i'm don lemon. tonight, the phone hacking scandal is playing out like a summer movie thriller. new developments exploding like robots in a transformer movie. the top two officials resign from scotland yard and david cameron cuts short a foreign trip as calls for his resignation appear in the british press. now, most disturbingly, sean hoare, one two of the whistle-blowing journalists that brought it to light was found dead in his home. rebecca brooks was arrested this weekend after resigning as ceo of news corp. she is expected to testify tomorrow. this is not her first time appearing before parliament, the clip i'm showing you is from 2003. watch closely. brooks testifying with andy coulson. coulson went on to become david cameron's spokesman and has since resigned and has been arrested in the scandal. >> can i ask, the one element if you ever pay the bliss for information? >> we have paid police for information in the past, and it's been -- >> will you do it in the put? >> it depends on -- >> within the code and within the law, there is a clear public interest and the same holds for private detectives, subterfuge. >> it's illegal for police officers to receive payments. >> no, no, no. i just said within the law. >> this is not only the beginning of the scandal. it's the beginning of the news corporation's attempts at damage control. coulson stepping in to blunt brooks' answers. i spoke with the other british whistleblower about the death of sean hoare and about the spread of allegations of illegal practices up the chain of command at news corp. here are the other stories we're digging into tonight, first. deadline, do they know what the word means in washington? two weeks to go, no compromise in sight. time is running out. don't ask, don't tell. the president repealed it last year. but it's still in legal limbo. this decorated west point grad served his country in iraq and afghanistan, and was discharged for being gay. he wants to know, what's taking so long? then, japan's reason to hope. inspired by the women's soccer team that could. defying a season of disaster, in a land of darkness. is the sun rising again? i want to get back to our top story, in-depth look into the phone hacking scandal at rupert murdoch's news corp. matthew, first to sean hoare's death, not suspicious, that's what police say, but certainly a strange turn of ooenchevents. >> another bizarre twist. sean hoare, one of the main whistle blowers, first journalist to go on record to accuse andy coulson, former editor of "news of the world" and former director for david cameron, not just knowing about the phone tapping that he alleges went but condoning it and encouraging it. he appeared in the press with more controversy. saying that they had access to sensitive police technology for cash payments, by using what's called pinging to pinpoint through mobile phone signals, the whereabouts of people they wanted to track down. that was another scandal he blew the whistle on, a few moments before he was found dead. we don't know the exact reason for his death at this point. there will be an autopsy i suspect. another twist in the ongoing saga. >> by the time we finish the segment on the show, things could have changed already. two to the british police officials resigned. john yates resigned today. another resigned yesterday. two top officials have resigned. >> it has shaken the metropolitan police. one of the biggest police forces in the world, in fact. toi to its core. stephenson stepping down 24 hours ago, and yates doing the same thing, all because of the linkage they have and the -- you know, the contact they've had with various officials from news international and with this phone hacking scandal. the ipcc, the independent press complaints committee here, obviously an independent body which examines misconduct, it's launching its own investigation into the way police have handled this, investigation into the top two figures at the metropolitan place and the conduct of at least two other former senior officials of the metropolitan police, how they conducted themselves with the phone tapping and how they sort of interacted with journalists over the past several years. don. >> let's look ahead to tomorrow, rupert murdoch, james murdoch, rebekah brooks to testify in house of commons. what can we expect from this? >> the big box office will be rupert murdoch, one of the world's most powerful media moguls, sitting in front of members of parliament in the british house of commons, being cross-examined essentially about what he knew at news international, news corp, about this phone hacking scandal, we are expecting to hear much less from rebekah brooks, former ceo of news international. editor of "news of the world" as with she's already been arrested so there is a police investigation into her conduct and her -- what she's been up to. and so she's going to be much more con stained as to what she'll be able to see legally to the mps, who will be asking questions. also constraints on what the mps can ask rebekah brooks. they don't want to jeopardize the ongoing criminal investigation into what brooks may or may not have done. an interesting day to watch tomorrow. >> matthew chance in london tonight, thank you very much. now more on in-depth coverage. together with sean hoare, paul mcmullan was one of the first to go on record alleging illegal activity. he was a features executive. whatever you think of his behavior as a tabloid journalist, is he one of the few to blow the whistle on news corp behavior. mcmullan used to work with rebekah brooks and his professional relationship with her did not end on happy terms. also, we reached out to the spokespeople for brooks, andy coulson and news corporation for their response to mcmullan's allegations. we haven't heard from them at this time, but when we do, we'll pass their response along to you. i spoke with paul mcmullan earlier and asked how being caught up in the story is affecting him. >> i've got at least one story -- and someone else keeps ringing me up. three people on twitter pretending to be me, sending tweets to my family and