this is a film about storytelling. about how we tell the story of our country's past. why do we want to believe one version and not another? maybe because it makes us feel safe at night. there is one episode of america's history that is told very differently depending on who you are and where you live. it is the story of our civil war and what came after. ♪♪ >> the winds of war blew across the land, made of it a country divided. friend turned into foe. brother fought against brother. it was such a long and drawn-out struggle, and the feeling on both sides was so intense. >> we're all just romantics, lost in contemporary times, you might say. every one of us feels we was born 125 years too late. >> to introduce myself, my name is rachel boynton. this is nelson walker. >> hi. >> we are independent documentary filmmakers. we're making a film about how we tell the story of the civil war. we're filming in lots of different schools, and we're going places with a deep connection to this history. >> there is a lot more coming. >> what made you choose the civil war and reconstruction? >> well, you know, america is kind of like a big family that tore itself apart during the civil war. and in order to make peace, we told ourselves a certain story about it. and for a long time, we had trouble telling the difference between that story and the truth. you can ask me anything you want. >> what did you want to do when you were little? and did you have a backup for if you couldn't get that? >> when i was really little, i wanted to be superman. when i got to be a little older, i wanted to be an anthropologist. do you know what an anthropologist is? >> no. >> somebody who goes around the world and studies the way other people live. >> so like this? >> kind of like this, yeah. >> people are having to come to grips with the civil war and enslavement which are the sort of founding bases of the country. >> our country is like a really old house. you may not want to go into that basement, but if you really don't go into that basement, it's at your own peril. whatever you're ignoring will be there to be reckoned with until you reckon with it. >> these voices were all happening on the eve of the civil war. i'm interested in what you think about. i'm interested in who's saying this. and i'll also give you the succession documents from south carolina. where is he from, what he is about, who is he? >> he is a philadelphia congressman, i believe. >> no, ohio. >> i think he is from ohio. so he delivers this when? when is this written? because that's one of the questions i asked. >> december 22, 1860. >> what is he saying? >> he doesn't want succession. he knows if there is a succession, there will be a huge war. >> people will know this war with their own eyes. he sounds scared, doesn't he? >> yeah. >> i think he probably was. what stood out to you in the arguments? >> so our article was presented by alexander stephens in atlanta, georgia. and not once does he talk about slavery, property, and what the war is really about, what they're really fighting for. >> other voices? yeah? >> i notice there seems to be a common idea that the civil war was totally about slavery. i'm going to disagree with that. the south did want to leave the union because of slavery, but the issue of the civil war was keeping the south in the union. so slavery isn't like the entire issue. >> pushback? comments? we will continue tomorrow. you are a thinker. that is for sure. the wedge is the slavery issue, right? i think we're agreed on that. it's just a way of describing it. yeah. good job. go, go, go. >> you're spending a lot of time telling the story of the civil war and reconstruction in your eighth grade class. why? >> because i think we have not adequately, you know, understood who we are as a nation. there is so much of this history that has been way too difficult for this country to look at. the reason it's important to understand this history is because we carry it within us. these things need to be unpacked and looked at and talked about, and we need to decide what we think about them now. it's challenging, but it's where the juice is. >> we call it the war between the states here. we don't call it the civil war. >> why it is important to call it the war between the states? >> because that's what it was. >> that's what it was. >> it wasn't the civil war. >> the war of aggression. the north came down here and invaded us. we didn't go up there. >> my grandmother said they had to hide the food in the chimney because the soldiers came. they'd take everything they had. they'd take all their livestock, any food in the house. it was terrible. and the war took place in our backyard. for the people up north, the war was a distant thing. >> we're both members of the local sons of confederate veterans, and we are responsible for taking care of this cemetery. but i'm afraid when herb and i are gone and our generation, that it will -- there is not going to be anybody around to take care of it. >> or to promote the true history of the 1860-1865 period of time. >> this class that i'm filming, the teacher is teaching the cause of the war is slavery. >> oh really? >> does that offend you? >> yes. >> can you explain to me why? >> because it's not true. you're telling stories that aren't true about my ancestry, about my family, about my country, the south. >> and tell me what the untrue thing is. >> slavery. they are not telling the whole story. slavery was one of the reasons. but for that professor to say that economics had nothing to do with that war is totally false. >> i would have fought for the south. you know why? it had nothing to do with political reasons. it's because my home was being invaded. >> the confederacy lost this war big time. no americans have ever lost a war quite like the confederacy lost this war. white southerners are going to need to process what the meaning of that whole collapse of their society really is. and their explanation of their defeat becomes a narrative. it becomes a memory. it becomes the lost cause tradition. and the lost cause tradition was this argument that the confederacy had really fought for noble aims. the war wasn't really entirely about slavery. it was about defending their homelands, their families, their women. that slavery was not the great issue. that if left to them, they would have handled slavery over time, and maybe even gotten rid of it themselves, they said, which is nonsense. there were alternative