if we don't fix it more downgrades of our economy are coming. the president rolling out some changes to his tenth housing plan today in one of america's hardest hit cities, las vegas. >> if you meet certain requirements you will have the chance to refinance at lower rates which could save you hundreds of dollars a month and thousands of dollars a year on mortgage payments. >> in a nutshell the plan increases the number of home owners eligible to refinance. now the administration says it would allow more of the five to seven million under water home owners who are still current on their mortgage payments to refinance. the administration is pushing for a rate of about 4% for those refis. we had two key questions. one, will the plan increase housing prices? well the chief economist of real estate website zillow website told us, even if the plan is fully implemented and everything is perfect, prices of homes may not rise. that was not the answer we were hoping for. two, will it work overall? ken rosen is an economist who helped write the original housing plan and told us he is very skeptical it will be implemented successfully, because it only backs mortgages handled by fannie mae and freddie mac. we don't have enough people to handle this many refis because unemployment has plunged 55% since the crisis. the bottom line is this though. even though there are questions about the plan we have a very big hole to dig out of on housing which at its peak was about 20% of the entire american economy. meantime we have more self-inflicted wounds like a congress that can't promise to make a deal to avoid more downgrades of america's debt which will cause interest rates for all americans to rise. will cane is a contributor here at cnn, contributor to theblaze.com. bill rady is former ceo and chairman of mtv international and author of "what makes business rock." thanks to all of you for being with us. i guess let's start with you, tim, since you're coming here from the democratic side. do you think that this plan can get it done? i mean obviously the president has been trying all these various options in part because congress hasn't been able to step up and do more. >> that's right. first of all i think it's important to remember that the housing economy is about 18% to 19% of our economy so one thing everybody agrees on is we can't do nothing. what i think the president was saying today is pretty simple where we can facilitate home owners who are in their homes and can make payments but at a lower interest rate. let's do that if that means keeping home owners in their homes. but the key part of the president's message i think is probably getting a little lost in the coverage today is what the president also said is that our housing problem is really an unemployment problem. foreclosure is largely a result of people being unemployed and that's why the president is out there pushing his jobs plan which economists say will create about 1.9 million jobs. you'll see the president continuing to push that because i think that is the most important part of the housing program. >> obviously housing and jobs are linked. it's a chicken and egg sort of issue or cycle. what do you think though? just in terms of the politics of whether this sort of thing can get done? deals like this for the reason they haven't worked is because it's not just getting the borrower and bank onboard but a lot of other people own the mortgages and it gets very complicated. >> right. tim talked about the president's message. i'd say it's part of the way he's selling it. he's selling it with the tag, we can't wait. it sounds nice, but in a government where we have separation of powers, three branches of government, checks and balances, sounds a little bit odd to say, we can't wait. we just have to do something. on the actual economics of the program i'm pessimistic. it seems like tinkering around the edges. the core problem is we have people in homes they cannot afford. that is not about the interest rate but their principal. until we solve that housing continues to be a problem. >> many people have backed off that issue, because a lot of people could take the hit. taxpayers, banks. bill, what do you think, though? is our problem here that we just need to accept that it's going to take a long time for asset prices and for most people that's their most valuable asset their home? they still have to fall. we can't stop it. >> yeah. there are some parts of what will just said i agree with but on the other hand every little bit helps. although this was a little bit, but i think i would go for anything that helps and i think that's what he's doing. i think you're right. it is going to take a long time to sort this out and there are much worse problems by the way when it comes to housing. i just came from britain and i think there is a terrible problem there. of course greece, which we can talk about and europe but it's just going to take a long time to sort this out. every little bit helps. >> i want to talk about the other big issue in washington but also europe. since you brought it up, obviously the biggest trading partner for the united states, not just a peripheral issue everyone. this is front and center to whether america can get out of our crisis. angela merkel and nicolas sarkozy an odd couple indeed. there they are and they're angry at each other and that's humorous i suppose but it's also dead serious. you spent a whole career over there. are they going to get out of this or are they going to send us into another recession? >> we designed a business that was based on country specific so anything that goes across different nationalities and languages i think -- >> i.e. 17 of them? >> have you ever heard 17 people agree on anything? especially if they speak different languages and are from different cultures. the real tragedy is sarkozy had to not be there for the birth because he had to meet yet again with merkel. you know, just think of the endless hours the policy makers have been spending on this, the bureaucracy. we discovered a long time ago you have to, all politics is local. people ultimately care about their own country. and think about the poor greeks. yes, the stereotype is the beauty, beautician who had a pension at age 50 but i asked a taxi driver who was there last month because they always know the true story. a greek taxi driver, what do you think? they said, gosh. i don't know. my pension is going down. my taxes are going up. my benefits are going down. the germans hate us and the eu won't give us any respect and the brand is ruined forever. the greek brand. he