forformer election for them? joining us today for former conservative cabinet minister, shadow business minister, liberal democrat and daily telegraph, columnist. this is politics live, election 202a. welcome to viewers on bbc two, bbc news and the iplayer. parliament has been dissolved which means politicians, are no longer mps but candidates. ordinary members of the public standing in their respectful constituents for their parties but they are welcome all the same. let's start for tax and spend and this headline on bbc news. labour rules out raising vat after was started by the chancellor, jeremy hunt writing today promising a conservative government you heard in the headlines, would not raise any headlines, would not raise any headline taxes. he claims that labour does have a plan to raise vat, this of course is a classic election strategy to try and expose hidden plans by your rivals during the campaign. but labour have quashed them and ruled out, as you also heard in the headlines, raising any of the headline taxes either. our liberal democrats have two, i should say. my opening question starting with you is why should people trust you on tax?- starting with you is why should people trust you on tax? well, the conservative _ people trust you on tax? well, the conservative party _ people trust you on tax? well, the conservative party has _ people trust you on tax? well, the conservative party has always - conservative party has always believed in lower taxes believed. stood for lower _ believed in lower taxes believed. stood for lower taxes. _ believed in lower taxes believed. stood for lower taxes. a - believed in lower taxes believed. - stood for lower taxes. a fundamental difference between the labour government and a conservative government and a conservative government has always been that labour governments want to spend more without saying where the money is coming from. they will find a way of putting up taxes one way or another. they are going to put vat on school fees, have green levies. evenif on school fees, have green levies. even if they rule out one or two ways, they will be looking around to put up taxes because that is what labour governments do. the word believe as you _ labour governments do. the word believe as you descend _ labour governments do. the word believe as you descend is - labour governments do. the word believe as you descend is doing i labour governments do. the word | believe as you descend is doing the heavy lifting because the truth and reality, so that our viewers know, is that taxes have gone up under conservative governments. as a result of freezing tax threshold since 2021 and continuing with that until 2028, four million more people will be pain taxi one before and 3 million more will pay the higher rate of income tax. i ask you again, why should people trust you on tax? we still believe on lower taxes and we have begun to deliver that, as you saw with the budget of cutting national insurance contributions. the conservative government believes in sound finance, getting the economy right. we had to spend a great deal of money to get this country through the covid pandemic and that did result in borrowing. of course we need to get that down as well. ~ , , ., course we need to get that down as well. . , , ., ., , course we need to get that down as well. _., ., , , course we need to get that down as well. ., , , well. why should voters trust you and the labour _ well. why should voters trust you and the labour party _ well. why should voters trust you and the labour party on - well. why should voters trust you and the labour party on the - well. why should voters trust you and the labour party on the issue well. why should voters trust you i and the labour party on the issue of tax and spend?— and the labour party on the issue of tax and spend? what you have to look at is the evidence. _ tax and spend? what you have to look at is the evidence. we _ tax and spend? what you have to look at is the evidence. we had _ tax and spend? what you have to look at is the evidence. we had the - at is the evidence. we had the highest — at is the evidence. we had the highest tax burden for decades under the conservatives. we have seen chronic_ the conservatives. we have seen chronic waste of public money, we have _ chronic waste of public money, we have seen— chronic waste of public money, we have seen fraudulent loans. why should we trust _ have seen fraudulent loans. why should we trust what _ have seen fraudulent loans. twig should we trust what labour have seen fraudulent loans. kwiy should we trust what labour says about not increasing taxes? we have set out very — about not increasing taxes? we have set out very clearly _ about not increasing taxes? we have set out very clearly fully _ about not increasing taxes? we have set out very clearly fully costed - set out very clearly fully costed plans _ set out very clearly fully costed plans against policies that we have announced. we have been absolutely clear that _ announced. we have been absolutely clear that every single policy we have _ clear that every single policy we have introduced is costed. unlike the conservatives they have made £71 billion _ the conservatives they have made £71 billion worth of unfunded commitments already which includes nationat— commitments already which includes national insurance, scrapping nationat— national insurance, scrapping national insurance, scrapping national insurance and a whole bunch of other— national insurance and a whole bunch of other policies. what we have to look at _ of other policies. what we have to look at is — of other policies. what we have to look at is their record, they crash the economy and why should the britisb— the economy and why should the british people trust... you the economy and why should the british people trust. . ._ the economy and why should the british people trust... you are not answerin: british people trust... you are not answering my _ british people trust... you are not answering my question. _ british people trust... you are not answering my question. my - british people trust... you are not i answering my question. my question is why should they trust your promises on tax? hang on a second. by promises on tax? hang on a second. by sticking to existing rules, the financial rules that you have said the costed manifesto when it comes out. the independent think tank, says that you're banking on growth is wishful thinking. many are so tight there are three clear choices. you ruled out one of them are not as tax rises. you are left either cuts on spending in unprotected departments or increasing debt which is already at record high levels. so why should people trust you on tax and spend. let's be clear about something. what we have had is 111 years of under investment. we know there are businesses waiting to invest but the political instability and the economic uncertainty and the chopping and changing policies has knocked confidence and investors are waiting to see what happens. i knocked confidence and investors are waiting to see what happens.- waiting to see what happens. i meet investors all — waiting to see what happens. i meet investors all the _ waiting to see what happens. i meet investors all the time _ waiting to see what happens. i meet investors all the time who _ waiting to see what happens. i meet investors all the time who want - waiting to see what happens. i meet investors all the time who want to i investors all the time who want to investors all the time who want to invest in our country but they want the stability and they need credibility and the management of our economy which they haven't had. that is how we get investment of growth. that is why it is vital that we get stable economic policy and we respect the independence of the institutions that are there to provide that credibility. let institutions that are there to provide that credibility. let me ask the same question _ provide that credibility. let me ask the same question of— provide that credibility. let me ask the same question of the - provide that credibility. let me ask the same question of the liberal. the same question of the liberal democrats. why should voters trust you on the issue of tax? the last time that the lib dems were in government was in coalition of the conservatives where you presided over years of austerity and public spending. over years of austerity and public sendina. ~ spending. when we were in government, _ spending. when we were in government, we _ spending. when we were in i government, we implemented spending. when we were in - government, we implemented what spending. when we were in _ government, we implemented what was on the _ government, we implemented what was on the front— government, we implemented what was on the front page of our manifesto which _ on the front page of our manifesto which was — on the front page of our manifesto which was to lift those on the lower incomes— which was to lift those on the lower incomes out of tax altogether and it was a _ incomes out of tax altogether and it was a liberal democrat policy to increase — was a liberal democrat policy to increase the threshold at which people — increase the threshold at which people started to pay tax. we fought hard for _ people started to pay tax. we fought hard for that and we implemented that and _ hard for that and we implemented that and since we came out of government you saw the tories which is why— government you saw the tories which is why we _ government you saw the tories which is why we have got people and families— is why we have got people and families up and down the country having _ families up and down the country having to — families up and down the country having to shoulder the highest tax burden— having to shoulder the highest tax burden since the war. going into this election the liberal democrat manifesto about how we can raise tax fairly not _ manifesto about how we can raise tax fairly not on _ manifesto about how we can raise tax fairly not on working families who are dealing with the cost of living crisis _ are dealing with the cost of living crisis but — are dealing with the cost of living crisis but reversing things like attacks— crisis but reversing things like attacks which would raise money. closing _ attacks which would raise money. closing the loopholes in the windfall tax. this morning i have been _ windfall tax. this morning i have been told — windfall tax. this morning i have been told that how we would treble the tax _ been told that how we would treble the tax on — been told that how we would treble the tax on additional services. you have set out _ the tax on additional services. you have set out your _ the tax on additional services. not have set out your stall on these all—important issues around the economy, tax—and—spend. how honest other political parties being with the public over this? i other political parties being with the public over this?— other political parties being with the public over this? i think voters will struggle _ the public over this? i think voters will struggle to — the public over this? i think voters will struggle to see _ the public over this? i think voters will struggle to see these - the public over this? i think voters | will struggle to see these promises on taxes _ will struggle to see these promises on taxes as— will struggle to see these promises on taxes as anything _ will struggle to see these promises on taxes as anything other - will struggle to see these promises on taxes as anything other than i on taxes as anything other than hollow — on taxes as anything other than hollow thev _ on taxes as anything other than hollow. they understand - on taxes as anything other than hollow. they understand that i on taxes as anything other than i hollow. they understand that the tax burden _ hollow. they understand that the tax burden is _ hollow. they understand that the tax burden is set— hollow. they understand that the tax burden is set to _ hollow. they understand that the tax burden is set to reach _ hollow. they understand that the tax burden is set to reach its _ hollow. they understand that the tax burden is set to reach its highest i burden is set to reach its highest level— burden is set to reach its highest level in_ burden is set to reach its highest level in seven _ burden is set to reach its highest level in seven decades, - burden is set to reach its highest level in seven decades, they i level in seven decades, they understand _ level in seven decades, they understand that _ level in seven decades, they understand that almost i level in seven decades, they i understand that almost record investment— understand that almost record investment is— understand that almost record investment is going _ understand that almost record investment is going into- understand that almost record| investment is going into public services — investment is going into public services and _ investment is going into public services and yet _ investment is going into public services and yet they- investment is going into public services and yet they are - investment is going into public- services and yet they are crumbling and they— services and yet they are crumbling and they understand _ services and yet they are crumbling and they understand that _ services and yet they are crumbling and they understand that that i services and yet they are crumbling and they understand that that is i and they understand that that is ballooned — and they understand that that is ballooned. and _ and they understand that that is ballooned. and then _ and they understand that that is ballooned. and then something | and they understand that that is - ballooned. and then something needs to go _ ballooned. and then something needs to go what _ ballooned. and then something needs to go what i — ballooned. and then something needs to go what i worry— ballooned. and then something needs to go. what i worry about _ ballooned. and then something needs to go. what i worry about is _ ballooned. and then something needs to go. what i worry about is that - ballooned. and then something needs to go. what i worry about is that we i to go. what i worry about is that we are not— to go. what