on the town the night he disappeared and because he had never been to her place, she sent him an email with directions on how to pick her up and out of an abundance of caution, he sent a copy of that email to a friend of his, just in case. i can t remember the last word of the email but he says if anything happens to me, you know where i m at, and you know, laugh out loud. it wasn t a phone number or an address, but there were detailed directions to her place, so the cops drove the root, and the directions led them to this neighborhood down this alley, and to this garage rented by a guy named mark twitchell. he happened to be, in the local arts community, local celebrity. he was making a name for himself in edmonton. he had recently made a low- budget sci-fi movie so they called him up, of course, and he readily agreed to come down and open the place up. when he got here, big surprise, someone had changed the lock. he could not get in, so with permission, officers broken, had a quick look around, and found nothing. just the same, with the changed walk in the weird coincidence of the email, there were things to figure out and mark twitchell was only too happy to tag along to the police station to help out however he could. the first thing i noticed is the padlock did not look familiar to me. twitchell explained he d been using the rented garage is a soundstage most recently for what they call a teaser, a short film designed to drum up publicity , buzz, with any luck, attract enough investor money to allow him to produce a full length feature movie. it s a suspense thriller, actually. a short film. okay, so yeah, suspense thriller? of course, he had a crew in and out of the place during filming, said mark. maybe one of them was up to something but it seemed unlikely, and none of them had ever asked to borrow the set for anything. so, if there was anything like that, if somebody needed to borrow the place or whatever, then they would let me know. they d let you know. they would ask, or something like that, so no, i don t know anything about that. anyway, he said, he had moved on for now to another project. i m working on a comedy right now which is actually a full feature, with a decent budget in the neighborhood of about 3 1/2 million. in the meantime, the garage comes studio was empty, so why would someone break into the place and then change the lock, he wondered. didn t make sense. i had a padlock previously but it wasn t the same one. it was silver on the outside with a black plastic dial in the center and this one was just all metal, so. so, you notice the different padlock on the door. mystifying, said mark. he had a bad feeling about this. a man disappears after telling police he was going to the very place his movie had been shooting. as soon as they called me on the phone, i get this weird chill. what about that woman john altinger had been flirting with online, the one who gave him directions to the garage, told him she would meet him there. the woman who signed her emails jen . does the name, jen, mean anything to you? no. we don t have a jen or anything like that. so, the name jen doesn t mean anything to you? you don t know an actress named jen? so, who was this mystery woman, jen? why in the world which she arranged to meet john altinger here in the very back yard garage and independent edmonton film crew was renting for use as a studio. how odd. especially since the movies producer director, mark twitchell, expressed exactly the same confusion as the police. he didn t get it, either. the dots did not connect. mark twitchell did not know johnny from adam and besides, there was no indication johnny ever made it to the garage at all. the close friends are the ones who have come to the police and they have nothing other than his emails. there was one thing, though, and it came from mark twitchell. he wondered if maybe somebody was being set up. it just doesn t sit right, so the first thing i started asking myself is, who all knows about what we do there and what our schedule looks like and stuff like that. is the disappearance staged somehow? if someone was being fooled, who was it, and why? was all this just some big stunt even a publicity stunt? detective bill clark was thoroughly engaged by now. he had spent a career listening to criminal spender stories. maybe you could figure out if this twitchell guy was trying to play the cops somehow. he pulled the recording of the interview. and i watch an interview, i listen to what the guy says but i m looking at body language, i m looking for signs of deceit. i remember coming out of their going you know, this mark twitchell guy interviewed really well. there were no signs of deception. he is free-flowing with the information. he has answered the questions logically. i don t see any looking away, nervousness, nothing. i see nothing. and then, when police looked into twitchell s production company, they encountered a perfectly legitimate company. more than that, actually. this was a promising effort to help edmonton get some national attention as a potential center of moviemaking. mark twitchell was very good at coming up attention and money from local investors. he was a very sharp, bright, young, articulate entrepreneur. exactly the kind of individual most of us are looking for. so, he checked out. hard-working local boy in the city of hard-working people. good parents, nice young wife, sweet little daughter, on his way to becoming a celebrity here in edmonton. detectives even got a look at the teaser film for twitchell s next projects, three and half million dollar buddy comedy. that is mark in the background playing the role of director even as he was the director, sort of a hall of mirrors type story, a movie about a movie about making a movie or something. fantasy and reality all mixed up somehow. just to cover the bases, police interviewed mark twitchell s crew members and they vouched for him completely. mark twitchell came off squeaky clean. his film company was respected, as was he, and bill clark and the edmonton police back at square one by the look of things. coming up, soon, this tough cop would catch a big break. we got a phone call from a detective. the detective says you won t believe it but this guy just told me he found a red mazda out there. the missing man s car turns up when dateline continues. urns up when dateline continues. -cologuard®? -cologuard. cologuard! -screen for colon cancer. -at home, like you want. -you the man! cologuard is for people 45+ at average risk, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your provider for cologuard. i did it my way nothing dims my light like a migraine. with nurtec odt, i found relief. the only migraine medication that helps treat and prevent, all in one. to those with migraine, i see you. for the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura and the preventive treatment of episodic migraine in adults. don t take if allergic to nurtec odt. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain. it s time we all shine. talk to a healthcare provider about nurtec odt from pfizer. a slow network is no network for business. talk to a healthcare provider that s why more choose comcast business. and now, we re introducing ultimate speed for business our fastest plans yet. we re up to 12 times faster than verizon, at&t, and t-mobile. and existing customers could even get up to triple the speeds. at no additional cost. it s ultimate speed for ultimate business. don t miss out on our fastest speed plans yet! switch to comcast business and get started for $49.99 a month. plus, ask how to get up to an $800 prepaid card. call today! bill clark:ok, i m going to get out here. keith morrison: (voiceover) bill clark is, he doesn t mind admitting it, an old school detective, of the sort that seems to exist more on the big screen than the mean streets. det. bill clark:you guys here last night? keith morrison: (voiceover) in fact, bill clark is an old-school detective, the sort that seems to exist more on the big screen than the mean streets. in fact, clark is such a throwback, the younger guys on the fourth kid him. they call him simple it s after the old hard-nosed detective on the top show, nypd blue. i still like coming to work every day. it s just part of my life. i still have the drive. i m still excited about it. in his decades on the edmonton police force, clark and scene murder take many forms, had seen the shattering effect it has on the family. you are the one the family depends on and i take that seriously. ultimately, that is in the back of your mind, that if you don t speak for the family or the dead guy, who is going to? for clark, there is no greater satisfaction than bringing in a killer. i consider myself a pitbull. you get a case and you get your teeth into it. we want to get the guy, we want to get this guy and put them away. as for the john altinger case, this wasn t even a murder, at least, not as far as anyone new yet, so clark kept himself on a tight leash . he had yet to smell blood. he must ve come to some point where you thought oh, there is definitely foul play here. no, not at all. all that they had, after all, was a missing man, johnny, who might just have driven off somewhere with her without some mystery woman named jen. certainly that would account for the fact that his red mazda coop was gone, too, but really aside from a few curious emails that might or might not make any sense, there was not much to go on, so being cops, clark and his colleagues employed standard procedure. they double back for a second look at things, like the garage johnny was apparently headed for when he vanished. we are thinking our next step logically as the garage. so, they applied for a search warrant and it was rejected. it gets turned down because we are told we have not proven there was a crime committed. so, the next step seemed simple enough. clark went to mark twitchell directly to see if he would give permission to search the garage. he goes yeah. i says i ll need you to sign a consent form. he goes no problem. they requisitioned the form, one of the detectives drove it over to mark s place to get a signature and then, the weirdest thing. i get a phone call from the detective. the detective says to me he says you won t believe it, but the guy just told me he bought a red mazda. a red mazda and didn t john altinger drive a red mazda and was in it missing? mark twitchell had not said anything about a red mazda when he came down to the police station and spoke to the detective the night before. he said he forgot. really? why would he forget i like that ? you don t want to get tunnel vision. i for homicide investigation, don t get tunnel vision so keep an open mind so i pull myself back. there is something fishy going on. clark invited twitchell to come back down to the station for a meeting at 10:30 on sunday night, and twitchell agreed. everything you do now, we are analyzing. we caught the up arrow down our scenario. the burial and up arrow for marcuse cooperative. the missing car, big down arrow. but, that s about all clark had to work with. we are just here trying to find this john fellow, john altinger. i don t know what s happened to johnny. because, once again, as the interview proceeds, the young filmmaker is the very picture of cooperation. he volunteers information, answers questions without hesitation or guile. his demeanor is expensive. even an untrained eye can see twitchell s body language is open, comfortable, and control. so, they get to the story about the red monster. he was approached, he said, a few blocks from his rented garage by an agitated man. it was the night johnny disappeared. the man seemed desperate to get rid of his car, said mark. he offered to sell it for practically nothing. he goes well, i shacked up with this really rich lady, you know, it s like a sugar mama kind of situation and she s going to take care of me and she s going to buy me a new car will we get back from a vacation regular take. and i and okay, is there like cocaine in the truck? i m trying to figure out what the catch is here. apparently, said mark, there was no catch, and nothing wrong with the car except that it had a standard transmission, which he didn t know how to drive, so he left it parked in a friend s driveway. does he live close by? yes, a couple of blocks away. is it finally a break? the detective monitoring the interview sent a patrol car to check it out and sure enough, there it was, empty, by the look of it. nothing untoward about the car. johnny is not in the car. meanwhile, bill clark left the interview room partly to regroup, but also to see how mark would act when they left him alone, and if he was rattled, he certainly didn t show it. here, he calmly placed a call to his wife. well, i tried to answer some more questions and fill them in and everything like that and it turns out that the car is, in fact, belonging to this missing guy and that it s a huge deal. that s what this whole thing is about. what in heavens name was going on? bill clark still did not have a clue. but he might in a minute, because bill clark good cop was about to become bill clark bad cop. coming up there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that you are involved in the disappearance of john altinger. you might be involved, but what was fact and what was fantasy? when dateline continues. when dateline continues. nexium 24hr prevents heartburn acid for twice as long as pepcid. get all-day and all-night heartburn acid prevention with just one pill a day. choose acid prevention. choose nexium. nexgard® plus helps you protect your dog from fleas, ticks, heartworm disease, and more. all in one delicious, monthly, soft chew. use with caution in dogs with a history of seizures or neurologic disorders. nexgard® plus: the one you want for one-and-done protection. nexium 24hr prevents heartburn acid before it begins. get all-day and all-night heartburn acid prevention with just one pill a day. choose acid prevention. choose nexium. israel is saying they rescued four hostages during a raid in gaza. the hostages were kidnapped during the nova music festival october 7th last year. officials meanwhile say more than 200 palestinians were killed in strikes by israel nearby, marking one of the bloodiest single days seen in eight months of war. pro-palestinian protesters descended on the white house to voice their frustration with the president s handling of the israel hamas war so far. for now, back to dateline. almost 4:00 a.m. now, downtown edmonton. filmmaker mark twitchell was sitting in an interview room at the playstation tasking talking to his wife on the phone, fading a little. outside the room, detective bill clark watch twitchell, went over a few notes, prepared to switch tactics. it s already started. the game is on. it s me against him. i know it. he also knew, he was quite sure of it, that all evening, mark twitchell had been handing him a whole load of nonsense and expecting him to believe it but also, all evening, as detective clark listened carefully and contemplated his up arrows and down arrows i agreed with everything he said. this is not the time of the interview to start pushing. it was not the time to start confronting him. that would come later on. because, one of those down arrows led to a particular conclusion. mark twitchell thought clark was a dumb cop. twitchell was trying to play him. while you are reading him during that interview, he had been reading you. no doubt. he probably had made some judgments about your ability as an interviewer. what did he think of you, do you think? i think he didn t think i was that smart. i think he thought he was smarter than me and i believe that he felt that anything he told us, he could concoct to make us believe him. and of course, there is only one proper response to that. i just let him go then taken back through it. question-and-answer, standard procedure, just nail down the details now. now i m starting to see he s not remembering specific details. let s go back to your lunch. you are at lunch. would you go for lunch? don t remember. don t know where you want for lunch? no. so now, it was early morning. they had been at it for hours. they had taken a break and let mark twitchell sit by himself and perhaps stew a bit and now had time for clark to play a different role. we done the good cop routine. now my forte, the bad cop is coming in. this is what i like. this is what i relish. there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that you are involved in the disappearance of john altinger. no doubt in my mind at all. i? now i m going to start hammering him with what i know. the problem is, i know very little. but, now that was perfectly clear to mark twitchell that he was a suspect in the disappearance and maybe a murder, his easy camaraderie seemed to shrivel. his eyes glazed with something that looked like fear . was he truly innocent? or, was something else going on, something more in keeping with his role as a storyteller? why can t you give me the version of events that night? has i m scared. as the night dragged on, twitchell doubled something about reality seeming more like some sort of fantasy. but, in the face of all of detectives clark s accusations, mark twitchell never wavered. for nearly four hours, he answered clark s questions always polite, apparently helpful, did not as much as ask for a lawyer. a by the end of the night? i got nothing. my gut instinct at that time is that the sky is involved up to his neck in this but what exactly he s done, i don t know yet, but i m going to find out. finally, at daybreak, mark twitchell let clark know he d had enough. in my being charged? not yet. am i free to go? yes. and i will. okay. and then, as bill clark escorted mark twitchell out of the building and into the early morning dark, he ups the ante a little, told twitchell he was seizing his car . then he goes he almost stopped and pulled back and he goes well, i need to get something out of it and i says you re getting nothing. i m taking that car. and, it was then, as clark approached twitchell s car to take it to the impound yard, that he noticed mark s unusual license plate personalized dark jedi. coming up. i have never in my life felt fear like that. police find witnesses who saw something that seemed like a horror movie. it s like every nightmare you had as a child after watching a scary movie, every nightmare you ve ever had. all of a sudden it s right here. when dateline continues. here. when dateline continues. is no exception. it s time you had a proven choice to help restore what s yours. opzelura is the first and only fda-approved prescription treatment for nonsegmental vitiligo. proven to help repigment skin over time. restoring what s yours. it s possible with a steroid-free cream that you can apply yourself. opzelura can lower your ability to fight infections including tb or hepatitis b or c. serious lung infections, skin cancer, blood clots, and low blood cell counts occurred with opzelura. in people taking jak inhibitors, serious infections, increased risk of death, lymphoma, other cancers, and major cardiovascular events have occurred. the most common side effects were acne and itching where applied. repigmentation is possible. ask your dermatologist today about starting or refilling opzelura. pursue it. you re the one that i want nexgard® combo is the only monthly topical that protects against fleas, ticks, tapeworms, and more. use with caution in cats with a history of seizures or neurologic disorders. nexgard combo,. you re the one that i want .the monthly one-and-done you want. everybody wants super straight, super white teeth. they want that hollywood white smile. new sensodyne clinical white provides 2 shades whiter teeth and 24/7 sensitivity protection. i think it s a great product. it s going to help a lot of patients. diabetes can serve up a lot of questions. like what is your glucose and can you have more carbs? before you decide with the freestyle libre 3 system know your glucose and where it s heading no fingersticks needed. now the world s smallest and thinnest sensor sends your glucose levels directly to your smartphone. manage your diabetes with more confidence and lower your a1c. the #1 cgm prescribed in the u.s. try it for free at freestylelibre.us stay ahead of your moderate-to-severe eczema. and show off clearer skin and less itch with dupixent, the #1 prescribed biologic by dermatologists and allergists, that helps heal your skin from within. serious allergic reactions can occur that can be severe. tell your doctor about new or worsening eye problems such as eye pain or vision changes including blurred vision, joint aches and pain, or a parasitic infection. don t change or stop asthma medicines without talking to your doctor. ask your eczema specialist about dupixent. keith morrison: edmonton homicide detective bill clark, ask your eczema specialist along with other members of the edmonton police service, felt a little like alice in the rabbit hole. their missing man, johnny altinger, had vanished without a trace. and there were whispers his disappearance could be part of some publicity stunt. their only suspect was an aspiring movie producer, a storyteller, who stood up to a bill clark grilling with his manners intact, even though, by this time, clark couldn t edmonton homicide detective bill clark along with other members of the edmonton police service felt a little like alice in the rabbit hole. they re missing man, john altinger, had vanished without a trace and there were whispers his disappearance could be part of some publicity stunt. their only suspect was an aspiring movie producer storyteller who stood up to a bill clark grilling with his man is