his lows and what he really thinks of his ex-wife. >> "the real housewives" was my parting gift to her. plus hillary duff, recording artist, actress. a child star all grown up. this is "piers morgan tonight." kelsey grammer is one of the most talked about and famous and beloved figures in history. you are, aren't you? you've been part of the american television consciousness for so long. you must walk out on the street and everybody goes, "hey, kelsey." everyone must think they know you. >> well, those things do happen. sometimes it "hey frazier." but more often than not it's "hey, kelsey." >> do you like the kind of mass attention you must still get or is it i've done it -- >> it's always pleasant. it's always flattering. it's always meant in an optimistic, kind of affectionate way. so i take it that way and return the compliment. >> do you enjoy the status of television icon? >> sure. i'd be a fool to say i didn't. >> i would. the odd thing about you and i mean this in the best sense is i don't think i've ever had an american television star sit here who openly admits to being a republican. >> oh, i'm that guy. >> and i think musicians. i don't think i've ever had a tv person. normally the world of television is infused with liberals and most movie stars i'd say. >> yeah, i think you're right about that. i'm a bit of a rebel. i don't tend to warm too well to people that tell me how i'm supposed to think. so my life in hollywood, i'm afraid i was destined to be a republican. >> how does it go down with all your famous friends? is it lonely out there? >> pretty lonely. but they seem to tolerate me somehow because i can at least state myself eloquently and without -- without actually kind of assuming the veneer of what they some is what a republican is is some kind of nasty, strange villain that should be vilified. >> it's awful because that has become the way republicanism is now perceived in this country. you're either extremely with them, with all that appears to entail, or you're completely against them. to say you're republican now divides people immediately. you go back 30 years, it wasn't like that. >> well, the tone of political assessment has changed and the battle for the hearts and minds of the american people have taken on a bit more of a violent and narrow approach. i mean, you have to actually make sure that nobody swallows anything of what you are in order to ensure that you get their vote. so it's very easy to understand why you'd want to make somebody hateful. >> as you say, people i guess see you as a comic actor. you were born in the virgin islands. you grew up in florida. at 18 you come to new york, go to the juilliard school, very prestigious acting school. you did do the hard yards of theatrical trainings, didn't you, to be a serious actor? >> for a couple of years and then they kicked me out. >> did you ever imagine at that stage, at juilliard, all these talented people, did you ever imagine in your wildest dreams or maybe nightmare the level of fame you would one day get through acting? >> no. it funny, there was something -- i did believe that i was going to be successful as an actor. i did realize if you're successful as an actor it might come along with fringe benefits, i guess or peripheral anxieties. >> stage acting is great because you go out every night and you get instant reaction from an audience, a play, good musical. they're cheering and you go off and feel fantastic. the worst thing about television i would think is the terrible wait. you make all this stuff -- i've made shows and they take months to make and then there's this terrible buildup and in the back of your mind all you're thinking of is this could tank and then what. >> i've had that experience, too. >> "frazier" "cheers," they were phenomenal shows. when you first started making them, did you get an inkling early on, okay, this is going to be huge, it's going to change my life? or did it just happen? >> i'll tell you a story that david hyde pierce has repeated. after we shot the pilot, we got a standing ovation and everything went away and we all felt pretty good about it and he said to me, so what do you think? what does this mean? i said for you? it means you're going to buy a really nice house. and he said, well, what does it mean for you? i said it means i'm probably going to buy a couple. you do have a sense -- you know when you know. you can tell. and there is a beauty about releasing it to the public, just saying, okay, here it is, love it or hate it, we did our best. >> kelsey, when i researched your life for this interview, i could barely believe about the stuff that's happened to you, the really bad stuff. most people go through life and have had a bit of trauma. but when i read your parents divorced when you were 2, your father who you had barely seen since then was shot and killed, in 1975 your youngest sister karen was abducted, raped and murder pshe was 18. in 1980 your young are twin half brother died in a scuba diving accident. in 2001, the producer of "frazier" died in the 9/11 attacks. i got to the end of this and i didn't know to be honest with you how you had even come through that. i don't know how any human being comes through this kind of thing. i mean, put it in some kind of overall context for me. to be hit by so much tragedy. >> we touched on it a little bit before, though. i was being general. and one that's really important is my grand dad died, too, when i was 12. he raised me. that was the big impact until my sister was killed of course. that one just seemed like an absurd topping on a situation that i thought was just impossible. and it was that incident that sort of propelled me into at least a phase -- i mean, i lost faith, i lost myself. it's sort of like that old what -- everything the boy saw, he became. i had a love affair with the universe, with a blade of grass, with a rising sun, with surfing. i used to surf all the time when i was a kid. my life was a joy. it was a joyful experience. it was full of sort of affirmation and encouragement. and i loved being alive. and i was consciously in love with being alive. and then these deaths took place, you know, these deaths occurred. and when i lost gordon, i went very quiet for a long time. that's my grand dad. and i didn't really speak to anybody for a couple of