i worry about is that we are not doing — to go. what i worry about is that we are not doing enough _ to go. what i worry about is that we are not doing enough on _ to go. what i worry about is that we are not doing enough on the - are not doing enough on the spending. _ are not doing enough on the spending, government- are not doing enough on the i spending, government spending are not doing enough on the - spending, government spending side that doesn't — spending, government spending side that doesn't seem _ spending, government spending side that doesn't seem to _ spending, government spending side that doesn't seem to be _ spending, government spending side that doesn't seem to be any- that doesn't seem to be any political— that doesn't seem to be any political appetite _ that doesn't seem to be any political appetite to - that doesn't seem to be any political appetite to try- that doesn't seem to be any political appetite to try and i that doesn't seem to be any. political appetite to try and rein that in. — political appetite to try and rein that in, despite _ political appetite to try and rein that in, despite the _ political appetite to try and rein that in, despite the fact - political appetite to try and rein that in, despite the fact that i political appetite to try and rein that in, despite the fact that iti that in, despite the fact that it has reached _ that in, despite the fact that it has reached above _ that in, despite the fact that it has reached above gdp. - that in, despite the fact that it has reached above gdp. we i that in, despite the fact that it. has reached above gdp. we are that in, despite the fact that it - has reached above gdp. we are coming to historic— has reached above gdp. we are coming to historic levels _ has reached above gdp. we are coming to historic levels of _ has reached above gdp. we are coming to historic levels of historic— to historic levels of historic spending~ _ to historic levels of historic spending~ now— to historic levels of historic spending. now we - to historic levels of historic spending. now we have i to historic levels of historic| spending. now we have got to historic levels of historic- spending. now we have got the main parties _ spending. now we have got the main parties making — spending. now we have got the main parties making all— spending. now we have got the main parties making all sorts _ spending. now we have got the main parties making all sorts of _ parties making all sorts of promises. _ parties making all sorts of promises, free _ parties making all sorts of promises, free childcare i parties making all sorts of. promises, free childcare for parties making all sorts of i promises, free childcare for all children— promises, free childcare for all children from _ promises, free childcare for all children from nine _ promises, free childcare for all children from nine months i promises, free childcare for all children from nine months andi promises, free childcare for all- children from nine months and above, the labour— children from nine months and above, the labour party— children from nine months and above, the labour party want _ children from nine months and above, the labour party want to _ the labour party want to renationalise _ the labour party want to renationalise rail- the labour party want to renationalise rail and i the labour party want to i renationalise rail and spend billions _ renationalise rail and spend billions of— renationalise rail and spend billions of pounds _ renationalise rail and spend billions of pounds on - renationalise rail and spendl billions of pounds on various renationalise rail and spend - billions of pounds on various green projects _ billions of pounds on various green projects i— billions of pounds on various green projects ijust— billions of pounds on various green projects. i just want _ billions of pounds on various green projects. i just want the _ billions of pounds on various green projects. ijust want the public- billions of pounds on various green projects. ijust want the public and| projects. ijust want the public and ithink— projects. ijust want the public and i think they— projects. ijust want the public and i think they understand _ projects. ijust want the public and i think they understand that - projects. ijust want the public and i think they understand that the i projects. ijust want the public and i think they understand that the is| i think they understand that the is are not— i think they understand that the is are not realistic— i think they understand that the is are not realistic promises. - i think they understand that the is are not realistic promises. it i i think they understand that the is are not realistic promises. it is i are not realistic promises. it is all well— are not realistic promises. it is all well sav— are not realistic promises. it is all well say they— are not realistic promises. it is all well say they are _ are not realistic promises. it is all well say they are not - are not realistic promises. it is all well say they are not going i are not realistic promises. it is i all well say they are not going to cut tax— all well say they are not going to cut tax and — all well say they are not going to cut tax and spending _ all well say they are not going to cut tax and spending and - all well say they are not going to cut tax and spending and they i all well say they are not going to l cut tax and spending and they are not going — cut tax and spending and they are not going to — cut tax and spending and they are not going to borrow _ cut tax and spending and they are not going to borrow more - cut tax and spending and they are not going to borrow more but i not going to borrow more but something. _ not going to borrow more but something, ultimately- not going to borrow more but something, ultimately is i not going to borrow more but. something, ultimately is going not going to borrow more but i something, ultimately is going to have to _ something, ultimately is going to have to get _ something, ultimately is going to have to get-— something, ultimately is going to have to get. lets talk about diane abbott, at number _ have to get. lets talk about diane abbott, at number of _ have to get. lets talk about diane abbott, at number of front - have to get. lets talk about diane| abbott, at number of front pages, she was suspended from the party about comments she made about race. she has been readmitted to the party but is saying that she is being blocked by the labour party the standing as a candidate for them in this election. here are some of the front pages, the guardian, diane abbott defies starmer with vow to remain mp for abbott defies starmer with vow to remain mpforas abbott defies starmer with vow to remain mp for as long as possible. this is the front page of the daily telegraph. and finally,... in the constituency she has represented for decades. last night she was at a rally in the constituency that she has represented and this is what she said... i has represented and this is what she said... . , ., , said... i have been a loyal member of my partv- _ said... i have been a loyal member of my party- i _ said... i have been a loyal member of my party- i have _ said... i have been a loyal member of my party. i have also _ said... i have been a loyal member of my party. i have also been i of my party. i have also been represented my party first as a counsellor and then as a member of parliament nearly a0 years. i was shocked to learn yesterday that i am going to be banned from running for the labour party. going to be banned from running for the labour party-— the labour party. watching those ictures the labour party. watching those pictures and _ the labour party. watching those pictures and listening _ the labour party. watching those pictures and listening to - the labour party. watching those pictures and listening to diane i pictures and listening to diane abbott, how did it make you feel? diane abbott is a trailblazer, she deserves the utmost respect and care. she has opened doors for people like me and many others. she is an iconic figure. i think it's really important that she, we recognise the contribution she has made our country. [to recognise the contribution she has made our country.— recognise the contribution she has made our country. do you think she has been treated _ made our country. do you think she has been treated well— made our country. do you think she has been treated well by _ made our country. do you think she has been treated well by the - made our country. do you think she i has been treated well by the labour party. i“m has been treated well by the labour party. i'm glad the investigation has been concluded and she has been reinstated in the party. it's very clear, it been made very clear that there has been no attempt to ban her from standing. i hope that... it’s from standing. i hope that... it's been made _ from standing. i hope that... it�*s been made clear yesterday that there has been no attempt to ban her and i hope that this is resolved as quickly as possible by the end the ec, all candidates will have to be improved, everyone of us by the nec and that will be happening in the coming days and i hope this will be resolved as quickly as possible. you sa ou resolved as quickly as possible. you say you want _ resolved as quickly as possible. you say you want to _ resolved as quickly as possible. you say you want to see her being dealt with with care and respect. do you think that is how she has been treated by the labour party, in an investigation has gone on a year. keir starmer saying that it was ongoing when it had been finished five months ago. she went on training on anti—semitism and then was told that she was being to the party only once keir starmer called a snap election. let's be honest, there was confusion over her status. she was a trailblazer, as you said, blazed a trail for she was a trailblazer, as you said, blazed a trailfor women she was a trailblazer, as you said, blazed a trail for women like you in the party. standing there saying that she has been mistreated. the rocess that she has been mistreated. the process for— that she has been mistreated. iie: process for complaints that she has been mistreated. tie: process for complaints as independent, no mp is involved in that. i can't get into and i am not aware of the details of that process. what i think it's really important is that she has been readmitted, that the decisions around candidates for the general election is made as quickly as possible. i am election is made as quickly as possible. iam not, election is made as quickly as possible. i am not, from what we have been informed yesterday, she has not been banned from standing and the decision by the nec will need to be made as quickly as possible. need to be made as quickly as ossible. ~ ., need to be made as quickly as ossible. . ., i. need to be made as quickly as ossible. ~ ., ,. ~' need to be made as quickly as ossible. . ., ,., ~ ., need to be made as quickly as ossible. . ., ~ ., , possible. would you like to see diane abbott _ possible. would you like to see diane abbott remain _ possible. would you like to see diane abbott remain as - possible. would you like to see diane abbott remain as the i diane abbott remain as the candidate?— diane abbott remain as the candidate? , , , , ., candidate? jess phillips and the nec will be making _ candidate? jess phillips and the nec will be making that _ candidate? jess phillips and the nec will be making that decision - candidate? jess phillips and the nec will be making that decision on i candidate? jess phillips and the nec will be making that decision on her. will be making that decision on her and everyone of us. that is our system, the ruling nec makes that decision. , , , , , system, the ruling nec makes that decision, , , , , ., , system, the ruling nec makes that decision, ,, ,, .,, .., system, the ruling nec makes that decision, ,, ,, ., decision. jess phillips has come out and said that _ decision. jess phillips has come out and said that i _ decision. jess phillips has come out and said that i would _ decision. jess phillips has come out and said that i would like _ decision. jess phillips has come out and said that i would like to - decision. jess phillips has come out and said that i would like to see i and said that i would like to see diane abbott stand as a labour candidate. would you like to see her stand as labour candidate? candidate. would you? those of us who decide — candidate. would you? those of us who decide to _ candidate. would you? those of us who decide to stand _ candidate. would you? those of us who decide to stand at _ candidate. would you? those of us who decide to stand at made i candidate. would you? those of us who decide to stand at made clear| candidate. would you? those of us i who decide to stand at made clear we want to stand, we would all like the nec. .. ~ ., , ., want to stand, we would all like the nec... ~ ., 4' want to stand, we would all like the nec... . ., ,., ~ ., want to stand, we would all like the nec... . ., ~ .,, nec. .. would you like to see diane abbott standing _ nec. .. would you like to see diane abbott standing as _ nec. .. would you like to see diane abbott standing as a _ nec. .. would you like to see diane abbott standing as a labour- abbott standing as a labour candidate? ii abbott standing as a labour candidate?