Transcripts For MSNBCW The 20240702

falling out of step with so many public. we have covered this before. it's a huge deal as the republicans face the midterm defeats in ohio, kentucky and virginia. the party is still reeling from that, celebrations where republicans are usually supposed to win. democrats feel emboldened. so, abortion rights groups working in tandem want to seize on the momentum, and make new pushes to protect abortion access and freedom, in states as red as even nebraska. >> protect our rights is an effort to put abortion rights to a vote in nebraska. >> you know, we have seen time and teen again, especially with how just last week, you put abortion on the ballot, and voters will protect their rights. nebraska is no different. >> that was just last night. you see the echo of ohio going into this week, and potentially future elections. it's just a fact if we're following what voters and different people have said in different places, in every election since the supreme court overturned roe when the composition changed with trump justice, the efforts to secure he rights are all undefeated in states red, blue or purple. voters have backed these issues over and over. this is where you see things are sometimes changing. we hear sometimes in politics things repeat so much, you thill they'll never change. but we have noticed something that hasn't yet changed the world, but is changing the rhetoric. some folks are rethinking what they've been doing. >> what an epic failure. >> on the issue of abortion, in ohio tonight, we continue the losing stream. >> republicans can't keep tumbling and bumbling on abortion. we will lose again and again and again. >> now, those were just random clips or voices. they are now that is only part of it. a, it's rhetoric at this point. you heard -- and second, they don't have as for the underlying issue, remember trump had to make a deal with the people who wanted roe overturned. he had to take a list of people he would put on the court, and he did largely choose from that list. there's a coalition here in a long-returning politics. if anything, in the face of these losses in red states, they're talking about doubling down. the truth is for me, i wouldn't compromise on abortion, even if it did mean losing an election. i will never accept abortion. i will never compromise. >> we don't have to waiver. >> there's no middle to be found. >> we had to get roe versions wade overruled. it created a ridiculous unconstitutional license to abortion. but now -- we just have to abandon it, man. >> that's backed by people like senator graham and others who talk about national bans. that's what the hard right wants. and, by the way, since it's gone to the states, no state with a referendum. there's a bit of a -- and also clearly people, including the trump side looking at election next year, where donald trump, according to some of these folks, who want him to win, they think he might lose more over a national ban than even his own trials and other issues. so this is one of the big stories out in the country that affects people's lives, but also will shape a lot of what comes down the pipe. that goes to the wider losing streak. he lost the last election. he needs to find more people to support him the last time. the losing streak is clear. if you go through every time there's been a maga election, i've always reminded folks, yes, he legally won. we follow the rulings and the outcomes of the election. clinton goes 3 million more, then the blue wave in '18. then as mentioned donald trump would need to make up about 7 million-plus more vote to even be close. then, of course, '22, the red fizzle. and then ohio, as i'm telling you about tonight, leading on to other states, where you have these dem wins in '23. if you actually just look at who votes -- i'm not saying if this is good or bad, but reminding people how it actually run -- clear out the hype, propaganda, rhetoric -- these are the years when more people back the democratic candidate. only once in to 04 did more people go to the race and actual ly preferred a republican. it's no surprise that donald trump has a lot of aides and former officials running around saying, hey, republicans, if you have any hopes of running even with biden next year, you have to get off your losing abortion message. will they listen? michael steele, former rnc chair and msnbc analyst is here. the numbers matter, as mentioned. i'm not telling you whether to like them or not, but boy, has it been a losing streak since trump got affiliated back in '16. where does abortion fit in for the party you once ran as rnc chair? >> the interesting thing, in answering the question of where it fits, are the clips coming into the segment. in the first clip you showed, reince priebus and stephen miller, fox news, talking about abortion on election night and afterwards. reince says, you know, we can't afford to bumble and stumble our way on abortion. then you had stephen miller saying we need to know how to talk about abortion. well, what the hell were we doing for the last 50 years? didn't we have a message on abortion over the last 50 years? we started very clearly turn, return abortion, the abortion rights discussion to the states the we laid out the value of the proposition over life, for life. so what's different? ah, what's different is you caught the car. you got what you wanted. you started acting aggressively. you baited and switched the voter. you said, oh, you know, we want to make the case for life, and we want to let the states decide. when the states decide it, particularly the blue states in reaction to