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Symone

about what you are hearing. this sounds like an admission. the former president asked him to reject the electors. here, they are talking about a delay, but this admission is the violence either way. >> this goes back to forming the intent. and i think a lot of focus is on divisive council and the first amendment, but really, all of these come down to intent and mike pence is going to be a witness, if he's an actual witness, comes in, and raises his hand, the oath. >> it seems like the government is relying on that and i would add if you are jacks mitt and you are planning on featuring mike pence so prominently in the indictment, you must know something we don't know, which is that we might get him to come in and testify, after all, you can subpoena him, he is a citizen, like anybody else. he may have privilege claims, but yes, jack smith takes

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The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell

and what the reporting is telling us about what jack smith is developing, using tools that you didn't have, much more powerful subpoena tools, that you didn't have. >> yeah, lawrence, he's exactly following the path that i think we set forth in our investigation, and we put forth to america in our hearings. as you said, he is able to get information that we weren't able to get. we interviewed rudy giuliani, at length. he repeatedly asserted, in attorney client privilege. we would ask him a question, about a particular election fraud claim, specifically, whether or not he had discussed that with the president. he said, well, i can't tell you that. that's attorney client privilege. the special counsel has the ability to push through privilege claims, to immediately adjudicate them, by taking those claims before the chief judge who supervises the grand jury, in the district of columbia where this investigation is taking place. and get a ruling.

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The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell

to america in our hearings. as you said, he is able to get information that we weren't able to get. we interviewed rudy giuliani, at length. he repeatedly asserted in attorney client privilege. we would ask him a question about a particular election fraud claim, specifically, whether or not he had discussed that with the president. he said, well, i can't tell you that. that's attorney client privilege. the special counsel has the ability to push through privilege claims, to immediately adjudicate them, by taking those claims before the chief judge who supervises the grand jury, in the district of columbia where this investigation is taking place and get a ruling. and then the court of appeals only will consider that on an emergency motion for stay. and evaluate whether there's a likelihood of success on the merits with the district court 's ruling. that happens very quickly. the special counsel is availing himself, wisely, of those tools. and getting stuff that was not

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Alex Wagner Tonight

girlfriended though not highly qualified. and here she is two years in about to handle one of the most significant cases in the histors of the country. >> yeah,of neil, can we talk abn the case and what makes it different from most cases and what these thorniest aspects of this are. are the question of executive ec privilege, national security implications, is it just the actual defendant and who he is? i meannd what do you think abou this case is trickiest on its face? >> yeah, there isn't any executive privilege issue. i mean donald trump sees executive privilege in anything, but back in the reality based world in which you and i live, there's noin executive privileg claim in this case. i do think classified privilege claims are difficult and take somecl time. and it's there you really want the experience. fact she's had four prior criminal trials is one thing, but tois really have no prior

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The Situation Room With Wolf Blitzer

also want to bring in cnn's senior political commentator adam kinzinger, and cnn legal analyst carrie cordero. kerry sarah just explained that a judge has already rejected trump's privilege claims. so does the former president have legal standing right now for this appeal can make the appeal and the judge will decide whether or not it goes forward. but look, this has been a losing argument for him again and again , and each time he does it, he's really weakening. what executive privilege is all about, because it can't stand to be for the proposition. that justice doesn't allow the investigation of activities that might potentially be violations of criminal law. so each time he has made this claim to try to keep his former aides from testifying in a valid federal investigation. he keeps failing in that argument, and i don't see any reason at this point. why that would change. adam kinzinger is with us as well. adam you're familiar with these trump aides from your time serving on the january 6th

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The Saturday Show with Jonathan Capehart

speech or debate clause privilege, and if a question or two arises that does implicate that privilege, you can go ahead and assert it. mike pence's privilege claims will fail, he will testify and he has sharply incriminating evidence against donald trump. >> mom glad you bought up the supreme court because trump probably going to try to push the situation to the supreme court. what's the likelihood that justices would step in. is it common for doj to try to break attorney-client privilege? >> it is not all that common. it is actually pretty rare, jonathan, that we will subpoena the criminal defense attorney representing the target of the grand jury investigation. why? because that person will order they really have a robust attorney client privilege to assert. but, when it looks like the client, in this case donald

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The Mehdi Hasan Show

with his position about what donald trump did, because we all sat there with our own eyes, it was an insurrection he sa what his colleagues were doing by continuing to try to clai this is some type of tourist visit mike pence at the time even though he did the right thing at the time and i wa pretty low hanging fruit h knew is unconstitutional to tr to overturn a free and fai election imagine he'd been this passion in fourth right about it at th time maybe mccarthy any others woul have found some courage, and found her spine and actually vanquished don trump for the dictator want to be that he is but they didn't, and here we are. yet certainly does the see like he could've made difference earlier if he wante to jill, pence seems to have no problem issuing this kind of quick criticism, from the stage, from the pages of his book as terry mentioned, yet he still refuses to sit down with the special counsel, these public comments have any impac on his privilege claims.

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Alex Wagner Tonight

january 6th, while he was acting as president of the senate and certifying the vote, it certainly does apply to everything within his knowledge about the events of january 6th. so, i think jack smith will prevail here. and i think it will result in some delay. but, you know, the court seemed to be moving rapidly on some of these privilege claims, and so, one hopes that they can get mike pence before the grand jury and short notice. >> yes, i'll read a little bit of the luttig op-ed, the courts quickly disposed of senator lindsey graham's speech or debate clause, claim requiring him to testify before the grand jury empaneled and fulton county, georgia. and his claim, lindsey graham's claim, was far stronger than mike pence's. in the unlikely event that mr. pence's claim were to make it to the supreme court, it, too, can be expected to take swift action. he sounds like it's not even a question that the supreme court with the ruling of jack smith's favor. do you agree with that? >> yes, i think that's right. it seems like such a stretch. you know, mike pence says, this

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Alex Wagner Tonight

mike pence back on january 6th. and now, to make this bold statement. i think it's right. i mean, you know, mike pence is being very aggressive here, in trying to behind a shield that's intended for legislators to protect him from harassment by the executive branch. you know, it's quite a stretch for him to claim that. but even if it does offer any protection whatsoever, it is not a complete shield from even a hearing before the grand jury. you would have to assert it on a question by question basis, even if there are some things pertaining to his activity on january 6th, while he was acting as president of the senate and certifying the vote, it certainly does apply to everything within his knowledge about the events of january 6th. so, i think jack smith will prevail here. and i think it will result in some delay. but, you know, the court seemed to be moving rapidly on some of these privilege claims, and so, one hopes that they can get mike pence before the grand jury in short order. >> yes, i'll read a little bit

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The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell

even more quickly than expected. the new york times is reporting that special counsel smith has already filed a motion in court to compel mike pence's testimony in anticipation of mike pence's objections to testify the times reports a request amounting to a preventive motion to compel mr. tensed as the monee came before the former vice president had even appeared in front of the grand jury and before any privilege claims had actually been raised in court. joining our discussion now is democratic congressman eric swalwell of california. he served as a house impeachment manager in the second impeachment trial of down trump. and importantly, for tonight, he is a former deputy district attorney of alameda county, california. also with us is glenn kirschner, former federal prosecutor and host of the justice matters podcast. he is a msnbc legal analyst. congressman swalwell, thank you very much for being here. i don't suppose, in your grand jury experience, you had to deal with very many public

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