— abbott standing as a labour candidate? . , ., , ., candidate? if that is what diane abbott wants _ candidate? if that is what diane abbott wants to _ candidate? if that is what diane abbott wants to do, _ candidate? if that is what diane abbott wants to do, the - candidate? if that is what diane abbott wants to do, the nec i candidate? if that is what diane | abbott wants to do, the nec will take that into account. like i am, i am waiting to be approved by the nec. ,, , ., ., , am waiting to be approved by the nec. ,, , ., ., y ., nec. she is not the only potential candidate who _ nec. she is not the only potential candidate who seems _ nec. she is not the only potential candidate who seems to - nec. she is not the only potential candidate who seems to be i nec. she is not the only potential candidate who seems to be on - nec. she is not the only potential| candidate who seems to be on the wrong side of the labour party for the faiza shaheen was a candidate and is now being blocked, again, from standing in chingford. she spoke to newsnight last night the top i spoke to newsnight last night the to r�* " spoke to newsnight last night the to r�* “ c, , a, spoke to newsnight last night the to “ c, c, , top i think the labour party, because we _ top i think the labour party, because we have _ top i think the labour party, because we have the - top i think the labour party, | because we have the system top i think the labour party, - because we have the system we do, needs to be a broad church. from what i can see, what's happening, i would say that, you know, less about the left and more about the message to muslims and black people this week. i think it's really not the message that the party wants to send. ,, . , message that the party wants to send. ,, .,, , ~ ., message that the party wants to send. ,, , ~ ., message that the party wants to send. ,, ., , send. she was blocked, or said she was told she _ send. she was blocked, or said she was told she was _ send. she was blocked, or said she was told she was blocked _ send. she was blocked, or said she was told she was blocked from - was told she was blocked from standing because she had reportedly liked tweets playing down anti—semitism. diane abbott and faiza shaheen are broadly on the left of the party, supporters of jeremy corbyn, the former labour leader. it does look like a purge of the left. if there are complaints being made against _ if there are complaints being made against candidates who ever they are, there — against candidates who ever they are, there is a process that has to be followed otherwise journalists will quite correctly and have done in the _ will quite correctly and have done in the past — will quite correctly and have done in the past come back and complained about— in the past come back and complained about the _ in the past come back and complained about the labour party not handling these _ about the labour party not handling theseissues about the labour party not handling these issues properly. during the process— these issues properly. during the process of— these issues properly. during the process of candidate selection, due diligence _ process of candidate selection, due diligence will have to be done by all parties. in the last parliament we saw— all parties. in the last parliament we saw a — all parties. in the last parliament we saw a number of by—elections being _ we saw a number of by—elections being triggered because mps have conducted themselves without following the parliamentary standards. so the issue to do with individual— standards. so the issue to do with individual candidates and the due diligence — individual candidates and the due diligence is not a matter for me and other— diligence is not a matter for me and other individual mps, it is a matter for the _ other individual mps, it is a matter for the party. but other individual mps, it is a matter forthe party-— for the party. but you have a view, rushanara- — for the party. but you have a view, rushanara- i _ for the party. but you have a view, rushanara. i cannot _ for the party. but you have a view, rushanara. i cannot get _ for the party. but you have a view, rushanara. i cannot get into - for the party. but you have a view, rushanara. i cannot get into the i rushanara. i cannot get into the secifics rushanara. i cannot get into the specifics of _ rushanara. i cannot get into the specifics of complaints - rushanara. i cannot get into the specifics of complaints being - rushanara. i cannot get into the - specifics of complaints being made, it's not appropriate... what specifics of complaints being made, it's not appropriate. . ._ it's not appropriate... what does it sa to the it's not appropriate... what does it say to the black — it's not appropriate... what does it say to the black and _ it's not appropriate... what does it say to the black and muslim - say to the black and muslim community, like faiza shaheen says? people need to be treated fairly according to independent processes. that is absolutely paramount. everybody needs to be treated fairly to the due process and i hope and believe that is what will happen. and if those things don't happen, within the labour party, we set out our concerns and we have had those in throughout the jeremy corbyn years and subsequently to make sure we get a grip on and he —— on anti—semitism, islamophobia and other issues. anti-semitism, islamophobia and other issues.— anti-semitism, islamophobia and other issues. labour says they will not acce -t other issues. labour says they will not accept candidates _ other issues. labour says they will not accept candidates who - other issues. labour says they will not accept candidates who fall - other issues. labour says they will| not accept candidates who fall well below standard is accepted by the party. this discussion we are having because it is an accusation of labour trying to control the candidates essentially, who represents them, and whether they represents them, and whether they represent their wing of the party, is this helping labour present itself has changed and better able to appeal to a wider electorate? i’m to appeal to a wider electorate? i'm not sure it is. _ to appeal to a wider electorate? i'm not sure it is, i think it serves as a reminder— not sure it is, i think it serves as a reminderto— not sure it is, i think it serves as a reminder to voters _ not sure it is, i think it serves as a reminder to voters that - not sure it is, i think it serves as a reminder to voters that labourj a reminder to voters that labour still seems — a reminder to voters that labour still seems to— a reminder to voters that labour still seems to have _ a reminder to voters that labour still seems to have an _ a reminder to voters that labour- still seems to have an anti—semitism problem. _ still seems to have an anti—semitism problem. or— still seems to have an anti—semitism problem. orat— still seems to have an anti—semitism problem, or at least _ still seems to have an anti—semitism problem, or at least once _ still seems to have an anti—semitism problem, or at least once did - still seems to have an anti—semitism problem, or at least once did in- still seems to have an anti—semitism problem, or at least once did in the i problem, or at least once did in the last two— problem, or at least once did in the last two distant _ problem, or at least once did in the last two distant history. _ problem, or at least once did in the last two distant history. it's - last two distant history. it's problematic— last two distant history. it's problematic for— last two distant history. it's problematic forjeremy- last two distant history. it's problematic forjeremy —— i last two distant history. it's i problematic forjeremy —— keir starmer— problematic forjeremy —— keir starmer that— problematic forjeremy —— keir starmer thatjeremy_ problematic forjeremy —— keir starmer that jeremy corbyn i problematic forjeremy —— keir starmer that jeremy corbyn is| starmer that jeremy corbyn is standing — starmer that jeremy corbyn is standing in _ starmer that jeremy corbyn is standing in his— starmer that jeremy corbyn is standing in his old _ starmer that jeremy corbyn is . standing in his old constituency. what _ standing in his old constituency. what does — standing in his old constituency. what does his _ standing in his old constituency. what does his approach - standing in his old constituency. what does his approach say? . standing in his old constituency. what does his approach say? i. standing in his old constituency. - what does his approach say? i would welcome _ what does his approach say? i would welcome the — what does his approach say? i would welcome the selection _ what does his approach say? i would welcome the selection of _ what does his approach say? i would welcome the selection of more - welcome the selection of more moderate _ welcome the selection of more moderate candidates _ welcome the selection of more moderate candidates for - welcome the selection of more i moderate candidates for labour, i think— moderate candidates for labour, i think that — moderate candidates for labour, i think that would _ moderate candidates for labour, i think that would be _ moderate candidates for labour, i think that would be better- moderate candidates for labour, i think that would be better for- moderate candidates for labour, i think that would be better for the| think that would be better for the country. — think that would be better for the country. and _ think that would be better for the country. and it— think that would be better for the country, and it would _ think that would be better for the country, and it would mean- think that would be better for the country, and it would mean that. think that would be better for the . country, and it would mean that we ntight— country, and it would mean that we might not— country, and it would mean that we might not lose _ country, and it would mean that we might not lose some _ country, and it would mean that we might not lose some of— country, and it would mean that we might not lose some of the - country, and it would mean that we might not lose some of the groundl country, and it would mean that we i might not lose some of the ground we have gained _ might not lose some of the ground we have gained in — might not lose some of the ground we have gained in areas _ might not lose some of the ground we have gained in areas like _ might not lose some of the ground we have gained in areas like the - have gained in areas like the culture — have gained in areas like the culture wars— have gained in areas like the culture wars for— have gained in areas like the culture wars for instance. . have gained in areas like the - culture wars for instance. labour have _ culture wars for instance. labour have watered _ culture wars for instance. labour have watered down _ culture wars for instance. labour have watered down the - culture wars for instance. labour have watered down the green i have watered down the green prosperity _ have watered down the green prosperity plan, _ have watered down the green prosperity plan, the - have watered down the green prosperity plan, the new - have watered down the greenj prosperity plan, the new deal have watered down the green - prosperity plan, the new deal for workers. — prosperity plan, the new deal for workers. i— prosperity plan, the new deal for workers, i imagine— prosperity plan, the new deal for workers, i imagine they- prosperity plan, the new deal for workers, i imagine they will- prosperity plan, the new deal for workers, i imagine they will stickj workers, i imagine they will stick to that _ workers, i imagine they will stick to that path _ workers, i imagine they will stick to that path or— workers, i imagine they will stick to that path or more _ workers, i imagine they will stick to that path or more likely - workers, i imagine they will stick to that path or more likely to - workers, i imagine they will stick to that path or more likely to if. to that path or more likely to if there _ to that path or more likely to if there are — to that path or more likely to if there are more _ to that path or more likely to if there are more moderate - to that path or more likely to if there are more moderate in i to that path or more likely to ifi there are more moderate in the labour— there are more moderate in the labour party _ there are more moderate in the labour party. quite _ there are more moderate in the labour party. quite how- there are more moderate in the labour party. quite how keir. there are more moderate in the - labour party. quite how keir starmer reconcile _ labour party. quite how keir starmer reconcile this — labour party. quite how keir starmer reconcile this with _ labour party. quite how keir starmer reconcile this with his _ labour party. quite how keir starmer reconcile this with his admission - reconcile this with his admission earlier— reconcile this with his admission earlier this — reconcile this with his admission earlier this week— reconcile this with his admission earlier this week that _ reconcile this with his admission earlier this week that he - reconcile this with his admission earlier this week that he is - reconcile this with his admission i earlier this week that he is indeed a socialist, — earlier this week that he is indeed a socialist, t'm _ earlier this week that he is indeed a socialist, i'm not _ earlier this week that he is indeed a socialist, i'm not quite - earlier this week that he is indeed a socialist, i'm not quite sure. - a socialist, i'm not quite sure. when — a socialist, i'm not quite sure. when it— a socialist, i'm not quite sure. when it comes _ a socialist, i'm not quite sure. when it comes to _ a socialist, i'm not quite sure. when it comes to the - a socialist, i'm not quite sure. when it comes to the matter i a socialist, i'm not quite sure. i when it comes to the matter of a socialist, i'm not quite sure. - when it comes to the matter of diane abbott. _ when it comes to the matter of diane abbott. i_ when it comes to the matter of diane abbott. i do _ when it comes to the matter of diane abbott. i do feel— when it comes to the matter of diane abbott, ido feelthat_ when it comes to the matter of diane abbott, i do feel that of— when it comes to the matter of diane abbott, i do feel that of course - when it comes to the matter of diane abbott, i do feel that of course she i abbott, i do feel that of course she was a _ abbott, i do feel that of course she was a divisive — abbott, i do feel that of course she was a divisive figure _ abbott, i do feel that of course she was a divisive figure and _ abbott, i do feel that of course she was a divisive figure and she - was a divisive figure and she clearly— was a divisive figure and she clearly remains _ was a divisive figure and she clearly remains so, - was a divisive figure and she clearly remains so, that - was a divisive figure and she clearly remains so, that she | clearly remains so, that she probably— clearly remains so, that she probably didn't _ clearly remains so, that she probably didn't deserve - clearly remains so, that she probably didn't deserve to l clearly remains so, that she . probably didn't deserve to have clearly remains so, that she - probably didn't deserve to have a more _ probably didn't deserve to have a more graceful— probably didn't deserve to have a more graceful exit _ probably didn't deserve to have a more graceful exit from - probably didn't deserve to have a more graceful exit from the - probably didn't deserve to have a i more graceful exit from the labour party— more graceful exit from the labour party than— more graceful exit from the labour party than it — more graceful exit from the labour party than it appears _ more graceful exit from the labour party than it appears she _ more graceful exit from the labour party than it appears she is - more graceful exit from the labour party than it appears she is at - more graceful exit from the labour party than it appears she is at the. party than it appears she is at the moment — party than it appears she is at the moment. , ., ., ., party than it appears she is at the moment-_ i _ party than it appears she is at the moment._ i am - party than it appears she is at the moment._ i am a - party than it appears she is at the | moment._ i am a huge moment. rushanara? i am a huge admirer of— moment. rushanara? i am a huge admirer of diane _ moment. rushanara? i am a huge admirer of diane abbott _ moment. rushanara? i am a huge admirer of diane abbott as - moment. rushanara? i am a huge admirer of diane abbott as i - moment. rushanara? i am a huge admirer of diane abbott as i said. | admirer of diane abbott as i said. we need to make sure that as a party, we support our candidates. and if there are complaints and issues, they are dealt with through independent channels. let’s issues, they are dealt with through independent channels.