we have billy crystal, who knew norman very well. we have lots to do. >> look forward to it. have a great night. >> thank you. you too. you know what i was thinking? >> yes, it's charles barkley. >> do you think it's right or fair that the united states has to be the policeman for the entire world? >> not for the entire world. >> i think the world looks to us. we need to have a conscience. >> if you could pick anyone for president, who would it be? anyone. >> hillary clinton. >> i would like to be presented with some different candidates. >> someone under the age of 50. >> announcer: from the cnn stutd y -- studios in new york city, it's king charles. tonight, secretary of state antony blinken, the legendary billy crystal, and roy wood junior. king charles starts now. >> going in. ♪ moving on up ♪ ♪ to the east side ♪ ♪ to a deluxe apartment ♪ >> to a deluxe apartment in the sky. it's the theme song of "the jeffersons." one of the shows forman lear made possible. you know why we are singing it. he passed away yesterday. i talked to his daughter earlier today. i talked to her daughter kate. she said he died peace it willy at home surrounded by people he loved. there was laughing and singing. one song was the theme songs to some of the shows. they played that song. >> i had the pleasure of spending a day with him. he was telling me about when he wanted to put black people on television. they said under no circumstances are we going to put black people on television. he says, what? he started sliding them in. what a legendary man. i didn't realize until we saw the piece, he was a veteran. shoutout to all the veterans out there. what an incredible life and legacy. >> he changed the world. we will talk more about norman lear. billy crystal will join us on the set. he was close to norman. he credits him in many ways with starting his career. this is our second show. it's your new favorite show you are hoping. we like to say this. we are not a show of record. we are a show of interest. we say this all the time, we want to talk with and about the people who shape our culture, people like norman lear and billy crystal. we want to talk to people at the center of the most important issues facing the world. tonight, secretary of state antony blinken sat down with us. it was his first cnn primetime interview. it was such a big deal to all of us that charles barkley -- tell them what you did. >> i got my eyebrows threaded. number one, we hope you like the show. we hope you got nielsen boxes. >> i was surprised getting threaded eyebrows was part of your beauty routine. that's another story. we see it. we appreciate it. we talked to secretary blinken to talk about his efforts to mediate the war between israel and hamas, how it's affecting him personally. it has. his guiden mantra. he told us that. the struggle to reunite hostages with their families. that's where we began the conversation. mr. secretary, thank you very much. we are glad that you are on the program tonight. we have been looking forward to this conversation. haven't we? >> this is pretty special. >> we think it's very special. >> great to be with both of you. thanks for having me. >> we feel that, too. let's talk about the hostages, if we could. the talks have broken down. the war resumed. everybody is concerned worldwide about the fate of the hostages. i realize it's all hands on deck, all countries are working to secure their hostages to get them home safely, to get all of the hostages home. is the biden administration doing anything specifically to get the release of the american hostages? realizing we want all the hostages home. >> we are at this every single day. it's my number one responsibility. the president feels it's his number one responsibility to look out for any american who is in harm's way abroad, and especially those who are being held hostage, being held captive in some way. i met with the families. i have heard directly from them. that's the thing that motivates me the most. we will not rest until we get every single one. >> it's not enough. i say this, mr. secretary, that for all these hostages, they are numbers for some people. but family members, they are somebody's everything. >> absolutely. >> share with us what you are doing. >> look, you will understand, i can't get into details. this is literally going on daily and even more than daily. sometimes even hourly. trying to find a way, an angle to get this restarted. you are right, these are not -- it's not a question of numbers. these are real people, real lives, real families, whose lives have been torn upside down. i have photographs of all of them. it's real for me. it's real for the president. we are on this. unfortunately, hamas gets the vote. hamas stopped releasing hostages. it reneged on its commitment to israel and to everyone else concerned. they chose to end this process of releasing hostages. they need to choose to start it again. >> you know, you asked israel to take precautions for civilians in gaza. is that possible? >> charles, i think it's important to do two things. first, we have to put this in perspective. what happened on october 7th is something i have never seen in the 30 years that i have been doing this professionally. for that matter, the 50 years or so i've been going to israel in one way or another. children executed in front of their parents. parents executed in front of their children. families burned alive. you heard yesterday about the horrific sexual violence, the rapes of so many young women. what was done deliberately, intentionally with the brutality that really i have encountered almost nowhere else in the many years i have been doing this. then you have this terrorist group, hamas, do that, retreat to gaza and intentionally embed itself with civilians, with innocent men, women and children in, and under apartment buildings, in hospitals, in and under mosques, schools. it's very, very challenging for israel to do what it needs to do to try to make sure this never happens again. and getting at hamas. but having said that, and as we said from day one, they nonetheless have an obligation to do everything possible to protect civilians, to distinguish between terrorists and innocent men, women, and children. >> that doesn't seem to be going so well, about keeping civilians safe. the civilians are dying, including thousands of children. i think that's what's so heartbreaking for everybody. >> it's gut wrenching for all of us. what we see now is we are seeing some i think important steps being taken as they are operating, they are beginning to operate in the south of gaza, after