intact even though by this time, clark could not shake the gut feeling that this movie director was one very bad day. i was thinking he had filmed whatever he did done to johnny. i was thinking he had killed him and filmed the murder. so, as police looked through twitchell s car and home, they had the idea they might find videotape of her murder. instead, what they discovered was an affair. twitchell had a girlfriend and when his wife found out about that, she kicked him out. but, twitchell seemed, at least to the outside world, unperturbed and instead of falling apart, he simply retreated to his childhood home and moved in with his parents and so, clark paid twitchell s dad and mom a visit. they just struck me as a parent for her son does nothing wrong where s the father wanted to hear what i had to say, and he listened but he got over it. they set up a surveillance team, 24 hour watch to keep an eye on the house and twitchell, but his behavior was anything but suspicious. he went on about his business, took meetings with investors about his movie project, even picked up a $35,000 check from his financial backer. the mark twitchell i was dealing with was articulate, in control, running his project the way you would expect any entrepreneur to be running his project. in detective clark s world of up arrows and down arrows there was one more huge up arrow in twitchell s favor. motive, or that is to say the lack of one. there was no earthly reason for twitchell to kill altinger. there was no love triangle, no rivalry, there was no robbery and to put it more simply, twitchell was not a criminal. did not have a record, had never even been arrested. why would a young, married father killed a perfect stranger? so, besides twitchell, police also focus their attention on this quiet suburban neighborhood around twitchell s rented garage studio where john altinger may have gone to see a woman he met online. they went door-to-door , had anyone seen john altinger or his car or anything suspicious? they found this couple who told a story that seemed almost lifted from a horror movie. i have never in my life felt fear like that. these two, their names are marissa and trevor, were out for an evening stroll when they stepped through the looking glass. it happened when a young man came stumbling out of this alley and collapsed in front of them. he was on the ground and it was just an instant bad feeling. he looked up and said i m being robbed. can you help me? then, as if on cue, another man. in pursuit. as i looked up the attacker almost ran into me. the attacker was wearing a dark, hooded sweatshirt and a hockey mask. it s like every nightmare you have as a child after watching a scary movie. every nightmare you ve ever had. all of a sudden, it s right here. this was no bewitching hour. it was 7:30, and early autumn sun had just begun to take on the glow of a long, northern evening. neighborhood kids were still struggling home from soccer practice. is it believable to you? yes and no, because the way that he fell, to me, looked staged. to get us to stop so they could grab us. yeah, we thought it was a set up for us. so, you did not know whether he was going to assault you or whether he was running from that guy for real. exactly. then, so trevor and marissa, the masked man retreated into the alley to this garage. that is where he stood. he stood there like he was protecting something. i was like, i m getting out of here right now. trevor and marissa left the man on the ground pleading for help like some seasoned method actor and left. when i got home, they called the police, so squad cars prowled the streets as the autumn wind light angled toward the horizon but in that quiet, nothing seemed out of place. nothing amiss. that was that until weeks later when police came back here looking for john altinger . was the guy in the alley actually johnny, not an actor, was he a real victim? one of the detectives went downtown to check on the report taken from trevor and marissa, and it didn t fit. that call was taken a week before johnny disappeared. besides, no victim ever came forward. no one claimed to have been attacked by a masked man. the whole thing sounded almost like , well, like a scene from the movie. coming up, or just maybe, a tv show about a serial killer. what attracted you to director? what i loved about the show in the books is how he was able to explore that darkside, rationalize that it s okay to kill somebody because this person deserves it in a way. and dateline continues. y. and dateline continues. but this is my story. 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(dad) we never thought that with verizon, saving on the the best in entertainment was gonna be so easy before. we had to pretend we had seen all these shows. now that we have verizon, we can stop pretending. (vo) disney+, hulu, espn+, netflix and max. all for just $20/mo. only on verizon. her uncle s unhappy. (mom) my turn. i m sensing an underlying issue. it s t-mobile. it started when we tried to get him under a new plan. but they they unexpectedly unraveled their “price lock” guarantee. which has made him, a bit. unruly. you called yourself the “un-carrier”. you sing about “price lock” on those commercials. “the price lock, the price lock.” so, if you could change the price, change the name! it s not a lock, i know a lock. so how can we undo the damage? we could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that s uncalled for. to light under the northern sun, especially with the aid of a search warrant. as bill clark and his colleagues closed in on movie maker mark strange things come to light under the northern son, especially with the head of a search warrant. as bill clark and his colleagues closed in on moviemaker mark twitchell, they seized his office computer, found in his house, and on the computer s hard drive, they found this video that looked almost like a movie. a horror movie. no, it was not a snuff film, was not john altinger s murder caught on tape. it was raw footage of one of twitchell s tease films, the one he had told the detective about the first time he d talked to him. it s a suspense thriller, actually. it s a short film. house of cards is what twitchell was calling it. get enough people talking about this and he might persuade some investor to ante up the money for a feature-length film. in house of cards, killer poses online as a flirtatious woman to entrap her victim. in this scene, it is a philandering husband who tells his wife he s heading off to the gym. but, once he arrives at the rendezvous site, the victim is dropped with a stun baton. murdered, then cut up into little bits. imagine a cross between friday the 13th and dexter. the victim in this teaser version was played by edmonton comedian, chris hayward. so, police decided to have a little chat with mr. hayward, but when they showed up at his door, hayward, no slouch when it came to the entertainment business, thought it was a prank of some sort. i worked on reality television. it was one of the first things i got into television on. they throw you curveballs and they have writers and i didn t know. i thought somebody s making this up. this can t be true. this is not a real story. police also tracked down toronto actor robert barnsley who played the starring role of the deranged mass murderer. i was thinking great sure and fill out the short film. i like the idea of this. of course i want to try to be the killer. he seemed like a very normal guy trying to do a film. very nice, very pleasant. playing a serial killer was almost too much fun, said barnsley. it got kind of scary for i enjoyed it too much. you got to be a sadist big- time. absolutely. very fun for me to play. i rather enjoyed doing it. i was thinking my to myself, that i just think i could do this and make it believable? which, said barnsley, was exactly what director twitchell seemed to want. there s a point where i had to stab the dummy through the chest with a samurai sword and he was sitting behind the chair he d be leaning in and say okay listen, when you re turning the blade, grit your teeth and really show that you re enjoying it. wait a minute, was this all about enjoying some fantasy game, pretending to be evil? detectives surfed around twitchell s computer account and discovered a facebook relationship that was all about pretending. at about the time he started filming house of cards, twitchell befriended an animal trainer and aspiring filmmaker, a woman named renee wary. and edmonton detective flew all the way to cleveland to question her, where she, right up front about it, told him about clicking on an intriguing facebook profile, dexter morgan. there was a picture of michael c hall, the actor who portrays dexter morgan on showtime. did you think you are friending the actor himself? sure, you know. what attracted you to dexter? what i love about the show in the books is how he was able to explore that darkside and rationalize that it s okay to kill somebody because this person deserved it, in a way. we flirted back and forth and i kept asking him who are you really, tell me who you are because i want to see the man behind the mask. finally, rene s facebook friend relented. no, he was not actor michael c hall, he admitted. his name was mark twitchell. once he told me who he was, i checked them out, you know. i did a lot of research online and found out that he was legitimate and he was up-and- coming. for rene, the would-be filmmaker, this seemed like her big break. he expressed interest in me and my writing styles and my ideas. what did he like about your writing style? you never said specifically. he just said i think we have, you know, like chemistry together and how we would be able to work very well together , and that we thought a lot alike. this had to be pretty exciting. yes. soon, she was intoxicated by this online collaboration and then wonder of wonders, he offered her work on his next project, the feature-length version of his short film, a film, he told her, about a serial killer. we had talked about our hypotheticals about how to kill somebody and get away with it. he told me well, you do it like dexter because dexter shows you how to do it all the time. dark? yes, but all in fun, of course, like twitchell s playful advice on eliminating, and dexter -like fashion, one of rene s rival in romance. with both her hands wrapped in duct tape, free one arm and slit the wrist. a hunters game processing kit comes with everything you need to cut the body into nice, manageable pieces. disturbing? yes but remember, all pretense. but then, a couple of weeks later, and this is what she told the police, something happened, strange and unsettling. there was a weekend-long pause in their play talk about dexter the darkside. not a single email from her friend, mark twitchell. then, when they came in with it, an apology that also had something else keeping me busy, he wrote. i m really concerned about telling anyone because of the implications. suffice it to say i crossed the line on friday. and, i liked it. crossed the line? what did that mean? coming up. was this all part of an elaborate hoax? a staged fantasy were something truly terrifying, when dateline continues. truly terrifying, when dateline continues. 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(vo) new and existing customers get iphone 15 on us when they trade in any iphone. verizon what causes a curve down there? who can treat this? stop typing, and start talking. it could be a medical condition called peyronie s disease, or pd. you re not alone, there is hope. find a specialized urologist who can diagnose and treat pd. visit makeapdplan.com today. nexium 24hr prevents heartburn acid for twice as long as pepcid. get all-day and all-night heartburn acid prevention with just one pill a day. choose acid prevention. choose nexium. keith morrison: (voiceover) it was choose acid prevention. halloween in edmonton, canada. halloween, a highlight in most any child s fantasy calendar, the night to be the terrible creature she it was halloween and edmonton, canada. i highlight almost any child s fennessey calendar, the night the terrible creature could never really be. mark twitchell loved halloween. spent weeks, months actually, stitching together getups, outlandish costumes. in 2008, weeks after his wife kicked him out and cops began tailing him everywhere, he decided to be ironman. built the costume in his parents garage. but, on the very witchy afternoon, hours from his planned grand entrance to a gala halloween party, as he was walking to a local coffee house to meet with potential movie investors, he was thrown to the ground by men wearing their own unique costumes. members of the s.w.a.t. team. mark twitchell was handcuffed and charged with the murder of johnny altinger. that made big headlines. police even held a press conference to announce the arrest. the reporters who had gathered were left with one juicy tidbit. we have a lot of information that he idolizes dexter. we went to his facebook page. steve was a crime reporter for the edmonton journal. he had a post that said mark twitchell is too much in common with dexter morgan and the idea that there s a man out there who is attacking strangers, innocent victims, it s almost myth. something built up by hollywood. it didn t seem like it could be real. in edmonton, the question began to circulate. had the cops been played by a clever promoter? mark twitchell is known as a prankster. people thought it was a hoax. you almost wonder whether or not he was doing it as a publicity stunt. exactly. so maybe, bill clark and the rest of the police force would wind up with red faces and not just from the cold. except, there was one little bit of news police did not announce. when they searched twitchell s car, they found a laptop and on the hard drive at that laptop, very smart detective found a deleted temporary file. a document about 40 pages long. could be described as a diary, maybe a far-fetched novel right treatment for a dexter episode. it was called sk confessions. it was a first person account written from the perspective and aspiring serial killer. i remember reading this the first day when they brought it down and i said holy mackerel, this tells us everything. except he s a professional storyteller who tells, you know, movies. they are not real. weren t you afraid you might be about to be drawn into a rabbit hole? something that might be true or not be true, it might be f&s e- absolutely. we had huge discussions about this. it read more like a work of fiction. like a story that could not possibly be true. it seems like a hoax right from the opening paragraph. this is the story of my progression into becoming a serial killer. i don t remember the exact place and time it was i decided to be a serial killer, but i remember the sensation that hit me. it was a rush of pure euphoria. there was something about exploring my dark side the greatly appealed to me. the author seemed inspired by the tv show dexter. i m a huge fan of the showtime series dexter, as you may have guessed, if you re at all familiar with the show. and a particular scene played an important role. i watched an episode of dexter where the flashback showed his father showing dexter a scan of the human brain. he identify the difference between a serial killer sprain in a normal person s brain. i was convinced that what i was was my own decision, my own path, but now i truly wondered if i had little choice at all. of genetics play a bigger role than i thought. i knew i was a psychopath further than he sociopaths because i had the perfect upbringing and no history of abuse, violence, or trauma. in sk professions, it s graphic. how the killer dispatches victims with a mental mental pipe. i thrusted in his gut. his reaction was pure hollywood. the lurch forward with the grant was dead on tv movie of the week. the little i knew at the time and the things i found, thought it was true. cops can have hunches and think what they want, but this hunches really hold up in court. sk confessions could be a make- believe story, might not be written by twitchell. it could ve been downloaded from the internet . investigators started going through sk confessions line by line, to see if they could sort out fact from fiction. and, indeed, police found details that lined up with reality. the writer in his first person account tells the reader how he used a processing kit to dismember the victim s body and police found a processing kit in twitchell s garage. the killers said he tried to burn the victim s body in an oil drum and his parents backyard. at twitchell s parents backyard, they found a burned ring on the back lawn. there was a detail about the killer getting a speeding ticket and so did twitchell about the time that johnny altinger disappeared. he joked about it about how this dumb cop didn t realize he had just killed a guy. he was now going out to celebrate and have sex with his girlfriend. the cop remembered up. it came back and we know the conversation. it was basically word for word that story told us. exactly what the sheriff told us. there was a key part of the story that could not be verified. a passage that goes on for pages about an earlier attack, but that victim got away. that part of the story read like that directly from the house of cards grip where the victim is tasered by man wearing a hockey mask and hood. it s a big part to prove it s true or not. it was a huge part. if someone had been attacked that way, you would ve heard of it. exactly. we got nothing. no call. nothing that even matches the similarity. is seem to be one part of the story that didn t make sense. they went public and released a photo of the hockey mask. that what week somebody s memory that that was me. it was a longshot, really. maybe that person did not exist. they put it out there. they waited. not for long. because, that very evening, a lonely casino security officer named gilles tetreault was puttering on his computer and saw the newspaper article online. the police appeal. they felt the blood drain from his face. that person was him. i am like, oh my god. it s the same hockey mask as i saw, that the guy was wearing. i started reading the story. oh, my god, someone got killed. that terrifying evening came crashing back into his head. it was he, gilles tetreault, who so frightened that couple out for a stroll. he picked up the phone and before long found himself in a little room with detective bill clark. in my career, it was probably the most spellbinding interview i ve ever had with a witness. now, you are about to hear that story firsthand. coming up. all of a sudden i see this man wearing this black and gold hockey mask. this guy was bigger than me. the horror story really happened. life flash before my eyes. oh, my god. my family will never see me again. again. govy®. with wegovy®, i lost 35 pounds. and some lost over 46 pounds. and i m keeping the weight off. wegovy® helps you lose weight and keep it off. i m reducing my risk. wegovy® is the only fda-approved weight-management medicine that s proven to reduce risk of major cardiovascular events in adults with known heart disease and with either obesity or overweight. wegovy® shouldn 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[coughing] copd isn t pretty. i m out of breath, and often out of the picture. but this is my story. ( ) and with once-daily trelegy, it can still be beautiful. because with 3 medicines in 1 inhaler, trelegy keeps my airways open for a full 24 hours and prevents future flare-ups. trelegy also improves lung function, so i can breathe more freely all day and night. trelegy won t replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. do not take trelegy more than prescribed. trelegy may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. what a wonderful world [laughing] ask your doctor about once-daily trelegy for copd because breathing should be beautiful, all day and night. ceover) when gilles tetreault joined because breathing should be beautiful, the strange developing horror movie plot up in edmonton, gilles tetreault joined the developing horror movie plot in edmonton, canada. a man with a broken heart. lonely in a new city without the wife who had left him for another life. she just wanted to move on? she fell out of love with me, i guess. that s not easy. when he came across that lovely, intelligent woman on an online dating site and she seemed to like him? well, who could resist. she looked beautiful in her profile. i believe i made the first contact. what did she say about herself? she said she was new in town and looking to meet people. i found it a coincidence. so was i kind of thing. with a view alone and looking to meet someone. i thought this is perfect. sheena was her name. she said how about dinner and a movie. she started making excuses that i couldn t pick her up at her front door. so has stayed asked him to park in an alley and comes right back entrance, through a detached garage. she would leave the garage door open and i would go through the garage to the other side, get into the yard and knock on the back door to pick her up. i didn t have to crawl under it. i just had to squat. hopeful, unsuspecting, he walked through the garage door, the store, that leads to the back patio. i touched the not and all of a sudden somebody attacked me from behind. i turned back to look to see what s going on. that is when, all of a sudden, i see this man wearing this black and gold hockey mask. this guy was much bigger than me. prodding me with a stun gun. at first gilles couldn t tell what it was this stinging at the back of his neck. but listen to this from sk confessions? pressing the baton across the back of his