— independent channels. let's talk about the policy _ independent channels. let's talk about the policy that _ independent channels. let's talk about the policy that labour - independent channels. let's talk| about the policy that labour does want to talk about, putting 30,000 more neighbourhood police and pcsos on the beat, how would they be paid for? irate on the beat, how would they be paid for? ~ ., on the beat, how would they be paid for? ~ . ., ., , on the beat, how would they be paid for? . . ., ., , ., for? we have already made announcements _ for? we have already made announcements and - for? we have already made announcements and it - for? we have already made announcements and it is i for? we have already made i announcements and it is fully for? we have already made - announcements and it is fully costed in terms of efficiencies that we will make. we have also set out how we will fund some of the other proposals in terms of non—dom is and a range of policies that rachel reeves has set out.— a range of policies that rachel reeves has set out. how much is it auoin to reeves has set out. how much is it going to cost? _ reeves has set out. how much is it going to cost? in — reeves has set out. how much is it going to cost? in terms _ reeves has set out. how much is it going to cost? in terms of- reeves has set out. how much is it going to cost? in terms of the - going to cost? in terms of the olicin: going to cost? in terms of the policing plan. _ going to cost? in terms of the policing plan, we _ going to cost? in terms of the policing plan, we have - going to cost? in terms of the - policing plan, we have announced they will be 13,000 pcsos, that is they will be13,000 pcsos, that is absolutely vital if we want to bear down on crime. and as i say every single policy that we have announced has been allocated... haifa single policy that we have announced has been allocated. . ._ has been allocated... how much will efficiency savings _ has been allocated... how much will efficiency savings actually _ has been allocated... how much will efficiency savings actually make - has been allocated... how much will efficiency savings actually make in l efficiency savings actually make in terms of funding officers?- terms of funding officers? those olicies terms of funding officers? those policies have _ terms of funding officers? those policies have been _ terms of funding officers? those policies have been set _ terms of funding officers? those policies have been set out - terms of funding officers? those policies have been set out in - terms of funding officers? those policies have been set out in a l policies have been set out in a fully custody document. and we will —— costed document and we will set out other policies that will be costed unlike the conservative party. the question is, why are they not setting out how they are going to pay the announcements they have made which amount to £71 billion of costs? ~ ., made which amount to £71 billion of costs? a, , , ., made which amount to £71 billion of costs? , , ., ,~/ made which amount to £71 billion of costs? , , ., i. costs? more broadly, do you welcome this oli , costs? more broadly, do you welcome this policy. john? _ costs? more broadly, do you welcome this policy, john? 13,000 _ costs? more broadly, do you welcome this policy, john? 13,000 more - this policy, john? 13,000 more officers on the beat. some of them might be in back offices but they are going out on the street. in might be in back offices but they are going out on the street. in the last, are going out on the street. in the last. under— are going out on the street. in the last, under the _ are going out on the street. in the last, under the conservative - are going out on the street. in the last, under the conservative partyj last, under the conservative party in we _ last, under the conservative party in we have — last, under the conservative party in we have increased 25% police officers — in we have increased 25% police officers. ., �* , in we have increased 25% police officers. . �*, , , in we have increased 25% police officers. , , . officers. that's because you cut them before. _ officers. that's because you cut them before. in _ officers. that's because you cut them before. in my _ officers. that's because you cut them before. in my county - officers. that's because you cut them before. in my county of i officers. that's because you cut - them before. in my county of essex, we have more _ them before. in my county of essex, we have more police _ them before. in my county of essex, we have more police officers - them before. in my county of essex, we have more police officers than i we have more police officers than any time — we have more police officers than any time in — we have more police officers than any time in history of the police force _ any time in history of the police force which goes back 170 any time in history of the police force which goes back170 years. what _ force which goes back170 years. what labour talking about, they are pcsos _ what labour talking about, they are pcsos which do an important job they do not _ pcsos which do an important job they do not have _ pcsos which do an important job they do not have the full power of a police — do not have the full power of a police officer. crime has been falling — police officer. crime has been falling steadily.— police officer. crime has been falling steadily. hang on... i will come back— falling steadily. hang on... i will come back to — falling steadily. hang on... i will come back to that _ falling steadily. hang on... i will come back to that claim. - falling steadily. hang on... i will. come back to that claim. rushanara talks about — come back to that claim. rushanara talks about unfunded _ come back to that claim. rushanara talks about unfunded promises, - come back to that claim. rushanara j talks about unfunded promises, she is talking _ talks about unfunded promises, she is talking about a very long—term objective — is talking about a very long—term objective to get rid of national insurance _ objective to get rid of national insurance contributions for employees. that is not in our manifesto _ employees. that is not in our manifesto commits a very long time commitment. jeremy hunt never suggested it would be deliverable under— suggested it would be deliverable under the government so it is not a pledge. _ under the government so it is not a pledge. it _ under the government so it is not a pledge. it is— under the government so it is not a pledge, it is an ambition one day. we have _ pledge, it is an ambition one day. we have been clear that we don't make _ we have been clear that we don't make promises or implement policies that we _ make promises or implement policies that we cannot pay for.— that we cannot pay for. except on defence? hang _ that we cannot pay for. except on defence? hang on, _ that we cannot pay for. except on defence? hang on, except- that we cannot pay for. except on defence? hang on, except on - that we cannot pay for. except on - defence? hang on, except on defence. we have not heard how you are going to fund it. the we have not heard how you are going to fund it. . , ., , , to fund it. the ambition is 2.5%. that is to fund it. the ambition is 2.596. that is rrot _ to fund it. the ambition is 2.596. that is not credible _ to fund it. the ambition is 2.596. that is not credible economic. that is not credible economic policy. it that is not credible economic oli . , ., ., that is not credible economic oli . ., . policy. it is a long-term ob'ective. you talk about i policy. it is a long-term ob'ective. you talk about believing _ policy. it is a long-term objective. you talk about believing things. i you talk about believing things. that's how liz truss crashed to the economy, you did not respect independent assessment or do an 0br forecast, they have been failing to account how your party will pay for things and we have heard you talking about long—term ambition in belief, very little credibility. the about long-term ambition in belief, very little credibility.— very little credibility. the labour party have _ very little credibility. the labour party have £38 _ very little credibility. the labour party have £38 billion _ very little credibility. the labour party have £38 billion of- very little credibility. the labour. party have £38 billion of spending commitments which they have not identified... commitments which they have not identified. . ._ identified... that is not true. identified — identified... that is not true. identified how _ identified... that is not true. identified how they - identified... that is not true. identified how they will - identified... that is not true. identified how they will be i identified... that is not true. i identified how they will be paid for. there are other taxes which we know _ for. there are other taxes which we know labour— for. there are other taxes which we know labour are going to put up. for instance. _ know labour are going to put up. for instance. the — know labour are going to put up. for instance, the pledge on police officers. — instance, the pledge on police officers, it's not clear how that could _ officers, it's not clear how that could be — officers, it's not clear how that could be delivered, and actually we are getting crime down now and we already— are getting crime down now and we already have... are getting crime down now and we already have. . ._ already have... let's talk about the record on crime. _ already have... let's talk about the record on crime. you _ already have... let's talk about the record on crime. you and _ already have. .. let's talk about the record on crime. you and other- record on crime. you and other politicians like to say that crime has halved since 2010, that excludes fraud and computer misuse, those numbers do not include all kinds of crime as well. when you look at the fastest growing crime, fraud, it isn't even in the figures and most people know somebody, if they have not experience it themselves, of being victim of fraud. it not experience it themselves, of being victim of fraud.— being victim of fraud. it didn't used to be — being victim of fraud. it didn't used to be recorded - being victim of fraud. it didn't used to be recorded in - being victim of fraud. it didn't used to be recorded in that i being victim of fraud. it didn't i used to be recorded in that way, it's a _ used to be recorded in that way, it's a relatively recent phenomenon. at an _ it's a relatively recent phenomenon. at an important one. with it's a relatively recent phenomenon. at an important one.