four think biden doesn't have the mental and cognitive health to serve as president. the poll was immediate conducted two days after the debate. it's margin of error is 4.2 points. but this is a seven point increase in the number of registered voters who have those specific doubts about joe biden on june 9. to counter the negativity, top biden supporters hit the airways today to stand by their candidate. i have spent time with joe biden. i can tell you that not only does he have a tough mind, but he has a tender heart. that is what you need in a president. donald trump has an ego. >> joe biden has confronted and has to come back from tragedies and trials and tribulations throughout his entire life. the moment we are in right now is a comeback moment. >> joe biden's decision to go forward is a decision we will all embrace because of the record he has and the performance that will come with it. >> for their part the campaign staff took a more abrasive approach to countering worries about joe biden. on saturday the campaign chair put out a memo stating that biden could still win and pointed to the $27 million the campaign raised after the debate. as for the polling, she stated, "if we do see changes in polling in the coming weeks, it will not be the first time that over blown media narratives have driven temporary dips in the polls." following that logic it's not because of his debate performance but because of the overblown media coverage. meanwhile in a fundraising email, the deputy campaign manager tried to reassure supporters by saying that the bedwetting brigade and they mentioned ammunition for this to deal with what they called your panicked aunt or maca uncle or some self-important podcasters. is that the best way to address supporters with legitimate concerns about biden's candidacy? maybe or maybe not. is the biden campaign dean defiant? probably or in they -- are they in denial?'s joining us is our panelists and a public scholars a fellow from the city of new york. tim, you are the card carrying member of the podcaster bedwetting brigade and do you want to respond to biden's attack on your integrity or more important on their spin? >> i don't know. he may have been attacking me. he didn't say. i will say this. we come from the same place to start with. which is that we passionately don't want donald trump to be the president in 2025 and a second trump term would be in absolute catastrophe. i think the bedwetters are motivated by that angle to keep trump out of the white house. to me, i think if you are watching this or in the biden campaign or a podcaster or a guest anchor on msnbc and are not bedwetting right now, i think you are deluding yourself. donald trump was winning this campaign before the debate. the reason why joe biden's team asked for an early debate in june was because they wanted to reframe the narrative, remind people about donald trump's extreme views and demonstrate that joe biden was up for the job. they failed on that. because of joe biden's performance and not because of the media coverage. right now, we are in a situation where trump was winning and biden had a terrible debate performance and trump is still now winning and we will see by much in the l coming weeks. we should be bedwetting. the biden campaign should be in figuring out if they are going to stay the course or what they will change in order to change the trajectory of this race so we can keep donald trump out of the white house. it's pick up on that. as far as tactics go, is this a smart one, to reassure people who do have legitimate concerns by saying, look, this panic isn't happening -- helping. it will cause more harm than we currently have inflict it upon ourselves. it should stop. or should they be more candid and upfront and acknowledge the debate performance and the severity of the problem they have created? >> they have to do both. i don't know why they agreed to a debate. we know that donald trump is quick on his feet and often qu times debate is about style and not substance. also most people don't change minds once they like -- watch a debate. this one made a lot of democrats quite nervous. where do we go from here is the larger question. i believe in playing with the cards i have. if indeed joe biden will stay the course and the democratic party will stick with him, they need to have some frank cover solutions with voters. i think some of the angst we need to be honest about is that some people don't want to see a black woman, the vice president, ascend as the president. that is a hard conversation for some people. and to see how long in the tooth that joe biden looked the other night at the debate is a question and they need to reassure voters consistently. he had a great performance the next day in north carolina which was with a teleprompter that many people pointed out. so getting out there and showing voters he is capable of doing this job, we don't talk enough about the fact that joe biden has been honest and on a debate stage it can slow things down. let's put them in an element . where people feel confident that he could actually do the job for four more years and he is the oldest u.s. president we have seen. people are nervous and rightfully so but incumbent upon the entire administration to assuage those fears. but not just get to november 5 but saying he can get the job done once he is in a second term. >> the times reporting that biden family is urging him to stay in the race and keep fighting during the retreat they held this weekend and the times is reporting, one of the strongest voices imploring mr. biden to resist pressure to drop out was his son hunter biden whom the president has long leaned on for device. and putting aside what you think of hunter biden, the family has an outsiders role in the future choices that the president will make and if they are planning to stick this out, what could they do to change the trajectory. yes, putting him out there morning on teleprompter specific environment may be the answer, but that seems to be the thing he can do the least. >> yes. and if he can't do it i think maybe we should be having a hard conversation and by we i guess maybe the pro-democracy movement but more specifically the top officials of the democratic party and the democratic family have an honest conversation about this. hunter biden's opinions and vibes and the fact he wants his dad to defend himself, i get it. i was there before jeb bush was deciding whether he was going to drop out or not and they were family members who wanted him to stay in but no path to victory. you have to make a hard choice in these situations backed by data and backed by the reality of the presidents ability. let's see what the data says and coming up this week the poll was 72% of people thinking he isn't cognitively able to be the president which is alarming and let's see what the swing state data says and let's have a conversation if they come out of that and say, joe biden needs to stay in this race. he needs to be out there. it is confusing to me that he wasn't doing interviews today and all of those clips you showed was from nancy pelosi and others and he did have that good event on friday in north carolina. he hasn't done an interview since the debate on thursday. that is totally not what you would expect a team to do if they needed to change the narrative. back when i was doing campaigns if we had a night as bad as that, we would've had the candidate out there the next morning and change the narrative and do interviews and go on the today show or 60 minutes or whatever going on fox maybe. he hasn't done that. >> he