neck, pulled the trigger. shocked and jump but did little more than merely alert him to what was going on. i tried to make a run for it. that s when he pulled out a gun. what is that like when somebody pulls a gun on you? terrified. i didn t know what to do. oh, my god, i think i m going to die and i cannot get away. there is no way i can escape a bullet. i felt a sick feeling. i pointed it at him and all of a sudden he took me seriously. his eyes wide. then he yells, get down on the ground. put your face down and close your eyes and put your hands in the back. he took out duct tape. he ripped off a piece. that s when he covered my eyes with them. just about then, gilles tetreault decided hits come to the moment of his death. i started tearing up. it was like life flashed before my eyes. it was quite emotional. oh, my god. my family is never going to see me again. i never told anyone where i was going that day. all of a sudden, by my legs, i hear his belt jiggling. what gilles heard was the sound of handcuffs as they neared his wrists. he said he felt the attacker was undoing his belt. i thought, he is going to rape may. i better fight for my life. i would rather die my way than his way. i knew he s going to pull the gun out again. you know what? if it kills me, it kills me. gilles makes his move. i darted for the gun. grabbed the end and pushed it away from my body. but this fight is far from over. he comes after me and grabs my legs. he starts dragging me back. me e of your health. centrum gives every body a healthy foundation. supporting your - oops - energy, immunity and metabolism. and yours too! you did it! plus try centrum silver, now clinically proven to support memory in older adults. hi, i m janice and i lost 172 pounds on golo. now clinically proven a friend told me that i was the only one holding me back from being as beautiful on the outside as i am on the inside. once i saw golo was working i felt this rush. golo really works. norman, bad news. i never graduated from med school. what? -but the good news is. xfinity mobile just got even better! now, you can automatically connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go. plus, buy one unlimited line and get one free for a year. i gotta get this deal. i know. faster wifi and savings? .i don t want to miss that. that s amazing doc. mobile savings are calling. visit xfinitymobile.com to learn more. doc? he d been lured into a garage then assaulted by a masked man gilles tetreault was in a battle for his life. had been lured into a garage and assaulted by masked man with the gun. now he is determined to turn the tables. get up and rip off the duct tape and i yell at them. i said, i can t do this. i m not going down like this. he started yelling at me. it back down on the ground. back down on the ground. i darted for the gun. grabbed the end and pushed it away from my body. he got back to his feet, having removed the duct tape. when i pointed the gun at him again, he grabbed a. it was the best feeling i felt in my life because i felt plastic when i grabbed it. immediately. who suddenly realized? it was a fake gun. i think i might ve seen a gleam that indicated he felt the gun construction a realized it was not real. i grabbed him by the arms and we re struggling all over the garage. according to sk confessions, by fighting back, had taken the story off script. overestimating the stun baton is a mistake i would not repeat. i should ve just pounded him on the back of the head while he was down until he lay unconscious on the floor. i tried to kick him. he saw me going to do that, so he actually went and swiped my leg and i almost fell down. i almost lost my shoe. i am thinking, i can t get down. if i get down on the ground, you are cooked. exactly. s adrenaline had been pumping and he was unaware how the shock from the stun baton had sapped his strength. my muscles could not move. i was so weak. he goes forward and tries to headbutt meet me. that s when he says, because you did not cooperate, this is the way it has to be. he starts punching me in the head. he stumbled back with every blow, closer and closer to the open garage door. i am letting him punch me. he punches me again. he grabs my jacket so i slipped out of my jacket and ruled under the garage door. i made it out of the garage. i start to try to run. all of a sudden, it s like my legs were paralyzed. i could not move. i fell on my face. a nightmare where you can get away from that monster. i start crawling away on this unpaved driveway. sure enough, he comes underneath the garage after me. grabs my legs and he starts dragging me back. i m thinking, oh, my god, i don t know how i will get away again. i have nothing left. there s nothing else i can do. underneath the door. au he drags me back and throw me back into the garage underneath the door. i m thinking, he does not have a hold of me anymore. this is my chance. i can maybe get away again and i roll underneath the garage door. i got back up, and in my head, i was like, there is no way i am not running this time. terrified. exhausted, gilles tetreault ran 30 or 40 feet to this pedestrian path and that s when he collapsed in front of trevor and marissa. i look up and i see a couple walking their dog. i couldn t really talk. all i could say is there s a man after me. he is trying to mug me, please, help me. they looked stunned. they didn t know what was going on. to me, felt like it was taking the masked man forever to come after me. but he came running after me. he comes close to me and i tell him them, that s the man. as i looked up, the attacker almost ran into me. once he saw the couple, he said, come on, frank. the guy was pretending they were friends. he was pretending he was going to live the mask like we were playing. then he does. he turns around and starts walking back to the garage. i stared back at them through my mask and then headed back for the cover of my layer. it was only once he arrived safe at home that gilles tried to put it together. how? what in the world just happened? who was the man behind the mask? and why had he been attacked? i decided i need to go back onto that online dating website. i want to get as much information as i can so i can give it to police. i go back on and all of a sudden, everything was gone. her profile was gone. although sent and received messages i got from the person were all gone. what is it like to be sitting alone in front of your computer with that realization in your head? it felt almost ashamed. i can t believe i got duped by this woman. i just want to put this behind me. i want to move on. and did not call the police. no, did not. i had no idea. for weeks, i had nightmares. i kept githinking, maybe this g is following me. maybe he s going to attack me again. i was terrified. i was facing him there with a gun. a month after his journey into the twilight zone, gilles tetreault was giving bill clark a videotape blow-by-blow of the assault. there s no doubt he is being truthful. the cops had real evidence that sk confessions was all true. except, it was not quite complete. it was a story without an end. the part we never had, we never had johnny. johnny altinger. the victim who it seemed did not escape from this suburban garage, still no sign of him. unless, just about then the detectives uncovered some of the, updated version of sk confessions. there was one more chapter. in which the killer leaves a clue. impossible to resist. the police take mark twitchell on a journey to the place where something evil had happened. here we are back at the killing garage. killing garage. nexium 24hr prevents heartburn acid for twice as long as pepcid. get all-day and all-night heartburn acid prevention with just one pill a day. choose acid prevention. choose nexium. nexgard® plus helps you protect your dog from fleas, ticks, heartworm disease, and more. all in one delicious, monthly, soft chew. use with caution in dogs with a history of seizures or neurologic disorders. nexgard® plus: the one you want for one-and-done protection. i still love to surf, snowboard, or neurologic disorders. and, of course, skate. so, i take qunol magnesium to support my muscle and bone health. qunol s extra strength, high absorption magnesium helps me get the full benefits of magnesium. qunol, the brand i trust. i m richard lui. is real saying it rescued four hostages during a raid in gaza who had been kidnapped by hamas during the music festival october 7. officials say more than 200 palestinians were killed by airstrikes nearby. marks one of the bloodiest single days and eight months of war so far. a 3-year-old horse took the victory in the 156 running of the belmont stakes. there was no triple crown champion is over two different winners in the kentucky derby and preakness stakes. loved the tv show dexter, was so taken with the whole idea the would be movie direction or dashed director loved the tv show dexter. so taken with the whole idea that he posted this online ad, attempt to sell the script for his house of cards short film as if it were an original dexter episode. in fact, the story of his computer, the one called sk confessions is a lot like an episode of the tv show. now, here in his rented garage, police found what looked like a kill room. there was plastic sheeting. autopsy table. all matching the careful descriptions in sk confessions. what the killer could not learn from dexter s how to dispose of the body. the tv dexter lives in miami, dumps his victims in the atlantic. but, edmonton in the middle of thousands of square miles of farmland and oilfields has hundreds of miles from the ocean and that fact seem to have stymied the sk controller who up had no idea how to get rid of the remains. perhaps it never occurred to him to put the body in the trunk of a car and drive it past city limits and bury it behind some old abandoned barn. so, according to sk confessions, tried burning them. that did not work. he thought about throwing them in the saskatchewan river there one town but was afraid someone would see him. he finally decided to toss them down one of the thousands of storm drains. the diary had got to a point where he talked about dumping the body in a sewer and then it ended. by this time, clark believed that the diary was true. all of it. without a body in a case as bizarre as this one, how could any jury be sure any important parts of this sk confessions wants some fantasy from the dark side? clark confronted twitchell with the evidence hoping he would confess. this reminds me of dexter. kill room. clean sweep. you were referring to your garages a kill room. your garage was a kill room. the table is the killed table. it s where you carved him up. i will show you that later but all the blood seeps underneath. the dude dna matching. when i say the show dexter, and you ve seen the show. it s all modeled after dexter. you know that. you kind of look like the guy. i look at that picture, i saw the one on your website, you even look the same. he kills people who needs killing. these guys who get off in court. the guys get off on technicality. he kills people who needs killing. the difference here is you killed a guy who really was no harm to society. there was no response at all. the next day clark and another detective took twitchell and drove him around edmonton hoping he would give up information. what was his demeanor like? defiant. assiduous show is where the body is. will show us where johnny is and drove right here. parked in front of his parents house. after that? mark twitchell was taken to a place that was the center of his life. here we are the killing garage. the dexter garage. look familiar? we parked on top of the sewer where you d dumped the body? jog your memory. clark even took twitchell to the back of the garage, the suspect a crime scene, hoping it would trigger some level of remorse. bring back any memories? want to tell us where the body is? get this over with? okay. back in the car, another detective heard of camera starts working on twitchell. you humiliate your victim. knocked him over the head. carve him up. chop him up. this pales in comparison. twitchell said nothing, at least not in person. he had said plenty in sk confessions, if he was the author. the document was incomplete, ending in a jumble of unrecoverable computer code. com hon, we are to the point where he dumped the body and we don t know the location. a detective did a slow, methodical search through the desktop computer found in twitchell s home, and it paid up. on the computer, once deleted but now found was yet another version of sk confessions with a view tantalizing paragraphs describing the location of the victim s remains. he talks about a specific sewer. how it s off an alley in a grassy area, and an old neighborhood. he talks about telephone poles in the alley. only certain neighborhoods here have telephone poles. the older ones. that s about the time bill clark became a man obsessed. we were pulling manhole covers up. i d be with a flashlight and looking down. we would call the city crews in. nothing. enough to make a person doubt his sanity. coming up. police were about to get some help. a man that open the case. they stopped right here. a year and a half later, where did you find the body? 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after 1.5 years, call from the city jail, and meet wanted to talk to detectives. his name, mark twitchell. he handed over a print out of this google map. at the bottom of the page there was a handwritten note. location of johnny altinger s remains. it was one block south of his parents house and that alley. this is the alley behind the home. it matched perfectly with the description from sk confessions, and in fact, this area had been searched by police a year and a half earlier. they pulled all these sewers all the covers? all the covers. they searched each one and they found nothing. this block, this area, and they sent cameras down the lines where they go down the lines and sneak them down and found nothing. where do they stop? about where you and i are standing. a year and a half later, where did you find the body? right down there. five telephone poles down half a block from where we stopped the search. this was johnny altinger s tomb. there is a piece of trash he probably thought it would get washed away. deteriorate to a point where it would be unidentifiable or no one would look. no one would ever look. why weeks before his murder trial was set to begin did mark twitchell give up johnny altinger s body? there must ve been a reason. because of all the publicity the case generated, the judge slapped a gag order on the press, the police, everybody. which is one the first day of the trial, the disclosure that altinger s body had been uncovered catches everyone by surprise. the reporter is written a book about the case. it doesn t get more explosive than that. it was new information no one had heard before. the trial only got more bizarre is the prosecution unveiled for the first time sk confessions. sitting in the courtroom became a journey deep into the wilderness of a mind of darkness. horde details were written down. no detail was not told within this document. it sounds just like it is fiction, like a script, but when you step back you realize it s a real person. it is a real man who has been murdered. was johnny altinger murder? twitchell admitted he dumped the remains down the storm drain, he never said he murdered him. never admitted he was the author of sk confessions. detectives knew they would need more than this document to get a conviction. the quietly build a case on csi basics. take the garage. this is what it looked like during the normal light of day. and this is a photo taken from the same angle minutes later once the floor was sprayed with luminal, the chemical that makes blood glow. huge spots in the garage would indicate pooling of blood. we found a piece of a human tooth in the garage. we found blood spatter along the walls and the garage door. hundreds of spots where repeating had taken place. also? csi investigators found this gang processing kit. hunters would take it to cut up a moose or whatever they have killed. this is what he used and every single tool in the kit had our victim s dna on it. in his car, police found other hard evidence. we find a knife and there. a knife with blood. visible blood? visible blood and it matches johnny altinger. he left it in the car? and the car is a gold mine . it absolutely blows the case wide open. there are yellow sticky notes on the console. one has a map drawn from the garage to johnny altinger s apartment. he kept everything. wrote everything down. after the presentation of the hard evidence, his coworkers were called to testify. one of the first was the actor who played the victim in house of cards. on his way to court that morning, he worried. what would happen if twitchell is acquitted? i feel he would probably kill me. chris was not alone. rene was unsettled too the day she testified but for another reason altogether. i didn t want to feel judge. because? i have dark thoughts and i shared them with a serial killer. johnny altinger s friend testified. there was nervousness, for sure. and a lot of sadness that day for me. all i can do is speak for john and the person he was. a nice man. definitely. if things had not turned out the way it did, he would ve found what he was looking for in life. it was the first time she had gotten a clear look at mark twitchell . he seemed like a normal, average person off the street. that is what disturbed me. twitchell remained stonefaced even when his wife took the stand. she is crying through all of this. mark twitchell s reaction was nearly blank. when this video was shown a chord during bill clark s testimony, twitchell became unraveled. he starts to cry and tears are streaming down his face. he is getting hysterical. the judge recognized and they took a break. when it comes back after the break, mark twitchell is no better. still very upset and he is crying. he actually faces detective clark and he starts talking to him. he said i am sorry for lying to you. this is extraordinary. you never have the accused talking to one of the primary investigators in the middle of their murder trial. this was far from the strangest moment of the trial. that came in the case for the defense when the attorney called it one witness. mark twitchell. the room was packed. i think everyone was on the edge of their seat wondering what does this guy going to say? twitchell finally had an audience. when he had been waiting 2.5 years to tell. what a story it was. he said you could blend fiction and reality so closely together that everyone would be fooled. fooled. [coughing] copd isn t pretty. i m out of breath, and often out of the picture. but this is my story. ( ) and with once-daily trelegy, it can still be beautiful. because with 3 medicines in 1 inhaler, trelegy keeps my airways open for a full 24 hours and prevents future flare-ups. trelegy also improves lung function, so i can breathe more freely all day and night. trelegy won t replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. do not take trelegy more than prescribed. trelegy may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. what a wonderful world [laughing] ask your doctor about once-daily trelegy for copd because breathing should be beautiful, all day and night. choose advil liqui-gels for faster, stronger and longer-lasting relief than tylenol rapid release gels because advil targets pain at the source of inflammation. so for faster pain relief, advil the pain away. hi, i m kevin and i ve lost 152 pounds on golo. because advil targets pain at the source of inflammation. i decided to give golo a try. taking the release supplement i noticed a change within the first week and each month the weight just kept coming off. with golo you can keep the weight off. keith morrison: (voiceover) in mark twitchell s trial, the defense had but one witness, twitchell himself. and right from the start, he admitted in mark twitchell, they had one witness. right from the start, he admitted killing johnny altinger . then, he told the jury a story. he said what he has done is cooked up this idea that you could blend fiction and reality so closely together that the people, everyone would be fooled into thinking what is fiction is actually reality. house of cards and sk confessions said twitchell worded very the building blocks to a entertain the concept of book and film. there was more. more twisted reality. to generate publicity, he said he first needed to create an online urban legend by doing a series of harmless staged attacks identical s to those depicted in this movie and novel. so when his movie comes out and when the novel comes out, people would googled this and find out there s this urban legend that maybe the movie is real. maybe fiction is reality. he called a? multi-angle psychosis/psychosis label entertainment. sitting on the beach and there s a palm tree and a beach in front of you but when you pull back, it s not a beach but a picture of a beach. the attack on geo tetra was just a stunt. he allowed his parade to escape. and johnny altinger? that was week too just like the first one. but johnny didn t get the joke and furious there was no woman to greet him, tap twitchell with a pipe. he s got this knife on his belt and he tells the jury in his testimony that he puts his hand on the handle of the knife and just as johnny is about to come at him, his lifting the pipe over his head and mark twitchell sticks his hands out in front of him and the next thing he sees is the knife in johnny s stomach and blood is on his hands and he collapses on the floor and dies. the only inaccuracy is the initial attacker was johnny altinger and he , mark twitchell, disposed of the body and the sewer. police have their answer as to why twitchell gave up the body. it was the prologue of his elaborate tail. his defense is a brilliant idea on the surface. he actually found a way to describe an entire police investigation that incriminated him to get him off scott free. in ohio, rene was following all of this online. i watched the live blog they had, and i was screaming my head off at home. you liar. were you afraid the jury would believe him? oh, yeah. you are looking at for the one person that has that doubt. take the doubt back to the deliberation room. gilles tetreault was in course dash cart the day it was completed. i got to sit in the second row. she looked back, my mom, and saw me. i didn t know how she would feel. she turned around and looked at me. she smiled. she grabbed my hand. she said i m so happy you are still with us. that meant so much to me. what was that like? i didn t know how she would feel toward me. when she did that, it was almost another closing moment for me. not for others in the courtroom. apparently not for the jury s deliberations dragged on. the time rolled on. people are thinking maybe there is someone out there who actually does believe mark twitchell. mark twitchell was a masterful liar, maybe this ultimate fantasy would beguile the jury. then that final audience trooped back into the courtroom and gave him his last review. they found him guilty of the premeditated first-degree murder of johnny altinger . he was sentenced to life in prison. i have never been involved in an investigation in my whole career. you theorizes someone has died. there is no doubt we don t always get it right. here we knew exactly what happened to johnny. because he told you. he told us. ultimately, johnny lettuce to a . and twitchell kept writing about it. he would ve kept writing dash cart killing. i did mark twitchell murder johnny altinger? was it a thrill killing? or something even darker? i think he wanted to experience the feeling of killing and dismembering a body. i think down the road, he was going to produce a film about it . he would be a producer who would tell his cast and crew and actors how to do it and only to himself he would know he has lived it. i think that is what he wanted to do. an ohio, rene, twitchell s friend, arrived at the same disturbing theory. i think he did it for artistic reasons. artistic reasons? i think he wanted to see how someone died so he could make a better story. film it better. write about a better. in fact, mark twitchell himself offered an answer to all the people who wondered why. he was different, he wrote in his sk confessions. he simply could not feel anyone. and so, intentionally or not, he offered a dismal reason for murdering a perfect stranger. it was a single line at the end of that horror movie of his house of cards when the killer tells his wife the best way to succeed is to write what you know. this is this is someone at a park at 3:00 am. i am andrea kncanning and this is dateline. i can t believe she would meet someone at a park at 3:00 a.m. i think she knew the second she got in his car that something was wrong. a college student disappears. i d liketo
