moammar gadhafi? i'll talk to an expert in the middle eastern region. plus 4:00 eastern, we'll go over fortune magazine's top 40 under 40 list. "your $$$$$" starts right now. president obama on the road this week pushing his jobs plan but is he fighting for your job or campaigning for his own. welcome to "your $$$$$." i'm christine romans, ali velshi is off. chrystia freelander and economist stephen moore. the president traveling through battle grounds on a key trip, wants to push congress to pass every part of his jobs act piece by piece. what is this about? whose job is he looking for. >> my view is if he had really been serious about passing a jobs bill earlier this year, if he had moved to the middle he might have gotten something through congress. once he started talking about a big tax increase on the rich, there was no way republicans were going to go to that. i think this has become a polit debate, not what we can pass now. that's a problem when you have 4 million unemployed people. >> didn't they teach the white house there was going to be no consensus and trying to do a deal, trying actually to move to the center is what the white house tried to do over the debt ceiling isn't going to work. you talk to the white house -- precisely for that reason you talk to people at the white house they say actually we really tried hard to do a deal and we think it's a huge mistake because the other side doesn't want to bargain and that's what the president is hearing. >> did make a deal. >> not a meaningful deal that moves economic deal. >> economic war far, tax the rich, that's not a bipartisan consensus. >> exactly, he's changed. to say that the reason he hasn't been able to pass his policies is because he hasn't sought consensus is just not accurately reflecting what he has done. >> there's nothing in that package that republicans really like. >> not now, but that's because he tried to reach consensus and there was nobody on the other side of the table. >> that's something his supporters want to hear, he's the one moving, they are not moving with him. i want to talk about the component of that bill of the senate blocked a component of the jobs bill aimed at jobs for teachers and first responders. he made it clear if they don't pass his job proposals, they will have to answer to the public. >> it's these proposals. if they say no to steps we know will put people back to work right now, they aren't going to have to answer to me, they are going to have to answer to you. >> this is for chrystia, even if the president gets parts of his jobs bill through congress going forward he's facing record high levels of pessimism. according to a poll, 59% of americans think the president's policies will fail. is he better off running on his policies or gridlock in washington? >> i think he has to run on his policies but i think it is really, really tough. i think for him to run on gridlock, which is a little bit what we're seeing and also trying to blame the previous administration for the economic problems, i think that's going to be really difficult, because people are going to say you've been president now almost for a full term. >> he ran as a uniter, not a divider. >> what he's saying is uniting hasn't work. i haven't been able to do anything. at a time when the economy is in dire straits i think that's a tough sell. >> bring in ken, fed out, the beige book. it says our economy is not in recession, losing steam, not doing anywhere near what we would like. are there pieces of the president's job plan that could help the situation or does it not matter because the politics have made it impossible? >> i don't think anything in it is a game changer but clearly something like extending the payroll tax cut might make sense. stephen wrote a good piece how we really need to think about something different here, new tax policy, new way of approaching things. we are in for a long period of slow growth. it's not just about what's going to happen this year but what is our future, where is america going. that's what we really need to see at this point. >> near term do you think we've averted double dip recession. there have been little bright spots, so little not terrible spots. jobs number not as bad, philly fed index this week that showed more activity than people thought. have we averted a second recession or ontoo miniscule. >> as you know, christine, i don't think we ever left the recession in a meaningful second. we call it the second great contraction. is it going to get worse? i think the norm is we have slow growth for an extended period. there's more healing and deleveraging. i'm very worried about europe. that's hanging over our head. we're not very strong. our banks aren't very strong. that's the big risk. otherwise if we solve that, slow growth until there's a game changer. >> you are the guru of financial crises and how historically economies have recovered from them or not. is this kind of economic winter just inevitable and should everyone have said at the beginning of 2009, okay, we've screwed things up. history shows it's going to be seven years before things get better? >> i'm afraid the answer mostly is yes. there are things you can do -- >> you've said that repeatedly. >> you certainly want to take aspirin when you have a fever. >> you don't want to do anything that makes it worse. >> you want to understand it's going to last for a long time, don't want to panic. you want to look forward and ask how do we get back on our feet, have a good decade. there was an idea we could jump-start everything, big stimulus, government, private sector will take over organically, go away. >> i disagree, you and i have had this discussion. i