tirade. and, calling on the a-list. president biden got some help from a listers in a record- breaking democratic fundraiser in los angeles. we will see how our panel reacts to biden's warning about the supreme court. i will be joined by actress and comedian marsha warfield, known as the unforgettable bailiff, roz, and "night court." she weighs in on the lgbtq+ community by making us laugh as part of a new program called "outstanding." this is the sunday show. good evening. donald trump seems to make a lot of assumptions about the black community. among them, being that we love sneakers and we are sympathizers to convicted felons but perhaps his boldest assumption lately is that the black community has lost its short-term memory. see, trump apparently wants us to believe that when it comes to race, donald trump the person is somehow different than donald trump the president . how else could he go to detroit last night, one of the countries blackest cities, and proclaim once again that he is the best president for blacks since abraham lincoln. keep in mind, trump has previously demoed -- denigrated detroit as a disgrace and likened it to living in hell but now, donald trump wants us to believe he is not the same guy who in the 1970s, was sued along with his dad, by the justice department for refusing to rent to black tenants. and then there was the time when he bought a full-page ad in new york newspapers calling for the death penalty for five innocent black and latino teenagers back in the 1980s after the now exonerated youths were falsely accused of a vicious attack in central park. or, maybe he wants us to forget that he is the same guy who started the birther nonsense and spent years trying to delegitimize the first black president by pushing the lie that president obama was born in kenya and not hawaii. as a huge michael jackson fan, man in the mirror is one of my favorite songs of all time so it's possible that someone could stand up and make that change, except he didn't. remember back in 2017 when president trump and -- he was president then, he declared that there were very foreign people on both sides after a deadly right -- white supremacist rally in virginia where there was also the time he called african nations -- whole countries. i don't even think i can say that on television. he is hardly made a case for black voters support, at least not with the things he has said, but none of that stop trump from watching a black americans for trump outreach group during a visit to a detroit church last night. he was attempting to paint president biden is the one who has the awful record on race. let's listen. >> he's been the worst president for black people. he's been the worst president for hispanic people. there's never been anybody so bad. >> listen, i like a bold argument as much is anyone else but even for me, this is a tall order to believe. we are expected to buy into the idea that trump is better for black people than the guy who actually chose a black woman to be his vice president and who nominated the first black woman to the supreme court? i'm not sure if i'm buying it. but ultimately, it is about the facts and i care about policy and details in these things matter and i believe that you should, too. when it comes to donald trump's on record with blacks in their voting and lack voters, he likes to tell his support for hbcu's and black lives matter. over the course of four years in the white house, donald trump tried to cut the budgets for hbcu's. it was actually congress who provided more funds, not donald trump. and while he does get credit for signing the first act when he was in office it's important to note that was the result of years of activism across the political spectrum before he even took his first see that the resolute deck but still, donald trump is playing the criminal justice card and helping black voters will feel a connection to him because he's a convicted felon. really? while many may think this is not the flex that trump thinks it is, some people are actually buying it. >> the fact that he has these felonies now and they are actually fake felonies but the fact that he has these actually would probably more help his cause because there are a lot of people in the black community who have felonies. >> i'm a former prosecutor. i'm not sure what a fake felonies but this is what we are dealing with, folks. let's not get anything confused. the same guy who claims he is down with the community because he has a mug shot is the same guy who once told police to be more violent when handling suspects, so when it comes to trump's outreach to the black community. remember, there is what he says and then there are the receipts. do with that what you will. joining me now is pastor lorenzo sewall, goes to donald trump's roundtable on saturday at the 180 church in detroit where he served the senior pastor. i want to thank you for being here. he reached out to you, donald trump, that is, to arrange this roundtable, basically to appeal to black voters before the november election. you told voters that you thought it was a joke. talk to me about why you agreed to let him speak at your church in the first place. >> thank you so much for having me. we are a praying people. we are a praying church. i'm so excited