did have a wphoto shoot with annie leibovitz at camp david but putting that aside let's talk about something you mentioned, kamala harris. we are in this weird moment where we are openly talking about potential replacements for joe biden should he choose to drop out but no indication he will do so. in fact we have been told he will stick with it. we hear names like gretchen whitmer, raphael warnock and others and every time he was g out there seeming to bypass or ignore the obvious choice to replace biden on the ticket would be vice president harris and not because she is vice president but all the money raised could really only go to her anyway. so you alluded to this. what you think is going on? will voters be offended by the fact she isn't being talked about in a more serious way as a potential biden replacement? >> listen, we need to have some real conversations about what country we live in and we know that black women have been the keepers of democracy in the democratic party for quite some time, but we do know that the vast majority of voters across the political spectrum have a real issue with black female leadership and there is a reason why there has never been a black female governor in the history of our nation and only two black female senators in the history of our nation. executive leadership has been a juggernaut in our country and has she done a steadfast job in the last three years serving the country? absolutely. the fact we start conversations about gavin newsom and gretchen whitmer and pete buttigieg, all fine public servants, but they aren't the vice president. we have to look at the data as tim said and be honest that white women vote for the publican party by and large and have consistently done so in the only two times that white women have voted for the democratic party candidate is 1964 and 1996. c having a black woman at the top of the ticket doesn't seem like it will move the needle. there is this intersection of race and gender that has always been through glaringly obvious things and it's about everybody else but not the woman who is been literally doing the job in the white house next to the president. >> thank you so much. i can't let you leave yet. next, donald trump keeps mentioning black jobs. what is he even talking about? 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>> there is a small segment of the population is obviously feeling the brunt of inflation and scared about the future. this is donald trump low hanging fruit way of trying to exploit some of the ■ç dissatisfaction that black voters have with the democratic party and have had for a long time. there is a certain segment, party capture, where you don't have another party to go to but talking to voters in florida or arizona and definitely this sense of why is it that other groups are getting things that black voters didn't necessarily get? donald trump is exploiting that and he is always been best at trying to divide people. this is his latest tactic and i do agree with simone fully and i am unclear about what a black job is and there were some great things on the internet trying tó çexplain that but at the core of moving beyond the means and jokes, it didn't get who donald trump is which is this divisive character, who has a strong view of who he thinks the blacks are and immigrants are and he doesn't respect either group. for him it is easier to pick them against one another as opposed to really putting towards -- forward policy issues that helps either group of which he has none. he did nothing when he was president. he takes credit for a lot of things but he actually didn't help the economy or hbcus or veterans and he wants to erase the federal government of which there are many black jobs there and many black people working in u.s. jobs for the federal government. there are a lot of ways to move past his divisive rhetoric and hear what he is saying and how he thinks about all of these groups, which isn't very kind. and it hasn't been. >> to piggyback on this, trump isn't a very consistent person, but i would say the ■çone consistent thing that he has brought to politics is he has demonized migrants. this goes to that essentially with him stealing jobs from other constituencies and can you talk a bit about how that has kind of been the undercurrent of all of his things going back to 2016? >> trump has this lizard brain hatred of foreigners and immigrants like archie bunker style racism. he has really not had a deep policy thought to go around. what we see here is some of the nativist policy advisors around him using this wedge between migrants and working-class voters of color and this is like a tale as old as time and this nativist right■ç as far as immigration. it is how they have tried to get support among more traditionally liberal constituencies for hard-line immigration policies by demonizing migrants and trying to hit groups against each other. trump is offering a more hackneyed version of that in his bigoted way and i think relating to that last question in the last segment, i will say, again, if you look at what the biden/harris ticket right now is in the conversation they have around joe biden, i feel like kamala harris has demonstrated that she could make a pretty compelling counterattack on this topic and has done so and has done so with abortion and other issues and has done so in other appearances since the debate on thursday. i think it is noteworthy that donald trump made this gap at the debate and joe biden really didn't push back on it but i think kamala ja$i%m pretty effective voice in pushing back on this. >> i do want to talk about the president of the black conservative federation who said, quote, he met the jobs of black people and we have been using this term for a while and that is not what he said, right? >> absolutely not. to tim's point, we will get this in a later segment but this f no christian nationalist agenda that donald trump's ilk has, donald trump doesn't care and he isn't interested in policy but interested in being in charge whatever that means for him just having people stand up and salute him but he doesn't care about these issues. he is always had a very particular view of the blacks and immigrants and nevermind the ■çfact that two of his thre wives are immigrants and four of his five children are children of immigrants. he doesn't see them as worthy or deserving or part of this country. we can't have a president who has that mindset and surrounds himself with people who have that. that is the larger question we are getting at which is the trump versus biden conversation we have. it isn't just about donald trump or joe biden but the types of people they surround themselves with and the types of policies we get. we get policies that drastically hurt women and drastically hurt black people especially with donald trump who wants to essentially pull this country apart and sell it for pieces. these are government jobs that black americans have relied on to elevate themselves into the middle class and these are the top jobs that the donald trump ilk are targeting to get rid ■ç and first if he is ever reelect. we have to make sure we aren't just talking about these two men and what they say or don't say but people who implement some of these horrible policies that donald trump has thrown out there at his rallies. >> i am not going to let you go. you have to stick around because we have more to talk about. next, the supreme court issued a win for abortion access and idaho so wire doctors there still scared to give life- saving care? 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