think if we had done structural things that need to take place with regard to changing the economy in 2009 we'd be in much better shape now. the reason i'm kind of against this stimulus, too -- >> the president's jobs bill. >> putting a band-aid on a cancer patient. we're in agreement, the problems are much more structural than temporary infusions of government spending. >> putting a band-aid on the cancer patient. you have a lot of people suffering. the argument from the white house, you've got to do something to alleviate suffering while we wait for the cure somewhere else. >> there is a really important question about actual human beings and human lives. the thing i'm worried about the most in terms of the winter theory of what's going on is what happens to the generation that comes of age during winter. the research about young people who enter such dreadful jobs market never get a good first job. that's scary. i don't think you want a whole generation whose future prospects for 10, 20, 30 years can really be stunted. >> ought to be things like, first of all, the housing. what do we do about housing. if you're going to run a deficit, do something dealing with that, thorny. education, what to do with 25% unemployment among teens. it's high among 20 to 25 years old. try to have something to bridge that, perhaps. the vision ought to be long-term not that we're somehow solving the short-term problem. >> let's talk about tax reform. that's not thorny or long-term. thanks reform is a very big issue. it was all about herman cain's 9-9-9 plan. now rick perry is talking about a flat tax. would it be good for you? is this the time for major tax reform? is that something that could jump-start the economy? we'll take a look at that next on "your $$$$$." welcome to idaho, where they grow america's favorite potatoes. everyone knows idaho potatoes taste great. but did you know they're good for you too? they're high in vitamins and potassium. and idaho potatoes are now certified to carry the heart checkmark from the american heart association for foods low in saturated fat and cholesterol. so they're good for my family, and for yours. heart smart idaho potatoes. always look for the grown in idaho seal. my sunglasses. 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>> i love the flat tax idea. steve forbes version was good. an earlier one jerry brown had. it's a spectacular idea, can you imagine tax form half a page, no bothering with accounting and lawyers and all the different things. i think it would be a great idea. it's a big change. some countries have done it. i think it's worked really well. we need a game changer, something that gives us growth. somebody will discover something, the next steve jobs. we hope that will done. what can washington do in this is something washington can do if they do it the right way. >> if we had 18% rate or whatever it is, i think on a competitive basis around the world, it would make america a very competitive place. you'd see a lot less outsourcing. >> sounds like you guys are sold. why didn't the united states do this? >> turning to the conversation at the beginning, i think tax reform and tax simplification, even if it's not as perfectly simple as a flat tax, i think that's an area you could have some real bipartisan support. one of the things you're seeing on the left right now, the grassroots left is a sense that big business and vested interest has been successful in gaining what stephen was talking about. the tax code has been a way that's happened. >> we finally find something we can agree on. that kind of simplification. >> they can lobby -- >> one of the reasons you've got the warren buffett problem, because who takes advantage of all these loopholes, rich people. >> it's why you have the problem. >> maybe it's why herman cain has been doing so well in the polls, there's noing to simple as three little numbers, 9-9-9. we know this week he modified 9-9-9 for people below the poverty line to 909, taking away taxes if they were below the income level. is this why it's resonating because it's simple? >> yes, i think simplicity is appealing. also something mr. rogoff has been saying, people know this is winter of people get that. the historical research shows it, people see that in their lives. people i think really want something new. they want a new idea. they do feel there needs to be some game changing political transformation. i think this is appealing. i think with herman cain the difficulty is going to be as time goes on and people test, is there anything behind 9-9-9. the world is a complicated place. >> it's great -- i want to say 911, because that's what i want to deal with this economy. >> your plan. >> rogoff's 911 plan. >> it's a muddled version of the flat tax. the flat tax is beautiful. this is not. it has a lot of problems. i give him a lot of credit for having the vision. let's make it simpler, do something people will understand. i don't think it's quite the wright way to do it. >> said, wouldn't it be nice to give a number for congress, the tax code will expire. we talked about it so many times, said the stars are aligned but is now the time to do it. >> now would be the best possible time. >> which means they won't. >> you don't know. i'd much rather we channeled all this anger with the tea party, with the occupy wall street, channel all this anger to something constructive. i'm worried if we don't we're going to get a game changer, a trade blocking regulation. >> we did in in 1986. that's the amazing thing. we had a total bipartisan consensus for cleaning out the tax system and lowering rates. that bill passed 97-3. >> it's not as radical as this. >> it depends on the white house. the president has said it's okay with me to be a one-term president if i can get big things done. so this is a moment when he could really roll the dice on this. another game changer i think is essential, which he tried to do is health care. if health care isn't fix, i don't think this reform fixed it. >> he got things done his critics don't like, health care done, a big stimulus done. they said you've had your chance, mr. president and we still have 9.1% unemployment. >> obama care. >> here we go again. a whole other five-minute block. nice to see you guys, have a great weekend. occupy wall street. two guests, two different opinions. both witnessed firsthand. one sides with the protesters, one doesn't. both sides next. ♪ do you believe in magic? 