how the red states were starting to decide on abortion by criminalizing the womb, by criminalizing travel, by restricting access across the board, by saying no longer 26 weeks, but 6 weeks, or okay, we'll be generous and give you 15, and the public reacted. kansas happened. ohio happened. all of a sudden what they realized is, wait a minute, these red states have a different view than we do as a national party, or we do as special interest on the subject. the second thing i thought was interesting in the second set of clips, you shod the individuals calling for an outright ban, we're done. what did we notice in that clip? they were all men. there weren't women out there screaming, yeah, we want to ban abortion, we want to make it illegal, we want to criminalize it, we want to say you have no right to access in rape or incest or life of the mother. so, you have still these white men -- sort of these young white men from the clips you showed talking about, well, we'll just abandon it outright. the message is not only mixed, but inconsistent with where, in large measure, kansas and ohio have told us the republican party really is. >> we have lauren leader standing by, who is a big person on this issue. no often, michael, but you're here because of your affiliation with the republican parties. >> i understand. i understand. >> to the point you just raised, the men talking, if you want to put it bluntly, and some of the men lying, i want to show before i bring in lauren -- she'll be here after our one-minute break. for folks that watch the show, they know how we do it. talk about men lying, look at hannity versus senator graham. >> democrats are trying to scare women into thinking republicans don't want abortion legal under any circumstances. >> i think we should have a law at the federal level that would say, after 15 weeks, no abortion on demand. >> so hannity says they're trying to scare you. that's actually the truth. michael, i want you on the politics of that, and lauren on the human rights of it all. both of you are here. we're back in one minute. it's also a special friday. we have the jack smith preview, and the elon musk problem, and tonight, hip-hop start li'l durk makes his debut. we're back in 60 seconds. if they continually believe, well, we can adjust or position, people do not trust you. you lied in kansas. you lied in ohio. you tried to rig the system against people, and people have caught on to this. we are back with michael steele, and joining us, lauren leader, cofounder of all in. i hand the floor to you, lauren. >> you also started talking about the math. one of the things you left out is that part of the reason why those numbers look the way they do is women are the majority of the electorate. they turned out in greater numbers in every single election since 1980. when you look at the questions about turnout and what we might expect in '24, we've been polling this since it was overturned. for women voters, obviously for democratic women, but also importantly for independent women, for suburban women, and for frankly a growing segment of republican women in the electorate, abortion is not that it's just on their list of things that matter, it's the number one, most critical voting issue. it is the thing they are voting on. i think when we look at this overall scope of what's on the ballot in '24 and what's been on the ballot in all these midterm election, over and over again the pundits -- especially "new york times," deuce respect, has been keeping publishing these polls, but they've been wrong. when you look at what actually gets people to the polls, and of course for democrats, turnout is everything, what's getting women to the polls particularly is their anger about the rollbacks of abortion rights. what i think we have to keep watching is what's happening in the state legislatures obviously these big refer ren comes, they've been over whelm -- -- what is the next big frontier is what happens in state legislatures. you have a bunch of states with a disproportionately high percentage in the state legislature, and north carolina is a great example of that one -- 70% of voters in north carolina, do not support bans on ace bores. the first thing they did was to restrict abortion rights. look, with due respect to my democratic friends, democrats have not focused on the state houses for many years, and republicans at the same time they were working relent leslie on packing the supreme court and shifting the power dynamics around abortion, they were also filling state house with his pro-life legislators. >> you packet in so much -- >> sorry. >> no, it's great. i wanted your reaction as well, on the so-called double tubal -- michael called it lying -- take a listen. >> we don't need to divide american over this issue anymore. let's find consensus. >> we're better off when everything counts. >> i trust the people of this country state by state to make the call for themselves. >> sexual responsibility for men. >> i'm 100% pro-life. >> if you took them at their word, there were differences. >> i think nikki haley is the only one i'm concerned about. i think she had an opportunity to take a different tack, which really would be to stay leave it to the states, this is a freedom issue, women should have a right to make up their own decisions. instead she equivocated. i think it's a missed opportunity for her, especially if she climbs in the polls they're not tied for second with desantis and i think may start breaking out even more. nobody knows what to do. michael knows this. this has been 50 years of talking points and frankly a lot of funding