you re still at the mercy of what these storms decide to do. autumn kirks: i have a very healthy respect for mother nature and tornadoes and what they can do. it can ruin your entire life. it can destroy everything you know. in 2011, after the joplin tornado, amber munson had lost her house, most of her possessions, and all of her treasured photographs. but months later, a miracle. there was a craigslist post from a stranger over 50 miles away who had found a photograph in their yard. it was a picture sucked up by the tornado. a baby photo of amber. the only one to survive. the woman mailed it back to amber along with $5, all she could afford, but wanted to give to help amber start her life over. and with $5, well, she could afford it, wanted to give to help amber start her life over for more information on what you can do in a tornado and what you can do to help combat the growing climate crisis go to cnn.com violent earth i m liev schreiber. thanks for watching. goodnight the listeners as it were the kgb, who had pulled the surveillance equipment lived on the floor above us. and in moscow and you knew they were then on the whole ones just intuitive i mean, i remember my wife and i had some kind of argument about where we could take the children for a weekend picnic in another and manly were, hey, i addressed the silina said, well, you up there, which we agree. and to my amazement, within about two or three hours, somebody had slipped in a note under our front door saying, well, you had agreed on costco vogue or cheerios over whatever was erase some some picnic place i felt that was a kgb surveillance who had a good sense of humor actually this is the unseen story of the cold war but not by politicians that by secret agents there was complete misunderstanding on either side. it s very difficult to determine whom you can trust as the soviet union faces off with the west in the early 1980s to spies play a dangerous game from the shadows they seek to win the upper hand while the world stands on the brink of nuclear war these are their stories in their own words testimony piece together from interviews over the years after 11 years of sigurd worth maybe i developed paranoia and never before heard recordings molten five go up adapting mod getter has been in service i understand the two nadh while catch-all that reveal the deadly intrigues at the heart of the battle between east and west look this is a war a secret war meant at tool was a time when people in soviet union s still believe reality of nuclear war confrontation between west and east was very serious sometimes it was not only iron curtains, it was like iron sphere this is a dangerous moment for the soviet union. almost 40 years into the cold war their economy is overstretched. the military entrenched in afghanistan, and support for communism in decline. the soviet leadership led by leonid brezhnev stockpiles nuclear arms in a show of strength against the west but there s a much subtler weapon to secret intelligence yuri andropov is the head of the soviet intelligence service. the kgb kgb have been running the rational life for years under opa was getting more and more convinced of the menacing was he was a full-blown kgb person who thought that it s either us or them. and basically better be your and drop-off concludes that the superpowers are on the verge of a nuclear war and so he begins a process of collecting information there would be indicators of the approach of nuclear war. this running tally of signs is called operation riyadh and every time andropov gets new intelligence, he takes note there was a chart four american said this the breadths said that somebody was caught here and the plane cross that border and i think and then drop up his mind. he was absolutely convinced nuclear confrontation is coming once this chart is full, andropov is convinced the soviet union should strive and so he uses every resource to keep close watch on his adversaries. being a skilled intelligence officer a spike the life was exciting it for thrilling it was romantic i was thrilled by being involved in specific kgb operation. so like a dead letter boxes or leg, or dsk are very high qualification intelligence officer he was born in a family working for kgb. his brother working for kgb i think was a good example of soviet intelligence service so get tenure on august keen to put agent or the rounds of all the kgb never sent abroad unmarried man there was married to my second wife later as we helped to children i wanted to participate some daring operation i wanted to get a broad as soon as possible in 1982, the kgb sends gordy fc to the uk disguising his identity as a soviet diplomat his posting comes at a tense time relations between east and west are at a knife s edge in december of 1979, the soviets had invaded afghanistan. soviet allies in central america. we re making gains nicaragua and we re trying to make gains in el salvador. meanwhile, on africa soviet allies were fighting in angola. and we re making new friends in other parts of sub-saharan africa. this picture seemed to contradict soviet commitment to better relations with the united states why are they behaving this way? if they really want better relations with us? why are they on the march in what was then called the third world? but we now call the global south there s a political standoff, and neither side shows any signs of backing down the cold war was a view of the world where you had a communist, totalitarian empire run out of moscow. and western countries led by the united states, but including western europe and britain, facing off against each other you have the soviet union, which is at this point a i ll minute superpower, nuclear leader, neck and neck with united states in terms of innovation and development but at the core their ideologies as we know, are completely different democracy versus communism what began as an ideological conflict has escalated into a terrifying nuclear arms race. and neither side wants to appear weak the soviet union had something like 33,000 nuclear weapons. we had something like 22,000 way too many and way too scary. the cold war was an existential struggle over the future of world civilization and that s what makes this moment in history so dangerous is you have both sides completely misunderstanding both the power of their adversary and the intentions of their adversaries assignments are going off. the tornado here you cannot it s one you cannot outrun it it really is a terrifying experience. it is a stuff of nightmares. you just hear it and feel it is o brien. i m thinking i m going to die and i thought that was it. along with earth, with liev schreiber tomorrow at nine on cnn imagine a future where plastic is not wasted. but instead remade over and over into the things that keep our food fresher our family safer and our planet cleaner to help us get there. america s plastic makers are investing 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everything the soviet union stands for and he s not alone president reagan s vast limousine has just drawn up here outside the normal porch of income from buckingham palace there s going to be the first time that an american president has addressed both houses of parliament here in westminster run reagan, that maggie thatcher in was amazed that they thought alike right mr. thatcher really did, despite her uptight bearing and her hairdo really loved to be row with or i ll reagan, there s certain magnetism, there s certainly laurie to him and she she felt that tingling i don t want chancellor speaking for all americans. i want to say very much at home we feel in your house ronald reagan said that soviet communism will lie, cheat still to advance its mission around the world. that was the idea that ronald reagan had to delegitimized the soviet union. the decay of the soviet experiment should come as no surprise to us. we see totalitarian forces in the world who seek subversion and conflict around the globe to further their barbarous assault on the human spirit even before he became president ronald reagan said the cold war will end. and i know how it s going to end we win, they lose and he s about to ramp up the rhetoric even further the march of freedom and democracy will leave marxism-leninism on the asieh history. as it has left other trnas, which stifle the freedom and muzzle the self-expression of the people ronald reagan is rallying the troops. is rallying the nato alone, trying to send a signal that the united states should be respected and even fear the america of the 1970s, which was licking its wounds after losing the vietnam war. that s over. we re back, we re strong, and we should be fear making america great again, if you will. we re going to win in the end. we will outlast them people like me, hardliners stopped. that was terrific most of the people in attendance of the speech didn t think it was to serve him think at all why? because he was too radical it did cause a reaction so that speech, it was offensive and was actually offensive to a lot of people. a lot of people i remember saying while the who the hell are you to? to tell us that we are be people who had streaked that fed into the sense in moscow that ron reagan was account boy and he intended to use nuclear weapons against the soviet union in a war that is really thought psychologically, it is think about how dangerous that is closer cooperation between the uk and the us is exactly what andropov fears and in this cold war, andropov looks to his agents for proof what intelligence did in those days where he gave us details of the overall picture we could follow the number of intercontinental ballistic missiles that they had deployed. we could follow the number of new submarines who could follow the number of new tanks you could follow all these things that you could see from the satellite and we could hear about rumblings from poland or texas czechoslovakia hungary, or bulgaria are the unit to russia this is very typical. one of my wife and my arms eating ice cream in the snow i ve cited the bolshoi that s i was head of sas station in moscow in 19, early 1980s, the civil servants old signatures of official secrets act and set what s not in the public domain is rarely not for discussion by bias station and moscow was quite a small one. the whole apparatus of control and surveillance is very sophisticated than they used to paint radioactive paint on the bottom of our cars i know trackers we were thin on the ground, rarely it is extremely hard for outsiders to discover anything significant about the soviet political intentions while british agents seek a foothold in moscow in london, all or gordy ascii joins his fellow spies london was one of the major cities where serwer bianna is going on the kgb quarters and london, it s called station because you get station it s located in the russia membership that london job was extremely advantageous for gerd gsk it means that he was trusted and that he was decent cooperative, and it was good for him at the kgb station in london, there are two agents above gordy ascii in the hierarchy one of them is the kgb station chief are cati good general beep, fat he was not able to speak good english so he could not do anything. he could not write. he only was able to sign guard duty. sql was supposed to spend most of his time nine to five in the embassy doing she s official job being a diplomat and then during the evening on weekends, she became a spy their job was to get british secrets especially sucrose concerning britain s foreign policy gardi ascii is under pressure to send intelligence to moscow that validates operation rayon at the same time, he s had to hide the fact that he is a kgb spy from the british in their eyes, he s just a diplomat if he blows his cover or fails to feed the soviet leadership with good intel, he ll be on the next plane to moscow boards are very good career move for gorgias by the british counter intelligence service by far, phrases considered one of the most professional services in the world i m purchase sure. she knew that wouldn t be a picnic for him the ceo is about to take off. there s no one that goes the things i do we are personnel in what, four wrestling can be we wednesday night dynamited aid on tbs if advanced lung cancer has you searching for possibilities discover a different first treatment. immunotherapies work with your immune system to attack cancer, but up devo plus your voice is the first combination of two immunotherapies for adults, newly diagnosed with non-small cell lung cancer but to spread tests positive for pd-l1 and does not have an abnormal egfr or alk gene up devo plus your voice is not chemotherapy. it works differently it helps your immune system fight cancer. and two from ways up, devo and year s way can cause your immune system to harm healthy parts of your body during and after treatment, these problems can be 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could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that s uncalled for. doctors preferred better science, better results. i m katelyn polantz at the federal courthouse in washington. and this is cnn close captioning brought to you by guilt visit guilt.com today for up to 70% off designer brands, it has a design is like your heart racing had inside a prices new every day, hurry. there ll be gone in a flash. designer sales that up to 70% shop guilty.com today well, i ve got various newspaper cuttings, but also photos with mrs. t log, with actually was uncompromising in her dislike of socialism and communism and that s what drove her. it look so young and innocent. my job was really to make sure that ten downing street worked well for the prime minister maga margaret thatcher knows that it s not just politics that dictates the key moves in the cold war margaret thatcher was fascinated by intelligence part of it was the glamour but also she d liked to collect as much information as possible and intelligence was one of the sources when the government, there was a special box in number ten in which there would have been regular reports of anything which became known about soviets activity in uk mi6 has a very big secret. they re keeping from the prime minister in britain. i was supposed to be just an official civilian official of the soviet state. but zervos, a number of secrets in my life i was a kgb spy, spying against britain but he isn t just a kgb spy pretending to be a soviet diplomat when the telephone call to business intelligence service that s what you hear welcome. orleck, london. we ve been waiting for you i ll let go ascii is a double agent i became secret agent for the british intelligence in the 60s and 70s, gordy fc was based in denmark as a loyal and dependable kgb agent and it s there that he begins to see things in a different light. a turning point for him was that the soviet decision to crush the prague spring and attempted liberalizing the soviet style regime in czechoslovakia in 1968 gardi f ski katz had an internal personal shift he recognizes the inherent repressive snus of the soviet system, which as a kgb officer, he sworn to defend this is an ideological decision for him if this photo government or security services realized that i was spying for britain, i would have been dead it is not betraying. my country, russia i hated the communist system. i wanted to fight against it i simply would have regarded myself as not an honest person. if i wouldn t be fighting against that system there are some things that i really cannot going to i know you ll understand the nature of what we re talking about. when all lag arrived in london in 1982 it was invaluable to have the views of an insider in the russian embassy in london, who use the meaning of everything that was happening only eight people in the country know about this highly sensitive operation at a highly sensitive time it would be very, very few people anywhere you about all you. don t want anybody at any stage. so betrays a source because accidents happen usually things are very, very carefully contained only people who need to know as a great principal to know you have to keep completely tight to a very few people especially extended 9:00 news with michael president brezhnev, ruler of russia for nearly two decades is dead. so the soviet people tonight, five days of mourning begin the leaders who ve grown old in his shadow, the chance of ultimate power who will take over administration officials so there will be no change in us foreign policy toward the soviets until there is a change in soviet policy the soviet union finds reagan s aggressive tone not just insulting but an existential threat right now, the last thing the communist party wants is to be seen as weak so it decides to promote someone with a very clear agenda one adviser, calm front lawn or yuri andropov, a hard line man who would be we ve talked to deal with hey, mom, how many should i decorated? have ran have blue. that s a really tough call for you. that s john king from cnn. let s look at the data your county leaned red eye 15 points in the last presidential election however looking at the latest polling, you re going to need a lot of those purple sprinkles how this guy really knows his stuff $5 a cupcake, you know, the average cost of a cupcake around here is $3 no comment i m getting vaccinated and pfizer s pneumococcal pneumonia vaccine because i m at risk for pneumococcal pneumonia already gotten pneumonia vaccine. but i m asking about the added protection of krever, not 20. if you re 19 or older with certain chronic conditions like asthma, diabetes, copd, or heart disease, or are 65 or older, you are at increased risk for pneumococcal pneumonia, prevnar 20 is approved in adults to help prevent infections from 20 strains of the bacteria that caused me cockle pneumonia in just one dose, don t get prevnar 20. if you ve had a severe allergic reaction to the vaccine or its ingredients adults with weakened immune systems may have a lower response to the vaccine. the most common side effects for pain and swelling at the injection site, muscle pain, fatigue headache, and joint pain. i want to be able to keep my plans. i don t want to risk ending up in the hospital with pneumococcal pneumonia. that s why i chose prevnar to ask your doctor or pharmacist? about the pfizer vaccine for pneumococcal pneumonia new group does assignments get my bag like a bunch of groceries, alice cheese and greens, just contemplate freedom. you can take your eyes off the