university. following that, services at the carter presidential library. and two days later, a funeral service for family and friends at the baptist church in plains, georgia, where the former president taught sunday school for decades. the news continues. "the source" with kaitlan "the source" with kaitlan collins starts now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com tonight, a remarkable clash underway inside the appeals court that is wrestling with the scope of donald trump's gag order. we'll take you inside the heated arguments that happened today. plus the white house is hopeful that negotiations between israel and hamas for the release of the hostages are, quote, close to the end. the aunt of a 3-year-old israeli american being held in gaza who sure hopes so will speak with us in moments. and a tech titan's sudden ouster has upended the world of artificial intelligence. the shakeup leaves the future of openai in dout tonight, with more than half of its employees threatening to walk out. i'm kaitlan collins, and this is "the source." tonight, we are closely watching a decision that could come down at any moment and would have significant consequences for the criminal defendant and presidential candidate donald trump. three federal judges right now are deciding whether to keep or get rid of a gag order in that criminal case in washington, d.c. accusing him of plotting to overturn the election. when it was in place, it restricted his ability to directly attack the special counsel, members of his team, court staff, and maybe most importantly potential witnesses at his trial. americans even got to listen in on these arguments today. >> the order is unprecedented, and it sets a terrible precedent for future restrictions on core political speech. >> this is only affecting the speech temporarily during a criminal trial process by someone who has been indicted as a felon. no one here is threatening the first amendment broadly. >> from what we heard, it sounds like the three-judge panel is poised to reinstate at least some version of the gag order. you heard one judge saying there that it doesn't broadly threaten his first amendment rights. but they also signalled they may loosen other parts of this gag order, like allowing trump to criticize the special counsel. one judge suggested that jack smith, that special counsel, could handle the verbal attacks. >> he has to speak his manners while everyone else is throwing targets at him. >> can't be that he can't mention mr. smith. surely he is -- has a thick enough skin. >> all eyes tonight are on the d.c. circuit court of appeals waiting for word. as we wait, joining me now is former federal prosecutor and cnn legal analyst el jot williams. elliott, i know this is unprecedented. trump has totally blurred the lines between his legal defense, his presidential race. what do you expect the judges to do here? how do they balance that? >> i think they keep some form of gag order in place, kaitlan, but they just carve it up a little bit differently. the judges seem to be signaling that by perhaps opening the gag order up to allowing criticism of jack smith directly or something like that. look, this is -- we talk about a lot of legal issues in context of donald trump, and i can say with certainly that the first amendment, free speech, is by far the hardest to figure out because everyone in america, regardless of citizenship status, is entitled to free speech. no one is entitled to threaten anybody else. but the line between those two can be complicated, particularly when you're dealing with candidates for office. it is incredibly complex. and the judges today, who are very exceptionally bright individuals, all three of them. i know them a little bit in town here. were really struggling with that. we'll have to see where they land on this. >> it was fascinating to be able to listen in to them go back and forth with the trump attorneys, the special counsel's team. if this order is upheld, if it goes back into effect, i think what we could see happen with the judge here, judge chutkan, having to deal with something pretty extraordinary, which is, what happens if trump violates that gag order? >> that's the thing. enforcement is itself a question. none one, she can warn the former president, once again, as he's been warned multiple times in other cases. but then you move to this new world of some sort of enforcement order, where often in federal court what you would do is file a new proceeding to bring criminal contempt proceedings against an individual who violated an order. that's never happened before, certainly for a former president. and, you know, it's one of those unprecedented areas. it's just, again, what do you do? and one of the questions that came up today along those line, kaitlan, is do you wait for a threat to come, or do you preemptively bar him from threatening everybody? even that is a little bit complicated and a little bit tricky. so, it just remains to be seen how they're going to handle it, number one, if he does violate something or number two, if he want to prevent him from doing it in the future. >> we'll see what they decide. elliott williams, thank you for your analysis. of course as we wait to see what they decide, these continuing legal troubles around the former president, he is still the overwhelming favorite for the republican nomination, at least at this point in time. my next guest is learning new details about what a second trump term in the white house could look like. joining me now is a rare appearance on cnn, his first on "the source," chief washington correspondent, jonathan carl, who is author of the new book "tired of winning: donald trump in the end of the grand old party." john carl, it's great to have you here. as we're waiting to see what these judges are going to decide, as you heard elliott talking about, part of this centered on, you know, he's been attacking potential witnesses in this case. mike pence, bill barr, general milley. if the panel rules against him, do you think he'd be able to help himself here? >> it's hard to imagine it. i mean, i thought it was very interesting