textbooks eventually published in the south, and it wasn't just textbooks they were trying to control. it was the stories being widely told in the public arena. and they had a tremendous influence. so what is at stake in the memory of the american civil war is who gets to control this narrative, the story. our financial planning tools and advice can help you prepare for today's longer retirement. hi mom. that's the value of ownership. have fun, sis! ♪♪ can't stop adding stuff to your cart? get the bank of america customized cash rewards card, choose the online shopping category and earn 3% cash back. okay, wait. i got to move the microphone. do you have any questions for me? >> i had one. i forgot what it was. do you consider yourself a radical person? >> am i a radical person? no, i'm not a radical person. i think i'm someone who questions things. i'm questioning the stories we tell. like in your class the story about slavery, right? they tell us something about why we're so divided. do you see us living in a divided country? >> every day. ♪♪ >> the high school creed. i'm the member of the high school family. education first. >> the kids that i have here are determined to not follow in the footsteps of what was in the past. i'm hoping i can spark something in them to say i want to know more. i want to learn more. >> in mississippi, do people talk about slavery as the cause of the war? >> you don't really hear the word "slavery" or "slaves" in mississippi. that was an incidental part of it. i guess the term is whitewash as i told my classes. a lot of time you want to see the good part of the history, especially history that you were part of. and you want to minimize the bad part about it. slavery is not an easy topic to tackle for black or for white. >> so how do you tackle the story of slavery? >> one thing is that the slaves were more powerful than we give them credit for. >> people said that lincoln freed the slaves. but you say actually they freed themselves. why? >> that was a question. >> why couldn't slaves free themselves in a sense before all of this if they freed themselves? >> we did have the abolition. we had nat turner. we had those people who stepped forward. but those people to me were just as brave as the 1960s. probably more brave. >> come on. >> think about nat turner. >> he was slave. >> to make a change, you got to be a little crazy. >> that's it. he caused people to think. he went from plantation to plantation, killing everybody. and he wanted to kill the women and children. he wanted to do that. why? >> you expect for a dude to do that. you wouldn't expect a mother, three kids. he set the right tone. you're going to kill them wise, cheering. >> don't take for granted the lives that were lost. whose brave enough to try and assist him when he is wrong? that's what makes these guys to be heroic. we can't devalue what we did. a white guy whose grandfather was a confederate, and he can keep that memory alive. why can't we? >> in holmes county, i noticed how we had the browns and the williams. we also had caucasian people with the same last night. i always wonder is there a relation between the two? and then i learned that, you know, slaves got their last names from their slave owners. so it's like did this family own this family? or like did they come from -- i always wondered about that. >> there is this enormous history of slavery in holmes county. do people ever talk about that? >> about? >> just the question of the history of slavery here. >> no. >> do you know if your ancestors were enslaved here? >> i don't know. >> would you want to know? >> not really. >> why? >> because i don't want to think about what all they went through for us. >> how come? >> because they are -- because they worked for all their life being a slave and not being treated right. that will just bring me down because they suffered. and i wish somebody could have done something back them that helped them out. >> so you don't want to think about it because it makes you sad? >> uh-huh. >> i don't want to hate people. and i want to hate people based on their character towards me now, not what they did hundreds of years ago, what their family did hundreds of years ago. >> i think white people are afraid it's going to make them feel ashamed. >> i think so too. that's why they're probably -- when they're teaching -- i know i keep going back to the teaching. but that's where it all starts. because i doubt you if a white man would tell his 6-year-old daughter we owned slaves or we did this to slaves, or like i doubt if that happens. >> i think we all should learn the real history, because as black people, we think we know, but we don't. i never met my great-grandmother. and, you know, they don't talk about slavery and the racial desegregation. they don't talk about it. >> would you want to ask her about it? >> i would. but i wouldn't. i think she would say she don't know to avoid the conversation. >> and why do you think she would want to avoid the conversation? >> it might hurt her. she might feel mad about it. >> it's hard to talk about things like that. >> yeah. ♪♪ >> it's personal around here. we're in a southern city, and we're talking about the civil war. and i'm going to have students who are pulling for the confederacy. i was that student. i pulled for the confederacy, because they're southern. i'm southern, right? and it's not about slavery in your mind. it's just like it's the cowboys versus the redskins and you want the cowboys to win the football game, right? that's what it is in their head. so when you throw slavery in there, it complicates it. it's not a football game. this was real. most history classes we teach that the winners write history. the civil war, the losers end up writing the history. when we look at southerners and how they tried to twist the narrative of what happens, i want us to put ourselves in their shoes and look at why. if you can teach empathy when it comes to history, i think it's such a powerful thing for the rest of your lives. >> all right, boys. in your packet, turn to new perspectives on slavery. what we've got here are statistics about slavery. and i want you to talk about what jumps out at you. >> it says about like 1.1 million southern white families owned no slaves, and only about 350,000, a little over 350,000 owned slaves. that's only a fourth or a fifth, which is actually a pretty crazy statistic. for a handful of people to have one to five slaves probably around