Transcripts For MSNBCW Jose 20240701 : vimarsana.com

MSNBCW Jose July 1, 2024



diaz-balart. right now inside a delaware courtroom, jury selection is underway in the high stakes criminal trial of president biden's son hunter. hunter biden is facing three counts tied to allegations that he lied about his illegal drug use when he purchased a firearm back in 2018. he has pleaded not guilty. this case focuses on a time of personal turmoil for the president's only surviing son who has been open about his addiction to drugs and alcohol particularly in the wake of the death of his brother beau. it's another trial at the center of the political universe coming days after his father's opponent and presumptive republican nominee donald trump was found guilty in his first criminal trial. mike memoli is outside the courthouse for us. joining us dave aronberg, state attorney for palm beach county, florida, and michael zeldin, former special counsel to robert mueller. mike memoli, take us inside that courtroom. how is jury selection going so far? >> reporter: well, ana, the first step in this historic trial, the first of course to ever involve the child of a sitting president is to select a jury. so far we see that the judge is pretty quickly processing through the pool of potential jurors about a majority so far have been qualified, not yet seated but qualified to potentially serve on this trial. as you talk about this unusual backdrop of a campaign environment under which both this trial and the former president's most recent trial of which he was convicted last week, you see that in some of the reasons why some jurors have been removed from the potential jury pool so far. several have cited potential political opinions for which they would not consider themselves potentially being able to be fair, one cited gun ownership as a god given right. another was asked in one of the questions these jurors or potential jurors are being asked about is whether they believe hunter biden is being processed because he's the son of the president or whether there are prosecutions made for political reasons. one of the potential jurors who was struck said that you see an example of that in donald trump's trial last week. so that speaks to the way the politics is affecting this potential jury pool. the other thing that's unusual here, ana, that i find so interesting, we talk about donald trump's jury, the challenges of seating a jury who could be impartial about a former president in the city of new york. well, this jury pool includes the entire state of delaware, a state that president biden as a senator represented for 36 years, as vice president of course eight years and now as president for the last four is a well-known figure. the entire family is a well-known figure in this small state both politically and geographically. one of the potential jurors who was qualified actually noted that she had served as a bartender, the president's brother-in-law jack owens who happens to be sitting in the courtroom. one of the clerks mentioned they had a family member in the jury pool. this is such a small state politically, and so that's affecting the nature of this process. so interesting so far, ana. >> it is interesting. we know jill biden, the first lady is also in the courtroom, ashley biden, hunter's half sister. what do prosecutors need to prove and how difficult might that be? >> they have to prove that he lied when he purchased a gun, that he was a drug user and that he denied that when he signed the atf alcohol, tobacco and firearms form that allowed him to buy the drug. they have to prove he was a drug user during this time period, that he knowingly signed the false statement because of his addiction and that he obtained a gun. it's not that complicated a case. j. >> dave, we know jurors have been asked questions such as whether their views on the 2024 election could impact their service as a juror, or whether they believe hunter is being prosecuted because he's the son of the sitting president. how do both sides ensure that potential jurors aren't coming in with any political motives or influences as a result of donald trump's conviction last week? >> ana, prosecutors and defense lawyers are pretty good at vetting jurors. it's not looking for a blank slate, an empty vessel. you just want people who can set aside their biases and just follow the facts and the law. so i've had some high profile cases down here, and we've always been able to get a jury. i do think it is ironic that some of the jurors that the prosecution wants to get off the jury are nra gun lovers, people who believe that a gun right is an absolute right. those would naturally be more republican jurors, people who would be antibiden, but in this case they'd be for hunter biden because they would be appalled that the government is ever prosecuting anyone for buying a gun, even if that person was an alleged drug user at the time. >> mike memoli, this trial is centered around what was a deeply painful time for president biden who happens to be spending part of the day just miles from that courthouse, first lady again in court today. what are the conversations at the white house about how to handle this trial? >> reporter: yeah, it's so interesting, ana, you mentioned the show of force that the family is making inside the courtroom, the first lady here arriving just as the deliberations were about to begin, hunter biden's sister ashley also in the courtroom as you mentioned. you saw this statement from the president also released just as this was beginning in which he talked about the fact that he as the president of the united states is not going to weigh in on ongoing legal cases but as a father, he said i have boundless love for my son. he talked about how much our family has been through together and that he and the first lady are going to continue to be there for hunter and our family with our love and support. ana, the last time the president and the first lady were here in wilmington was just a few days ago with hunter to mark the ninth anniversary of the death of beau biden. you can draw a direct line the ways in which the death of beau biden in 2015 affected the entire family, but especially hunter, leading him as he himself has discussed into drug addiction. and so that is certainly going to be a part a of this case. in terms of the political impact, i think we see in the trump verdict as we're unpacking what that might mean for voters, the bigger question among those close to the president is what will the impact of this trial be on the president himself. he is a father, he is obviously the president at the same time, and as the president