in the proceedings when the judges, in questioning the prosecution, questioning defense counsel, used the example of mike pence. what if trump issued a warning to mike pence before he testified in this case if he were to testify in an open trial. and said, mike pence has a chance, once again, to do the right thing. i mean, we saw what happened on january 6th, when trump put so much pressure on pence that it literally unleashed a mob seeking his execution. and trump, just a couple of months after that, told me that the mob was chanting, hang mike pence, because they were angry. and he had absolutely no criticism whatsoever of the people calling for the execution of his vice president. so, no, i have a hard time imagining that even with a gag order that trump won't test the limits of of that gag order. >> you mentioned, you know, the last days of the trump white house. in your book, there's a chapter where you, kind of, see this isolated and defeated trump. it's banished to mar-a-lago, end of his presidency. you write about the days that followed him, you know, were, kind of, bleak, that he was spending his days on a patio at mar-a-lago, just this remarkable moment from going to the white house to this. i'm wondering what you think those days, how his first term ended, would tell you about what a second trump term would look like. >> well, kaitlan, one thing i detailed is how, in the final weeks, really the final few months of the trump administration, they went about a process of trying to rout out all of the people that were in any way disloyal or not sufficiently loyal to donald trump. johnny mcinty, his very junior aide, who at one point was just carrying the president's bags around and then was put in charge of the white house personnel office, led this effort to rout out disloyalists. by the time you got to january 6th, there were very few people left to challenge the president. but there were a few. there were people like white house counsel pat cipollone, who tried to keep him from doing things that were blatantly illegal. of course gone shortly before january 6th, but bill barr at the justice department and jeffrey rosen, who replaced him. the thing is, i believe, based on the reporting in this book, that a second trump term begins with all of those people who would have kept him in check, who did keep him at least partially in check in those final days of his presidency, would be gone. they wouldn't be there. they're going to hire for loyalty. as one of johnny mcentee's top aides back then has put it more recently, loyalty is more important than policy. you can teach policy, but you can't teach loyalty. they are going to make sure that this is not a team of rivals, not a team of people supporting the constitution first and first and foremost, but a team of people supporting at all costs donald trump. >> and it also speaks to how he viewed people who supported biden. i mean, you write that he hung up on kim kardashian at one point because he assumed that she'd voted for joe biden. >> yeah. he doesn't want to deal with any disloyalty whatsoever. he saw that as a betrayal. by the way, he had no idea who kim kardashian actually voted for. but kim kardashian, who's become an advocate for criminal justice reform, was going and trying to get his help in seeking a pardon, a clemency, for somebody who was on death row. and trump didn't want to hear about it, just wanted to -- berated her over the phone. you want help from me? you want me to help you after you voted for joe biden? so, that's -- you know, that's the attitude is loyalty above all costs. it is loyalty above policy. it is loyalty not to a constitution or to the country, but loyalty to donald trump. >> and, you know, when i think about this, over the weekend, when we saw what happened in argentina, with the leader who won there, as we covered the white house, you saw trump had this affinity for these strong men leaders. he's congratulating this newly elected president of argentina, someone who has drawn comparisons to trump because of a populist message, embracing conspiracies. what do you make of looking what a second trump term could potentially look like, the way that his style is spread overseas? >> well, and i think that he -- it's both his style that has spread but i think he also feeds off that. he admires these strong men leaders, whether it be putin or president xi or kim jong-un or viktor orban in hungary, the newly elected soon to be leader of argentina. there's an incident i wrote about that had never come to light before. at the very end of the trump white house, the leaders of the army put out a statement. this is the chief of staff of the army ask appnd the secretar the army. put out a statement. you remember when michael flynn went out and called for martial law, suggested there could be martial law, to rerun the election. the active duty leaders of the army put out a really simple statement saying, there is no role in the u.s. military determining the outcome of an american election. very basic. there's no role in the u.s. military in determining the outcome of an election. trump was infuriated and directed his man, johnny ma mcentee, to ensure that never happened again. mcentee assured him it would never happen again and if it did, they would both be fired. i think that trump in a second term fancies himself as somebody that will be the commander, not just of the executive branch but the military, the commander in chief, but not in a way in the traditional sense that we've seen presidents, but that they will respond to him on all things, including things domestically, whether it be the insurrection act, putting down rioters, or whatever he had in mind in what they would do determining the outcome of an election. >> john carl, it's a lot of good reporting in this book. very important read. thank you for joining us tonight on cnn. >> thank you, kaitlan. >> great to have you. ahead, someone who's trying to prevent that second trump term with everything that he has got, 2024 republican primary opponent chris christie will join me. they want answers, amid optimism from the u.s. we'll speak