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MSNBCW All June 7, 2024



loose tomorrow. understand this. >> steve bannon gets his surrender date. >> there is no doubt that mr. knows far more. there is no doubt that all hell did break loose. >> tonight the implications of another maga foot soldier heading to prison. >> there is nothing that can shut me up. there is not a prison belt or a jail built that will ever shut me up. >> and big concerns over trump's order to install loyalists on a key house committee. >> representative perry contacted the white house in the weeks after january 6 to seek a presidential pardon. plus, as the alito flag scandal gets worse day >> breaking news, clarence thomas has wealthy friends who have occasionally been generous to him. >> stunning new details on the generous friends of clarence. don't look now, but did president biden break the world's largest oil cartel? when "all in" starts now. good evening from new york, i am chris hayes. steve bannon is going to prison. it has been a long time coming. today the former advisor to donald trump, who wears two button-down shirts on top of each other for no discernible reason, was ordered to report to prison for four months starting on july 1 for his conviction on federal contempt of congress charges nearly two years ago. bannon, you might remember, was subpoenaed in 2021 and like fellow trump advisor peter navarro and several members of congress including jim jordan and scott perry, he flatly refused to comply. did not invoke the fifth amendment, just said no, take a hike. navarro was also convicted of contempt and is currently in federal prison in miami after appealing his case all the way to the supreme court, which failed to bail him out. bannon played out a lengthy appeals process he ultimately lost. we should note this is hardly bannon's first brush with the law. you might remember in 2020 steve bannon was arrested on the aunt of a chinese billionaire and in fact if you were not bailed out by a last- minute pardon by donald trump on the last day of trump's presidency, bannon may have already been imprisoned following the federal indictment from trump's own department of justice. an indictment which says he grifted millions of dollars from hundreds of thousands of trump's supporters through phony claims that he would privately fund construction of a border wall. they did not really do it. two of his codefendants pleaded guilty to the charges. a third was convicted at trial. they are currently serving between three and five years in federal prison as part of the same plot that bannon was accused of being part of. bannon, however, was spared that fate by his former boss after january 6 when bannon proved himself to be a vital ally during the attempted coup, including, as the january 6 committee revealed, frequent contact with trump in the hours before the insurrection. >> while certain close associates of president trump privately expressed concerns about what would occur on january 6, other members of the inner circle spoke with great anticipation of the events to come. the committee learned from white house phone logs that the president spoke to steve bannon, his close advisor, at least twice on january 5. the first conversation they had lasted for 11 minutes. from those same phone logs we know the president and mr. bannon spoke again that evening for six minutes. >> we also know bannon was an advisor to the group of trump allies who met at their so- called command center at the willard hotel in washington, d.c. ahead of january 6 to plot ways to steal the election. according to bob word word and robert costa, bannon was at the willard when trump called him on the night of january 5 and to be clear, bannon was not trying to hide his involvement in this scheme. in the days and weeks before january 6 he dedicated hours of his daily podcast to the big lie and the stolen election, often dropping less than subtle hints that something explosive was in the works. >> people are getting fired up. people are getting matter, as they should. mike pence, his moment of destiny awaits him and it is coming on 6 january. it is the clarity that january 6 is going to be the day or one of these big days and we had to converge everything down to january 6. starting tomorrow it's going to be wild. it is incredible. you can be part of history. we want as many people to get here as possible. his first term is ending with action and his second term will start with a bang. all hell is going to break loose tomorrow, just understand this. >> now almost two years after being convicted, steve bannon is going to prison. that's not all, because bannon is also facing a state indictment in new york, once again for the same scheme to rip off diehard trump's supporters and still their money from them. just like everyone else in trump world, bannon likes to whine about vengeance coming for people who put him away. the real explanation is much simpler. donald trump is a criminal convicted on 34 felony counts who surrounds himself with other criminals like steve bannon and peter navarro and his longtime political operative roger stone who trump sprung from jail and paul manafort, former campaign manager sentenced to 7 1/2 years on prison on a fraud conviction. rick gates, the deputy campaign manager who got prison time on charges of conspiracy and lying to the fbi. and george papadopoulos who did a stint in prison for lying to investigators about his contacts with russia. he also got a pardon and of course michael cohen who got sentenced to three years in prison for the work he did for donald trump, partly for his role in