— at an important one. with online tradin: at an important one. with online trading and _ at an important one. with online trading and scams, _ at an important one. with online trading and scams, and - at an important one. with online trading and scams, and we - at an important one. with online| trading and scams, and we asked taking _ trading and scams, and we asked taking special measures to tackle online _ taking special measures to tackle online fraud. i was involved in some of those _ online fraud. i was involved in some of those and — online fraud. i was involved in some of those and i was asked the minister~ _ of those and i was asked the minister. it is something which affects — minister. it is something which affects people very badly. and it also affects _ affects people very badly. and it also affects your _ affects people very badly. and it also affects your claim _ affects people very badly. and it also affects your claim that - affects people very badly. and it| also affects your claim that crime has fallen, there are also reports that say that their burglaries are barely investigated. charge rates have not changed in nine years over the conceptus, can you be —— they have plummeted from 16% to 6% from 2015 to 2024, can you say you are the party of law and order? i 2015 to 2024, can you say you are the party of law and order? i accept we have more _ the party of law and order? i accept we have more to _ the party of law and order? i accept we have more to do, _ the party of law and order? i accept we have more to do, solution - the party of law and order? i accept we have more to do, solution is - the party of law and order? i accept| we have more to do, solution is like having _ we have more to do, solution is like having more — we have more to do, solution is like having more police officers like labour— having more police officers like labour say is something you have done _ labour say is something you have done. �* , ., ., labour say is something you have done. �* i. ., ., labour say is something you have done. �* , ., ., ., the done. but you got rid of them. they have been replaced _ done. but you got rid of them. they have been replaced since _ done. but you got rid of them. they have been replaced since then - done. but you got rid of them. they have been replaced since then but l have been replaced since then but they were got rid of in the years you were in government. knife crime has one you were in government. knife crime has gone up — you were in government. knife crime has gone up by _ you were in government. knife crime has gone up by 8096. _ you were in government. knife crime has gone up by 8096. one _ you were in government. knife crime has gone up by 8096. one of- you were in government. knife crime has gone up by 8096. one of the - you were in government. knife crime | has gone up by 8096. one of the ways ou tackle has gone up by 8096. one of the ways you tackle knife _ has gone up by 8096. one of the ways you tackle knife crime _ has gone up by 8096. one of the ways you tackle knife crime is _ has gone up by 8096. one of the ways you tackle knife crime is bringing - you tackle knife crime is bringing in more — you tackle knife crime is bringing in more stop and search which the labour— in more stop and search which the labour party is opposed to. let me brina in labour party is opposed to. let me bring in munira, _ labour party is opposed to. let me bring in munira, what _ labour party is opposed to. let me bring in munira, what is _ labour party is opposed to. let me bring in munira, what is your- labour party is opposed to. let me| bring in munira, what is your author when it comes to tackling crime? ferrite when it comes to tackling crime? we have always —— your author? we have always _ have always —— your author? we have always said _ have always —— your author? we have always said more _ have always —— your author? we have always said more visible _ have always —— your author? we have always said more visible policing, - always said more visible policing, police _ always said more visible policing, police officers _ always said more visible policing, police officers on _ always said more visible policing, police officers on the _ always said more visible policing, police officers on the ground, - police officers on the ground, constables _ police officers on the ground, constables or— police officers on the ground, constables or community - police officers on the ground, i constables or community police officers. — constables or community police officers. our— constables or community police officers, our intelligence - constables or community police officers, our intelligence led . constables or community police officers, our intelligence led to| constables or community police . officers, our intelligence led to be able to— officers, our intelligence led to be able to tackle _ officers, our intelligence led to be able to tackle crime _ officers, our intelligence led to be able to tackle crime and _ officers, our intelligence led to be able to tackle crime and build - able to tackle crime and build relationships— able to tackle crime and build relationships in— able to tackle crime and build relationships in the _ able to tackle crime and build i relationships in the community able to tackle crime and build - relationships in the community to be able to— relationships in the community to be able to solve — relationships in the community to be able to solve crime. _ relationships in the community to be able to solve crime. john _ relationships in the community to be able to solve crime. john talks - able to solve crime. john talks about— able to solve crime. john talks about the _ able to solve crime. john talks about the fact _ able to solve crime. john talks about the fact that _ able to solve crime. john talks about the fact that he - able to solve crime. john talks about the fact that he thinks i able to solve crime. john talks - about the fact that he thinks there are record — about the fact that he thinks there are record numbers— about the fact that he thinks there are record numbers of— about the fact that he thinks there are record numbers of police - are record numbers of police officers. _ are record numbers of police officers. if— are record numbers of police officers, if you _ are record numbers of police officers, if you talk - are record numbers of police officers, if you talk to - are record numbers of police i officers, if you talk to anybody, people — officers, if you talk to anybody, people don't— officers, if you talk to anybody, people don't feel— officers, if you talk to anybody, people don't feel that. - officers, if you talk to anybody, people don't feel that. people. officers, if you talk to anybody, - people don't feel that. people don't see a _ people don't feel that. people don't see a visible — people don't feel that. people don't see a visible police _ people don't feel that. people don't see a visible police presence - people don't feel that. people don't see a visible police presence on- see a visible police presence on their— see a visible police presence on their streets. _ see a visible police presence on their streets, whether- see a visible police presence on their streets, whether they- see a visible police presence on their streets, whether they are | their streets, whether they are individuals. _ their streets, whether they are individuals, domestic- their streets, whether they are i individuals, domestic burglaries, homes _ individuals, domestic burglaries, homes being _ individuals, domestic burglaries, homes being burgled _ individuals, domestic burglaries, homes being burgled last- individuals, domestic burglaries, l homes being burgled last week... individuals, domestic burglaries, - homes being burgled last week... you are not homes being burgled last week... are not pledging new offices, you want more visibility but not new? ferrite want more visibility but not new? we will be pledging new officers and that will— will be pledging new officers and that will be — will be pledging new officers and that will be clear _ will be pledging new officers and that will be clear in _ will be pledging new officers and that will be clear in the - will be pledging new officers and l that will be clear in the manifesto when _ that will be clear in the manifesto when it— that will be clear in the manifesto when it comes _ that will be clear in the manifesto when it comes out. _ that will be clear in the manifesto when it comes out. let's- that will be clear in the manifesto when it comes out. let's not- that will be clear in the manifesto. when it comes out. let's not forget that every— when it comes out. let's not forget that every single _ when it comes out. let's not forget that every single day, _ when it comes out. let's not forget that every single day, 6000 - when it comes out. let's not forget that every single day, 6000 casesl that every single day, 6000 cases are being — that every single day, 6000 cases are being closed _ that every single day, 6000 cases are being closed without - that every single day, 6000 cases are being closed without being - are being closed without being solved, — are being closed without being solved, just _ are being closed without being solved, just last _ are being closed without being solved, just last week - are being closed without being solved, just last week i - are being closed without being solved, just last week i was i are being closed without being - solved, just last week i was talking to an _ solved, just last week i was talking to an independent _ solved, just last week i was talking to an independent shop _ solved, just last week i was talking to an independent shop in - solved, just last week i was talking to an independent shop in my- to an independent shop in my constituency. _ to an independent shop in my constituency, £20,000 - to an independent shop in my constituency, £20,000 of. to an independent shop in my. constituency, £20,000 of stock overnight — constituency, £20,000 of stock overnight and _ constituency, £20,000 of stock overnight and the _ constituency, £20,000 of stock overnight and the police - constituency, £20,000 of stock overnight and the police were i constituency, £20,000 of stock i overnight and the police were not able to _ overnight and the police were not able to help — overnight and the police were not able to help or— overnight and the police were not able to help or take _ overnight and the police were not able to help or take it— overnight and the police were not able to help or take it forward - overnight and the police were not i able to help or take it forward even though— able to help or take it forward even though there — able to help or take it forward even though there was _ able to help or take it forward even though there was footage. - able to help or take it forward even though there was footage. there i able to help or take it forward even though there was footage. there isj able to help or take it forward even i though there was footage. there is a serious _ though there was footage. there is a serious resulting _ though there was footage. there is a serious resulting issue _ though there was footage. there is a serious resulting issue that - though there was footage. there is a serious resulting issue that needs. serious resulting issue that needs to be _ serious resulting issue that needs to be tackled _ serious resulting issue that needs to be tackled and _ serious resulting issue that needs to be tackled and people - serious resulting issue that needs to be tackled and people need - serious resulting issue that needs to be tackled and people need to| serious resulting issue that needs. to be tackled and people need to see visible _ to be tackled and people need to see visible police — to be tackled and people need to see visible police presence _ to be tackled and people need to see visible police presence on _ to be tackled and people need to see visible police presence on our- visible police presence on our streets — visible police presence on our streets. ., ., , ., streets. you are here in the studio but the liberal _ streets. you are here in the studio but the liberal democrat - streets. you are here in the studio but the liberal democrat leader i streets. you are here in the studio. but the liberal democrat leader has been out and about, let's put it, having fun. let's put it that way. hannah miller has been following him on the campaign bus. hello, hannah. another day, and another ed davey stunt, i understand.— stunt, i understand. absolutely, es. he stunt, i understand. absolutely, yes- he does — stunt, i understand. absolutely, yes. he does looked _ stunt, i understand. absolutely, yes. he does looked to - stunt, i understand. absolutely, yes. he does looked to be - stunt, i understand. absolutely, | yes. he does looked to be having quite a lot of fun, compared to some of the other party leaders, not taking himself too seriously. we ask him about it earlier, and said, is there a risk all of these stunts are getting in the way of the policies you are trying to announce? his response was essentially that he thinks that politicians should take people seriously but they don't necessarily need to take themselves too seriously. he was out doing a slip and slide enough room earlier, getting quite wet, butjust because it was raining. he did it more than once, very happy to get involved as ever. i actually had him saying he enjoyed it more than he thought he would do. he has been paddle boarding this week, freewheeling down the hill in a bicycle in mid wales, so having quite a good time and hoping the lib dems strategy is that these moments get them in the headlines, get them visibility, and ultimately, that that eventually translate into votes. ferrite ultimately, that that eventually translate into votes.— translate into votes. we are en'o in: translate into votes. we are enjoying the _ translate into votes. we are enjoying the pictures - translate into votes. we are enjoying the pictures again | translate into votes. we are . enjoying the pictures again of translate into votes. we are - enjoying the pictures again of ed davey on the paddle board. i hope you are as energetic as he is if you are on the trail with him, taking part in some of these stunts. here he is free wailing slightly cautiously, wisely, not wanting to come off. he will be exhausted by the end of this campaign, won't he? yeah, he doesn't seem itjust yet. we did ask if he had checked if he has working brakes yesterday. i have had a go myself at the slip and slide this morning, just for the fun of it, why not if you are there. he was even up for doing interviews on the paddle board, we gave that a go. he is doing these things, having a laugh, having a smile and like i say trying to get serious messages across at the same time. right, hannah miller, _ across at the same time. right, hannah miller, thank _ across at the same time. right, hannah miller, thank you - across at the same time. right, hannah miller, thank you very i across at the same time. right, - hannah miller, thank you very much. looking dry and warm on the coach. does he look not serious, munira? is there a risk of attracting headlines of these stunts detracts from what are important messages to the public? are important messages to the ublic? ~ �* ., , ., public? when i'm out blocking on doors, public? when i'm out blocking on doors. one _ public? when i'm out blocking on doors. one of— public? when i'm out blocking on doors, one of the _ public? when i'm out blocking on doors, one of the things - public? when i'm out blocking on doors, one of the things that - public? when i'm out blocking on doors, one of the things that has| doors, one of the things that has fed back— doors, one of the things that has fed back to— doors, one of the things that has fed back to me, _ doors, one of the things that has fed back to me, as— doors, one of the things that has fed back to me, as well- doors, one