it's thursday, may 30, right now on cnn this morning, verdict. >> watch the trump hush money. >> jury back to work today and asking for another look at some key evidence. >> justice samuel alito, defiant, refusing to recuse himself from january 6, related cases, and do my hands up and my hey, hey, hey, hey and he just pulled me down a family car jack in their own driveway and it's all caught on a doorbell camera. let's terrifying and elon musk, white house adviser, what might happen if donald trump wins in november right 6:00 a.m. here in washington live look, and new york city on this thursday morning and cloudy there as those jurors get underway with their work. >> good morning, everyone. i'm placing it is wonderful to have you with us. jury deliberations about to resume in donald trump's criminal hush money trial. and we're getting a better feel for what those seven men and five women, women are focusing on how the former president may be preparing. >> or maybe he's just preparing his supporters for about outcome after deliberating for more than four hours on wednesday, the jury is now reviewing four pieces of testimony they requested michael cohen and national enquirer chief david pecker's descriptions of an august 2015 trump tower meeting pecker's phone call with trump in june 2016 about former playboy playmate karen mcdougal and pecker's testimony about not finalizing trump's payment to the national enquirer's parent company for mcdougal's life rights. jurors also asked to read here a portion of judge merchan's instructions, trump seemed to be trying to lower expectations about the pending verdict mother teresa could not be discharged these charges are rigged all thing is rigged. it's a disgrace. and i mean that mother teresa interest charges, but we'll see we'll see how we do okay. >> joining me now to discuss former federal prosecutor, cnn legal analyst elliot williams, tara pulmonary as senior political correspondent for puck. matt gorman, former senior adviser to tim scott's presidential campaign. guys, mother teresa, where we fit mother teresa territory with this president. i mean, they're also hammering this in a memo out this morning from chris lacivita and susie wiles, which tells me this is a kind of a focus political strategy more than illegal one. but elliott, let's start with what we are going to go and hear from the jury later on today here in court, the jury is going to read here, i should say in court later today, the threat that seems to tie these things together for me he is donald trump's involvement in knowledge. what went on and it's great of you to say the for me portion of that because there are things that lawyers might focus on and things that the viewing public that's not lawyers might focus on as a smart consumer of news. >> that's an important question for you to ask. now, it's added let's look at the question of intent and back to this august 2015 meeting to be clear donald trump is charged with falsifying business records in the first degree, which requires falsifying business records to conceal or aid in another crime that other crime here, either being campaign law violations or tax violations in order to prove if any of that you have to prove that donald trump is at the center of it, knew it, put it in motion, are actually engaged in the act himself. this august 2015 meeting is critical to that for prosecutors because they're donald trump is said to have spoken with michael cohen, his former fixer and lawyer and david pecker from the national enquirer, where sort of hatched the scheme as prosecutors allege you've got to put donald trump in the room. that's the room that allegedly he was in and it's clear that jurors are focusing in either direction to be clear, it's not necessarily that they're leaning toward convicting him, but they just want to know what happened in there and it was quite telling that they asked about that specific moment. >> yeah. no, i thought it was really interesting taroko married this mother teresa situation. i mean, they seem to be a look, they may be right that none of this actually matters, right? that's the argument that they're making here. >> this does seem like a classic as if we were going into a debate. >> and i was playing the role of classic political reporter. i would say, oh, they're lowering expectations are saying he's gonna do terrible when actually it's going to be other side that it's all fine yeah. >> i think you're right. i mean, that's exactly what you do. you set expectations, myths verdict is like winning or losing a debate. this is a milestone in a political campaign. shirts, nothing like we've ever seen before, but yeah, whether he wins or loses, that will have a lot to do with how how this campaign moves forward. he has an acquittal. it'll be a huge de for donald trump, as we know, if he doesn't it'll be interesting to see what happens six months from now. i mean, it's a long time between now and when voters go out to vote and whether it's on their topless of priorities, that one of the candidates is a convicted felon or perhaps was charged on a number of counts, but not on, but a query it on others. i think, you know, the jury's clearly taking their time. they're taking this seriously. 34 counts a lot. i covered the john i was trial and they were only six. it was very similar to this trial. it was a six-week trial, and the jury deliberated for two weeks. and in the end, they had a mistrial and five counts and declared him not guilty on one and it took them two weeks to get down to that. it's a lot hanging on, especially when it's political people, when there's like he wasn't even it wasn't even a candidate. you didn't move past the primary. so i just think like we could see them deliberating for awhile. they understand the gravity of this and a lot of material to get through. >> i can't tell you how many people up next did already texted me saying, oh my gosh, like four hours why are they taking so long and oh, my my god, they're still learning where the bathroom is in the building, let alone how they want to decide. juries can deliberate for, like you said, days, weeks. >> yeah. yeah. and i remember we were all just waiting for them to come up with a decision. >> they go back to the judge and they would just every day another question, another concern, another then the judge was like, okay, you have to come back and tell us and it ended up being a hung trial. so i just don't think it's going to be that clear cut. i don't think they're that partisan. i think they're not just sitting there being like, let's just nail into the wall two weeks, hope hope you all are ready ready? >> oh, my god, telegraphy mathematics is right here and a lot of ladakh is vamping. >> but no look, i think when we talked about kind of setting the table had the exact same thought as you, casey. it reminded me of the debate ready laurie expectations. >> and look, i think i've been pretty consistent with this. >> i think that no matter what happens at the end of the day, it's not going to move many voters enlarge either way, pro or con. it might give the biden campaign and talking point, but that's about it but look, i think to one of the things that i'm keeping my eye on as well is look at the jury. it's having trouble with these instructions and shows the general public i think in a lot of respects, their jury pool and a lot is often the voting base. so if they're having trouble really understanding, digging it out exactly