operations in the north. in the south, what we are -- i said to them clearly when i was there a week ago, we cannot have a repeat of what happened in the north, in the south in terms of harm being done to civilians. also making sure that humanitarian assistance is getting to people who need it, who are in need of food, water, shelter. what we are seeing is areas clearly designated by israel that are safe areas, where there's not going to be firing or the military. we have seen efforts to make sure people know that they need to move and not the entire city, but discreet neighborhoods. that's positive. on the other hand, there's more that has to happen, that needs to be done. making sure people have safe corridors to get from areas that could be in danger to places where they will be safe. making sure those areas where they are going to have the proper resources, have the food, have the water, have the medicine to care for them while they are in those areas. there are a number of things that need to happen. >> my son-in-law is an amazing man and a great husband. he is also jewish. you are jewish. he is taking this israel thing very personally. how are you feeling -- louhow d it affect you? he is struggling. you and a jewish man, how are you handling this situation mentally? >> and the stepson of a holocaust survivor, which adds another layer of pain in this particular story. >> of course, it's affected me personally. i have talked about that a little bit. it's affected me personally because my late stepfather survived the holocaust. he was in the concentration camps. my father's father, in a different generation, got chased out of what's now ukraine. when i saw what happened on october 7th, of course, it had a perso personal resonance, especially the savagery. having said that, i'm an american. i have the awesome responsibility and privilege of being secretary of state and representing all of the american people around the world on behalf of the president. as i'm doing my job, to the best of my ability, i'm trying to make sure that i'm reflecting america's interests, america's values, and doing what's right for our country. >> how safe -- two questions. how safe are jewish students in college? where is the line between hate speech and freedom of speech? >> charles, we are seeing this every day play out on our campuses. while i'm focused on the world beyond our borders, like anyone else, i'm reading, hearing about what's happening on some campuses, talking to my own relatives who have kids who are college age who have been on the receiving end of this. it's deeply, deeply disturbing. and more to see some of the hate that we are hearing on college campuses, the expressions of vitriol, intimidation of students for being who they are. that's something that is not entirely new, but it has sort of come out from beneath the rock since october 7th. by the way, i'm also deeply disturbed about the same hate and vitriol being directed against muslim americans, arab americans. we see this in all different directions. we have to get back to a place where people on all of our campuses can feel safe being who they are, who they are and saying what they believe. >> i think you raise a really good point about feeling safe and being able to speak. i know so many people are struggling with even how to have -- even how to have a conversation about this, mr. secretary. no matter what you say, no matter what you say or how you say it, you are immediately slammed by somebody. how can we have this conversation init will gently a -- intelligently and respectfully with all these points of view? >> my humble opinion is this. we need to stop the dehumanization of each other. we have to put ourselves in other people's shoes. we have to have that openness of mind and openness of heart. when you have that, you can talk about anything. even the hardest things. once you start to dehumanizing, once you start seeing someone as another and somehow not human, that takes -- that takes every guardrail, every check away. >> i always say that it's very hard to hate up close. >> exactly. >> i always say that. >> what part do our politicians have they played? clearly, if you watch television every day, the democrats and republicans, they are not civil to each other. what part do you think they play in our -- in us losing our civility? >> one of the great things about this job, being secretary of state, is i don't do politics. i don't want to start. >> what do you mean -- wait a second, mr. secretary. your job is politics. explain. >> around the world, but not here at home. here is the thing. what i have heard president biden say for years -- i had the immense privilege of working for him for more than 20 years. he will -- he constantly said, it's totally appropriate to be questioning each other's judgements. let's stop questioning each other's motives. let's assume that motive is good intentions. then we can have a conversation and we can try to get to some place better. i think that's what we need to do, too. >> i like what you said about the conversations that you have had with president biden about questioning people's -- you can have conversations, you don't need to question people's motives. i would like to end with this. what's your personal mantra that gets you through? i think i'm going to adopt whatever you are having. what's your personal mantra, mr. secretary? then we will let you go. >> you know, it's funny, because one of the -- i had a chance the other night to meet rob reiner, the great director and actor. he made one of my favorite movies of all time. this is probably the wrong thing to say. i told him that movie has my mantra in it. one of the characters says at one point, there's such a fine line between clever and stupid. i try to stay on the right side of that line every day. >> okay. >> it's been an honor. thank you very much. >> we are very grateful. >> great to be with you both. >> thank you, sir. >> thanks. >> he is very busy. we were very appreciative and very grateful. i like how he ends, a fine line between clever and stupid. do you think that's true? >> which part am i? >> i didn't say that. which part are you? i didn't say that. >> it was kind of him to take the time. i know he has a lot of stuff going on. we appreciate it. >> he does not do primetime interviews very often. we appreciate, secretary blinken, your time and candor. norman lear redefined television. billy crystal joins us to tell us about the man he credits with giving him his start. we will be right back. . >> i love this man. i love him . >> that's so fantastic. that's billy