months. >> he'd been the father figure. >> he was my father basically. and when i finally sat one night -- this is in ft. lauderdale where we had moved and i got this overwhelming sense that i was just going to be alone for the rest of my life, which made me kind of sad. and when i was 18, i packed it all up and went up to juilliard to find my fortune, whatever. but it was that year, two years actually, when karen was killed that sent me into kind of a tail spin. and it was a horrible nightmare for her. the three young men who be a dkted hersh raped her repeatedly, said maybe they would let her go. there was more documentation about what happened. and i being the big brother i'd always been thought that i had some responsibility for that. and that haunted me for, well, at least 20 years. that notion. >> it makes so much more sense to me the kind of slightly chaotic relationships that you had and the kind of dissent into drugs and alcohol and so on. it all makes much more sense when you understand what you've been through. it doesn't surprise me. >> i think after the success came, you know, robin williams had that great saying about saying cocaine's good's way of telling you you're making too much money. >> you trained with him at the juilliard, didn't you? >> yeah, we were together in school. but once success came, i think what really compounded my difficulties in dealing with some of that was simply they've didn't feel like i was worth it, like i didn't deserve that kind of success, that kind of reward, that kind of -- well, what you say about me, you know, this popular face on television. i'm okay with it now. i really am. >> but is part of that because you've managed to deal with so many of the demons? >> yeah. there was a self-loathing about it that came into play and it was easier to run away from it. but there was also the intoxicating inner vating charge of getting high and having fun. and there was even the kind of mythology of being a hollywood actor, this errol flynn and some of the big drinkers of the past. >> is it mythological or is there actually a reality? you were earning millions, you had the big houses, the fast cars, you had beautiful women. for a while it must be fun, despite everything else. >> absolutely. i would be a fool to tell you i wasn't having a good time. >> people say it's terrible. it it was that bad, you wouldn't be doing it. >> cocaine, it was too much to me. it brought me to my knees eventually. >> what was the wake-up moment for you? >> there were several along the way where i'd say have i to stop. it's hard to do that with cocaine. it's insidious and that's the problem. >> how did you manage to stop? >> i did go to betty ford and that helped. the best thing that they said actually was how's it been working for you? that's what i thought. and they said you spent a month here and maybe you'll figure out a way to do thing as little differently. and honestly that's what was the turning point in terms of me being able to take charge of my life again. because, i mean, i do all kind of things. i still have a wonderful, fun kind of approach to life. i do not -- i don't do cocaine anymore. >> do you drink alcohol? >> i have a drink sometimes, yeah. >> you can drink in moderation? >> yes. but you have to be ever mindful that you had a relationship with it in the past that can cause some probably so you have to be careful. >> after the break, come back and talk about how you got back on your feet and dabble slightly in marriage and divorce. >> okay. >> because you are something of an expert in this area, kelsey. luck? 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(laughing) yeah. get $100 rebate when you buy four tires. 100 bucks! only at your ford dealer. 3 million tires. 11 major brands, fiona's kind-of-nice. i don't know why you're not here. i tell you what i can spend. i do my best to make it work. i'm back on the road safely. and i saved you money on brakes. that's personal pricing. kelsey, let's talk love, marriage and divorce. >> all right. >> i don't mind what order you do it in. you've already i think explained in a very profound way why you think you drifted in what i think turned out to be inappropriate relationships but at the time downseem inappropriate. did you struggle for a long time to have any meaningful relationships because of the drugs, the partying and everything else? was it all inconsequencial at the time? how did it feel to you? >> i spent about eight years not really settling down with anybody, having peripheral relationships with people. i was mostly focused on acting, trying to get a job, doing some work. and then when i came to new york, i met a girl, i was 28 years old and i thought i'm tired of this, i actually want to settle down and i want to have a child. i thought i'd like to start a family. so i met my first wife. >> doreen. >> doreen. and it went pretty badly. it lasted a year. it took a long time to get divorce, which is interesting. it was a five-year divorce. >> you had a great child, spencer. >> that was fantastic. >> your second marriage -- it starts to really deteriorate so you married the stripper in 1992. and that lasted a year. >> that was a year. >> lots of allegations of abuse. she fired a gun at you, she filed for divorce, she attempted suicide. that was "the national enquirer" for real. >> did she fire a gun at you? >> that was another night. that was before i married you. >> you married her after she shot at you? wasn't that warning sign? a woman shoots at me, i'm thinking twice about the marriage, you know? >> so that fell apart pretty quickly. and then i met my third wife. and what's funny is i didn't see the -- i didn't see the similarities at first but all the same impulses came up about, oh, i could really help her. you know, i can -- >> this is camille? >> yeah. i can save her, give her some sort of refuge. and i think in the long run, i mean, it's difficult to have anybody hear this but i think it wasn't really a relationship based upon love. it was a relationship based upon appearances. it was good for me to basically at least try to settle down and have a normal relationship. so i sort of dedicated myself to that without realizing that i needed to have a profound love to really pull that off. and so -- >> and what was bizarre about the whole thing was