new 2024 jeep wrangler in gladiator jeep, there s only one during the jeep make this the summer event, get 2000 bonus cash allowance plus no monthly payments for 90 days on the 2024 gop-led ear. and most 2024 jeep wrangler gas-powered models yeah, introducing ned s plaque psoriasis. he thinks is flaky red patches are all people see. oh, tesla is the number one prescribed pill to treat blacks psoriasis oh, tesla can help you get clears don t use a tesla if you re allergic to it, serious allergic reactions can happen. oh, tesla may cause severe diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting some people take new tesla had depression, suicidal thoughts, or weight loss upper respiratory tract infection, and headache may occur 242424 new cnn original series new episodes tomorrow would nine just two days after leonard brezhnev death, the head of the kgb hard line or yuri andropov, is promoted to the top job and drop was quite a terrifying man. he came out of the apparatus of control and he event, ran the soviet union as a very controlled environment. the moral vice president bush arrived or also secretary of state show pushes visit is intended as a gesture of conciliation according to western diplomats here he s diplomats worried that new communist party chief yuri andropov may have had to pledge a tough anti washington line and big weapons buildup to win military support. they would like the american delegation to meet with andropov after the funeral monday, but have no assurance the meeting will be arraigned here was a guy who came out of the soviet intelligence community you had the feeling during and drop-offs period that, you know, things were really inert. and the old generation was still still running the country my family was simply terrified. a great grandfather was crews shift. it was said the general secretary of the communist party of the soviet union khrushchev dismantled or as much as he could, he dismantle the kgb after stalin s death. so i m drop-off as my mother was convinced, was going to come back at us and the family with a vengeance. and there was even a talk that the gulags are going to be reinstated he is going to push forward certain policies including international policies as leader of the soviet union. andropov takes his operation rayon charts from the kgb back rooms to the heart of soviet policy you re andropov is a very conspiratorial figure. he is convinced that the united states is seeking domination over the soviets and ultimately a nuclear victory and then so the soviet union has to be completely and utterly prepared to push that button all eyes are now on reagan in this uncharted new landscape reagan was adamant that he is not going to deal with this red, red and for and rope of reagan, was that cow boy who s going to destroy the soviet union because he was playing an oldest films like john wayne reagan, and drop him always found each other neither of them would be a cough this was moment when we were really scared of the nuclear war that really stayed with me as the scariest time that i ve ever experienced in my life. and the soviet union the opposing sides and the cold war could not be further apart britain s double agent is now vital to understanding the level of andropov his paranoia he s got access to the operations being were on against the united kingdom by intelligence officers in the embassy and he s got a knowledge of the politics of moscow god, yes, get of course was able to brief his handlers on the gossip he knows a lot of people in the system and therefore, he s got this unrivaled insight into how decisions are taken, how they think in the senior reaches of the politburo he would be able to leave the embassy on a regular basis and to a safe house where he would be debriefed and if he could smuggle documents out of the embassy so much the better and the b arrangements for copying those in the safe house gordy? yes. skis actions make him so valuable. mi6 decides to inform ten downing street in? december. 1982 margaret thatcher is told that a highly placed kgb spy now works as a double agent for the british but she isn t told his name two months later, gordy ascii provides crucial intelligence operation. reihan is now official soviet policy what the soviets didn t understand is that there was a possibility that operation reihan could be a self-fulfilling prophecy operation reihan was perfect example of starting with a conclusion and then looking for justification for that conclusion. agents were asked are the americans and the british on the verge of nuclear war they were asked, proved to us find the evidence that they are, so that we re be ready for it. and that was the fundamental flaw with operation rayon we were instructed to watch for signs of special activities greetings within particularly by night. blitz, windows of the means of defense, and 40 law office. the american embassy, wrecking overtime until early morning hours what you like that jeff skate really brought was an insight, understanding of what operation rayon was really about it we re showing a paranoia but the paranoia was real asu, they very seeing reports the number of clauses was slowly, slowly growing visuals lucky the point, yes they re preparing when two sides don t know one another, they both misread signs you can see how dreadful things can happen by that kind of misunderstanding gardi of skis intel on the deepening soviet paranoia is so vital to the british that they must conceal their source even from the american the reason the british did not want the americans to know who gordy xq was, was the more people who know the name of a source the more imperiled the source becomes. reagan doesn t have the luxury of the brits inside knowledge. he feels the most effective approach is to scare the soviets into backing down he takes a brazen and terrifying new stands cnn special event. it s time to celebrate freedom progress and the trail blazers. he paved the way this is a festive day for all black americans. we still have a lot of work to do joins cnn s victor blackwell for a native interviews and performance is by john legend smoke robinson and so much more cnn special event, june celebrating freedom and legacy. wednesday, june 19 at ten when cnn i have relapsing a mess but i still want to spend my time my 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blamed for the cold war. they re both to be blamed for all these nuclear weapons. there s an moral equivalence between the two. ronald reagan was saying there s no moral could lead us, pray for the salvation of all of those who live in that totalitarian darkness. they are the focus of evil in the modern world everybody suggest this was, and how inflammatory this was. people worried that this cowboy from the west was irresponsible and he could blow us all on reagan s approach is to aggressively arm europe as a way to force the soviets to back down the whole idea of whether you were taught tough or soft on communism was still very much part of our political landscape. he decided to assure the right wing of the republican party that he was tough on communism. and i was dismayed because what is the strategy to call somebody? the global center of evil, if you insult people publicly, you ll have a hard time getting cooperation out of them. reagan also promotes a defense system nicknamed star wars these space lasers would identify and prevent incoming nuclear missiles its critics ridiculed it as unrealistic but the prospect of taking the nuclear arms race to space terrifies andropov there s the idea that we need to be very strong the only way to deter the soviet union from any kind of regression is to show them that they cannot win. and anything second thing that was going on was that we re going to increase our defense spending quite a bit in the soviet unique can t do that. they can t keep up with us. so we re going to spend them into oblivion. as reagan ramps up his rhetoric, a drama unfolds on the other side of the world that threatens to push the cold war over the edge governments around the world have expressed indignation over the soviet union s action and shooting down a korean jumbo jet over the cluster and pacific. the un security council will take up that incident later today. that tragedy later today, it s now reported that at least 50 of the 269 people on that jet were americans. the search goes on for the planes wreckage the crisis of our flight deck below seven just about half were korean, japanese, and taiwanese the free world was outraged once it s no exaggeration to say that western governments have been stunned and evening little frightened what s the news comes at a soviet had shut down the korean airliner, ronald reagan mediately goes on national television and uses every dirty word for their behavior that he can find. the source what can be said about soviet credibility when they so flagrantly lie about such a heinous act the soviet union becomes very defensive, very quiet, and makes no apologies at all. the military in moscow explain the korean jumbo was spying. so our missiles brought it down hi, my name s is robert mental cable news network. wondering if you will be having any type of statement not to say about the carolinas, not thank expect one soon. so that drove people in the west, especially conservatives like me, to think, boy, they are even worse than we thought they were. the incident raises the frightening thought that the finger on the soviet nuclear trigger could be as unstable as the individual who gave the order to shoot down the korean airliner it sparks protests and condemnation around the world i mean, there was really significant fear that this was going to lead to something big and extremely, extremely dangerous when the competition is a nuclear competition spying is extraordinarily important the russians were trying to spy on us we were spying on them it s very difficult to determine whom you can trust i was telling frank everything got that a control this is a war. the secret was secrets and spies, a nuclear game. sunday at ten on cnn, apartments.com. let s any landlord find qualified renders and signed leases and collect payments from any place even here and whirs here, he sled dave and ada apartments.com, the place to list of place every time i need a new phone, i had to switch carriers. 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questions. so we have answers like how to keep your yard looking, luck bush, which paint color matches your bold style with my lows rewards credit card, you can say 5% every day. you got this and we got, you doctors preferred better science, better results. chasing life with dr. sanjay gupta. listen wherever you get your podcasts in late 1983 piece hangs in the balance between the east and the west in a bid to be ready for soviet nuclear attack west launches able archer it s an annual military operation. but this year s exercise is more realistic than before 40,000 us and nato troops gather across europe right on the ussr s border. april archer was a normal military exercise by dado command to prepare naval forces in europe for an attack from the soviet union. but the way it was done was not normal at all the nuclear component of the exercise was hyped up the idea of it was make this as realistic as you could possibly make it the western powers show an almost naive ignorance of how this huge training exercise will be received in the ussr for andropov, it looks like his operation rayon prophecy is coming true they really see much more cables payable agile i knew, it wasn t dramatic moment i knew moscow was nervous and it came i m at a very sensitive moment for moscow that it had been humiliated on the global stage following the downing of that jet in particular. so every move was interpreted probably to a larger degree than it should have. b52 bombers with nuclear capabilities now arrive at the us airbase in germany andropov watches everything unfold from his hospital bed the soviet people are unaware of their leaders declining health as he keeps his hands firmly on the reins of power they re all puffy is dying, but he s clutching that red button. she really thinks if it s not him, who else he s in charge the soviet scrambled to respond nuclear submarines are primed and ready soviet troops are put on a 15 combat standby oh, ola go dfc probably was the one person who could convey to western sources what was going on inside the mind of soviet leadership at the time of able archer ascii helps his handlers realize that they re dealing with sheer paranoia at the hands at the top leadership in the soviet union. now unfortunately, it didn t come in time enough for this exercise to be canceled the exercise continues oblivious that a nuclear confrontation is now just a phone call away. but it s again, but i mean, it but it s not a game too. and i think what happened is that everything got out of control. this is just something that people can t comprehend that human error could bring the end of the world people just can t absorb that ultimately, you i kind of have this mid udacity. you believe in you own propaganda of your own greatness. you re in the control of the state all russian and soviet dictator s the problem is they always think that the, the last line of defense you are in power you have the right to if you decide to destroy it. so nobody else forget the united states doesn t even notice that the soviet der, on edge. they didn t even put the soviet reaction into ronald reagan s presidential daily brief before andropov can act, the able archer operation wraps up on schedule andropov is finally persuaded he that this really was just an exercise. this time life contribution was explained that this is dangerous you ll playing with fire the liver simply daughter the stands and intelligence. old russian leaders they able archer exercise world came very close to nuclear war the united states didn t know the ratchet down the tension when it really matter that is an indicator of just the lack of understanding that the united states and the soviet union headed each other. but in a nuclear confrontation, lack of understanding can have catastrophic consequences when adversaries have nuclear weapons pote
100%. judy s family says they can finally move on with their lives. there is one thing that brings them peace. you are religious. does that give you any comfort to know your mom and dad are now together? they are in a better place than we are. what would you say to judy? i will tell her that i love her and i would give her the biggest hug. that is all for this edition of dateline. thank you for watching. ank you this sunday edition of morning joe weekend. it was another fast-moving news week. here are more of the conversations you ekmight have missed. donald trump and his allies are ratcheting up their calls for revenge against democrats in response to trump s conviction in his new york city criminal trial. some examples. in a fox news interview on friday, former white house advisor stephen miller called le on republican secretary of state and attorneys general to quote, get in the game and use every facet of power to go toe to toe with democrats. florida senator marco rubio who is reportedly in the mix to be trump s running mate which would make sense given his behavior wrote on social media quote, it s time to fight fire with fire. in response to a new york times piece about recent calls for refry abuse, former white house chief strategist steve bannon echoed stephen miller telling the paper quote, there are dozens of ambitious backbencher state attorneys general and ne district attorneys who need to seize the day and own this moment in history. then there is trump himself. in s an interview earlier this week he suggested hillary clinton be jailed in response to his guilty verdict. and here s what he said at his florida home yesterday in a fox news interview last night with sean hannity where you see hannity trying to get him to the right answer but no. take a listen. you can t gag a nominee. can you imagine you re running for office and you gag. you re not allowed to talk. when that happens we are no longer a democracy. and we re not going to let that happen. and i know a lot of republicans who want retribution. they want to do that we re going to see what happens. people are claiming you want retribution. people are claiming you want u what has happened to you done to democrats. would you ondo that ever? look, what s happened to me has never happened in this country before. and it has to stop because wait a minute, i want to hear that again. it has to stop. we re not going to have a country. if you re elected awhat doe that mean? define that. what i ve gone through nobody s ever gone through. i m a very legitimate person. i built a great business. focus on those that want people to believe that you want retribution. that you will use the system of justice to go after your political enemies. number one, they re wrong. it onhas to stop. otherwise we re not going to have a country. look, when this election is over, based on what they ve done, i would have every right to go after them. it s easy because it s joe biden and you see all the criminality. will you pledge to restore equal justice? equal application of our laws? end this practice of weaponnization? is that a promise? you have to do it. but it s awful. look, i know you want i m asking. i don t want to look naive. what they ve done to the republican party, they want to arrest on no crime. i will do everything in my power not to let, but this tremendous criminality here. what they re doing to me if it s going to continue we re really not going to have much of a country left. okay, willie. help me out here. first of all, no criminality. this was not biden s justice department in the criminal trial in new york city. it was a yjury of donald trump peers, 12 people and alternates. just to fact check him right there. but also hannity, mr. softball, setting him up saying come on, come on, you wouldn t actually have retribution. you don t mean that. of course he s like yes, i do. just like what the documents. when hannity was like come on, you didn t actually take the documents. donald trump is kenot messing around. he promises retribution and as he even told hannity when hannity gave him a chance to semi cover it he will serve it up. so, with that, i mean i m not sure what more people need to know given a lot of things donald trump has promise have had come to pass. i m not smiling about the substance of what the president said, i m smiling with what you put your finger on which is this entire genre of interview where sean hannity embeds the answer into his question and tries to lead donald. i wish my oral exams in high school and college were like that where the teacher would just nod along and give you the answer. that s the way they do it. he said donald trump in the remarks we played before that clip he said a malot of people are saying they re going to want retribution. so he likes to separate himself but obviously he means himself and obviously sending cues to others about what should happen. again, he was charged, he was tried, he was convicted by a jury of his peers in new york. the fact that he took classified documents back to his beach club is not some imagined conspiracy against him. he did. hing we ll see what happens in that trial as it moves forward. he wants retribution against people, the justice department, the fbi who are actually bringing him to justice on things that he did or is alleged to have done. let s bring to the conversation yeah. one thing before we get to our guests. it s so interesting to me that n he says this has never happened before and that s why something needs to be done. in every case, well, i will say in the most clear cases because obviously we have to wait for the law to play out. but in the case of the documents you see the pictures. he says he took them. he says they re his. he admits to the crime. in the case of the hush money. criminal trial where 34 felony counts against donald trump came up guilty, there was evidence presented in court that backed it up. so yes, yes, mr. president, former president trump, this hasn t happened before. there hasn t been a former president who had sex with a porn star while his wife was pregnant and then years later before a campaign was to get into full swing paid off through hush money through a fixture breaking campaign finance laws and having fraudulent business records. i mean that is not happened before. he s right, otit hasn t happene before. but it s unfortunately what happened to him because of his own actions. right. and change the suspect from subject to some imagined conspiracy that suggests the government is out to get him. let s bring in ceo of the massina group jim massina. and ran obama s 2012 reelection campaign 20successfully, of course. jim, great to see you. you often are the guy who comes in and sort of tries to calm the nerves a bit of democrats b when they get panicky. not in some polly anish way, but looking at data, looking at normals. let s talk about the fundraising that scared a lot of democrats after donald trump was convicted last week on 34 felony counts. raised a boatload of money. put that into some perspective though as compared to how the biden campaign is doing. yeah, if you look at the overall numbers biden continues to have a very healthy fundraising lead. has way more money in eathe ban i know this sounds geeky, but the truth is joe biden s money is all small donors whereas donald trump s money is from m big donors who are giving to his super pacs. that ad buying later in the campaign is more expensive. they can t get the lowest unit rate. most importantly, the one thing you can t make more of in a presidential election is time. we re 152 days out and the biden campaign has over 150 field offices staffed with paid staffers in the battleground states. donald trump has zero. so every day these people are talking to voters both their own base and these swing voters and you just can t replicate that with money. we always knew that trump was going to catch up weafter he go the nomination. he clearly had an outstanding day after his criminal conviction. it s a little cynical they raised a bunch of money after he was found guilty of 34 felony counts. it y is what it is. overall the biden campaign is doing what they need to do which is build a massive army in these battleground states. the biden campaign looking forward to that first debate as a moment to change fra joke tour of the race. we re seeing polls shift a little bit towards the president. let s owget you to weight in yesterday. this wall street journal story about the president s age. we can set aside the marriage of the journalism. there were flaws in the story we covered at length yesterday. polls suggest some americans think the president is too old for office. we know donald trump just a couple years younger. if you were still in the white house, what would your communication strategy be to simply manage the issue. fair or not it s out there. how would you suggest the white house and campaign handle it? by doing exactly what they re doing. getting him out there as much e as they can. about getting an early debate. you re exactly right. it is an issue. people have questions about it. we all remember at the state of the union he did a master performance and looked on top of his game and the polls rose then. this debate moment is really, really big for them. i can t believe donald trump is letting them have it. people expect joe biden to not be as good as donald trump. trump has set all the expectations to the top activity moon. he s this great or tore. he s this great guy. joe s sleepy joe, et cetera. joe biden goes in there and has a good debate and it s going to significantly make people think about their perceptions of this race. i think it ll be a very big moment and i think biden was very smart to ask for a debate as early as he could get it. we ll be right back with much more morning joe. ore morn. sup? -who are you? i m your inner child. get in. listen. 