from the christian right and anti-abortion groups. i think there's a lot of candidates at the state and national level, they literally don't know what to say, because the sands shifted so fast. 50 years of politics having turned upsidedown. >> michael? >> i think that's exactly right. this is why i sort of led off with the point that, you know, we -- for 50 years, we had a message. post-dobbs, we seemingly don't. the reason is because the message was leave it to the states. the states now have it, and the people don't like what the states are doing. there's no counter measure. the reality of it is, for someone like nikki, a way to slide and to hold that pro-life flank while she trying to move to a different space. to your point, the challenge will be if you catch trump, get the nomination, how then will you talk about this issue? to on this issue. the granddaughters and the fact. i'm over on time, which is not my fault, because i have joy and other things coming up, but i want to thank you both for joining me here. we gave it two blocks, because we wanted to get into it. i will tell folks what's coming. now there's mo tapes. elon musk under fire. former president obama, who you may have noticed doesn't weigh in, he's weighing in on this, policing misinformation and lies on line. >> it's perfectly reasonable for the broader society to say, well, man, we don't want to leave that entirely to an entire company. i think we feed to at least now how ear making those decisions, what you might be airportlyfullying through your algorithm and what things you are not. algorithm and what things you are not. the way? get back to the things you love... with fasenra. fasenra is an 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rules they used in prior elections. as for elon musk, he's under fire for amplifying and agrees with something that was posted on twitter which asserted the jewish people as part of this conspiracy theory, are worded in a cabal with horde of minorities with this alliance to go after the rightful white people to run america. that's a summary. and they also have a hate tres in general against all white people. the same user that musk was embracing, there's an implied agreement with the statement that, quote, hitler was right. that's how axios summarizes this. musk responded -- you have said the actual truth. groups and others are condemning this. the white house spoke up, when someone this important does this, hitting musk for basically an abhorrent theory. some advertisers are bolting. musk is doing all of this amid st. the wider concept of maga race baiting, mounting violence in america, and related and important, this spike in anti-semitic incidents and hate crimes. this is yet another chapter since musk has taken over twitter. he blatantly repeatedly attacks free speech, because he's proven to be an opponent of free speech. obama is warning how this will all affect your vote as we go into '24. he's saying this is a time to deal more forcefully online with the misinformation. >> the problem is, right now, let's face it, it's gotten so caught up in partisanship, partly because of the last election, partly because of covid and facts and anti-vax proponents, that we have lost sight of our ability to just come up with some principles that don't advantage one party or another, or one position or another, but do reflect our broad adherence to democracy. >> that is true, and he puts it quite precisely there. this is not a story about technology, or whether you use twitter or call it x, like elon wants you to, or care about elon musk. this is actually a story about people, how do we deal with the world we share, and the facts we need to govern ourselves in a democracy at a time of rising hate, anti-immigrant, anti-blanket, anti-brown, and anti-semiticentiment. this is a special day here on the beat. it's chai day. you see the cartoon, the man, the myth, the legend. you see the flag along with his alma maters. good to see you. >> good to be here. >> you worked on obama campaigns, but what do you think about the way he put that, not a partisan basis, but something more fundamental here. where does that fit into elon musk's hate, racism and anti-semitism. >> it reminds me of a saying from marvel comics -- with great power comes great responsibility. i think what barack obama is saying there, the enormous pow their big tech has in our lives must come with some responsibility. some responsibility to be about stewards of a democratic society. that is completely missing and absent from all our conversations about technology. we seem to be talking stock prices, earnings, and platforms and deplatforming, et cetera. no discussion really of the responsibility of those in charge of these platforms to use them responsibly to better cultivate a democratic society. >> we covered earlier this week how facebook is walking away from already mellow standards, about not lying for elections, for example, that undermine public trust. if you put out directly fraudulent material about an election, for example, telling people to go to the wrong location, or the wrong day to vote, you can go to jail for that, because your free speech rights do not includes interfering with an election. another one is if you continue ads to sell fake rolex watches -- they just won't run the ads, because the tv company and the internet company doesn't want to be on the hook for that. look at this headline, where facebook is backing off -- meta is the parent company -- rigged election claims were not allowed. now they're saying trump and others can go on there, continue to sow that kind of