of the things that has fed back to me, as well as - doors, one of the things that has| fed back to me, as well as people being _ fed back to me, as well as people being fed — fed back to me, as well as people being fed up _ fed back to me, as well as people being fed up with— fed back to me, as well as people being fed up with the _ fed back to me, as well as people being fed up with the tories - fed back to me, as well as people being fed up with the tories and i being fed up with the tories and wanting — being fed up with the tories and wanting to — being fed up with the tories and wanting to kick— being fed up with the tories and wanting to kick them _ being fed up with the tories and wanting to kick them out, - being fed up with the tories and wanting to kick them out, there| being fed up with the tories and . wanting to kick them out, there are a lot of— wanting to kick them out, there are a lot of voters — wanting to kick them out, there are a lot of voters who _ wanting to kick them out, there are a lot of voters who are _ wanting to kick them out, there are a lot of voters who are pretty - a lot of voters who are pretty switched _ a lot of voters who are pretty switched off _ a lot of voters who are pretty switched off from _ a lot of voters who are pretty switched off from politics - a lot of voters who are pretty| switched off from politics and a lot of voters who are pretty - switched off from politics and don't want to _ switched off from politics and don't want to engage _ switched off from politics and don't want to engage. if _ switched off from politics and don't want to engage. if this _ switched off from politics and don't want to engage. if this kind - switched off from politics and don't want to engage. if this kind of- want to engage. if this kind of photo — want to engage. if this kind of photo op _ want to engage. if this kind of photo op or— want to engage. if this kind of photo op or stunt, _ want to engage. if this kind of photo op or stunt, whatever. want to engage. if this kind of. photo op or stunt, whatever you want to engage. if this kind of- photo op or stunt, whatever you want to call— photo op or stunt, whatever you want to call it. _ photo op or stunt, whatever you want to call it. gets— photo op or stunt, whatever you want to call it, gets people's _ photo op or stunt, whatever you want to call it, gets people's attention - to call it, gets people's attention to call it, gets people's attention to talk— to call it, gets people's attention to talk about _ to call it, gets people's attention to talk about serious _ to call it, gets people's attention to talk about serious issues, - to talk about serious issues, whether— to talk about serious issues, whether it's _ to talk about serious issues, whether it's paddle - to talk about serious issues, | whether it's paddle boarding, to talk about serious issues, - whether it's paddle boarding, and we are talking _ whether it's paddle boarding, and we are talking about _ whether it's paddle boarding, and we are talking about the _ whether it's paddle boarding, and we are talking about the filthy— whether it's paddle boarding, and we are talking about the filthy sewage . are talking about the filthy sewage going _ are talking about the filthy sewage going into — are talking about the filthy sewage going into our— are talking about the filthy sewage going into our rivers _ are talking about the filthy sewage going into our rivers and _ are talking about the filthy sewage going into our rivers and cs- are talking about the filthy sewage going into our rivers and cs and . are talking about the filthy sewage j going into our rivers and cs and we need _ going into our rivers and cs and we need to— going into our rivers and cs and we need to do— going into our rivers and cs and we need to do strong _ going into our rivers and cs and we need to do strong action _ going into our rivers and cs and we need to do strong action on - going into our rivers and cs and we need to do strong action on the - need to do strong action on the tories — need to do strong action on the tories have _ need to do strong action on the tories have let _ need to do strong action on the tories have let us _ need to do strong action on the tories have let us down, - need to do strong action on the tories have let us down, todayl need to do strong action on the i tories have let us down, today the slip and _ tories have let us down, today the slip and slide — tories have let us down, today the slip and slide he _ tories have let us down, today the slip and slide he is— tories have let us down, today the slip and slide he is talking - tories have let us down, today the slip and slide he is talking about i slip and slide he is talking about children's— slip and slide he is talking about children's mental— slip and slide he is talking about children's mental health, - slip and slide he is talking about children's mental health, it's- slip and slide he is talking about children's mental health, it's a i slip and slide he is talking about i children's mental health, it's a way of capturing — children's mental health, it's a way of capturing attention _ children's mental health, it's a way of capturing attention because - children's mental health, it's a way| of capturing attention because let's face it. _ of capturing attention because let's face it. you — of capturing attention because let's face it. you love _ of capturing attention because let's face it, you love to _ of capturing attention because let's face it, you love to frame _ of capturing attention because let's face it, you love to frame the - face it, you love to frame the election— face it, you love to frame the election is— face it, you love to frame the election is a _ face it, you love to frame the election is a labour— face it, you love to frame the election is a labour versus i face it, you love to frame the . election is a labour versus tory contest — election is a labour versus tory contest if_ election is a labour versus tory contest if it_ election is a labour versus tory contest. if it enables _ election is a labour versus tory contest. if it enables us - election is a labour versus tory contest. if it enables us to - election is a labour versus tory contest. if it enables us to getl election is a labour versus tory| contest. if it enables us to get a serious — contest. if it enables us to get a serious message _ contest. if it enables us to get a serious message across - contest. if it enables us to get a . serious message across particularly to members— serious message across particularly to members of— serious message across particularly to members of the _ serious message across particularly to members of the public— serious message across particularly to members of the public who - serious message across particularlyi to members of the public who don't necessarilym — to members of the public who don't necessarily... do _ to members of the public who don't necessarily- - -_ necessarily... do you think it works? no. _ necessarily. .. do you think it works? no. i— necessarily. .. do you think it works? no, i know— necessarily... do you think it works? no, i know there - necessarily... do you think it works? no, i know there is l necessarily... do you think it l works? no, i know there is the necessarily... do you think it - works? no, i know there is the old adaae but works? no, i know there is the old adage but there _ works? no, i know there is the old adage but there is _ works? no, i know there is the old adage but there is no _ works? no, i know there is the old adage but there is no such - works? no, i know there is the old adage but there is no such thing i works? no, i know there is the old| adage but there is no such thing as bad publicity but i struggle to believe that this isn't doing more harm than good. it's coming at a time when the landscape on the left of british politics is changing enormously. we have a green party candidate on later. the lib dems are not necessarily the fault go to as a protest vote for people who are fed up protest vote for people who are fed up with the two main parties. 50 it might well be that through the ed davey triathlon, he wants to get serious messages across, but i'm not sure that that is how it is going to play with the voters at a time when public trust in politics is at an all—time low. it public trust in politics is at an all-time low.— public trust in politics is at an all-time low. it helps get people tuned in to _ all-time low. it helps get people tuned in to the _ all-time low. it helps get people tuned in to the message, - all-time low. it helps get people tuned in to the message, and i all-time low. it helps get people tuned in to the message, and on all-time low. it helps get people - tuned in to the message, and on the seriousness — tuned in to the message, and on the seriousness point, _ tuned in to the message, and on the seriousness point, unlike _ tuned in to the message, and on the seriousness point, unlike keir- seriousness point, unlike keir starmer, _ seriousness point, unlike keir starmer, davey— seriousness point, unlike keir starmer, davey has _ seriousness point, unlike keir starmer, davey has been - seriousness point, unlike keir starmer, davey has been on i seriousness point, unlike keir. starmer, davey has been on the cabinet — starmer, davey has been on the cabinet table _ starmer, davey has been on the cabinet table before _ starmer, davey has been on the cabinet table before and - starmer, davey has been on the cabinet table before and shownl starmer, davey has been on the - cabinet table before and shown that he is serious — cabinet table before and shown that he is serious politician _ cabinet table before and shown that he is serious politician travelling - he is serious politician travelling renewable — he is serious politician travelling renewable energy _ he is serious politician travelling renewable energy in _ he is serious politician travelling. renewable energy in government. there _ renewable energy in government. there is— renewable energy in government. there is a — renewable energy in government. there is a challenge, _ renewable energy in government. there is a challenge, rushanara. i there is a challenge, rushanara. well reminded, ed davey with the liberal democrats delivered austerity with the conservatives. what we are seeing now is a party thatis what we are seeing now is a party that is not serious. the country has had so many shocks self—inflicted by the conservatives, the liz truss crash, public services struggling, cost of living crisis, and we have the lib dems leader pulling stunts. we need a labour government talking about the issues that matter to people... about the issues that matter to eo - le. .. ~ . about the issues that matter to --eole...~ . , people... whether that is the crumbling _ people... whether that is the crumbling nhs _ people... whether that is the crumbling nhs or _ people... whether that is the crumbling nhs or the - people... whether that is the crumbling nhs or the sewage people... whether that is the i crumbling nhs or the sewage in people... whether that is the - crumbling nhs or the sewage in this rivers _ crumbling nhs or the sewage in this rivers. when there has been a crisis. — rivers. when there has been a crisis. the _ rivers. when there has been a crisis, the liberal democrats have led the _ crisis, the liberal democrats have led the way every time. we called for a _ led the way every time. we called for a windfall tax first, we were the first — for a windfall tax first, we were the first to _ for a windfall tax first, we were the first to call for a windfall tax on energy— the first to call for a windfall tax on energy companies to put a price cap on— on energy companies to put a price cap on energy bills, you followed suit a _ cap on energy bills, you followed suit a bit— cap on energy bills, you followed suit a bit after that and then the tory— suit a bit after that and then the tory party... suit a bit after that and then the tory party- - -_ suit a bit after that and then the tory party... you spent five years delivering — tory party... you spent five years delivering austerity _ tory party... you spent five years delivering austerity with - tory party... you spent five years delivering austerity with the - delivering austerity with the tories. , ., , ., , tories. let me show you this in the guardian. there _ tories. let me show you this in the guardian. there slogan _ tories. let me show you this in the guardian. there slogan could - tories. let me show you this in the guardian. there slogan could be, l guardian. there slogan could be, yeah, you are talking about us, aren't you?— yeah, you are talking about us, aren't you? yeah, you are talking about us, aren't ou? . . �* ., , aren't you? and we are. i'm not sure it hels. aren't you? and we are. i'm not sure it helps. politicians _ aren't you? and we are. i'm not sure it helps. politicians want _ aren't you? and we are. i'm not sure it helps. politicians want to - aren't you? and we are. i'm not sure it helps. politicians want to say - it helps. politicians want to say that they are humans but they are running for political office. i started a long time ago working for margaret thatcher and the idea she would have fallen off a paddle board... ~ . . , would have fallen off a paddle board... . board... what about boris johnson? i seem to remember _ board... what about boris johnson? i seem to remember and _ board... what about boris johnson? i seem to remember and image - board. .. what about boris johnson? i seem to remember and image of- board... what about boris johnson? i seem to remember and image of the | seem to remember and image of the former mayor of london on a zip wire looking, well, how can i put it? some people might say somewhat look ridiculous on a zip wire. he some people might say somewhat look ridiculous on a zip wire.