friends, now concerned about my mental health because other people are pretending to be me. i bought a bar six or seven months ago, it's not safe for me to stand behind my own bar. someone tried to throw a glass in my face. so many people, particularly mps, in britain, are taking credit for taking apart murdoch's empire. it was sean hoare. he was a good guy. stood up for good values in journalism and so disappointed that andy coulson, who regularly asked him to hack into people's phones, you know, the master of the dark arts turned round when we started getting caught. it wasn't us, so it wasn't me, it was the reporters, and the reporters now are getting, you know, arrested or brought into scotland yard. time and time again, rebekah brooks said we knew nothing about it it wasn't us. and andy coulson said it wasn't us, and that made sean hoare angry it made me angry. you generally shouldn't throw your sheep to the wolves. >> was he worried about something, did he have issues because of the scandal? >> he -- well, i mean, i felt quite stressed for the last two or three weeks particularly, i think my blood pressure is a bit raised. and if you've got an existing i believe heart condition, he looked a bit of a mess recently. and the stress of this wouldn't have helped. i don't think he was bumped off. i don't think he committed suicide, there was suggestion from one of our friends that rang me up two minutes ago, but i don't think that's the case. i think he was in fading, ill health. he was disgusted the way his boss, and former friend, andy coulson, behaved. and he wanted that brought into the public domain. and he's well done. the guy got sacked, as he indeed should be, and he got arrested. and i carried on the good work, and rebekah brooks has been arrested and next guy up, will that be rupert murdoch's own son? it might be, and all because someone crossed a boss who stabbed him in the back. >> was rebekah brooks aware of these practices? was she aware? >> i have to say without a doubt. i don't know anyone at the paper, including freelance photographers that it was going on. quite a few people were disappointed. this was going back to the 1990s, and if everyone knew in the 1990s, when she was still features editor. did she edit with fingers in her ears and hands over her eyes? i don't think so. >> do you think rupert murdoch was aware of these practices? >> i don't think he was, no. i only met him once in the office as a saturday night as the paper was going to press, and he actually came across to me as almost a decent man, above the kind of -- the news of the world. basically, all about people having affairs. sometimes it's almost written as almost soft porn, the way a politician drops his trousers around his ankles and so on, and i almost got the impression that murdoch didn't support that, but it made a sufficient amount of money for him not to interfere. >> you believe james murdoch, he was aware of these practices, and by default, encouraged them? >> yeah, i mean where i started on this and where i started blowing the whistle was -- it was from the point of view of the story, and i remember hiding in rebekah brooks' front garden. quite rainy, not a very pleasant job, and just waiting for them to horse ride together just -- just to illustrate the point that we have james murdoch, we have rebekah brooks and we have a man who wants to be prime minister, just a matter of weeks before the election and this is how they plan it, and this is how close they are, and maybe someone should bring this to light. and i went to all of the hub restaurants and hotels where they have went and tried to build up a picture of just how close these people were and maybe too close. >> you mentioned david cameron, the current prime minister, who has a cozy relationship, by all accounts, with the murdoches. >> yes. >> and with the people at news of the world. >> yes. >> what do you make of that? was he aware of this? was his relationship in your estimation too cozy? >> yeah. i have made my own submission to parliament. they requested my take on it. only two viewpoints of david cameron's association with rebekah brooks. he's either a complete liar or a total idiot. he is either lying about knowing it, and if you lie in parliament, that's perjury, a 2 1/2 year potential jail term. you're not supposed to do that. >> you're making some pretty bold assertions here and some will say speculation. have you told this to police? and do you intend to testify to all of these issues that you have spoken about to us here? the prime minister's involvement? brooks' involvement? james murdoch's involvement? do you tend to go on record with this? >> i would go on the record to parliame parliament. i wouldn't go on record to the police. the police aren't showing themselves to be exactly trustworthy in britain be at the moment. and my former colleague, sean hoare, refused to cooperate with the police and that was a fair tact to take. we only have freedom of speech in britain in one place and that's the houses of parliament. and i think i'll leave it for that. >> paul mcmullan, thank you. >> all right, thanks. still adhere tonight, the murdoch way. when you're up against it, the best defense say good offense. that tactic has worked in the past, but with murdoch facing the british parliament and u.s. legal system, i'll ask media critic and legal analyst dan abrams, will it work now? 