the household, probably would have been treated pretty well. >> well, it depends. >> of course the southerners were trying to -- i mean, they weren't treated like regular humans, but they took care of them because they were a way to make money. >> correct. it's an investment. that's my money. i need to take care of my money. i want that to keep producing more money for me. therefore i take care of it. and i don't take care of it and provide. it's still a dirt floor they sleep on, you know. it's still i'm working them 10 to 12 hours. it's not -- let's look at 210. whips per person. in the south, where was the wealth? so owning land and owning slaves. if i invested $23,000 in something, i don't want to beat it to a pulp, right? so why did they do it? >> fear. >> fear. you hit on it. that's the word. here is what american slavery is about, money and fear. they're making lots of money and they are terrified of what happens if this goes away. what happens when people talk about abolition and emancipation? what do i start picturing in my head? >> getting lynched. >> yes, retribution. they're going to come after us. so you can look at it and say you know, this situation is not great, but i don't want to get lynched. i don't like people throwing rocks through my windows. k. 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( ♪♪ ) we're still going for that nice catch. we're still going for that sweet shot. and with higher stroke risk from afib not caused by a heart valve problem, we're going for a better treatment than warfarin. eliquis. eliquis reduces stroke risk. and has less major bleeding. over 97% of eliquis patients did not experience a stroke. don't stop taking eliquis without talking to your doctor as this may increase your risk of stroke. eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. don't take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. while taking, you may bruise more easily or take longer for bleeding to stop. get help right away for unexpected bleeding, or unusual bruising. it may increase your bleeding risk if you take certain medicines. tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures. the number one cardiologist-prescribed blood thinner. we're going for it. ask your doctor about eliquis. the violence. police officers pointed guns into crowds of young people. it was shocking to me. why are we still in a war in this country over race? slavery, it lasted 200 years. you have to develop a psychology on the part of the white people who were doing this that involved enormous acts of denial. we haven't even claimed it as the horrific system that it was. >> she says slavery is the cause. and so many white people that we hear say don't talk to me about slavery. i didn't own slaves. my parents didn't own slaves. >> the cultural conditioning that began in slavery has continued. the privileges that you see that some white people goes back to i'm better than you. >> why, why? why are they better? >> oh, i don't believe it. >> i know. but why do they think they're better? >> privilege. privilege has told them they're better. >> they don't even know they're privileged. i remember a book i read in seminary -- >> i'm glad they don't know they're privileged. >> well, i serve a congregation of overeducated white people who don't recognize their privilege. they don't see that you start that -- >> if you don't feel that you are privileged, how do you account for the differences between white people and disadvantaged black people? >> they're not comparing themselves to black people, right? my white friends are mostly comparing themselves to other highly educated well off white friends. >> but when you say white people can't get it, i don't buy. >> i don't know they can't get it. they don't get it. >> since the '60s, i have been proving myself, and there comes a point in life when you say i'm done. it's on them now because i know i'm okay. so the way i look at it is your loss. i don't intend to spend all of my life proving to white people that i'm okay. >> don't prove it. i think you got to educate them. >> no, we don't. >> well, what i'm saying is nothing wrong with having conversation. >> last night i was at this dinner. there was this conversation about slavery being the source of our racial problems. the topic of white privilege came up a lot, the idea of white people have advantages in this country. yeah, advantages, or you could flip it around and say black people have disadvantages in this country, simply because of skin tone. >> i feel like it kind of goes both ways. sometimes white people have a disadvantage. i had a friend a couple of years ago, his gpa was 4.26. and his friend was black that had a 3.933. and they both applied to princeton, and the black kid got in. everyone says well, there is a lot of white privilege so we have to give other ethnicities advantages in this place instead of trying to view everyone as an american. >> not talking about the race issue. just not bringing it up to the next generation would keep them natural in that sense and they would not be racist. >> i don't think that slavery and the civil war and jim crow should be forgotten. i think that they should be remembered because they're an important lesson that america isn't perfect and to work against that in the future. >> if you look at things like the incarceration rate for young black men in this country and why it's so disproportional or why you have the socioeconomic situations you have between, say, white people and black people, that you can see this didn't come out of nowhere. this isn't a reflection of the tone of somebody's skin. it's based in history that goes back before your generation, before my generation, before my grandparents' generation. it goes way back. >> i think there is a balance between like recognizing our past, but also not overtalking it and overemphasizing the problem to where it's always on our minds. it's difficult to be very equal when something is always on your mind is racism and things like that. >> so please welcome dr. kelley carter jackson. [ applause ] >> so first off, i want to tell you a story about one of my students. he raised his hand and he said "who is harriet tubman?" and i was oh my god. i tried really hard as a professor, you have to fix your face. before i could answer the question, he goes oh, i remember. she's the woman who wouldn't get off the bus. and i was no, no, that's not her at all. but it's important because i think it highl