what they need to come up with translating that to the voting public and a political campaign is going to be even tougher. >> well, but do you think like a conviction, i mean, it's a relatively simple message. >> yeah, it's a relatively simple message, but it's a matter of will. it actually we move votes and i think according to polls, i've seen, it really doesn't move votes either way. and same thing with it moves acquittal. it wasn't all of a sudden biden voters and i go back to trump. if people are tend to be in their camps, if they move, i think it will be on things like the economy, immigration and abortion eighth, anything anybody who might be swayed by while when he was charged with with a crime, it was still in his camp, but a jury convicted him, therefore, oh my god itself. look at chess people knew what they were assigned might actually matter though in the margins, because if this race is actually decided by a very small group of voters in battleground states that haven't somehow made up their minds already about two people who have already been the office, which is the other thing about all of this, then maybe this will move them. >> they may just feel like this is not something they want to be. they feel like integrity is important to them. >> so i think it could it could sway a few voters in that could be what matters. >> so many swing voters. the most interesting people and all of america, because, hey, i don't know know all alright, coming up next here 2024, we're going to make you donald trump or loser again president biden and his vice president launching their push to try to win over black voters plus justice alito refusing to recuse and continuing to blame his wife for the upside-down flag and what was he thinking? 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>> it's not that his wife accidentally hung up the flag. it was a political symbol and one that was associated with a certain political movement in the country, right there. if that entity has matters before the supreme court, it's something he audit recuse and just congressman raskin in his op-ed wrote he wrote an interesting one in the new york times yeah. >> no, in fact, let's let's put that up here so this is congressman jamie raskin, who's a lawyer, constitutional lawyer, reading this quote, everyone assumes nothing can be done about the recusal situation because the highest court in the land has the lowest ethical standards, no binding ethics code or process outside of personal reflection. the justice department and attorney general merrick garland can invoke too powerful textual authorities for this motion. the constitution, specifically the due process clause and the federal statute mandating judicial disqualification for questionable impartiality. >> so that would be a pretty aggressive remedy in general. and our government, there's always a remedy, there's always a solution, but often it's sort of out there and buried deep in the constitution will be very hard to implement, right? so who knows, i have a hard time believed that you'd ever we get congress to do that. i just brought him up the clearest line for the point i'm making here is he says, quoting john roberts judges are like umpires, which is what john roberts said in his confirmation hearing. john roberts, the chief justice, right. but professional baseball would never allow an umpire to continue to officiate the world series after learning that the pennant of one of the two teams was flying in the yard of the umpires house. >> do we have angel hernandez i'm glad he's fire better way. >> but no look, i think i think this whole thing is ridiculous because especially to as of last week, the appeal to heaven flag was flying outside the conservative bastion of the san francisco city hall. so i think that whole thing is just ridiculous on its face. and look, i take it leads point. i can do. but i think what's become incentivized is you have members of congress who i think have a pretty big incentive to say they feel a reasonable standard because down the line, there's a political goal which is what they want to see recusal, but more importantly, what they want is they want cases involving trump, whatever entity they are on either side on to win. and so i think that's what this is. and he saw it yesterday too, with this rolling stone article going after who jesse's barrett. jesse barrett husband, amy coney barrett, who his clients are. they're trying to set this standard where sowing doubt intentionally. i think in people's minds to create this kind of doubt. so that way down the line, if rulings don't go their way, they can appeal to this sense. well, let me just does not seem to be limited i'm sorry. what i want to say does not let me democrats or more to the point justice this is spouse's clients would never be grounds for recusal unless adjusted, spoken out in that way. i think we're getting lost in this question of what we think of the right versus the left in this country. and if it were a, don't tread on me flag, another, a political symbol from the american revolution. no one would doubt that that was a political symbol. and the point is, the justice was flying political symbols in front of his house. whether we like them or not. well, and i think grounds for recusal, tara, the bottom line two, is that increasingly i mean, 50% of people think that politics motivates justices, while 49% say, well, they're mainly motivated by the law. i mean, it does feel like the court has moved from umpire two something else. >> right. i mean, we're supposed to believe they're just like us. they have domestic issues throwing his wife under the bus, et cetera by at the end of the de they don't follow their own ethics rules and it seems like they've become almost infallible. and that's the problem you hear about alito and his flags. but then then there was hardly in crow who was taking offering major gifts to another justice and even just the fact that they can decide whenever they want to retire from the court whether they're in good health or not, i think people are just starting to lose trust in that process. and of course, the overturning of roe versus wade was a major moment in this country when people felt like the justice took away one of their rights. >> all right, come up next here. biden and trump roll out the red carpet for celebrity endorsements, doesn't make any difference. plus my god carjacked in their own driveway. one of the five things you have to see this morning your assignment with audie cornish. >> listen wherever you get your podcasts first, we did the impossible you age so many of them possible that we completely ran out and now there by the law, cookies, back-end subway at morgan stanley old school, hard work meets ball, new thinking to help you see untapped possibilities and relentlessly work with you to make them real this is the story of the one, the one who believes being prepared is not just a way of life it's how we help everyone stay safe he sweats the small stuff before it becomes big stuff for the one being an unsung hero in a building thankful of everyday heroes is just how he likes it the industrial grade products you need deliver fast, call, click granger.com or stop by great journey for the ones who get it done welcome to the roots of our legacy where excellence comfort and electricity are forever in blue welcome to beyond the mercedes my buck eq suv we're trying to save the planet with nuggets because we need the p