and as a candidate, they say this is not impacting him. but as a father this certainly will be. as we see, the president will be traveling overseas later this week. he will be overseas for the majority of this trial as it gets underway. the family wants to be there in person with hunter on this, the opening day of the trial. >> and the president also saying in his statement how proud he is of where hunter is today and who hunter is today talking about his resilience, his strength, all of that, how he's faced adversity and come through the other side. michael zeldin, the judge has already given prosecutors the green light to use portions of hunter biden's memoir. what difficulties could this pose for the defense when prosecutors can use hunter biden's own words against him? >> we saw that in the trump trial, did we not? they are going to use this book to say this admission, if you will, in the book as to his use of drugs during the time that he made the purchase is essentially direct evidence out of the mouth of hunter biden that he was drug addicted during this time and that he purchased a gun. now, it's relevant, but i don't know that it's dispositive of the case because in this case there were two forms that were filled out, one which was signed by hunter biden. and it seemed as if the trump -- the gun dealer then filled in a form, and there's a question about who checked the box as to whether he was a drug user at the time. and so there's a very technical defense at abbe lowell who's a terrific lawyer will try to mount besides the very sympathetic view of hunter biden that i think will try to be a jury nullification implicit defense in this case. >> yeah, let's talk more about that, dave, because jurors could be sympathetic to someone who has struggled with addiction, particularly someone who's been so open about it. how do lawyers handle that? >> i agree with michael, i think this is a pretty cut and dry case, perhaps the best chance that hunter biden has is through what's called jury nullification. that's where you get to the sympathies of the jury, and you have just one juror perhaps that says i can't send this guy to prison. i'm not going to go along with the prosecution, even though the evidence and the law dictates it. it's always a prosecutor's biggest fear. it's our nightmare because although they're not supposed to do that, they're supposed to follow the evidence and the law, it does happen, and they do go rogue. and yes, biden's own statements, his text messages will come back to haunt him because he did text around the time of buying the gun that he was smoking crack down the street in wilmington. and so that's powerful evidence. and when he says, you know, i just came out of rehab. i didn't feel that i was still in the throes of addiction, well, your own words at that time will come back to be used against you. so perhaps jury nullification is the best defense they have. >> dave, prosecutors also plan to use some of the data recovered from the laptop that hunter biden allegedly left at a delaware repair shop in 2019. how could that serve their case? >> well, all the words that hunter biden has said whether through text messages, e-mails, that can be used against him. the stuff from the laptop that the republicans like to crow about, about so-called business dealings, that's not coming in. that is not part of this trial. this is all about the purchase of the gun while he was in addiction, and so anything he says at the time that shows that he was in the throwing of addiction around the time he bought the gun is fair game. that's where you'll see it from the laptop. >> michael zeldin, potential witnesses include hunter's ex-wife as well as hallie biden who is beau's widow, also had a romantic relationship with hunter among others. >> really just interested in the text messages and the book and things of that sort. those are words out of the defendant's mouth. i'd be surprised if hunter biden himself takes the witness stand, it will depend on how abbe thinks the case is going. the others will talk about hunter biden broadly in this time period. remember, he has to at the time of the purchase been a drug user. if they can say during this time period he was using and there is evidence that he was in remission, out of remission, sometimes in denial. all of that stuff undermines the broad notion that the other witnesses will bring that he was generally speaking a drug user. so it's really the stuff out of biden's own mouth at the time of the purchase that i think will be the most compelling prosecutorial evidence. >> dave, do you think hunter biden might testify? >> oh, that's the big question. you know, i think he will because i think he can reach the jurors as a human being, as someone who has faced darkness and come out on the other side. i think he wants to humanize himself in front of the jury. and if your defense is going to be jury nullification, that's when you have to do. you got to put on a sympathetic figure on the stand and let him look the jurors in the eye and plead to them as humans and not as just anonymous jurors who are going to decide his fate. >> just quickly as you will, we talked so much about the risk if trump were to take the stand as an example. do you see it as a risky move to put hunter biden on the stand? >> it's always a risk, and we prosecutors generally like that. prosecutors are good at exposing the weaknesses of these witnesses, of these defendants. but here, if your plan is just to reach the jurors as fellow citizens, as humans, as parents who may have experience with family members going through addiction, then, yeah, i think you do need to take the stand. that's why i think it's probably 60/40 he does take the stand. >> mike memoli, dave aronberg and michael zeldin, thank you all. we'll be watching closely the developments out of that courthouse today. turning to donald trump's legal trouble, we'll play for you what he thinks about that prospect. dr. anthony fauci on the hot seat this morning over the origins of the coronavirus. we'll tell you what's happening right now on capitol hill. and mexico makes history in a ground breaking election, how that could impact border policy here in the u.s. we're back in just 90 seconds. 