to see another black man in the position you are in. for us, because we are a praying people, we believe everyone should come into god's house regardless of politics, regardless of posturing. we want to make sure that whether it is president biden or former president trump or anyone who has power, we want to make sure they can hear the voices of those in 48227 because often times, we are the ones on the menu and we are never at the table. >> pastor, last year i recall reading an op-ed you wrote for you basically touted the infrastructure plan from the biden-harris administration in the context of wanting to strengthen detroit's super information highway, essentially. to provide better access to the digital divide and to lessen that. should we interpret your allowance of donald trump and your -- i don't want to call it adulation but supportive families coming to your church as switching sides in terms of political allegiance? >> well, i don't have a political allegiance. my allegiance is to jesus. i don't worship a donkey or an elephant. i worship the lamb of god that was slain for the sins of the world and anybody that can come to his house and be prayed over, they are more than welcome. obviously, i'm excited about what our current president did as pertains to the digital divide because he is helping our committee. i was so excited that former president trump actually physically came to 48227, a place where women are human trafficked as we speak. a place for our kids can't read, write, nor do math, a place where people are hurting. i was so excited to see the former president there. >> i want to take a look at this video from the congregation and the church during yesterday's event that was really geared toward black voters. when you pull out to see the crowd, it seems like what we are looking at here are more white trump supporters, so was the audience mostly quite? did that message of outreach to the black community actually hit its target? >> to be frank, i was very surprised to was there. there were famous rappers i didn't even know, but my 15- year-old, he knew. i was surprised to be very frank and honest with you, about how many black people were actually physically in the building. i remember walking down grand river, a place that is absolutely desolate, on the west side of detroit, walking down the street and just inviting people, saying hey, the former president is here. if you want to come, come, and they were just laughing like i was when i was first approached, so i walked them through the front of the line through secret service and they were there. in terms of outreach i think is something that quite frankly surprised me, as well. >> that has been pastor lorenzo sewall. thank you for your time. we appreciate you. now with me is reverend dr. wendell anthony, the president of the detroit branch of the naacp and the pastor in detroit at fellowship chapel. thank you for being here. let's start with your take on donald trump's visit to that to try church which we were just talking about along with reverend sewall. what is your take away? >> thank you. obviously, you articulated what needed to be said within your commentary. first of all, it was not an outreach. it was in in reach. you called it right. there were more white folk there than african-americans and the fact he was coming to charge and talk to the african- american community, he did not. it is amazing to me how one can utilize the black church, a sacred institution for your pernicious, perilous bargaining relative to what you want to do to propel your political concerns. it is not a question of coming in for policy. he did not articulate any policy. he articulated the fact that he wanted to come and get some black votes, but where is the policy? we believe in policy. the very community he came to needs education. you just heard the pastor talk about that. they need the infusion of economic development and small business loans. putting your face on a t-shirt, that is not policy. coming in talking about $16 billion for hbcu, that is policy, having an infrastructure bill to create jobs and opportunities in the same community that this pastor is from, that is policy. talking about a policy where people are treated fairly and equitably by the criminal justice system -- trump talked about wanting to end crime. well, why don't you institute the crime bill? why don't you pass the george floyd justice in policing at? that is policy. why don't you pass the john lewis boating rights advancement act? that's policy. talking about what you're going to do with some sort of cracked that plan when you had an opportunity to do, that's frivolity, not policy. holding a bible upside down in front of a church talking about you love the lord when you've never opened up the book to see what the lord says in terms of loving your neighbor as yourself, treating people like you want to be treated -- i was a stranger and you took me in, i was hungry and you fed me. i was thirsty and you gave me water. i was a prisoner and you came to see me. those are policies. that is what we need. we don't need people to stand up on frivolity. we need you to come in and talk about policy. we know what you have done. the question is, if you have another chance, what will you yet do which is not