veterans group there at pennsylvania avenue being briefed on what could happen to their ranks if the debt ceiling is not raised. also cnn is learning some states making contingency plans. california specifically taking out a temporary $5 billion loan just to help pay its bills in case congress fails to act and turmoil in the credit market makes it difficult to borrow money after august 2nd. take a walk with me. i want to look at what exactly is proposed here. we have two different plans, two different bills on the table. one from democratic leader, senate majority leader harry reid, speaker of the house boehner there. here we go. first up, as we mentioned before, look, they definitely have similarities. first of all, both of them would cut spending. also neither plan would raise taxes. but there is one really huge difference we need to highlight. the reid plan would raise the debt ceiling beyond next year's presidential election, but the boehner plan here would raise the debt ceiling in two different steps setting up the possibility that we could be having this whole entire debt ceiling debate, this whole thing could be happening around election season. as it stands right now, it's highly unlikely the house would pass the reid plan or senate would pass the boehner plan. here we are essentially to quote the president last night at a stalemate before the deadline of august 2nd. that is the final day the white house says the united states will have enough money to pay all of his creditors. let me say this. we're talking money here. this is unchartered territory. no one knows for sure what exactly will happen if we all wake up the morning of august 3rd with no increase in the debt ceiling. economists warn interest rates are likely to jump. how will that affect you? mortgage rates, affect you with an adjustable rate mortgage, an a.r.m., looking to buy a house, refinance, sell your house. higher mortgage rates would price some potential buyers just totally out of the market. here is another practical example, car loans. if you're in the market for a new car, car loan would most definitely cost you more. another example, credit cards. you're going to pay more to keep a balance on credit cards. one more here. one more example for you. you have one of these? stock and bond market could drop. retirement savings and mutual fund investments would take a hit. we've been talking to a lot of you. a lot concerned how a failure to raise the debt ceiling would affect your wallet. take a look. >> concerned, for sure. >> makes up quite a bit of my income, my basic income. i think it's really important, however, that our country, the people that represent us actually do represent us and really want the best for us. >> if credit card interest rates went up, that would be a real problem for me. if it makes borrowing more difficult, you know, i want to buy a new car next year and that might be more difficult. you know, just things like that, you know, basic day to day things that i deal with. my credit cards, trying to get credit for a purchase. >> i'm concerned we're going into social security and medicare to help balance things off and that's going to affect me personally. >> people don't have jobs. we have this horrible economy and you're going to let the debt ceiling cave in? what are they thinking? they have houses, cars, get their pension, they don't have to worry about it but there's people out here that do. it's just clear they don't care. their concern is not for the people. >> you hear all of that? perhaps some of that resonates with you today. i want to bring in robert reich, at berkeley. authored "aftershock, america's economy and future." i want to begin with you. i know we have you on and i want to talk jobs and that's what people want to hear about. two scenarios, labor secretary during the government shutdown oddly '95 and early '96. at the time businesses couldn't get loans guaranteed through small business administration, health services for veterans stopped, national parks were closed because, you remember, there just wasn't a budget. so let me give you the if. if congress cannot reach a deal on the debt ceiling by one week from today, how, sir, would the impact compare to what we experienced during the government shutdown during the mid-90s? >> brooke, it would be much worse. a government shutdown is one thing. even in the government shutdown vital government services will continue. people got medicare checks and medicaid, social security, unemployment checks. the government continued to pay its creditors what was due. but if the debt ceiling is not raised next week, none of that happens. government simply doesn't have any money to pay medicare, medicaid, social security, unemployment insurance, nor can it pay its creditors. it has a limited amount of money but that amount of money continues to dwindle as it tries to pay off everybody it owes. that's why interest rates will go up. everybody who owes money or the government owes money to, including international lenders, are going to get nervous. >> you're saying the situation would be worse come next week. i've also done reading here. you say the budget deficit isn't our biggest problem, it's joblessness. let me ask you this, what does washington need to do, robert reich with regard to the debt ceiling, negotiations, that would create a better atmosphere for job creation and higher wages? >> well, for one thing we've got to, i would say, exempt the first $20,000 of income from payroll taxes maybe for the next two years. another thing we could do is for the federal government to amend bankruptcy laws so people who are struggling to pay their mortgages could declare personal bankruptcy on their primary residence, something they cannot do right now. that would give them more bargaining leverage with their lenders. a third thing we could do, brooke, would be to have what was done during the new deal, a wpa, civilian conservation corps. all of the long-term unemployed instead of sitting] there, some of them collecting unemployment insurance, could actually be put to work doing things that are not now being done. we could repair our infrastructure, parks, teachers aides, all kinds of things that are necessary. granted this would cost some money in the very short-term but not cost nearly as much as what we are now enduring, which is a huge amount of joblessness. >> huge amount of joblessness. you've cited several different examples. bottom line congress has to pay -- president says we don't pay the bill we walk away from the bill, it's a debt. the president last night talking about without