90 s , power e*trade makes complex trading easier. react to fast-moving markets with dynamic charting and a futures ladder that lets you place, flatten, or reverse orders so you won't miss an opportunity. e*trade from morgan stanley here's to getting better with age. here's to beating these two every thursday. help fuel today with boost high protein, complete nutrition you need... ...without the stuff you don't. so, here's to now. boost. if you're looking for a medicare supplement insurance plan that's smart now... i'm 65. and really smart later i'm 70-ish. consider an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan from unitedhealthcare. with this type of plan, you'll know upfront about how much your care costs. which makes planning your financial future easier. so call unitedhealthcare today to learn more about the only plans of their kind with the aarp name. and set yourself and your future self up with an aarp medicare supplement plan from unitedhealthcare. this morning president biden is congratulating the first woman to be elected as the future president of mexico. claudia shanebaum, a climate scientist, the former mayor of mexico city will also be the first mexican president of jewish heritage. early results show her winning up to 60% of the vote over her opponent, and this election will not only have major consequences in mexico, but it could also impact us here in the u.s. president biden saying in a statement, in part, quote, i look forward to working closely with president-elect sheinbaum in the spirit of partnership and friendship that reflects the enduring bonds between our two countries. let's get to guad venegas live in mexico city. and standing by nbc news homeland security correspondent julia ainsley. guad, tell us more, who is claudia sheinbaum, and why did voters choose her as their next president? >> reporter: ana, i should start off by saying that president biden will be able to have conversations with her in english, something he could not do with current president manuel lopez obrador. sheinbaum is fluent in english. she lived in the u.s. for some time while taking classes at berkeley and stanford. as you mentioned, she's an academic. she has a ph.d. in energy engineering, which gives a lot of hope to mexicans that will place a lot of focus on climate change here, and on issues with energy, the cost of power, the cost of gasoline, so we expect her to focus more attention on how mexico can move forward with the issues, sometimes with gasoline prices going up and also the cost of energy. let's hear from sheinbaum last night when she spoke to her supporters. >> reporter: sheinbaum speaking to all mexicans but also sending a message to all women in mexico. we know that today the news of her being elected is going around the world, the first female president in mexico in the country's 200-year history. last night you could hear her saying all women arrive at office with her together. as she said we came here together, also sending a message saying mexico will work closely with the united states. there's a lot they will have to negotiate like immigration policy, also the economy. remember that mexico and the u.s. not only share a big border, but they're also each other's large trading partners. >> to see a woman elected president in a country like mexico, we know machoismo is a big part of the culture, one more note to how historic this election is. julia, what does it mean now for america's relationship with mexico? >> it couldn't come at a more important time, ana. as you know, we're expecting to hear as soon as this week something on executive action having to do with the southern border, and this policy, as we understand it, will rely heavily on mexico, to do even more than they've already done. over the last years we've reported at nbc, the previous administration more than tripled the number of interdictions of migrants going north, most of those u.s. bound, and now they could be asking mexico to do even more to take back migrants who won't be allowed to cross the u.s./mexico border. we know that in mexico they have repeatedly said under the lopez administration, they will work with whoever. we do understand from people within the biden administration that there's really been a change in the way mexico has been dealt with, really a 180 from trump to biden. the biden administration said they treat mexico like a sovereign equal and they go into these conversations about immigration, about fentanyl, about gun trafficking, something mexico's really worried about. guns coming illegal from the united states. they're entering those conversations, treating them as equals, not putting pressure on them over trades and tariffs, just like the trump administration did, and not using some of that really charged rhetoric that trump did about mexico when he was president and even currently. so this is a good -- this is welcome news for the biden administration to be able to keep really a very similar administration in mexico going from lopez obrador to the sheinbaum administration because they are so closely connected. the biden administration would like to continue to do that work. >> the criminal gangs, the drug cartels, guad, obviously top of mind for a lot of mexicans as they went to the polls. this election cycle has been riddled with violence from september to may, 34 political candidates or aspiring candidates were killed including three mayoral candidates just last month. what's going on there, and why are these political candidates being targeted? >> reporter: ana, when you look at that report with the 34, that will update because there were more killings this week just leading up to the election. so this is a case, according to experts of organized crime gaining more power in local municipalities. you have to look at mexico's two different parts of the country. the large cities like here in mexico city, guadalajara, the city of monterey have good protection, and we didn't see a lot of violence there. the violence took place in the rural parts of the country like wacha ka, areas where organized crime has slowly worked to get control of local governments. so a lot of the people involved in local elections are the ones that were the victims of this violence. so the new president of mexico, sheinbaum will have to work on figuring out ways to fight the criminals, to fight these organizations that we used to call cartels. experts are no longer calling them cartels. now they not only work with drugs, they also get money or make money from smuggling migrants and also from businesses that they have at the local level. it will be a big challenge moving forward for the next president as they deal with an increase in violence we've seen in mexico over the last few years, ana. >> julia, in terms of the human trafficking and the migrant smuggling that guad just referenced, you mentioned the potential executive action to come as soon as tomorrow at the border and president biden's plans, what do we know about the potential plans he

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