in our interest. >> dr. anthony, i got to stop you before you preach another sermon. you already worked today. donald trump sat down recently for another interview with semaphore and had this to say. i have so many black friends that if i were racist, they would not be my friends. they would know better than anybody, and fast. he told me they would not be with me for two minutes if they thought it was a racist and i'm not a racist. is this an effective appeal to black voters? i know you talked about policy, but at the same time, there is a portion of black electorate members, particularly black men, who feel as though they are not being spoken to. is there a danger that donald trump may appeal to this particular demographic in a way that takes away votes from the democratic party? >> there is always a concern relative to people who are going for the okey-doke, the misnomer, the miscommunications. the fact that donald trump comes in and talks about what he's done for white people, look at the record. by their fruit you shall know them. you just call that what is not done with regards to the central park five. he never apologized. he wanted them to get the death penalty. he is called black people s- whole countries. he has haiti and the congo and ethiopia and the sudan in addition to what is happening in gaza and the relief there, that it is against educational enhancement. he is not talked about a program to assist hbcus. he wants to end social security as we know it . some of the folk in the church, we need to make sure that we look at the records. when you look at the record, it is clear. i think donald trump has a song he likes about oscar brown jr. i've heard him quote it. he talks about a snake that a woman had pity on and she took him in. she took him in and the snake once she took him up fed him, gave him clothing, gave him everything that he needed, the snake turned around and bit her and said woman, you know i was a snake when you took me in. don't fall for the stake because every time you're going to get bit. >> dr. wendell anthony, thank you for your time, and on this conversation, be sure to catch the msnbc documentary special, " black men in america." we explore politics through black -- the eyes of black men in america. this is streaming right now on nbc.com as well as on peacock. coming up after the break, how democrats plan to combat the far right's vision for the future and a potential second term. congressman jared huffman, who is leading the efforts against project 2025, joins me next. later, the maga crowds war on the justice department. how steve bannon another allies say they will go after the house prosecuting the former president. stay with us. you are watching the sunday show on msnbc. e watching the s show on msnbc. i brought in ensure max protein with 30 grams of protein! those who tried me felt more energy in just two weeks. -ugh. -here, i'll take that. woo hoo! ensure max protein, 30 grams protein, 1 gram sugar, 25 vitamins and minerals. and a new fiber blend with a prebiotic. 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>> thank you for having me, and thank you for you and your network talking about project 2025. honestly, the most important thing any of us can do is to take this dystopic agenda out of the shadows of this right- wing fever swamp and just make it known to the american people, how extreme it is and how seriously it should be taken, so congressional democrats are stepping up with this task force to do our part in that regard. >> we are talking about a 1000 page outline sketch for the future of american democracy. i know this may be a tall task, but what is it in that document the concerns you the most around this becoming a reality? >> that is a tougher question than it sounds like it should be, because every part of project 2025 is a wrecking ball towards our government, our democratic institutions, or fundamental rights. i think the piece that disturbs me the most is the explicit extremism embraced in this workplan for the maga right wing republicans, and the fact that there are no longer any constraints. they are just blasting through norms, and it's not even clear that they will be bound by the rule of law as they roll this agenda forward, so we could talk about the sweeping away of the civil service, repopulating the federal workforce with these vetted trump loyalists that are going to be from a database maintained by the heritage foundation. we could talk about eliminating the department of education, rolling the military into blue cities, so many aspects of this are just extreme and dystopic, but it is the explicitness of the extremism and the fact that it is coming from the highest echelons of donald trump's inner circle that troubles me the most. >> in some ways, i feel like democrats have a bit of an advantage here because, as you have pointed out, this is not a secret. you know it is coming. you know this is what the plan from the right is, so instead of being reactive, my question is, what proactive steps -- you have this task force. can we expect to see any actual legislation introduced or being designed to stave off some of the things that we already know are coming out of project 2025 so that we are not reactionary? >> good question, charles. we are going on of