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[ male announcer ] get up to 795 miles per tank in the all-new volkswagen passat tdi clean diesel. the world needs more energy. where's it going to come from? ♪ that's why right here, in australia, chevron is building one of the biggest natural gas projects in the world. enough power for a city the size of singapore for 50 years. what's it going to do to the planet? natural gas is the cleanest conventional fuel there is. we've got to be smart about this. it's a smart way to go. ♪ i tell you what i can spend. i do my best to make it work. i'm back on the road safely. and i saved you money on brakes. that's personal pricing. occupy wall street, lots of anger from the protesters, lots of questions from those observing the movement from outside. we're joined by two men who observed these firsthand. will cain, matt taibbi, contributing editor with rolling stone. you say you love these protests but you want to see the movement focus on a few things. what are they? >> first of all, i don't think it needs to focus yet. what it's doing right now is just getting bigger is an end in itself. they have been tremendously successful at that. everyone around the country is asking what do these people want so we can give them something and make them away. the longer they wait to announce specific demands the more people will be willing to give them. right now growing is an important goal. when it comes down to time for specifics, they should settle on one or two differ things. for me the big suggestion would be break up the banks. that's something that already had a lot of support in washington, a massive show of force could actually achieve that. >> break them up, make them smaller, make more of them. >> no more too big to fail companies. if a company is too big to fail, it's too big to exist. gholds and bank of america have implicit support of united states government it's not fair to the rest of the world, smaller regional banks, unhealthy situation and taxpayers should not be on the hook. >> what did you see driving this? >> one thing i'm going to challenge matt on, i don't think people are asking to satisfy wall street protesters what they want so they will go away but so we can have a focused conversation and make it better. i've read matt's five potential demands, one is a suggestion to wall street, break up the banks. i would almost describe to every one of his pieces of advice, including break up the banks and defend them from a free market perspective. my conclusion is different. i don't like what i see. it's not what matt wants to demand. if you give them all five, nobody is packing up a sign and going home. >> that's one of the things. there are a lot of people who say i love the idea of occupy wall street the movement. the movement says don't take your liberal world view and put it on us. we're not a package for how you think the system should be changed. >> well, but i think they are right to not define themselves yet. what's happening, all these people are trying to speak for the movement and trying to coral them and put them in a box and find leaders they can negotiate with or identify as head of this movement by not having a specific set of demands or structure, it's got everybody guessing. >> what do they want, i guess? it's anxiety against the economy. everyone has got that. is it middle class or a lot of people who felt like they haven't had a voice and bringing it together but what are they asking for? >> it's an uprising of everybody except a small group of people who -- yes. everybody is responding to the same thing, a sense of growing inequity not only in income but political power in this country. this idea there are 400,000 people here deported millions of people foreclosed on with the help of law enforcement and not a single person went to jail for the financial crisis. >> we heard comments including president obama emphasizing occupy wall street. listen. >> i think people are frustrated. the protesters are giving voice to a more broad-based frustration about how our financial system works. >> so democrats, do they deserve to have the protesters behind them with the ballot box? do you think this will become a political movement for the president? >> absolutely not. if you look at the history how we get into this mess, democrats have been worse than republicans. >> why? >> they have hands on repeals, deregulated derivatives market. >> lowering standards for home ownership. >> yeah. >> that's actually a very contentious part. >> to me that's a peripheral. >> to the wall street part. >> look, their chief architects of the bailouts since 2008. they have their hands on everything. obama surrounded himself almost entirely with people and they have been architects of his economic policy. there's no way people should have any faith in the democrats. >> you mentioned something before we went to that sound bite,