revenue increases, which we know now by looking at boehner and reid plans, none of which have up front. we're going to have to cut, president cites cuts from education, infrastructure, energy. how would those cuts, robert, make the job crisis even worse? >> well, if the cuts were done now when we have almost 15 million americans unemployed, when we are so much short of our total productive capacity because so many factories and offices and retail establishments and commercial establishments are shuttered, if we started cutting now, that would mean fewer jobs, less money in circulation in terms of buying things. that would mean more joblessness and a worse economy. that's unthinkable. you know, brooke, the fundamental mistake here is to assume -- this is a political problem, not an economic problem. the political error is to connect deficit reduction over the next 10 years with raising the debt limit that's tuesday. there's no reason that the two of them had to be or have to be connected. >> the republicans when you talk about, let's go back to jobs, republicans argue by raising taxes, that will keep businesses from creating new jobs. that's been their huge sticking point. we know you worked with the clinton administration and we know he raised taxes during that time. 23 million jobs were also created during his eight years in office. what does president obama need to do to get the job market at least moving in that same direction? >> well, as i said, there's many things that can be done. if you're talking about raising taxes, we know that when president bush reduced taxes, mostly on the wealthy, we didn't get a huge, huge job response. as you said, 22 million new jobs during the clinton administration after president bush reduced taxes on the wealthy we had only 8 million jobs in his eight years of his administration. the median wage, the wage of the typical worker continued to decline. for the first time in history we've seen a recovery when that occurs. reducing taxes on the wealthy doesn't trickle down. we've tried trickle down economics for years, brooke, and it will not work. >> what will work quickly? >> aside from the ideas i put forward just about three minutes ago. >> wpa, et cetera. >> many things can be done. infrastructure bank that would enable united states to borrow from international markets without affecting the budget but nevertheless finance a lot of the roads and deferred maintenance that needs to be done on our bridges, ports, levees and put a lot of people to work as well. there are five. i've given you five things that can and should be done. unfortunately nothing is being done. we're just locked in this absurd contest over raising the debt limit. >> robert reich, i appreciate it. he says if we don't come to something, this will be worse than the government shutdown back in the '90s. heaven for bid we see that day again. thank you so much, sir. now i do want to take you to capitol hill and get you the latest on the wrangling, absurdity. votes could come on the proposed bills proposed by john boehner in the house and democratic harry reid in the senate. correspondent lisa des jardin has raced through both bills in the fight. any changes we should be aware? any meetings? there's always meetings behind the scene. any sign of, dare i say, compromise? >> yes, very small one. just in the last hour senate republican leader mitch mcconnell said he is willing to accept something that is not perfect. so he's kind of opening the door to say i am willing to back down from my ideal. he's sending this signal after last night when we heard all the very shop words back and forth. that might be a good sign for compromise. but brooke, to signs in the opposite direction, first of all, we don't know that any plan has the votes to pass. in fact, brooke, in the house republican speaker john boehner is having trouble getting enough votes for his own plan. right now it looks like he doesn't have enough republicans to pass it, hoping for help from democrats. that is high drama on the house side. the second thing, brooke, we just heard from the white house a statement about boehner's plan. the white house sent a strange veto threat. not the president issuing the threat but said his staff recommends he veto boehner's bill. that's the president walking right up to declaring he will veto it but leaving it open if it's the only option. >> we heard about the threat before although he didn't say it last night at 9:00 eastern. i'll be talking with a member last night. i'll ask about that. the president called on americans to pick up the phone, get on the internet, contact your member of congress to express your views on what should be done here. are the switchboard operators working overtime on the hill? are people calling? >> i have the numbers. i just got them in the last half hour. staff for the house tells me that the call volume today has been twice a normal day. we do know that it shut down many house offices, folks trying to call know they are not getting through because call volume is twice as high as usual. a republican spokes perp for this committee said, noted this is still not as high as the volume for the health care bill. much higher than usual but still not at health care level. >> bottom line americans are engaged. lisa desjardins, thanks so much. later i'll speak with jay powell, secretary under president bush and talk about a possible back-up plan in case no actual plan, no actual deal is made come august 2nd. stick around for that. coming up we are learning new details about the suspect who says he slaughtered 76 people at oslo, norway, including drugs he took before the attacks. we're learning about this today. also how his attorney plans to defend him in court. also ahead a drunk driver hits and kills a 4-year-old georgia boy. so why is the boy's mother being punished here? we'll be right back. ok. [ cellphone rings ] hey. you haven't left yet. no. i'm boarding now... what's up? um...would you mind doing it again? last time. [ engine turns over ] oooohhhh...sweet. [ male announcer ] the chevy cruze with the my chevrolet app. the remote control car is finally here. well, now she's just playing with us. oh. [ horn honks ] -why? -why? -why? [ female announcer ] we all age differently. roc® multi-correxion 4 zone moisturizer with roc®retinol and antioxidants. lines, wrinkles, and sun damage will fade. roc multi-correxion. correct what ages you. [ slap! slap! slap! slap! slap! ] [ male announcer ] your favorite foods fighting you? fight back fast with tums. calcium rich tums goes to work in seconds. nothing works faster. ♪ tum tum tum tum tums unlike fish oil, megared softgels are small and easy to swallow with no fishy smell or aftertaste. try megared today. you know president obama and vice president biden paid their respects today, just this afternoon, to the victims of norway's domestic terror attacks. they visited the home of the norwegian ambassador to the united states and sat there, signed the condolence book. the president wrote that, "thoughts and prayers of all americans are with the people of norway." another somber visit today, this one by norway's prime minister to the site of the massive car bomb explosion there near his office in downtown oslo. that explosion killed eight people and preceded the horrific shooting spree at the campus 20 miles away on the island last friday. let's go live to oslo to my colleague michael holmes who is there. clearly michael the memorial growing behind you. talk to me a little about it. we're learning some of the names of the victims today, names of the 76 people killed last friday in and around oslo. >> combine both those into one. i'll get the camera man to pan around when i talk about the memorial growing here every minute. we've been here all day. people coming through hundreds, thousands really placing flowers, flags, candles, all kinds of mementos, drawings by kids to honor those slain by anders breivik. it's been a very moving day, actually. it's very quiet here, very respectful, dignified, literally thousands of people have come. you mentioned the names. that's right. police today saying they will complete all identifications by the end of the week formally and starting to release names. they will do so every day at 6:00. they released four names. while we look at the memorial, i think it's important to read them. >> please. >> there's four to be named today. so from 23 to 61, the first of the victims of anders breivik named today by police and there will be more tomorrow. >> look at those flowers. look at that picture. michael, i dov to ask you about the suspect anders behring breivik. the defense attorneys spoke to reporters today. they are not painting the most flattering picture of their client. they are also not denying breivik confessed to killing these people. >> absolutely. this the interesting thing. he admitted to everything. he said i did it and i don't regret doing it either. it's part of a war. he wanted to start a revolution in europe. it's part of a war and everything will understand why in 60 years, real ranting stuff. his lawyer has a real insight into how this guy is thinking. he said from the facts of the case, the guy is in sane. he's still deciding whether he'll use an insanity verdict. listen to part of the news conference, brooke. >> i can't describe him because he's not like any one of us. so it's very difficult for me to describe him. this whole case, it's indicated he's insane. he's in a war and says the rest of the world, especially the western world, don't understand his point of view that in 60 years' time we'll all understand it. he hates everyone who lives in the western world, believes in the normal political system. anyone who is not an extremist he will hate. >> breivik now has spent his first night, about to spend his second night in solitary confinement, having eight weeks before his next court appearance, brooke. >> michael holms, thank you so much. i want to remind you just to stay with cnn. we're going to explore more the mind, possible motivations of bombing and shooting suspect. in just a couple of minutes a professor and author reading breivik's purported 1500-page manifesto tweeting his thoughts. jeff joins me here later on cnn with more on what he's learning. coming up next, a hit-and-run accident killed her 4-year-old son, a drunk driver charged and spent since months in prison will why is this little one's mother punished? she's in court today and now is speaking out. that is coming up next. for broccoli, say one. for toys, say two. toys ! the system can't process your response at this time. what ? please call back between 8 and 5 central standard time. he's in control. goodbye. even kids know it's wrong to give someone the run around. at ally bank you never have to deal with an endless automated system. you can talk to a real person 24/7. it's just the right thing to do. a georgia man could have gotten more prison time than the hit-and-run driver who killed her son won't spend any more time behind bars here. a judge sentenced raquel nelson to 12 months probation and community service. she was convicted of vehicular homicide and two other misdemeanors in the jaywalking accident that killed her son. that story got a lot of people's attentions because nelson initially faced up to 36 months in prison, a sentence six times longer than the time served by the driver who hit and killed her son. this accident happened last october. nelson and her three children that got off a bus at a stop across from their apartment building north of atlanta, when four-year-old a.j. broke away from her and started running across the street. a driver swerved around, hit and killed him. nelson and one of her daughters were slightly injured. she told nbc's "today" show the nearest crosswalk was .3 of a mile from the dross walk and she was trying to get home before dark. the driver took off. police did catch up with him. he was sentenced to five years in prison and served a mere six months. he is on the probation for the rest of his sentence. raquel nelson says she couldn't have gotten through the ordeal without support from her family, the community. here is what she said a few moments ago. >> i'd really like to thank everybody for your concern and support and helping get the message out there. hopefully we can move on from this situation better than we have been throughout this situation. i'd like to thank everyone who showed up today, all you guys, everyone who showed up and told me that they love me and they really cared about the situation. it's helped a whole lot. >> the judge also offered nelson the option of a new trial. her attorney tells the atlanta journal constitution he thinks they will move ahead with that on this story in the 4:00 with sonny hostin. still ahead he's accused of making unwanted sexual advances on a teenager girl. his campaign staff said he needs psychiatric help. today a surprise announcement from a seven-term congressman. another casualty in the shaky economy, why the local post office could soon close its doors. are. the volkswagen autobahn for all event is back. right now, get a great deal on new volkswagen models, including the cc. and every volk