confusion. what do we do with that? >> yeah. i mean, one of the things that whole conversation seems to be about is how much money meta needs to make, or how much meta will make if they push this information. there's no discussion of the responsibility that meta has, as a corporation, as a number one news source in america, which is facebook. >> yeah. >> to push out accurate information to people on facebook. there's a lot of discussion about the rights that people have, rights of free speech, et cetera. those are extremely important. i don't want to undervalue them, but with the rights comes responsibilities having responsibility not to just make money, but they have a responsibility, as we all have to watch our democracy and free and fair elections. >> you put your finger on it. it's literally about ad money. the ongoing elections will take over a years, and they want that ad money. the other big issue is what these intelligence robots will want to be able to do. take a look. >> i think the government as an expression of our democracy needs to be aware of what's going on, those who are developing these frontier systems need to be transparent. i don't believe that we should try to put the genie back in the bottle and be antitech because of the enormous potential, but i think we should put in guardrails around some risks that we can anticipate. >> that's hi summary. in all honesty, chai, i don't think either party has been out in front of this. should the democratic party do more? >> i think that there has been an element of the democratic party that has historically been aligned with silicon valley, we don't need to be anti-tech, i should be very clear about that. we need to be better users of tex, more responsible users ourselves of technology. as barack obama says, it's not putting the genie back in the bottle, it's now once the genie is out, making sure the genie serves the interests of a democratic society, not necessarily the interests of tech shareholders. >> really well put. maybe your old boss is listening somewhere. he clearly cares about a.i. as well. i wish you a great weekend. you too, ari. >> absolutely. good to have you. something i have never said on this program before, we in the trenches relax, li'l durk makes his beat debut. it's a worth while conversation. we sat down together in los angeles, but first, donald trump play playing himself on tape, that's next. playing himself on that's next. in 99% of people over 50. it's lying dormant, waiting... and could reactivate. shingles strikes as a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. and it could wake at any time. think you're not at risk for shingles? it's time to wake up. because shingles could wake up in you. if you're over 50, talk to your doctor or pharmacist about shingles prevention. 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(vo) black friday starts now. turn any iphone in any condition into a new iphone 15 pro with titanium and ipad and apple watch se - all on us. only on verizon. on this friday, we are going to turn to culture. you new nominations for the grammy awards just dropped with nods for big names, rising stars, and lil durk, the chicago-born rapper who helped put drill rap on the map. he's put out a string of albums, with quite raw depictions of street life coming out of chicago. he's also work with some of the biggest rappers alive today, and as you see here, we just sat down for this exclusive interview debuting right now. i asked about had raw, candid lyrics, including recounting seeing his own friends killed and talking to surviving members. i want to share some of it with you now. when we hear "almost heal" is that aspirational or where you hope to get, or where you now? >> i don't think i will never be completely healed, but it's basically me telling the world i'm in a better place. >> something we do on our program is try to listen. i always feel like, when you find people worth listening to -- >> yeah, yeah, keeping doing it. >> they've been doing a lot of listens. sometimes not everyone really listens to all the words. >> yeah. >> so allow me to read this to you, and then we talk about it. on that opening track -- talk at on that opening track -- tells was going on there. >> my cousin died in front of me. you know -- that's a mother's first instinct. she was like going crazy. i talked to her every day. she lost -- and that's one of my favorite aunties. she always called for advice and stuff, but i was kind of lost. even though i've been through it, it's kind of hard to tell a parent like, damn, you know what i'm saying? >> yeah, that's all in your 20s, these people die. >> yeah. >> how do you take that in? how does that affect you? >> i used to go on the internet and like, dang, but people started to make it a joke, a meme. so i just kind of ignore everything, just go behind the doors of my family or my brothers, so just being opening tearing up, or -- >> you felt like even when you were being honest about, say, a recent death, people online or maybe they don't even know you, what, they're trying to make fun out of it? >> it's the world. anything going on in the world, making a meme. so i just avoid it. i just keep it to myself. if i give it through music, i never talk about it. lil durk giving us more background on how he comes to deal with the serious topics in the music. we all know what the internet is like. he doesn't post and share things like that, but puts it into the lyrics and the music. it got a little darker, we kept talking, talked about musical style. there's a lot of people who think about, write about music, who say you've developed