— ridiculous on a zip wire. he seemed to lean into — ridiculous on a zip wire. he seemed to lean into the _ ridiculous on a zip wire. he seemed to lean into the same _ ridiculous on a zip wire. he seemed to lean into the same mantra. - ridiculous on a zip wire. he seemed to lean into the same mantra. he i to lean into the same mantra. he wasn't running for office, he was mayor of london and it was promoting the olympic games. this is a serious campaign, and we need to address serious issues. there is nothing wrong with showing you have a sense of humour. at the moment all the liberal democrats have managed to achieve it a success of pieces of footage, ed davey pulling off things. i don't think that is helping them get a serious message across. ~ . . ,., helping them get a serious message across. ~ . . , ., helping them get a serious message across. ~ . . _ across. what about your policy announcement _ across. what about your policy announcement today, - across. what about your policy announcement today, how - across. what about your policy | announcement today, how does across. what about your policy i announcement today, how does it across. what about your policy - announcement today, how does it help these sorts of election stance, when you are talking about having mental health practitioners in it's half term and there were lots of children there having fun, but too many children are not having fun. one in five children are struggling with mental health. languishing on waiting lists, with the latest data showing that 340,000 children have been waiting on average up to 15 months, on average six months for mental and support and by putting a dedicated, qualified mental health practitioner in every primary and secondary school, it helps tackle these issues early step i school, it helps tackle these issues earl ste_ . school, it helps tackle these issues earl ste_ , . . . ~ early step i asked rushanara ali about costing _ early step i asked rushanara ali about costing on _ early step i asked rushanara ali about costing on the _ early step i asked rushanara ali about costing on the policing i about costing on the policing policy. how would you pay for it? it would cost £620 million per year for would cost £620 million per yearfor the we would pay for that by travelling the digital services tax, levied on social media ad tech giants, which would raise a lot more than that. ~ .,, giants, which would raise a lot more than that. ~ ., giants, which would raise a lot more thanthat. ., , than that. most of those companies are in the united _ than that. most of those companies are in the united states. _ than that. most of those companies are in the united states. we - than that. most of those companies| are in the united states. we already tax them, are in the united states. we already tax them. it — are in the united states. we already tax them, it was _ are in the united states. we already tax them, it was introduced - are in the united states. we already tax them, it was introduced in - are in the united states. we already tax them, it was introduced in 2020 | tax them, it was introduced in 2020 at a rate of 2%, and we think they should pay more because we know the social media giants and tech companies are fuelling a lot of these problems we see in young people. these problems we see in young --eole. �* . these problems we see in young --eole. �* , people. but whether it is debatable. the us government... _ people. but whether it is debatable. the us government... but _ people. but whether it is debatable. the us government... but labour. people. but whether it is debatable. the us government... but labour is| the us government... but labour is also promising mental health practitioners in secondary schools so presumably you welcome this. irate so presumably you welcome this. we have so presumably you welcome this. , have made that announcement, in secondary school, and in primary there is a slight variation and in there is a slight variation and in the nhs we are prioritising the need for mental health practitioners increasing the numbers. there is a crisis and we are focused on that. we have made that announcement. one problem is absentee levels in schools, which has happened since the pandemic. schools, which has happened since the pandemic-— the pandemic. that's been on the conservative _ the pandemic. that's been on the conservative watch. _ the pandemic. that's been on the conservative watch. the - the pandemic. that's been on the| conservative watch. the pandemic the pandemic. that's been on the - conservative watch. the pandemic was while we were — conservative watch. the pandemic was while we were in _ conservative watch. the pandemic was while we were in government, - conservative watch. the pandemic was while we were in government, yes. - conservative watch. the pandemic was while we were in government, yes. i l while we were in government, yes. i accept _ while we were in government, yes. i accept that— while we were in government, yes. i accept that mental health in schools is a very— accept that mental health in schools is a very serious issue and we want to see _ is a very serious issue and we want to see more — is a very serious issue and we want to see more mental health support for children at school. but we are not going — for children at school. but we are not going to pop up tax. the lib dems— not going to pop up tax. the lib dems have _ not going to pop up tax. the lib dems have come up with another tax which _ dems have come up with another tax which we _ dems have come up with another tax which we want to oppose. i don't think— which we want to oppose. i don't think it _ which we want to oppose. i don't think it would be beneficial for the british— think it would be beneficial for the british economy to tax our most important — british economy to tax our most important vestas, and who are at the forefront _ important vestas, and who are at the forefront of _ important vestas, and who are at the forefront of research into things that are — forefront of research into things that are going to transform... we have a that are going to transform... have a mental that are going to transform... , have a mental health emergency in the last two months i have had one teenager in my constituency commit suicide and have heard about scores of others who regularly end up in a&e. this is about priorities and choices and we are saying, actually, working people shouldn't pay more tax to be able to fund a policy like this, the big tech giants, who are causing these problems, should be made to pay for some of the promise they are causing. taste made to pay for some of the promise they are causing-— they are causing. we have taken action to make _ they are causing. we have taken action to make sure _ they are causing. we have taken action to make sure that - they are causing. we have taken| action to make sure that children and vulnerable people are protected online _ and vulnerable people are protected online i_ and vulnerable people are protected online i was involved in the passage of the _ online i was involved in the passage of the online safety act, which is legislation to deal with that. but mental— legislation to deal with that. but mental health isn'tjust legislation to deal with that. but mental health isn't just about online, — mental health isn't just about online, it's not making it easier, but the — online, it's not making it easier, but the general issue of trying to support— but the general issue of trying to support children with mental health problems— support children with mental health problems i fully accept is something we need _ problems i fully accept is something we need to be concentrating on and where _ we need to be concentrating on and where we _ we need to be concentrating on and where we are doing quite a lot. how worried are — where we are doing quite a lot. how worried are you _ where we are doing quite a lot. hmnr worried are you about the threat of the liberal democrats in what we call the blue wool, formally safe conservative parts of the country? there is a real tussle between conservatives and lib dems in about 85 seats and they could topple some high—profile ministers. the 85 seats and they could topple some high-profile ministers.— high-profile ministers. the problem with the liberal— high-profile ministers. the problem with the liberal democrats - high-profile ministers. the problem with the liberal democrats is - high-profile ministers. the problem with the liberal democrats is they l with the liberal democrats is they have to _ with the liberal democrats is they have to make clear that, if elected, they wiii— have to make clear that, if elected, they will support a labour government and the heads are clearly they wiii— government and the heads are clearly they will not enter into coalition with a _ they will not enter into coalition with a conservative government so, if you _ with a conservative government so, if you are _ with a conservative government so, if you are voting at lib dem, you're essentially— if you are voting at lib dem, you're essentially voting for keir starmer to be _ essentially voting for keir starmer to be prime minister. you essentially voting for keir starmer to be prime minister.— essentially voting for keir starmer to be prime minister. you are voting for a local liberal— to be prime minister. you are voting for a local liberal democrat - for a local liberal democrat champion who will stand up for you in parliament when the toys are taking them for granted for so many years, whether that's down the road in places like esher and walton, wimbledon, winchester, to manchester cheadle and hazel grove. these are constituencies where we are competitive and will be putting forward a strong liberal democrat offer. ., ., , . , forward a strong liberal democrat offer. ., ., , ., ., offer. you will not be able to form a government- — offer. you will not be able to form a government. you _ offer. you will not be able to form a government. you will _ offer. you will not be able to form a government. you will be - offer. you will not be able to form . a government. you will be supporting a government. you will be supporting a labour— a government. you will be supporting a labour government. we a government. you will be supporting a labour government.— a labour government. we will be there on our— a labour government. we will be there on our own _ a labour government. we will be there on our own manifesto, - there on our own manifesto, championing the areas we represent and standing up for liberal values in parliament, as we have done through this parliament. lets say labour through this parliament. lets say labour wins _ through this parliament. lets say labour wins the _ through this parliament. lets say labour wins the election, - through this parliament. lets say labour wins the election, on - through this parliament. lets say labour wins the election, on the | labour wins the election, on the budget or any sort of key policy areas, you are going to back the labour government? we areas, you are going to back the labour government?— areas, you are going to back the labour government? we will see what the come labour government? we will see what they come forward _ labour government? we will see what they come forward with. _ labour government? we will see what they come forward with. i'm _ labour government? we will see what they come forward with. i'm sure - they come forward with. i'm sure there would be areas of a labour government but it will not agree with the step were not standing on a collision manifesto for the path we are stand on our own policies and principles and values and you will see that manifesto in the coming weeks. . . see that manifesto in the coming weeks. , . , . , . weeks. liberal democrats are confident _ weeks. liberal democrats are confident in _ weeks. liberal democrats are confident in the _ weeks. liberal democrats are confident in the blue - weeks. liberal democrats are confident in the blue wall- weeks. liberal democrats are confident in the blue wall andj weeks. liberal democrats are - confident in the blue wall and they are contesting many seats were its could be straight fight between conservatives and lib dems. how well do you think they could do, in terms of profile? i do you think they could do, in terms of rofile? . , ., , , of profile? i have my doubts. i thinkthis _ of profile? i have my doubts. i think this could _ of profile? i have my doubts. i think this could be _ of profile? i have my doubts. i think this could be an - of profile? i have my doubts. i think this could be an election| of profile? i have my doubts. i- think this could be an election that rules— think this could be an election that rules the _ think this could be an election that rules the lib dems had from being the third _ rules the lib dems had from being the third party in british politics, but let's— the third party in british politics, but let's see whether they end up being _ but let's see whether they end up being the — but let's see whether they end up being the kingmakers, as they were in 2010 _ being the kingmakers, as they were in 2010 i_ being the kingmakers, as they were in 2010. i think a problem the party has is _ in 2010. i think a problem the party has is that— in 2010. i think a problem the party has is that people don't really know what they— has is that people don't really know what they stand for and, if you look at some _ what they stand for and, if you look at some of— what they stand for and, if you look at some of the literature, they are on the _ at some of the literature, they are on the one — at some of the literature, they are on the one hand promising to build more _ on the one hand promising to build more houses in order to help young people _ more houses in order to help young people get— more houses in order to help young people get on the housing ladder, which _ people get on the housing ladder, which is _ people get on the housing ladder, which is a — people get on the housing ladder, which is a massive issue, but on the other— which is a massive issue, but on the other hand — which is a massive issue, but on the other hand they are making promises about— other hand they are making promises about blocking building or championing the occasions during which _ championing the occasions during which they have blocked building in local constituencies.