said, you know, you have a phrase for it. it's all greek to me. >> bill and i were talking back stage. you're telling me thousands of years of separate traditions and cultures didn't melt into a single entity in the euro zone? that doesn't end until it breaks up or it becomes a single political unity. the interesting thing is, it's not that different than housing. this doesn't end until we liquidate housing or have principal reduction. tinkering in the middle won't get it done. >> you raise a fair point. the u.s. has to be prepared for europe to break up. they have to be prepared for it which brings us to congress and how congress isn't getting anything done. tim, let me ask you whether congress in your view is actually going to do something that will shock the world, create confidence, and get our economy back ontrack and that is do a deal with the super committee, a grand bargain? >> i think they'll certainly do a deal. i think the question is how big that deal is going to be. i think most people look at the super committee and think they'll make some changes in terms of spending cuts, spending reductions but i think that giant kind of tax and spending grand bargain is going to be elusive probably until next year. one thing is that people don't realize is that the sequestration, the cuts that are automatically triggered don't actually take place for a year so the thing that everybody knows has to happen, tax increases, cuts to spending, entitlement spending, discretionary spending, everybody knows the formula. the real pressure is not going to be until after this year. >> well that is not going -- we can't afford from a market perspective -- we can't afford this to be a countdown again and afford to go into automatic cuts whether they happen next year or not. it's just bad for the country. >> tim and i have to agree. i'm pessimistic. any credible long-term plans require tax increases, revenue increases, entitlement cuts. congress shows no propensity to do either of those. >> i do a lot of work in countries around the world. it used to be we had the best system. the question no one is asking, is this really a best system? should we be a parliamentary system? clearly it is dysfunctional. nothing is happening. it's destroying -- you said it earlier -- confidence. the whole economic situation is probably based on confidence. >> it is. >> i live in britain. i thought the brits were pretty bad on themselves. i've never seen this country in such a funk. there is no confidence. there is no x factor. i think you'll have to get x factor back. >> not the best model right now. >> i don't know. when you point one finger three come back. i think right now nothing is working. >> thanks to all three of you. we'll leave it there. viewers let us know what you think whether we should dry a different system. just a macro question. because we can't afford this thing to be a countdown again opinion >> wow. >> they got to step up. courage, courage in congress could lead to confidence. all right. still out front moammar gadhafi's body has been in a libyan meat locker for five days. the latest from the michael jackson death trial. and what the defense must do to save conrad murray and oh, we can't resist. a much younger barack obama than we're used to especially because the job of president ages you. oh, but we can't resist showing you the new president. americans are always ready to work hard for a better future. since ameriprise financial was founded back in 1894, they've been committed to putting clients first. helping generations through tough times. good times. never taking a bailout. there when you need them. helping millions of americans over the centuries. the strength of a global financial leader. the heart of a one-to-one relationship. together for your future. ♪ i got it, i'm sorry. these people, huh? you know i've found that anger is the enemy of instruction. you don't know the egos that i have to deal with. you're probably right. thank you! whoever you are. i'm pretty sure that was phil jackson. he's quite famous... million championships... triangle offense innovator... [ male announcer ] the audi a8. named best large luxury sedan. nice wheels zen master. thank you...todd. ♪ the number tonight, zero. that's how many ribs are in a mcrib sandwich. the favorite is going to be returning to mcdonald's nationwide but only through november 14th. to promote the return of the mcrib mcdonald's has launched a game called the quest for the golden mcrib. what is in a mcrib sandwich, since it's not a rib? it is a boneless pork patty that includes barbecue sauce, sliced onions and pickles but is not for those on a diet. 500 calories, 26 grams of fat. 40% of the daily recommended fat intake. oh, mcdonald's. all right. libya, word tonight from a military spokesman in tripoli it is highly likely the body of moammar gadhafi will be buried at a secret location tomorrow. this comes after men lined up for days to see the decaying remains of gadhafi who was shot in the head last thursday. his body has been laid out in a meat locker four or five days. the line of people parading through to look at him frankly is barbaric. it's a sign that in libya home to the world's largest light sweet crude oil reserves there is still a real struggle for anyone to take charge. cnn's dan rivers has spent days reporting on the bizarre scene and joined us moments ago from tripoli. >> reporter: it's extraordinary, yeah. i don't know how it's allowed to happen frankly. it's dragged on for as you say getting on for five days now. and we think now there is a possibility that he will be buried either tonight or tomorrow local time here but this has been a really embarrassing episode i think for the new government here. it's marred the declaration of liberation for this country. there's still lots of questions about how he died and just questions about the ethics and morality of treating a body like this no matter who it is. you know, he's a human being and they said they'd treat his body with dignity. they said he would be buried in accordance with muslim traditions and so far they haven't stuck to that. they have carried out an autopsy, yes, but we still don't know the full results of that. all we know is that he was shot in the head but we don't know at what range and so it's, you know, these questions about whether he was executed rather than killed in a cross fire continue and from the u.n. down ward people want answers to these questions. >> they do. it certainly will say a lot as to whether the national transitional council can govern even if it has the will. does it have the