the stormy daniels hush money scheme among other charges and allen weisselberg, who is currently as i speak to you in a cell at rikers island awaiting a payment from trump to keep his mouth shut. so, steve bannon joins a rogues gallery of trump associates going to prison and he can talk all he wants about revenge. his number one concern should be finding a guest host for his podcast for four months. joining me now is glenn kirschner, former federal prosecutor who was inside the courtroom with steve bannon today. he has covered steve bannon extensively, even once getting kicked out of his 2020 rooftop election party, which is a great sentence letter. he also is the author of a new piece on the dangers of a second trump term. you were in the court today. i guess there was an open question about whether the judge would say times up, time to go to prison. how did it play out? >> chris, not only was it an open question, i think most of us were on the edge of our seats because you really could not read where the judge was going. the prosecutor, a former colleague of mine from the u.s. attorney's office made a very compelling argument as to why, now that the appellate court definitively shot down the one legal issue that the judge said was kind of an open question in his mind, which is what prompted him to allow steve bannon to remain on release pending appeal. he got up and made what i thought were valid points and as he was questioning the prosecutor and the defense attorney, you really could not read where judge nichols was going to land and i think it wasn't until the very end of his announced findings that it became clear that he said now that the appellate court has basically definitively resolved the one question of law that judge nichols thought might be available to win steve bannon some relief on appeal, then he kind of brought the hammer down. he said you will report to the federal bureau of prisons no later than july 1 to begin serving your sentence and then something happened that rarely happens in federal court. i saw david shown sprint up to the lectern and i can tell you from being in that courthouse for years, usually you wait for an invitation from the judge before you approach the lectern. he was loud and he was angry and the judge really had to put him in his place. i don't know if that was performance for bannon or someone above bannon, but it was clear the judge made up his mind and would not revisit this ruling. >> they all, as far as i can tell, everyone in that world likes to throw temper tantrums and further toys on the floor when they get upset that something does not go their way. there are two aspects. one is that he has this professional wrestling shtick that he does. i am steve bannon and i am so tough and scary and you should all be scared. settle down, magneto. we are going to be fine. in some ways there is a level in which the cover-up kind of worked. you know we never got the testimony from him. there was a reason he wanted to keep shut about it. now he will do four months in prison. >> steve bannon is such a weird character in my life, because i feel like many political reporters, he has been this person i've had to deal with for like a decade at this point, right? he was a subject of mine. he has been a source of mine. he ran one of the kind of most poisonous right-wing media outlets in america for a while. he helped get trump elected, he is in the white house and throughout all of this, i will say as an aside to your point, i often struggled with how to depict him, because he clearly was one of these people who enjoyed so much being depicted as like a super villain character that i sometimes wondered if i was like doing his bidding by contributing to that characterization, but what i will say is steve bannon eventually, you know, throughout all of this time, just acted with complete impunity. i remember when he was pardoned on the last day of trump's presidency, feeling like talking to other reporters about this and this guy would never be held accountable. he escaped accountability. what has been interesting in the past several years is watching all these people in trump's orbit, one by one, actually face accountability, including donald trump himself. it kind of culminated with his conviction. it is kind of a surreal moment for journalists like me and people who have been following trump and his allies for so long, seeing them finally kind of get their comeuppance. it is almost hard to fathom. >> in this case, the sentence is the duration of a semester abroad, so it is not a long sentence, but he is not out of the woods. the new york case against him, as we said before, the other folks as part of this scheme, doing 3 to 5 years. he is staring down very serious criminal liability this fall and maybe commuting to that trial from some federal penitentiary. >> and as you said in your lead- in, but for a presidential pardon previously for largely the same charges, although in federal court. he will now be charged in state court in new york. he could already be in prison. it feels like we are forever thirsting for accountability and it so rarely comes. but if we now look at the fact that navarro was serving a prison term. steve bannon has been ordered to report to prison on july 1 and donald trump will be sentenced for 34 felony convictions on july 11. dare i say accountability might be trending at this point. >> yes, justice grinding slow, but exceedingly fine at this point. the last thing is there is so much open talk now. we are going to prosecute our political enemies because they are our political enemies. they dropped any pretext. we