it was all being played out on television. >> everything's played out on television. >> she was on the "the real housewives of beverly hills" and you would pop in and out so the whole unraveling of marriage. i imagine for you who had always run away from that kind of attention from your private life, this must have been like hell. >> i have to tell you, the real housewives was my parting gift to her. it was my way of saying, look, you always wanted to be famous, here you go. everybody knows reality shows are not a particularly great way to be famous, but you'll still get attention and still get all those things that come along with the ride, which i think is what she was most interested in. that was the gift. and i knew that when it came up, we'd be saying good-bye. i remember having one conversation where i said don't worry about, it after the first season you can do the divorced wives of beverly hills next season. >> you were already joking. at one stage quite early on in the marriage you said this, you said that camille was the most pro fond, the most rewarding, the most honest relationship of your life and it was love at first sight for you. >> you know, i think what i was trying to do was sell it to myself. you know, knowing that i didn't really have many more chances at something like that in my mind. and i thought that this was the kind of relationship i should try to have. and it just -- there was the still small voice in the back of my head saying this isn't going to work. but i stuck to it. >> how are things between you now? because you've got two children. it's been, to put it mildly, messy. and you've pretty muff kept your dignified counsel but how are things? >> it's not good. >> do you have any dialogue with her? >> no . there have been some public incidents in front of the children, things like that i'd like to avoid. there's been some attacks on kate which aren't particularly interesting but i guess you know people say all kinds of things. but none of those are true. and we've had some difficult moments. the only thing that i've ever really wanted was to try to work out something that would be nice for the kids, but -- >> how is your relationship with them? >> oh, it's great. >> you get plenty of access? >> they're doing their best to make that difficult for me right now. well, here's the thing, listen. camille asked for a divorce really almost the first day we're married. i give a piece of advice to women who say i want a divorce as some sort of tactic. if you say i want a divorce enough times, you're going to get one. >> do you think she married you because you were kelsey grammer, tv icon? >> no, i think she married me because i was frazier. >> really? simple as that? >> i think it was frazier. he had this great, wonderful life, stylish -- >> had a wonderful life. >> a little gay. he was famous. kelsey grammer is a different story. you get home and kelsey grammer is somebody different. she's said quite a few ugly things and it's not so bad that she says them public live but i know that what happens is she's actually saying them in front of kids at home. >> what's been the worst thing, the most hurtful thing she said about you? >> well, you know, i haven't been keeping track of everything. >> if there's one that you think about, what is the thing that really stunned you? >> what do you hate being called the most? what's the most unfair labelling? >> she once said that i didn't want my daughter. that pissed me off. >> it would, wouldn't it? the one thing i sense with you is you're a very committed father. you've been a fairly hopeless husband from time to time and some have been pretty useless wives but you've throughout it been a very conscientious, loving father. so that kind of thing must really hurt you. >> the thing that she said that hurt me the most, that hurt both kate and me actually, was the thing about the child we lost. >> because kate was pregnant -- >> something about it being karma. >> that's just a vicious thing to say. >> it's disgusting. so i guess that's all i have to say. >> let's have a break. let's make things happier here. let's bring things up to current day and to your new wife, kate. you finally went british. as i said at the start of this interview, if you'd just gone british earlier, kelsey, you could have saved yourself a lot of aggravation. ish you guys had layaway -- well... 'cause i could pay a little at a time... but actually we do -- and my kids would be like, "awesome, mom!" oh! i did not see that. [ male announcer ] layaway's back for christmas in our toys, electronics, and jewelry departments. ♪ got so many scratches and scars ♪ ♪ maybe time can mend us together again ♪ ♪ it's not what we've done but how far we've come ♪ ♪ i know that we will recover [ male announcer ] here when you need us most. i'm a wife, i'm a mom... and chantix worked for me. it's a medication i could take and still smoke, while it built up in my system. [ male announcer ] along with support, chantix is proven to help people quit smoking. it reduces the urge to smoke. some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal thoughts or actions while taking or after stopping chantix. if you notice any of these, stop taking chantix and call your doctor right away. tell your doctor about any history of depression or other mental health problems, which could get worse while taking chantix. don't take chantix if you've had a serious allergic or skin reaction to it. if you develop these, stop taking chantix and see your doctor right away as some can be life-threatening. if you have a history of heart or blood vessel problems, tell your doctor if you have new or worse symptoms. get medical help right away if you have symptoms of a heart attack. use caution when driving or operating machinery. common side effects include nausea, trouble sleeping and unusual dreams. my inspiration for quitting were my sons. they were my little cheering squad. [ laughs ] [ male announcer ] ask your doctor if chantix is right for you. if you all think i'm just an old slipper, well, am i a good boy? would i buy you this? i'm running with scissors! >> the brilliant "cheers" of course from paramount again. "cheers" is appropriate. we've come up to the point in interview where things take a happier turn. you're on a flight to new york? from engl