ability? wanted to ask you, dan, about moammar gadhafi's son, his heir apparent, who according to officials in libya is potentially on the border trying to escape. what can you tell us about that? >> well, i think we have to be a little skeptical about claims concerning any of the gadhafi family especially safa who has according to them been captured or hospitalized or surrounded or involved in a gun battle. we've had a different rumor almost every day in the last week but the latest we were hearing from one source is that he is down south somewhere attempting presumably to flee over the border. but frankly until we actually have some conclusive proof i think we have to be pretty careful about putting too much credence in that. >> all right. we shall see. thanks so much. >> sure. >> all right. we looked into what ongoing civil war in libya could mean for oil prices given there are 140 tribes and clear concern over who is in charge. an expert oil analyst ran the numbers for us and says if there is fighting prices for oil could go back above their arab spring highs to as much as $125 a barrel. now here in the united states that translates into $4.50 per gallon of gas. what happens in libya sure matters here. if you think libya matters, it's really nothing compared to saudi arabia. the kingdom of saudi arabia is the most important country in the world for stable oil and gasoline prices and tonight there are serious succession questions for the monarchy. with the crowned prince of saudi dying on friday night the next in line to the saudi throne is prince nayef the conservative chief of saudi's feared secret police. he is 78 years old and is tightly allied with the religious clerics in saudi arabia. he is known for opposing the rights of women to drive or other rights. king abdula is a much more liberal force, at least 87 years old and has spent a lot of time recently in hospitals in morocco and new york. the fact that we do not know their exact ages is indicative of how new the saudi monarchy is. their father was the first king and succession passes from son to son. when this generation dies there are thousands of princes who could rule. experts hope the succession will be smooth but if it is not the country's instability would rock the world. again, if king abdulah dies and the west becomes comfortable with prince nayef oil would still go up 5 to 10 dollars a barrel. if nayef makes an allegiance to them, it could jump as much as $20 a barrel. if there is saudi unrest or disorderly transition to the next generation oil could go get this $200 a barrel. that would send prices here in the u.s. as high as $8 a gallon. succession in saudi arabia is a big story around the world. the prosecution wrapped up the state's case today against dr. conrad murray. now his defense team has a turn to try to poke holes in the state's theory that murray's reckless use of the drug propofol which was used to help michael jackson sleep, makes the doctor criminally responsible for the star's death. ted rowlands was in the courtroom for us today. so the defense now has the floor. what are the holes that they can try to exploit? >> well, one thing the prosecution's theory dictates is that michael jackson died from an i.v. drip and the problem they have is that at the scene at jackson's house they didn't find that i.v. cord anywhere. that's something i think the defense will try to work through and get that message across to the jury. the other thing they have to do is try to rehabilitate murray's reputation somehow through character witnesses. >> i know a lot of defense witnesses did take the stand today after the state rested. is anyone going to be the star for them? >> absolutely. paul white is an anesthesiologist and he is basically the other side to what the prosecution put up. and he does have qualifications. the key will be whether white's theory of what could have happened will resonate with this jury because the prosecution's expert witnesses surely it seems did. the jury really was locked into their testimony. >> all right, ted. thanks. talk to you soon. outfront next new developments in the baby lisa case. police spotted something unusual on security camera footage. we'll tell you about that. and the latest from iowa. rick perry pushing a flat tax. will it be enough to win over that state's voters. they carry a lot of weight. and a story we can't resist. barack obama like you have never and really i can say that there's only one or two people on the planet who may have seen him like this before. [ tires screech ] [ crying ] [ applause ] [ laughs ] [ tires screech ] [ male announcer ] your life will have to flash by even faster. autodrive brakes on the cadillac srx activate after rain is detected to help improve braking performance. we don't just make luxury cars. we make cadillacs. now a story we can't resist. a collectible company called ashton drape galleries has released a new barack obama doll. that's not that unusual. we have seen dolls honoring presidents in the past. there was george washington. there was teddy roosevelt. eisenhower, g.i. jfk. and of course this is a little strange 2008's cabbage patch candidates. but it's not even the first time this particular company has reproduced famous people. they've made dolls of lucille ball and kate middleton has a doll now. they've even made one of the president's wife michelle like she is now. but what makes the new doll so unusual is that it's depicting president obama as a life like baby. the president barack obama commemorative baby doll is made of collector quality vinyl dressed in blue shorts, white booties and a t-shirt that reads the birth of hope. priced to move at $150. reviews have been mixed with some reviewers on amazon calling it horrible, over priced, and some scary. speaking of scary dolls this gives us an excuse to play a clip from the 1998 "killer doll" movie "bride of chucky." ♪ >> now! >> okay. it wasn't that scary but still. ooh. we just couldn't resist. still "outfront." the outfront five, a big idea. in washington everybody hates each other and it's hurting america. how do you fix it, elmo? hunting for votes i want to make the tax code so simple that even timothy geithner can get his taxes in on time. a disturbing theory. >> he had the baby in his arms and had the baby's head kind of like this. >> where is baby lisa? >> kind of frightening actually. >> all of this "outfront" in our second half. the postal service is critical to our economy-- delivering mail, medicine and packages. yet they're closing thousands of offices, slashing service, and want to lay off over 100,000 w