are going to use the tools of the state to put people in prison. frankly authoritarian promises. what you make of those promises? >> i mean this is the danger. frankly even the way we have these conversations about accountability. we should make clear the reason it is good that accountability has come is because there was always a lot of evidence. >> correct. and a long process of a trial and appeals. yes, all of that. >> right. right and what donald trump has done is skipped that part when he talks about prosecuting his political enemies. he is saying and his allies are saying, and i have spoken to his allies. the whole notion of an independent justice department should be consigned to history. it is now the explicit promise that trump in a second term will use the justice system to go after political enemies, whether or not they have committed crimes and that is the important difference. i think there are a lot of people that worry about prosecuting the former president and i understand those concerns. when there is so much evidence of criminality and a jury decides he is guilty, that is the system working. when you weaponize the justice department to go after people because they oppose you politically, that is authoritarianism. i think we need to be really careful about drawing that distinction. >> both good talkers. both possible fill-in host if steve bannon is looking, just throwing it out there. thank you both. coming up, melissa murray joins me on the incomparable side hustle of the exact justice you are expecting it to be, next. the color's nice, that's a swell lid for you, baby! finding the exact date on ancestry that our family business was founded, really struck a chord with 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that big bar on the left is clarence thomas compared to all other justices who served during this time. melissa murray is a professor at the new york university school of law. cohost of the strict scrutiny podcast. she joins me now. i have to say at some level we new bits and pieces of this. there has been an amazing series of articles that won the pulitzer about all of the gifts thomas has gotten, but am i wrong to say generational scandal for the court? >> i think you are exactly right. we have seen this trickle out piecemeal, but having it in the aggregate really does make clear the expanse of the grift. i think that is the right term for it. it is a graft and if you think about thomases salary, it is roughly equal to the amount of the gifts that fix the court has identified. that is actually quite staggering. he has managed to amass day >> the cumulative gross pay over that period is about $4.6 million. total gifts over $4 million. he is serving two masters. he is working for, you know, the american people and then he's got -- >> which american people? let's talk about that. it has been said, look where your treasure is, for there your heart will be also. it is not surprising that some of the individuals linked to these gifts, like the koch brothers network which has had clarence thomas speak at donor events for example, happens to be deeply involved in a set of challenges to the regulatory state. these are cases we are still waiting for the court to decide, but we already know where the koch brothers would like justice thomas to be. now we are waiting to find out, have they made enough payments? we don't know, but that is where all of this is going. >> part of the argument people make in defense of thomases that he was always a conservative anyway and these are his friends hooking him up. >> it is not unconstitutional to have friends. i want to be clear about that. you have a right to have friends, even rich friends. i think where the optics become more problematic is that we are seeing individuals essentially donate funds to the court to keep the conservative super majority in play. there has been a lot of reporting by the new york times last year about justice thomas complaining about his small judicial salary, which is actually quite significant relevant -- relative to what other americans make. maybe he would not stay on the court and these wealthy interests wind, no, no, no, let's figure out how to keep you on the court and keep you happy and suddenly you see the money rolling in. >> this is a key point. i also want to talk about the delay on the immunity case, because it is not surprising. i think they tipped their hand. first they would not let jack smith jumped to the supreme court, even though we knew they would want to weigh in. even though they did it on covid cases and student debt. then they sat on it for a while before the announced arguments. then they announced arguments on the last day. now it has been six weeks. >> i said this a million times. by the time the supreme court weighs in on this, this court must say at some point that there is no absolute immunity for any president, but there may be details about what is public and private and on the outer perimeter. >> a holy invented doctrine, to be clear. >> whatever they decide is purely epidemic -- purely academic because they have immunized this defendant from liability from these criminal charges and that is kind of all that matters right now. >> i want to play you this clip from alito's neighbor who was in a sort of verbal altercation with him and his wife and gave an interview. she is making this point that when the flag went up, alito says it was about this verbal altercation. he went to a fox news reporter who reported exactly what he said and did not do additional reporting. here is his neighbor talking

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