— local constituencies. we have a brilliant record _ local constituencies. we have a brilliant record of— local constituencies. we have a i brilliant record of house-building brilliant record of house—building with vets in the lake district, in cambridgeshire, kingston. but you are roud cambridgeshire, kingston. but you are proud of— cambridgeshire, kingston. but you are proud of the _ cambridgeshire, kingston. but you are proud of the times you - cambridgeshire, kingston. but you are proud of the times you have i are proud of the times you have blocked — are proud of the times you have blocked new houses and other vital infrastructure of strip i'd love, blocked new houses and other vital infrastructure of strip i'd— infrastructure of strip i'd love, to know with _ infrastructure of strip i'd love, to know with anybody _ infrastructure of strip i'd love, to know with anybody on _ infrastructure of strip i'd love, to know with anybody on the - infrastructure of strip i'd love, to know with anybody on the panel| know with anybody on the panel thinks you should build a house anywhere for anybody. we don't want to see big luxury developments on the green belt. we need to see affordable housing for key workers and young people. for everyone, particularly in my constituency, where i have been campaigning for affordable housing for workers and young people are being driven out because they can't afford to live there. . ~ because they can't afford to live there. . ,, ., , there. talking of the green belt, let's no there. talking of the green belt, let's go to _ there. talking of the green belt, let's go to bristol, _ there. talking of the green belt, let's go to bristol, where - there. talking of the green belt, let's go to bristol, where the - there. talking of the green belt, i let's go to bristol, where the green party are launching their election campaign. we have had if you technical issues but i think we can talk to their candidate for brighton pavilion, sian berry. we have asked all the politicians representing their respective parties when they first appear to give as a 32nd pitch for the greens. so, first appear to give as a 32nd pitch forthe greens. so, please, first appear to give as a 32nd pitch for the greens. so, please, take the floor. �* ' , . , ., floor. after 14 years of driving ublic floor. after 14 years of driving public services _ floor. after 14 years of driving public services into _ floor. after 14 years of driving public services into the - floor. after 14 years of driving i public services into the ground, people are crying out for change but labour are not offering the change people want. people are feeling quite hopeless about the fact that labour are offering only twixt conservative policies. the greens are here to be a bold choice, offering hope. green mps will challenge labour and people can see how vital a voice that is. we will push for more investment in the nhs, more action on the growing climate crisis, what housing and the right to an affordable to these are the mainstays of things we are hearing on the down step. click on your 30 seconds are up. caroline lucas has been the sole green mp for 30 years. you want four — been the sole green mp for 30 years. you want four mps _ been the sole green mp for 30 years. you want four mps elected _ been the sole green mp for 30 years. you want four mps elected in - been the sole green mp for 30 years. you want four mps elected in this - you want four mps elected in this election. what makes this year different for you? taste election. what makes this year different for you?— election. what makes this year different for you? we have seen our number of councillors _ different for you? we have seen our number of councillors growing - number of councillors growing virtual exponentially they have gone up virtual exponentially they have gone up fivefold in the last five elections. we can see that there are lots of other places in the country ready to elect green mps, and we are focused on four constituencies. we expect to see growth next year and in the next and election after that. when people elect greens they like what they see. when people elect greens they like what they see-— what they see. caroline lucas has been the sole _ what they see. caroline lucas has been the sole chemical _ what they see. caroline lucas has been the sole chemical green - what they see. caroline lucas has been the sole chemical green mp| what they see. caroline lucas has - been the sole chemical green mp and you havejust been the sole chemical green mp and you have just reiterated what we have heard from— you have just reiterated what we have heard from politicians, which is the need _ have heard from politicians, which is the need to _ have heard from politicians, which is the need to push _ have heard from politicians, which is the need to push the _ have heard from politicians, which is the need to push the next - is the need to push the next government. _ is the need to push the next government, which- is the need to push the next government, which will- is the need to push the next government, which will be l is the need to push the next - government, which will be labour if the polls— government, which will be labour if the polls are — government, which will be labour if the polls are right, _ government, which will be labour if the polls are right, for— government, which will be labour if the polls are right,— the polls are right, for bold action for the if labour _ the polls are right, for bold action for the if labour win, _ the polls are right, for bold action for the if labour win, what - the polls are right, for bold action| for the if labour win, what policies you want push them on?— for the if labour win, what policies you want push them on? where they are fallin: you want push them on? where they are falling short _ you want push them on? where they are falling short and _ you want push them on? where they are falling short and issues - you want push them on? where they are falling short and issues people i are falling short and issues people are falling short and issues people are raising the nhs investment, people are worried about the future of the nhs, the creeping privatisation labour say they want to continue with, and the cuts in green investment. those things are coming up strongly. on the water companies, they can see that labour plans on that fall way short of what is needed. we need those companies in public hands, we don'tjust want to stop bonuses, we need to seize those companies and invest what we need so we have clean water and a sustainable water supply for the future. �* , . ., . future. broadly, you want to reduce labour future. broadly, you want to reduce labour does — future. broadly, you want to reduce labour does covered _ future. broadly, you want to reduce labour does covered in _ future. broadly, you want to reduce labour does covered in this - labour does covered in this election?— labour does covered in this election? ~ . . ., ,, , ., election? we are aiming to keep our green seat and _ election? we are aiming to keep our green seat and gain _ election? we are aiming to keep our green seat and gain a _ election? we are aiming to keep our green seat and gain a labour- election? we are aiming to keep our green seat and gain a labour seat i election? we are aiming to keep our green seat and gain a labour seat inj green seat and gain a labour seat in bristol and we are aiming for two conservative seats, so there is a range of different votes. rushanara ali, what range of different votes. rushanara ali. what do — range of different votes. rushanara ali. what do you — range of different votes. rushanara ali, what do you say _ range of different votes. rushanara ali, what do you say to _ range of different votes. rushanara ali, what do you say to sian - range of different votes. rushanara ali, what do you say to sian berry? | ali, what do you say to sian berry? this is going to be serious pressure on labour politicians like you, isn't it, in this election? this election is — isn't it, in this election? this election is a _ isn't it, in this election? this election is a straight - isn't it, in this election? this election is a straight fight. isn't it, in this election? try 3 election is a straight fight between the conservatives and labour and it's a choice about whether people want a change in government, a changed labour party to serve this country and to restore growth to rebuild our economy, our public services, and the greens and independents who are challenging mps are frankly going to damage our chances, if they get a foothold, and where that is the case the public, i hope, will look at what they ultimately want, do they want five more years of conservative government or do they want a change labour government? our plan on green issuesis labour government? our plan on green issues is that we have got very radical plans. we to co—invest with the private sector in green technology as well as decarbonisation. we want to see energy bills reduced by investing. letter shall respond.— letter shall respond. 100% of the olls are letter shall respond. 100% of the polls are saying — letter shall respond. 100% of the polls are saying that _ letter shall respond. 100% of the polls are saying that labour - letter shall respond. 100% of the polls are saying that labour are i polls are saying that labour are going to have a massive majority and people are worried that labour, with all the power, won't live up to what people need. there green plants have already been cut back. people know they are going to be a better government, with greens holding them to account, scrutinising them and giving them a good ideas in our manifesto. that's how greens work around the country. we will be a constructive opposition, the opposition labour needs. by, constructive opposition, the opposition labour needs. a yougov oll this opposition labour needs. a yougov poll this week _ opposition labour needs. a yougov poll this week but _ opposition labour needs. a yougov poll this week but conservatives i opposition labour needs. a yougov poll this week but conservatives in | poll this week but conservatives in third place among voters under 50 with the greens in second. how worried are you they are going to take seats and split the vote? it’s take seats and split the vote? it's crucial that _ take seats and split the vote? it�*s crucial that we get a good, strong working majority, and that's why it's vital that people look at this in terms of which party they want in government, and the labour party has got a clear set of plans both on the green agenda, creating greenjobs, decarbonise our economy, making sure that we meet the climate transition, and we want to turn around our country we want to restore hope and make sure that we are in a better place as a country for the decades to come. let place as a country for the decades to come. . place as a country for the decades to come. , , . to come. let me bring in the liberal democrats- — to come. let me bring in the liberal democrats. you _ to come. let me bring in the liberal democrats. you had _ to come. let me bring in the liberal democrats. you had a _ to come. let me bring in the liberal democrats. you had a deal- to come. let me bring in the liberal democrats. you had a deal with - to come. let me bring in the liberal democrats. you had a deal with the | democrats. you had a deal with the greens, orthere democrats. you had a deal with the greens, or there was a broad consensus in the last election that you wouldn't stand candidates where you wouldn't stand candidates where you might split the vote on the progressive alliance. what about this time? . . progressive alliance. what about this time? , . . , this time? liberal democrat will be standin: in this time? liberal democrat will be standing in every _ this time? liberal democrat will be standing in every seat. _ this time? liberal democrat will be standing in every seat. would - this time? liberal democrat will be standing in every seat. would you | this time? liberal democrat will be l standing in every seat. would you be interested in — standing in every seat. would you be interested in an _ standing in every seat. would you be interested in an agreement - standing in every seat. would you be interested in an agreement with - standing in every seat. would you be interested in an agreement with the | interested in an agreement with the lib dems? taste interested in an agreement with the lib dems? ~ . . ,., interested in an agreement with the lib dems? ~ . . , , , lib dems? we are also studying every seat. we lib dems? we are also studying every seat- we need — lib dems? we are also studying every seat- we need a _ lib dems? we are also studying every seat. we need a better _ lib dems? we are also studying every seat. we need a better voting - lib dems? we are also studying every seat. we need a better voting system| seat. we need a better voting system and the collaboration last time was also about that. we need to get more greens and people properly representing the vote people cost across the country in parliament. that way we can have a modern mature democracy where peoples views are generally represented and i'm happy to work with parties who want that, and i think labour members do want that, so labour should be listening. we will be speaking and scrutinising the different parties on their offers to voters and we will have a range of views and opinions expressed from other guests. i will bet tomorrow at 1215. bye—bye. today at one: a total of 25 years in prison for members of a benefit fraud gang who stole almost £54 million from the public purse. footage of them revelling in the fruits of their deception. the judge said they'd systemically plundered the state's support mechanism. 12—year—old richie parry and his father tom, missing in the scottish highlands — police say they have found two bodies. a child and three adults are in hospital after a shooting last night in east london. is your supermarket�*s loyalty points scheme pushing you to spend more than you can afford? and how the harries — that is, fans of harry styles — can now be guided around the village where he lived. and coming up on bbc news... "i feel at home" — vincent kompany speaks for the first time since he swapped burnley�*s manager dugout for bayern munich's.