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(in chinese) ask me why i never want to leave my ergo. ask me why i'm glad i didn't wait 'till i was too old to enjoy this. start asking real owners. ask me how to make your first move... find out more about the tempur advanced ergo system! call the number on your screen for your free dvd and information kit. to find an authorized dealer near you, visit tempurpedic.com. tempur-pedic. the most highly recommended bed in america. more on our in-depth story. the hacking scandal taking down people on both sides of the pond. we have seen resignations of two top police officials. dan abrams joins me now, founder of mediaite.com and an abc news analyst. >> good to see you, don. a long time. >> what do you make of the newsroom culture? >> i think you have to still evaluate it. newsroom by newsroom. right? can you imagine if at time warper, everyone started evaluating all of the properties together. as opposed to evaluating them individually. now, some people say murdoch is different. a culture. at the murdoch properties that make them different. that may or may not be the case. but as a legal matter, you've got to evaluate it separately. "the wall street journal," separate from "the sun," separate from "news of the world," separate from fox news channel. >> you have to admit that rupert murdoch has had an influence on the world. >> no question. >> so why wouldn't that trickle down in the company as well if he can do it around the world? >> it's fair for us in the media to be asking about it, right? fair for us to be saying what's the culture there? is this sort of indicative of a bigger problem in the media, but as a legal matter, and you just laid this segment out by talking about the arrest. we're talking about serious stuff here. so i'm not going to sort of look at this with a broad brush. instead, it's really important when you are talking about these very serious allegations, to look at it entity by entity, and there is no evidence up to this point that the american institutions, "the wall street journal," fox news channel, et cetera, were engaged in any kind of the conduct we're talking about. >> what are the legal implications for that culture, f rupert murdoch, rebekah brooks. >> some of the british leaders of the organizations are facing some serious allegations. >> and james murdoch, the son as well. >> he's a separate issue. he will me first talk about the people directly responsible. they are facing allegations with regard to interceptioning communication. hacking. phone hacking. if that turns out to be the case and people here did it, they could be investigated as well. that's a crime in england, a crime in the united states. the bigger concern i think for the empire, as a whole, is that the u.s. authorities are now investigating, the fbi is investigating with regard to 9/11 victims, but also federal laws. >> right. >> that basically prevent an organization from paying off foreign officials. so usually it means paying off for a contract. like you want to get a special contract with a foreign government, you can't effectively give them bribes or you'll be prosecuting in the united states. there's some saying that law could be used to prosecute news corp here in the united states, but i think to do that, there is going to have to be some knowledge on the part of the u.s. officials that this was going on and you heard in your previous interview there, that even he was saying he didn't think murdoch had knowledge of this. >> it is probably below his pay grade, if you know what i mean. you heard rebekah brooks being asked about that, and she said, yes, did we pay police? yes, yes. later she tried to come back and clarify. >> she's been arrested. we can focus on rebekah brooks, but she's been arrested. with regard to her, the authorities are going after her. no doubt with it. >> i'm sure you read "the wall street journal" and saw what the editorial board put in. phone hacking is illegal, and it's up to british authorities to enforce their laws. if scotland yard failed to do so adequating when the hacking was first uncovered several years ago, that is more troubling than the hacking itself. are they putting the blame on somebody else? >> this is classic for a murdoch operation. >> okay. >> which is to go on offense as good defense. i don't think that's very smart right now. if they were under less skrut snow and under less trouble, i would say go after it. but considering how much is going on on the legal front, that's almost taunting people to say, yeah, you know what? bring it on. they are the problem. the authorities, not us. >> you're reporting on this, mediaite, we're reporting on it, abc, do you think this is schodenfreid reporting? they say any competitor that is saying this is gloating. we also trust that readers can see through the commercial and ideological motives of cower competitor critics. the schadenfreude is so thick you can't cut it with a chainsaw. >> i think in some respects they are right. i think there are some glee among competitors. >> but it's a big story. >> i'm saying that i think there is glee, and yet the problem with making a statement like that is it suggests it's not a real story, as you point out. it is a real story. it say legitimate story, but that doesn't mean -- there are many sfoers legitimate and real where people reporting on it seem to have a great enjoyment or glee in reporting it. >> i got to get onto this. rupert murdoch's future as ceo, head of the company? >> there are reports tonight suggesting that maybe he could think about stepping down, et cetera. look, i think that's going to be a business decision. >> who would do it? >> i think he would -- i think he felt -- >> who would take his place? >> i think some of the people currently in the leadership would take over. >> chase carrie? >> i don't know. purely my guessing, based on what i'm reading would be chase carey. we should be careful. i think they are considering that, but i wouldn't be surprised if they are also suggesting that to tell the world, we're taking this really seriously. i promise you, we are not taking this lightly. so whether he actually steps down or not, i don't know. but i think if in the end it came down to saving his company or not, giving up the title at his age, would that be something he would consider? i think so. >> good to see up. >> don, as always. >> and as always, great analysis. dan abrams, we appreciate it. senate leaders say they'll stay in session every day, even through the weekends, until a deal on the debt ceiling. but is that enough to break what feels like a never-ending stalemate? we'll ask david gergen and gloria borgen. ith three strains of good bacteria to help balance your colon. you had me at "probiotic." 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