crystal in one of his first tv roles. it was a one-episode part on "all in the family" written for billy crystal by norman lear. he died tuesday at the age of 101. he developed classic shows. you know them. "the jeffersons" and "sanford & son." you sat down and charles said, i'm sorry for your loss and you said, it's the world's loss. that's how it feels. >> it is. 101 years of a great life and a life well lived. >> yes. >> what he leaves behind, the legacy of not only the show but his friends and the laughter and his dedication to america, his love for this country. >> yes. >> he was an extraordinary man. >> he told me once that laughter was one of the best sounds in the world. i want to go to 1975. here is billy crystal on stage. you are performing. in the audience is who? >> it was at the comedy store in l.a. i was a new guy. it was my second trip to l.a. they put together a night. i did 20 minutes. in the audience was norman. the great carl reiner, who would later become a big part of my life also. he came outside and was standing out there. he was there. he comes out and going, hi, i'm norman lear. of course, you are. he said, tell me about yourself. well, it's kind of new, i'm substitute teaching and i have a year and a half old daughter. this is what i want to do. great. it was really good. next week, i'm back in long beach, long island, i'm feeding my daughter. the phone rings. hello. hold on for norman lear. hello? it's norman lear. we met at the comedy store. what am i going to say? he said, there's a part coming up on "all in the family." you play mike's best friend. i have a feeling about you two that you would be really great together. can you get out here? i said, i'm there. they flew me out. monday work started. he said, the script is not ready but it will be by friday. that's how it works here. we had the first read through. he was right, the script wasn't ready. i watched rob take over with the writers. laying the panthway for who he would become. friday we taped. we were saying good-bye to each other. we played best friends. rob said, keep it going. 48 years later, here we are. >> why did he care so much about diversity? >> because he was a human being. he knew inequities. he knew the world should not be this way. for me, there was always a lesson. i'm a new guy. he gave me the same kind of greeting that he would give to any of the big stars on the show. he made me feel important. he said in the writers' meeting, listen to him. listen to him. >> he is talking about you? >> yeah. you are part of our family. but the important thing is that that relationship, from that one week with rob led to a friendship which led to my being in three of his wonderful m movies. they are all in the library of congress, which was a big part of my getting the kennedy honor last week. >> norman lear was the oldest kennedy center honoree. you brought a picture. i want to get to that. his daughter said he was fearless, committed, believes the american public was smart and wanted to talk about life, hard things and uncomfortable truths. you think that's true? >> absolutely. >> he showed that time and time again. >> but his -- we were all in his family. the united states was all in his family. look at -- for "all in the family," what he went after in episodes, there was rape, there was racism. >> abortion. >> there was abortion. there was -- besides being wonderfully funny, every week you tuned in to find out something about ourselves. >> you know what's amazing, i didn't know until we were talking about it at the beginning, he was a veteran. i was like, first of all, i have great admiration for teachers and veterans. did he ever talk about that ? >> very much so. when he was a young man, against his mother's wishes, he enlisted. he hated what the nazis were doing to the jews. being a proud jewish man d, he didn't want her to know. it was like 50 missions or something, bombing missions in germany. he was very devoted to that and making sure they got the right care when they got home. >> that's kind of a weird dynamic. soldier, tv producer. that's a to z. >> yeah. everyone fights different kinds of battles. for "all in family," he stood up to the network. the cast that we grew to love was i believe the third pass at getting it right. >> as i said, he was one of the oldest kennedy center honorees. you are in the new class. you went to him to tell him about it. tell us what that meeting was like. >> when it was announced, i came on your show and the same day, we went on strike. suddenly, i'm out of work. norman was on my mind because of what i told about hooking me up with rob and what that led to. >> here is the picture. >> i told him. as i was leaving, we had lunch together, and i had the feeling i might not see him again. >> you did? >> he was wonderful. he was in a great mood. so funny. i took that picture. i sent it to you today because it just -- it was poignant. the house he was staying at was very high above los angeles. that's where he is now. >> wasn't he making plans? he told me he was still making plans. >> he kept saying to me every time i saw him -- i was at his 101st birthday. i want to gather everybody and do something really important for us. the us he meant was america. he did not like what was happening politically and in between all of our people, the hate, the distrust, the he wanted to heal that. i don't know, a concert, something. something we gotta do together. >> sometimes i say, man, what a great life i have had. how often do you, when you are in your private moments say, man, i have had an amazing life? i've accomplished some great things. >> there are times i let myself have that. this past weekend with the kennedy center honor, from the time it was announced, i was very emotional, to actually still now, because your life passes in front of you and your career. if they are similar, my life is different than my career. you are reminded of the moments and all of the people who helped along the way and the ups and downs. sometimes the middles are harder than the downs. i'm very grateful that i have had a chance to do what i want to do my entire life and have done it pretty much my entire life. >> when i think about norman, because he was a big part of your life, it's not even in sadness, i feel grateful we had him in our lives. it's a time to celebrate his life. do you feel that? >> yes. i don't have a sadness. i'm sad i won't be able to talk to him. >> understood. >> and joke with him. one morning he called me at 9:00 a.m. out of the blue and said, just want to tell you, i love you. come over and have lunch and bring f