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[vroom] [train horn] [buzz] clearing the way, [whoosh] so you arrive exactly where you belong. everybody wants super straight, super white teeth. they want that hollywood white smile. new sensodyne clinical white provides 2 shades whiter teeth and 24/7 sensitivity protection. i think it s a great product. it s going to help a lot of patients. there is actually axios has reporting this morning quoting steve bannon. take it for what it s worth. a voice of a maga world saying they re going to go after alvin bragg first to try to put him in jail. a lot of people go oh, it s donald trump popping off. it s what he does. he s calling in to newsmax. you have to take this stuff seriously given not only who he is but who he has surrounded himself with. we ve learned when he make as threat like this we have to take it seriously. and what s different here, there s been republican anger for years now. they claim the witchhunts against donald trump. what s different about this verdict is how out in the open it is. there s no euphemisms here. there s no let s be clever. they re saying we re going to go after those who have done this to donald trump. yes, steve bannon talking about alvin bragg. we have speaker johnson. the house speaker saying they re going to look at the department of justice and try to defund a lot of what it can do as payback for the biden doj going after donald trump. now of course there s a limit to what they can actually do. the threat is still there. it erodes americans faith in our institutions. this has been one of the most dominant themes of the trump era is going after, perceiving whether it s the fbi or the media and they have singled out those of us there as well as targets for retribution. and trying to get americans to say hey, look, they re not on our side. they re for them and really vilify everyone and it s putting us in a dangerous place. the most dominant aspect, i would suggest. not one of. the most dominant aspect. and you know, largely this is my personal view now. but at some point americans have to ask themselves what kind of a country do we want. in this particular day it s almost sack religious to be talking about donald trump said and what he means and what he s going to do. we just spoke to a man who just finished a book on eisenhower talking about the night before d-day when general eisenhower went through the 101st airborne shaking hands and he knew every other hand he shook was a young 18, 19 or 20-year-old paratrooper who was going to die within 12 hours on the beaches in normandy. we were going to lose a young american. why were they going? they were going to fight for democracy. all these years later, 80 years later, democracy is again in peril. that s a fact. that s a fact. listening to donald trump, that s a fact we have to live with. that s a fact that americans are going to have to make up their minds about. what kind after country do we want going forward? we may hear some of that theme from president biden tomorrow at normandy when he delivers the address. he ll be there all week as you reported yesterday. he ll be at bella woods later in the week the world war i site. talking about the young men who frankly saved the world in those days, weeks and months but also about bringing it to today and the threats of democracy here. it s hard not to be almost emotional thinking about this scene with eisenhower. we ll hear from the president several times this week. his remarks tomorrow will be relatively brief. it s the next day, the friday where he goes where ronald reagan delivered his famous speech. talking about yes, the sacrifices of 80 years ago that helped save the world. but connecting it to today. the battle we re seeing in ukraine. also just the need to affirm and rebuild democracies across the globe. i m told the odds are against him invoking donald trump by name. trump will shadow this. he will draw an implicit contrast to the future that trump will bring versus the one that he would. one with allies. one with defending democracy. we know donald trump will take a different approach to the ukraine war working to be returned to office. he almost pulled autoof nato on the eve of going to helsinki. we ll hear that in grand terms from president biden in what aides tell me will be one of the most important speeches he delivers this year. one that will not on the surface be a campaign speech. yeah. we just talk about the choices. mike talking about the choices. we hear what he said about hillary clinton. we re talking about nato. donald trump trying to undermine nato. said he wanted to undermine nato. said a couple months ago he encouraged vladimir putin to invade nato countries if they didn t have sort of defense structure that he wants them to have. of course he talked about putting hillary clinton in jail. throwing political opponents in jail. his people have talked about throwing us in jail. throwing people that run this show in jail. they ve talked about throwing media companies in jail that are insufficiently loyal. he talks about executing chairmans of the joint chiefs of staff who are insufficiently politically loyal to him. he talks about terminating the constitution. he talks about using seal team six to execute political opponents and says that he would be immune from that. he had his lawyers argue that in court. go through all of it and it is extraordinary. it s extraordinary that this man is talking like an autocrat. talking like putin and that right now this race is too close to call. i think it s really worth pointing out that the difference between trump in 2020 and trump in 2024 and trump in 2016 is this time around his team and campaign are much more focused on how they would do exactly the kinds of things you ve spoken about. they ve drawn up the policy papers. they ve dug in to the workings of the american government to see how they could effectively take control of the fcc. of the doj. use the irs against political opponents of theirs. they ve been very honest about the idea of using this second administration for retribution against those people who have counted donald trump. it s sometimes easy with donald trump because we hear so many things that are out of the norm they go well, it s just another thing donald trump says. behind donald trump in 2024 is a whole infrastructure of people putting in place the plans to follow up with the kinds of things that donald trump is saying out on the campaign trail. they didn t manage to do much of it in 2016 because they weren t prepared. this time around they re making sure they are prepared. so the group republican voters against trump is launching a new billboard ad campaign looking to persuade moderate republicans and republican leaning voters in four swing states. the billboards feature former trump voters who now say they won t vote for him in the wake of his conviction last week in his new york city criminal trial. let s bring in the executive director of republican voters against trump sarah longwell. she s also a publisher and host of the focus group podcast. thank you so much for joining us. to tell us more about this campaign and what you re hearing from republican voters. question after the conviction, the political question is will voters care? and from our perspective you have to help make them care. the republicans are out there right now and they are building their own narrative. building their own echo chamber. they are all singing from the same song sheet that this was rigged, that we have a two tier justice system. we have to go on offense right now and make sure voters understand how unique, how historically unique in a desperately dark way it is to have a convicted felon running for president. so our program republican voters against trump, it hick hinges on a key theory which is you need credible messengers to speak to these vote percent. we have hundreds of people who voted for trump in the past, many voted for him twice who are explaining and there s testimonials all over our website explaining why they won t vote for trump again. but after the conviction we wanted to make sure that it stuck with people. we have watched donald trump extraordinary things have happened. like his own vice president not endorsing him. and yet it kind of just rolls off voters minds. trump s been around for a long time. we have two functional incumbents and that create as dynamic where voters aren t as tuned in in ways they might have. you have to go on offense. you have to have strong affirmative messaging to make sure things stick in the mind of voters. you can t count on the idea that voters hear conviction and walk away. you have to help them understand why this is so extraordinary. why what he defense wrong and why he s too dangerous to be in the white house. to that point about the difficulty in making things stick to trump. we live in a world where it seems like everyone s attention span is a few fleeting moments. so it s not just there s a conviction. conviction happened at the end of may. here we are the first few days of june. we re still five months to the election. how do you get it to resinate to stay in the forefront of voters minds not just now but as they head into the ballot box? this is one of the ways democrats have to figure out how they re going to do their messaging strategy. i think that oftentimes they get really fractured around messaging and have a difficult time going on offense as opposed to playing defense. so part of this is to make sure that acknowledging donald trump s conviction is a regular feature in the way that democrats are talking about him. and not just joe biden. joe biden as a messenger has a particular role i think to explain to the country what he s going to do over the next four years. but democrats need an army of surrogates who are out there making an affirmative case. going on offense. going on attack against donald trump. making sure the countriens understands. and that he s a been convicted of sexual assault and that he s been convicted for, you know, the things he did with the trump org and reminding people of january 6th. it is really, this is going to be a choice about who is the the lesser of two evils and you have to have voters understand trump is the greater of evils. liable of sexual abuse, defamation and massive fraud. and then convicted felon who is openly hell bent on revenge. that s what voters have to consider. sarah longwell. thank you for being on this morning. coming up, new reporting on how closely europe is watching the upcoming u.s. election. we ll be right back. l be right. i brought in ensure max protein with 30 grams of protein! those who tried me felt more energy in just two weeks. -ugh. -here, i ll take that. woo hoo! ensure max protein, 30 grams protein, 1 gram sugar, 25 vitamins and minerals. and a new fiber blend with a prebiotic. 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( ) start your day with nature made. the #1 pharmacist recommended vitamin and supplement brand. november s presidential election has implications well beyond our country s borders. in a new piece entitled what europe fears details how european leaders and nato are preparing for the potential reelection of donald trump and joining us now the author of that piece staff writer at the atlantic mckay coppins. tell us what these leaders are saying. i was struck by two things. they re watching the u.s. election very closely. the state secretary in germany told me that in a year when billions of people around the world will have the opportunity to vote the one election everyone in europe cares about and is paying attention to is the american presidential election. the other thing that struck me is almost every official i spoke to believed that donald trump was going to win again. and they say that with a sense of dread in some cases bordering on panic. the word that i heard most often in these interviews was existential. if donald trump comes back, we made it through the first trump term. and it took a toll on the transatlantic relationship. but they made it through. they said if he comes back given what he s been saying about nato, given what he s been saying about russia, the war in ukraine, they re really afraid that it will be the end of nato and the beginning of a new stage of russian aggression that europe frankly isn t prepared for without america s support. so mckay, let s dive into that more. there s been from president macron of france this effort to make europe less dependent on the u.s. in terms of our military and financial strength. what other steps are he and his fellow european leaders taking to try to if you will trump proof what they re doing right now ahead of his possible return? yeah, there have been a number of efforts recently proposed. one of them as you mentioned is, you know, developing defense autonomy in europe in a way that would potentially channel funds away from nato which really does rely on america and toward the european defense alliance. there s been talk of taking the responsibility for arming ukraine, literal logistical responsibility out of america s hands and putting that in nato s hands because they don t know if a future trump administration would abandon the war or not. really the biggest change has been that a lot of european allies are spending a lot more now on their own defense. and this is one thing that, you know, trump takes credit for and i have to say a lot of the european officials i spoke to grudgingly gave him some credit for. they said trump by kind of being so vociferous about this issue that european allies aren t spending enough on defense has sort of bullied a lot of these countries into spending more, but it s come at a cost. and that cost is that these european countries while they are now spending more on collective defense, contributing more to nato, also don t trust america as a long term ally the way they have for the last 75 years. when america becomes an unpredictable power or a transactional power, that changes the entire global order in ways that i don t think we can predict right now. sure does. and we heard back in i think it was 2018, 2019 angela merkel saying we can no longer depend on the united states basically with trump because he s so erratic. we ll have to defend ourselves. it s something macron said as well. if donald trump s making them spend more money on defense because they re spending more money on defense because they know they can t count on the united states in their minds if donald trump is president of the united states. mckay writes this also, that almost every official i spoke with believed that trump is going to win. i hear that an awful lot from europe and i hear from across the world. i think claire, we should probably tell our friends not to bet too many euros or pounds on that fact because what you see on tv may not be what ends up happening at the voting booths for swing voters in wisconsin, michigan and pennsylvania. yeah, those three states particularly where really biden has never been more than a point or two behind and in polls has been ahead. those three states are incredibly important. mckay, i wanted to ask you about what s going on in europe domestically in terms of their politics. we have seen in the united states populism and anti- immigration that has really roiled our politics here. what is happening in that front in europe? it looks from a distance that they re having some of the same issues internally within the conservative parties there. the antiimmigration, the populism. is that something that europe is also worried about? oh, no question. the fear of trump s return in europe is of a piece with the fear of a broader rise of right wing populism and nationalism. we ve seen it in the uk. italy. in germany the afd party. the far right party. there was one recent poll that found 25% of germans now identify with that party. and that s a pretty extreme party. so there s no question that throughout western democracies and really in europe especially we have seen a lot of the same forces that contributed to trump s rise. in some ways the europeans understand trump through that prism. they re saying, you know, we get it, we have our own issues here. if some of our allies have elected leaders like donald trump. it s different when it happens in america. america is not only the lynch pin of the nato alliance. it is in a lot of ways seen as kind of the big brother. european countries rely on america for security, they rely on it for leadership. they rely on america to set an example to the world for what a well functioning western democracy should look like. a lot of the anxiety about this election in europe stems from the fact that they re seeing this chaos in american democracy and wondering if the city on a hill can still be looked to as an example. and that causes a lot of alarm among our friends in europe. the new piece is online now for the atlantic. staff writer mckay coppins, thank you for writing the piece and being on the show this morning. next, former capitol police officer harry dunn will be here to talk about why he is starting a new pac to support candidates running against pro- trump republicans. trump republicans. slowing my cancer from growing and living longer are two things i want from my metastatic breast cancer treatment. and with kisqali, i can have both. kisqali is a pill that when taken with an aromatase inhibitor helps delay cancer from growing and has been proven to help people live significantly longer across three separate clinical trials. so, i have the confidence to live my life. kisqali can cause lung problems or an abnormal heartbeat, which can lead to death. it can cause serious skin reactions, liver problems, and low white blood cell counts that may result in severe infections. avoid grapefruit during treatment. tell 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like a migraine. with nurtec odt, i found relief. the only migraine medication that helps treat and prevent, all in one. to those with migraine, i see you. for the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura and the preventive treatment of episodic migraine in adults. don t take if allergic to nurtec odt. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain. it s time we all shine. talk to a healthcare provider about nurtec odt from pfizer. some of the police officers who defended the united states capitol on january 6th are continuing their fight to protect democracy. harry dunn, daniel hodges to make the case for reelecting president biden in november and stopping donald trump. today coming off an unsuccessful bid for congress which saw him bring in more than $5 million for the campaign, dunn is launching a new political action committee. i was always ready for game day. two teams lined up. it s us versus them. you leave it all on the field. i m harry dunn and on january 6th the good guys won. they fellow officers and i fought as a team. we had each other s back. and we didn t do it for one person or one president. we did it for our country. to make sure everyone s vote counted. that s what democracy is. that no one person s voice is greater than another. when i ran for congress, hundreds of thousands of regular people stood with me and we broke records in fundraising. but our system still allows the wealthiest americans and their corrupt super pacs to support insurrectionsists and drown out our voices. our team has got to change that. we need to support candidates committed to getting money out of politics and defending our democracy from donald trump and maga extremists. nobody said it would be easy, but for our country, fur our team, we can t stop now. and former u.s. capitol police officer harry dunn joins us now. he s the author of the recent book standing my ground. thanks for being with us again this morning. you ran for congress in the state of maryland. fell a little short l but did have some money leftover from that campaign. tell us more about what you plan to do with it. thanks for having me on. always good to be on with you all. we did fall short, but the reason why i ran was to do everything i can to continue to fight for democracy. to fight to preserve our constitution. and to fight to stop maga extremists. at the very top of the ticket, donald trump. we did raise millions of dollars in a very short period of time and what that told me is that a lot of people across the country that message of our democracy, the threat of losing it. the threat of this being our potential last free and fair election resinates with a lot of people. it s at the top of peoples minds. what we ll do is continue to use that momentum to continue to go across the country. up and down the ballot. and elect democrats and stop maga republicans. also fight to continue to get big corporate money out of politics. and support those candidates that really want to do that. so harry, when you re out there, when you re out there running for congress and meeting a lot of people and talking to a lot of people. that aspect that you just mentioned the threat to democracy. when you would talk to people about the threat to democracy, how many of the people you spoke to thought it was like real? that it could happen? as opposed to no, it worries a lot of people. it worries a lot of people. because like i say, a lot of the issues that we talk about. common sense gun reform, lowering inflation. all of those things as important as they are, if we have a dictator in the white house, a dictator over democracy, what is the purpose? those issues really don t matter because the dictator gets what he wants. everybody is definitely worried. even people that voted against me tell me they are worried about our democracy. so i think it is very front and center with a lot of people. being out here on the campaign trail for president biden i m in pennsylvania right now, one of the things people are definitely worried about. it resinates with people and as people talked about, he s talking about retribution and imprisoning his political opponents. and people are really worried about that. next, actor bill pullman on his new life time movie that was ripped from the headlines as he plays alex murdaugh who was found guilty of murdering his wife and son. morning joe weekends will be right back. right back. of finding psoriasis can t filter out the real you. so go ahead, live unfiltered with the one and only sotyktu, a once-daily pill for moderate to severe plaque psoriasis, and the chance at clear or almost clear skin. it s like the feeling of finding you re so ready for your close-up. or finding you don t have to hide your skin just your background. once-daily sotyktu was proven better, getting more people clearer skin than the leading pill. don t take if you re 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the heart of the family s demise alex murdaugh. once a successful lawyer from a team with a rich history in south carolina, his trial made headlines last year when he was convicted of murdering his wife and his son and stealing millions from his legal clients while blaming an addiction to painkillers for his crimes. join us now, bill pull nba who plays alex murdaugh. good to see you. you re kind of like i was with this trial which i didn t really know a ton about it and then i tuned in late and kind of couldn t get enough of it. so when you first heard about this role what were your impressions of this guy? yeah, i realized everybody else in the world in america knew about it. i think i, you know, i didn t know if i was going to do it. kind of had to be a fast decision. but my first thing was i don t know if i want. i don t know anything about it. then you start watching something and they ve got body cam and dash cam and of course the courtroom scene. so much there. and then i realized but as i first started into it i was nauseous. i was nauseated. i thought i can t do this part. then it tripped over into i m excited to do this part. that s what i was going to ask you at some point as an actor as repulsive as the man is there s something about getting into the character and playing it that s rich for you professionally, i think. yes, yes. really you re going to enter into you ve got to put on armor about your morality and everything else and you become, you know, a jedi knight of denial which we have a few of those these days. we do. seems to be going around. i remember talking to a friend connie who said yeah, that murdaugh guy it s like old satan looked at him and went whoa, dude. like you re bad. how did you prepare for the role? not just someone who satan would say that about but someone who is so timely. who is alive. who their developments in the case as we speak. how much did you study him? how do you decide on your performance? there s a lot to look at. you can go lateral, long time. researching and looking. i had to get moving pretty quick because production thing was so fast. i think there s certain amount of things you can make yourself similar to and then because there s other things you re just doing your own interpretation. so you re trying to, you know, channel those aspects as they would occur to you rather than just mimicking him. it was also really heard because he lost a lot of weight and there were those issues and i had to go with my weight and we don t have a lot of time to shoot this movie. you capture him well. let s take a look at another clip where alex confronts his son paul about the boating accident that killed his friend. besides a dead girl and our financial ruin. stop. i am not finished. talk to me. talk to me. she was my friend. huh? i didn t mean for it to happen. i didn t mean to hurt anyone. the hurt you cause that night hasn t even yet been felt. i m ashamed. and embarrassed of you. get out of my sight. in addition to having to capture the darkness of the man you have to capture a southern accent too, bill. if you get it wrong people will let you know. and there s a lot of different accents. south carolina, but even the low country they call it. there s a lot of different accents. you can always go check it out. tough scene. it s a tough scene. oh my god. they would let for years and years i did of pulling it off. could see him just on the stand his friends saying to say i had no idea but i do know he did it. they know he was capable of it and all caught up to him. both installments are streaming now on amazon prime video, as well as on my lifetime.com. bill pullman, great to have you with us this morning. great to be here. we ll get you back into the new york city theater. putting out a call to directors. this man. don t go away. we have a second hour of morning joe on this sunday morning. coming up right after the break. after the break. chevy trucks advanced camera 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(fisher investments) we have a transparent fee, structured so we do better when you do better. at fisher investments, we re clearly different. welcome back to morning joe weekend. it is now 7:00 a.m. this sunday morning. here s more of the stories we covered this week. writing about president biden s visit to normandy this week in your latest column for the washington post , with some reflections on history, not just the invasion in normandy on d-day 80 years ago but where america was on the precipice of world war ii in terms of the division we saw in this country, not unlike what we are seeing here now. we look back at world war ii and the d-day invasion and we see this incredible national unity. everyone was polling in the same direction in this great struggle that engulfed the entire world and american society was transformed and everyone had to pitch in and there was national purpose and national unity and we forget that in the years before the war, our country arguably was as divided as it is now. it was divided over a number of things. one way it was divided was racially segregated. that continued even during the war. the units that went ashore at d- day were all white and one all- black unit that morning. of course, once they got on the beaches, they were, there was no color and i write about one soldier, a medic in the one black battalion that landed that morning. there were others who came later. he was wounded as he landed with german shrapnel, pretty serious wounds but he was well enough to set up a medical aid station on the beach and he stood there and he treated the wounded four 30 hours before he collapsed and had to be taken to a hospital ship. he survived the war, came home to a racially divided nation and was a second-class citizen until the civil rights movement triumphed and he died in 2005. it was just this week awarded posthumously the second highest honor in the army. that wasn t the only division. there were bitter divisions about whether the united states should get involved in the war. isolationism, you think it is something no, isolationism was a major strain in our politics. there were bitter divisions over franklin d roosevelt s new deal policies, which were being described as totalitarianism and communism and socialism. the rhetoric we hear now, we have heard before. the difference is there cannot be another world war ii unite us. we can t have another one of those after hiroshima and nagasaki. we simply cannot have a world war like world war ii. so, we are going to have to find a different way to get past these divisions that beset us now. we have a barely functional political system but that is what we ve got and we are going to have to find some way to make it work so that we can, we can continue because there can t be another d-day like there one, the one there was 80 years ago. as you point out in the piece, america first, the term we hear from donald trump and his supporters, coined in the years leading up to one or two. i m so glad you are pointing to the heroism of so many black men who helped to liberate the beaches and treat the wounded on d-day. the military was desegregated by president truman three years after the end of world war ii largely because of the heroism we saw. president biden will meet with president volodymyr zelenskyy a short time from now before traveling back to normandy. meanwhile, the war in gaza rages on. the leader of hamas says he will only agree to the latest cease-fire proposal if israel commits to permanently ending the war in gaza. the statement made in response to the three phase plan president biden publicly until last week. under the proposal, phase two would be an end to the war. that is a sticking point for israel. far right drivers of israel s government say the conflict can only end once hamas is eradicated. dozens of people, meanwhile, including children, were killed in an israeli airstrike at a united nations school in gaza. it happened overnight thursday. the israeli military says it was targeting a hamas compound embedded in the school. the idf claims about 30 terrorists were using the classrooms at the base. the strike, however, drawing international criticism as gaza health officials say 40 people were killed. israel so far has only released the names of 9 terrorists it says died in the attack. meanwhile, the united states says it will wait and see what information israel releases about the strike before considering any action. the state department says it expects the idf to be fully transparent. this comes as the washington post reports a u.s. made bomb was used in the strike at that school. president biden addressed israel s war with hamas during an interview with abc news yesterday in normandy. the president says he believes pre-minister benjamin netanyahu has acknowledged concerns from the white house pointing to the way israel adjusted its strategy in russia. is benjamin netanyahu listening to you ? i think he s listening to me. they were going to go into rafah fullbore, invade all of rafah can go into the city, take it out, move with full force. they haven t done that. what they have done is they have agreed to a significant agreement that if, in fact, i must accept it, look, it is being backed by egypt, being backed by the saudis, being backed by almost of the home arab world. we will see. this is a very difficult time. richard hoss, he s right about who s backing it, everyone except the two parties involved in the war to have this cease-fire come about and perhaps an end to the war. hamas says it will not agree to the terms. israel says it will not agree to anything that does not include eradicating hamas as israel puts it. where does that leave us ? it was exactly a week ago today president biden went out and announced this three phase plan and the wait was represented a week ago that it was sent to the israel s plan and the idea was to get hamas to sign on. israel backed away from it, if they ever signed onto it to begin with. hamas, as you saw, has now said it won t accept a temporary cease-fire, which is phase one of the plan. it seems to have been stillborn. what we are looking at is the other part of the news this morning. you are going to have continued israeli military operations, inevitably, no matter how careful israel is, because of co-location of hamas with civilians, you will see this kind of stories you have for people, innocent people are going to be killed, along with hamas militants. my guess is we will see this for some time. this will go on, the israeli national security advisor said military operations will continue through the end of the year. i don t see any reason to doubt that. i think the real question is whether we see an escalation of fighting as things dial down somewhat in gaza in the north between israel and hezbollah. that has been the most recent news out of israel. the idea that we are on a precipice of peace somehow, actually, the opposite is more the reality. i hate to be so depressing this morning but i think we are looking at open ended but low level war in gaza with the danger of escalation in the north in southern lebanon. coming up, ed luce of the financial times, will tell us his new piece, titled biden respects the law, trump does not and what that could mean for the election. have you always had trouble losing weight and keeping it off? 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[ bird squawks loudly ] to a pet shop. meg s moving company uses t-mobile. so she scaled down her fleet to save money. and don s paying so much for at&t, he s been waiting to update his equipment! there s a smarter way to save. comcast business mobile. you could save up to 70% on your wireless bill. so you don t have to compromise. powering smarter savings. powering possibilities. joining us now for more u.s. national editor of the fund opens ed luce . your new piece is entitled what hunter biden tells about america. in it, you write the trump biden cases is a tale of two parties. biden could have spared his son his judicial ordeal by pardoning him, a tool that trump used for political associates who were jailed. if the president is breaking the system, he has a funny way of showing it. hunter biden may or may not merit jail time. ditto for trump in his hush money case. but these are mere sideshows. one of america s potential presidents respects the rule of law. the other does not. everything else pales in comparison. i think that is why wall street journal, article does when it was so frustrating because of the difference between these two candidates. the moral equivalence. we talked about you can look at that article versus donald trump for getting up world war ii existed, forgetting barack obama is not still president and then also you could just do, again, the false moral equivocation between january the sixth, the riot, trump s role in that and joe biden forgiving student loan debt. we get all these false comparisons. i ve got to say one of the most maddening has been donald trump stealing nuclear secrets versus hunter biden and whatever republicans decide at the time is a great risk to america s national security because of what hunter biden did. the key point here is america s system is working, it is intact. both donald trump last week and hunter biden in wilmington for the next couple of weeks are receiving trial by jury, due process, they will have the right of appeal. i ve no idea whether hunter biden will be convicted or acquitted but i do know that he has two cases against him. the second of which, the tax case starts on september the fifth at the beginning of the general election in california. biden could at any point to stop this from happening. he s not, he s not interfering. there is no rigging coming from this president. where it is coming from is the supreme court. we will get them later this month, presumably later this month. they might prevaricate even longer. later this month, finally coming down with their ruling on what should have been an open and shut case about whether the resident has immunity for whatever he does in office, thereby ensuring trump will not be held accountable for january 6th in court before november the fifth. that is the real story going on here. the trial is in wilmington. i have no great insight to what is going to happen there but the trial in wilmington is the rule of law taking its normal course, as was the case in new york last week. what is happening in the supreme court is judicial interference in the political process. so, ed, you have the gift of being able to look at america and american politics from the distance created by your birth. you are not from here. you weren t born here. so, when you look at it and you write about it, as you did today, and you mentioned the supreme court slowing things down, making it almost impossible for a trial in the january 6th or the papers kept at mar-a-lago, a trial for most things are happening prior to election and hunter biden on trial today in wilmington, what is your sense of what would happen to the system, and the rule of law if hunter biden is acquitted and what is your sense of what other countries, other nations think and view this when they look at what is happening in america? that is a great question. it is a remarkable moment that we are having. the first conviction of a former president and the first trial of a child of a sitting president happening in the space of a few days of each other. i have no doubt if hunter biden is convicted, there is not going to be an uproar on the democratic side, there isn t going to be accusations of bigoted justice, even though the judge is trump appointed, there s no reason to believe that judge is a hatchet job kind of charge. if, however, hunter biden is acquitted, all conspiratorial hell will break loose. you mentioned the other trump trial that isn t going to happen, the one in florida, the federal trial that judge aileen canon is in charge of. she is finding extraordinary time delaying tactics, once that nobody had ever thought of. the latest is whether the special prosecutor, smith, was unconstitutionally appointed and she s going to hear arguments about that. she is finding any and every excuse, including invented ones not to hear this case. it is an extraordinary example of justice delayed being justice denied. and, i think that is what foreigners are kind of gob smacked by when they watch this. it is, you bring up judge aileen canon in florida on the documents case, which is really one of the most serious cases against donald trump and resounding as well, given all the documents were hidden at mar-a-lago and he tried to hide them again as the government was trying to get them back. and, the, it is frustrating to see what is happening. it is also the judge that we got, the judge that is, in this case, the judge that was given this case. that is the way it goes. you will not hear, unlike on fox news, that this is a weapon based justice department. you will not hear, unlike on fox news, that somehow joe biden is up to this or donald trump is up to this and somehow he s polling the strings here. you will not hear that here because this is the judge we got and that is the way it goes with the rule of law. we have lots more to get to this hour. morning joe weekend continues after a short break. break. the only migraine medication that 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will buy you a werewolf. the judge announced next month, steve bannon will start serving his time in prison. in prison? he looks like a guy who just got out of prison. steve bannon goes to prison on july 1st. it s too bad we will all miss out on something that summer beach body. former trump advisor steve bannon has been ordered to report to prison next month. the judge ruled yesterday steve bannon must begin his four month sentence on july 1st. a stay on bearman s sentence was lifted after his appeal in the case was denied. as nbc news reports, steve bannon could still appeal the ruling. he said yesterday his team plans to appeal all the way to the supreme court. we are going to go all the way to the supreme court if we have to. i want to say something specific about the justice department. merrick garland, lisa monaco, the entire justice department, they are not going to shut up trump, they