this -- pitchfork put this interests. he uses memoir, journalism and fiction to capture life in the trenches, a lens into a deeply american brand of days on. how do you feel when you hear your work described like that? >> i'm going to break it down for another word of trenches, just giving my story. it may sound like that's a lot of movie. it may sound like terror, as long as you give them to me. >> are you surprised that people are so makes sense. >> i feel it's important, though, because they let me know they listen to the music deeply, not just the beat or just listening to the hook. they becoming superfans or really listening to the message. that stops me from saying a lot of goofy stuff in my music and just keep it straightforward and pass the real message off. giving the message or telling you what i seen before. that's why they come get you for you. if somebody want you on a song or want your appearance, they want you for your character. they don't want you to change up who you is. when you do a feature with them, don't try to go in their lane or a lane that isn't yours. stay original, stay you. you level up your sound but still be you at the end of the day. i'm not saying regular abc, but do you. >> do you, and stay you. that's a lesson we can all use from time to time. beyond the therapy and some of that somber talk, we also had some fun. we did our classic "beat" lightning round. we mentioned some of the times we quoted lil durk to describe ron desantis being goofy. our final clip are some of these fun highlights. >> how come you didn't bring a million dollars in cash to this interview? >> for one, we in cali. i don't want them taxing me on it. ♪ she getting cake off the pictures she take ♪ >> i'm going to guess nobody asked this. is drake correct, was she smirking? >> i hope so. drake got his own world. called drake's world. if he said it, he seen it. >> can you explain? >> goofy acting. overdoing your part. you can ask right now, what can i say to lil durk to make my interview way better. >> don't think i didn't. in a word or sentence, chicago. >> good. >> something you called the drake effect. >> culture. >> culture. okay. because you're in the culture. the trenches taught me -- >> how to be who i am today. to survive any place on earth. >> therapy is good for -- >> mental illness, being able to express your feelings when you feel like you got nobody, and relief from your past. >> i thought it was over when -- >> when i started losing friends. >> i knew i made it when -- >> when i picked up a microphone. >> failure means -- >> a second chance. >> success means -- >> success means you made it. >> finally, being healed means -- >> you can never be healed. you can always be in the process of healing. but you can never be fully healed. me, i'm going to say me. >> you can never be fully healed. i love that final thought heat shared after the conversation we had because his point was don't feel bad if you're not 100% healed. take what you have been through. and say it's a process of healing. if you know lil durk, you know why we wanted to sit down with him and his impact on culture. if you don't, that's great because we learn new things through the news. you can pick up any spotify or youtube and search him and find out about his album, almost healed. he's up for a grammy, as mentioned. go to msnbc.com/ari. go to msnbc.com/ari and it will be the top video. 30 minutes, me and lil durk sitting down chopping it up in the trenches. thanks for being here. we'll be right back. back. ucine. headache? 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do you have plans? maybe you dont. because we at msnbc want to let you know there's a new documentary premiering on msnbc sunday, periodical, which tackles many issues surrounding men apos, menstruation, women, issues that aren't always dealt with directly. here's a sneak peek. >> i had such a great experience having a support group. i want that for other people. i want that for girls that look like me, especially. a lot of us don't have the privilege. we don't have the freedom to just know about our bodies. we don't even have the access to just love our bodies. sex ed is not mandatory here in america. schools are not teaching students about periods, even though it's clear they have students who men straight. >> they take a health class, and in that health class, there is units in regards to sexual education. certainly, and as well as they have biology, which freshmen take as well. it's not a specific course in regards to sexual education. i definitely think there are politics at play, and people have a different feeling in regards to menstruation. for us, with happy period, with our programming we're filling in that gap. >> plenty of seating here. >> we're actually going into institutions and challenging them to really be allies for their students. >> does anybody here know exactly what a period is? who knows what a period is? okay, who has a period? oh, okay. so some people who have a period don't know exactly what it is? >> that's just some of periodical, which is debuting this sunday, 10:00 p.m. eastern on msnbc and streaming on peacock. if you're thinking about your weekend plans, go to msnbc.com/ari. msnbc.com/ari, and get our latest videos for free, no paywall, including our lil durk interview. msnbc.com/ari. it will direct you directly to our youtube playlist. thanks for spending time with us. "the reidout" with joy reid starts now. tonight on "the reidout" -- >> you draw your people close to you. so we can hear your voice. so we can hear your

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