are not going to shut up navarro, they are not going to shut up brandon and they are not going to shut up maga. steve bannon was found guilty in judge aileen canon force of defining subpoenas from the january 6th select committee. let s bring in nbc legal correspondent lisa rubin. this is always been, we will hear from president trump s on this interesting moment, as a personal attack, as president biden ordering his opponents to jail, except, when you don t answer a subpoena, no matter who you are in our society, just like if you cook the books at your organization to pay off an adult film star to stay quiet before the presidential election, there are consequences. there are indeed consequences. there is some connective tissue between this and the other case you mentioned, the recent conviction of former president trump. that can connective tissue is robert castillo, steve bannon s attorney and the attorney on whose advice he says he relied in ignoring that congressional subpoena. steve bannon wanted to argue, this was the crux of his appeal, that he was entitled to reasonably rely on bob castillo s advice that he should blow off the subpoena because trump was going to invoke executive privilege. the only problem with that is twofold. one, he was repeatedly advised by trump campaign lawyers that is not, in fact, what the former president intended to do for steve bannon, in part because steve bannon had been out of government for three years. the other problem is there is a 1961 case by the d.c. circuit this is where contempt charges are concerned, it is no defense to say i relied on the advice of counsel. it was that decision that a recent d.c. circuit panel reaffirmed and it is on that basis that yesterday, judge carl nichols of the d.c. district court said, you know, sir, vista longer presents substantial questions of law. i m going to the the state of your sentence and you need to report by july 1st. will come as no surprise to anyone that donald trump took to social media to really get this, calling it, a total and complete american tragedy that the duke joe biden department of justice is it is interesting. steve bannon has said he will appeal again and looking to push off the july 1st report date. tell us what mechanism that would be. is there a chance of success? or, is he going to go in july 1st ? steve bannon does not officially work for the trump campaign. he is an informal advisor and a large maga voice. if he goes in july 1st, he will be silenced for the stretch run of the collection. that is likely true when i think it is likely, if not highly probable he will go in july 1st. let s talk about his mechanisms for appeal. he can ask for a rehearing in the d.c. circuit. he has and june 24th to make that request. in all likelihood, they are not going to respond to that request before his july 1st reporting date. he can also file a petition with the supreme court but the deadline for him doing so comes after his july 1st date. either of those options, they could reimpose a state of his sentence. and i believe it is likely they are 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( ) start to get yourself back, with bimzelx. ask your dermatologist about bimzelx today. philanthropist melinda french gates has announced she will be donating $1 million over the next two years to support women s rights. in a guest essay for the new york times , french gates writes, in nearly 20 years as an advocate for women and girls, i ve learned that there will always be people who say it is not the right time to talk about gender equality . it is frustrating and shortsighted. decades of research on economics, well-being, and governance make it clear that investing in women and girls benefits everyone. one of the recipients of the great was the american institute for boys and men. joining us now is that organizations president, richard reeves. also with us, repressor of marketing at the nyu stern school of business, scott galloway. good to have you both. richard, i will toss to you first and ask why this grant makes sense overall for women s rights. well, i think what melinda french gates has realized is that a world of floundering men is difficult to be a will to flourishing women. we do have to rise together. and, the young men and investing in education and mental health is going to be good for women. men and women will be raising children together. there s evidence that many young men are struggling in education and mental health, especially young men and men of color above all. i think it is a recognition that the gender equality movement has to expand to include boys and men as well. coming from figure with such prominence of melinda french gates was such a strong track record of leadership, i think it sends a strong signal that we do need to include boys and men in this conversation. to your point, scott galloway, you have been a great force on this on the state of young men in america right now. explain the challenges. equality doesn t necessarily mean that each side is the same. men and women have differences. what is happening to young men is equally, potentially as disturbing. could be with you and congratulations to my friend richard reeves. this is a great american story. unfortunately, young men are paying for the advantage that me and my father received. so, there is a lack of empathy. richard turned me onto this great quote, empathy is not a zero-sum game, civil rights didn t hurt white people. to richard s point, what he s always said he s who wants more economically and emotionally viable young men? women. women, of the tract, as they are doing, especially younger men, they are more prone to nationalist content, they are more prone to misogynistic content. you know, richard, it is so fascinating. maybe five years ago, when people like scott galloway three years ago were talking about this and a lot of people through their hands up, my god, how dare you talk about boys when men have been dominant through, you know, for thousands and thousands of years. you heard those complaints. on a very personal level but so much anecdotal evidence that i suspect a lot of people here in this are young women talking to mika and me going where are the men to date, where are the men that understand the basics? and, there s this horrible choice. on one side, you do have again, all anecdotal but you have, well, i m not going to wander into that minefield what i was about to say. let s just say younger women are understanding the costs of the mail crisis right now. they are living the cost. they are living the cost of it. what is interesting, these stories you say anecdotal but it is in the evidence, it is in the data. there is a big gender gap in college today than there was in the 70s. the biggest rise in suicide rates, tragically, has been among young men. we are losing 40,000 men a year to suicide. what i discovered is, among parents if you have a boy in the k-12 education system, you kind of get this immediately. if you have a doctor in the dating market, you kind of get this immediately too. and, realizing you just can t separate these things out and it is not a betrayal of the ideals of gender equality to start dealing with issues of boys and young men. it is the application of the ideals of gender equality. it is not a zero-sum game. i think that penny is dropping. the people are realizing we cannot neglect the problems of boys and men if we want a world that is better for all of us. i was particularly interested with what ms. gates has done. i salute her for it in terms of investing also in young boys and men and i think you or richard mentioned young boys and men of color. many of us in any study has shown disproportionately are raised by single mothers. i was one of them. to help those young boys and men that are buttressed by programs like yours, and to develop them, also helps the single mothers who are trying to balance life. talk about the challenge of that and how this could be helpful. reverend, you and i said that, we were raised by superheroes. my mother was an immigrant who lived and died a secretary, raced me on her own. what the research shows is the single point of failure, if you were to reverse engineer and why men are struggling is when they lose a male role model. the second most single-parent household, which is latin for a woman heading a household alone, just behind sweden. as richard s work has pointed out, the vast majority of people in primary school education are women. a boy is twice as likely to be suspended for the same behavior in school and five times as likely if he is black boy. would you have is an entire cohort of men being raised without male influence. what is equally interesting is girls have similar outcomes in single-parent households, same college attendance, same rates of self-harm. what richards research has shown is that while boys are physically stronger, they are mentally and emotionally weaker and we need to knowledge that. we need a group of thriving gunmen. how many times have we heard people say i know it time of young single women who are great and i can t find men for them. you can t find men for them, just not any man they want. we need to level up young people in general, specifically young men. coming up, historian doris kearns goodwin on how looking at america through a historical lens can help make sense of the issues facing our country today. try today. 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presidential historian, doris kearns goodwin. so good to have you with us. what a time. let s start with president biden making some of his most candid comments yet about former president trump s criminal conviction at a fundraiser in connecticut last night. the president called trump a convicted felon who stopped after the 2020 election. the president addressed the attacks trump and his allies have lobbed at the justice system. biden s of the former president, wants you to believe it is already. nothing could be further from the truth. it is reckless and dangerous for anyone to say it is rigged just because they don t like the outcome. biden added, the justice system is a core of american democracy and we should never allow anyone to tear it down. biden continued, here is what is becoming clearer and clearer every day. the threat trump poses in his second term would be greater than his first. this isn t the same trump that got elected in 2016. biden said, he is worse. doris, this is joe biden using the term convicted felon, a private fundraiser in connecticut, as john has been telling us, this is something we may hear more of from the biden campaign. they now officially are running against a man convicted of 34 felonies. how do you think that figures into the race ? every event affects the next event and i was going to think this project will affect how the conventions will happen. president trump has put out is we are a backward country, we are a country that is corrupt, we are a country that looks like a third world country and all of our systems are corrupt. i just don t think the american people are going to feel that way. one of the things i look at when i look at history is the backward look and the negative look as not working campaigns. i think biden understands that. when dragon was running against carter, carter talked about the malaise of the people, that it was a crisis of confidence in the people and we can comes along and says it s not the people, it s leadership that has failed and i am here to provide the leadership. the same thing happened when hoover talked about there s not much he could do about the depression because the government would weaken the people and he was going to hope we were getting through it somehow around the corner prosperity would come and fdr says it s not the people that is the problem, it is your leadership and i m going to do action. biden is on a good stand, in a certain sense, to talk about the rule of law, to talk about the country being a country that is not corrupt and to make that a contrast. i think this is going to be something, we don t know how. the debate could change everything, the conventions could change everything, events could change everything but right now, this will affect the tone of the campaign. this darkness, this dim view of the country presented by donald trump, this american carnage as he called it in his inauguration address way back. i guess it resonates with his base, it resonates with some people but the point you re making is you have to win more than your base to win an election. perhaps an optimistic message is the way to go for president biden. i think about the fact that when you are nominated, and he s about to be, you have to expand your base. i think back to 1964 in the republican convention and barry goldwater. what happens there is governor rockefeller, new york governor rockefeller, popular person in the party is trying to argue for a different platform, a civil rights platform. he gets shouted down and it all on television and it looks like the party has narrowed itself. they said in many ways, goldwater lost the election at that convention. when you do something like canceling larry hogan out, you need him, you need him in the senate and you are narrowing your party by saying you can t even say this verdict should be followed because it is a verdict that it is the rule of law. it hadn t even begun yet, he had said it before, it was a natural thing to say about our system. we have the moment you describe just from 1964. let s take a look. i would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. let me remind you also that moderation and the pursuit of justice is no virtue. doris, 1964 is really instructive. i will also say, obviously, fdr, a sense of optimism, we have nothing to fear but fear itself. the band play in happy days are here again. ronald reagan, it s morning in america. i truly believe america s greatest days lie ahead. it is always the optimism that rules the day. still ahead, legendary e street band guitarist steve van zandt on his remarkable life and career in music and show business. business. keep those expectations with reliable ground shipping. thanks brandon. with usps ground advantage®. it s hard to run a business on your own. make it easier on yourself. with shopify, you can have your inventory, payments, and customers in sync across all the places you sell. start your journey 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wedding band from the godfather. i heard it was really great. i don t remember a thing but that s what i heard. that was a look at the new documentary titled steve van zandt, disciple. the film follows the life of the musician and actor from his humble beginnings in new jersey to the apex of his one-of-a- kind career, performing along bruce pristine and james gandolfini in the sopranos. tuning is now, stevie van zandt, also the films director. i can t wait to see this. tell us why now, why did you decide this was the moment? he chased me for how long ? a long time, 2006 and years and years of trying to get, let me do this film. i m not comfortable being the center of attention. that is just a fact. i didn t even want to be in it at first. he s not in the early cut. you have to be in the movie. it would be hard to do without him in it. there s a lot of footage out there. anyway, they worked on it for two years before i agreed to be in it. i think, look, and and, we talked about what is the purpose of this thing and it is about the work. getting the work exposed as much as we can because, you know, that is one of the things i ve always had trouble balancing that art and commerce thing. can you explain how hard is it to explain the coordination of a band? you are in a big and, in a group of guys on stage in the synchronization of the shows always amaze me, you know what someone is going to do before they do it and you do your thing. well, we really have a long time. let s face it. that helps. a bit of esp goes on after a while. in the beginning, we had to be really good before we even got in the business. we had to be good life. that really, we had very high standards, growing up in the 60s. we had to compare ourselves to the beatles and the rolling stones and the who, very high standards. a lot of history, i think, bill got into it in the film. tell us exactly that. what are some of the things we will see, people who know stevie van zandt from the states or the screen, what are they going to see, what are they going to learn from this film ? telling them the whole breath and scope of the work and career and love of rock n roll is interesting. i think people may know him from television, from his acting, or they may know him for his music but they don t know he had the first branded satellite radio station, the first streaming television show. was a producer and writer and director. they may not know that the way, the things he does for education and they may not know his record label. there s so much to stevie van zandt beyond that music and we also get to expose the story of his amazing music, his friendship with bruce, his beautiful love story with his wife. he sees all thing. and then south africa. people may not know that silvio dante helped free nelson mandela and end apartheid. it is a pretty good resume. did you ever think from watertown, massachusetts to where you are today, the envelope you had to shoot through in terms of fate and lack is incredibly small. how often do you think about that ? about every hour. no doubt, we are the luckiest generation ever and i am the luckiest guy in the luckiest generation. i m so grateful, first of all that somebody would have an interest in making a movie about me. that is incredible already. i am honored that bill and the guys really spent their time doing that. destiny plays a role. if my mother hadn t remarried, my father adopted me and brought me from boston to new jersey, you know, i would have never gotten into the new jersey scene. if david chase hadn t happened to be clicking around, he wouldn t see me in dr. rascals and i want to get that guy on my new tv show the sopranos. there s a lot of detail in my book and i think bill, bill was, the conversations we had, i haven t seen the film myself at ceramic just to see what happens. you haven t seen it ? that is all the time we have this weekend. we will see you tomorrow at 6:00 a.m. eastern for more morning joe. until then, enjoy the rest of your sunday. your sunday. good morning. it s sunday, june 9. i m alicia menendez. with michael steele and symone sanders townsend. we are following president biden on his final day in france and the appearance of his message
Themselves in a way that the average politician would think of themselves. i go, i better not do this, or i better do that that because then they become politicians are not judges. i want them to be judges first. well, in case the supreme court is so front and center for a lot of voters, especially after roe versus wade was overturned. and we heard president biden last week in philadelphia. he was talking about this the supreme court and he was saying the next president is going to be able to appoint a couple of justices. he says, i ll be talking about putting really progressive judges in there if that would change people s lives. do you think this is something that he should be talking more about, not just in the sense of how roe versus wade was decided, but in what he would do if he has a second term when it comes to the supreme court well, remember, he views he find he believes it to be very fundamental. the separation of powers it s government. he has always been very, very careful not to use the power of the presidency to overstep or two in any way
This is now the unifying principle of the trump campaign and the republican party, make them pay. and part of the reason for that is because they have nominated a criminal who surrounds himself with criminals and who attended to in the constitutional republic. in fact, just today in arizona some co-members of that plot had to appear for an arraignment. trump s white house chief of staff, mark meadows, and a campaign aide both pleaded not guilty to charges saying they subverted joe biden s win in arizona in 2020. joining me now is andrew weissmann, he now cohosts the podcast prosecuting donald trump. andrew, meadows is an interesting figure because he has been at the sort of center of so much of the coup plot. he gave over text and then stopped cooperating. he has been indicted in georgia. he now is indicted in arizona. he has kept a low profile at the surface, but he has a serious case against him in arizona. absolutely. so, he is alleged there, as well as in georgia, as being a
That person you are sending them into the arms of donald trump and going why on earth are these people voting for donald trump? because they are getting ignored. i am not saying they should be coddled, i am saying should we at least acknowledge them and get a basis of truth back to the center? this is part of what we are talking about when the new york times does what is going on the world? we ask trump voters. they don t care what they think. we don t have to be checking in with what they think. i also think it is the responsibility of white people to educate white people. it should not be placed upon bracken brown people and emigrants. i would like to know what it would take to achieve the persuasion that emigrants are not so scary. i would like a practical proposal before i decide to sort of center the feelings of people who are fed lies. what if you did not reject the fears? and i want to correct the record. i am not talking about coddling the fears of white people. i think there are plenty of black and brown people that are