to the family member of an american hostage right after this. tonight the white house says that hostage negotiations are, quote, getting close to the end. for 45 days, hamas has held more than 200 people captive. sources tell cnn the possible deal could include the release of 50 hostages or so for a four- to five-day pause in fighting. i should note nothing has been agreed to yet. nothing is final. we've been speaking to israeli officials regularly about how fluid these talks are, where they're going. they've been urging a lot of caution. what we do know is that the pressure on the israeli prime minister, benjamin netanyahu, is only growing more intense tonight. the families of israeli hostages met with him in his war cabinet earlier. they want answers and a written commitment to bring their family members home. 3-year-old abigail aidan is the youngest known american hostage. her parents were killed in the october 7th attacks. i'm joined by her great aunt. i should note she was appointed to the heritage abroad by president biden last year. i'm so glad that you're here tonight. and i'm sorry that we're meeting under these circumstances. when you hear from the white house that they're hopeful a deal is close, have you gotten, or your family, any information about a deal from israel or from the u.s. or anybody? >> we hear what you hear. we hear what everybody's hearing. it's frustrating because, through this whole time, it's been dark. we have been -- metaphorically it's dark. we don't know. and virtually, it is dark for these people that are in gaza. we have no answers. and people think that we're getting specific information. and just like everybody, we hear they're very close to having a deal. and until we actually see hostages released, we really don't know anything. >> and you're wearing the number on your jacket of how many days that she has been held in gaza. i mean, if you could speak to those people who are negotiating, the officials who are negotiating these talks, what would you want them to know? >> well, first, 44 is the amount of days since these innocent civilians were abducted and taken as hostages. and i wear this in solidarity with rachel goldberg, who's son, hersh, who was kidnapped, taken, had his arm blown off, and was taken as a hostage. we have been wearing this to make it clear that 44 days, how long, abigail. she is a 3-year-old little girl. there are over 30 children. there's over 50 children and mothers. i can't imagine, as a mother, what it's like to be somewhere in the dark, somewhere without -- without the family. and abigail is an orphan. abigail's parents were murdered on october 7th, and she is with -- >> how are her siblings doing? i know they survived. >> they survived. and, you know, how is a 6 and a 10-year-old after surviving -- after seeing both their parents murdered? they have a beautiful family. they have a loving family. and they are able to be themselves and to talk about what happened and to share what happened. and they're very much forward in telling what their stories are. and they're with their grandparents and with their aunts and uncles, many who survived from the kibbutz. so, they're part of a community. and they grew up with them nearby. >> i can't even imagine the trauma that a 6 and a 10-year-old would feel over this. >> i can't. >> when you talk about abigail, her fourth birthday is this friday. i mean, what do you think about when you think about the fact that she could be turning four and trapped in gaza? >> well, i can't imagine. i can't imagine her having a birthday and turning four alone without her family. and i think about her sister and brother. and their one hope is that abigail comes home. and for them to have her come home before friday and to be there and have her celebrate her birthday in their arms is a dream i have. and i just imagine -- i keep hoping that each day we wake up and we hear that there really is a release. because, you know, you think about a nine-month-old child turns ten months as a hostage. and you think of abigail turning four as a hostage. these are innocent civilians. these are children that did nothing. >> babies. >> babies. and so, you know, i just -- i keep hoping and believing. and there's been so much outpouring of love and support from people across the world and people from all different backgrounds. it's a humanitarian issue. this is not political. these are people that were innocent civilians. >> and i just keep thinking, like, as a mother, having a child as a hostage, it's -- it's inconceivable, to be honest. >> it is inconceivable. and i hope you know that we're all thinking of you. and we realize how important it is to tell your stories. >> yeah. >> and we're hopeful for abigail and for everyone that they all come home. >> well, thank you. thank you for letting me tell my story. i keep abigail's picture with me all the time. >> adorable. >> when i look at this picture, i believe that she is going to come home and be with her family and we are going to be able to embrace her and that we will be able to bring home the hostages. >> thank you, liz. >> thank you for having me. >> thank you for coming on. and we're hopeful for that too. >> thank you. of course, israel has been a massive topic on the campaign trail, even here at home. we're going to speak with the candidate -- a candidate who went there. chris christie. he just went time on the ground in israel. he has a new warning for voters tonight. he'll join us live in moments. tonight on the ground in new hampshire, governor chris christie with a new warning for voters who are considering making donald trump the gop nominee. >> if trump is the nominee -- because if trump is the nominee, i bet you manchin is going to run. and you could have a situation where nobody gets 270. then it goes to house of representatives. if you think our country is divided now, imagine when that happens. those jokers took three weeks to pick a speaker. imagine how long it will take them to pick a president. and who knows where that will end up. >> well, that could be a nightmare scenario, but one that governor christie clearly sees as a possibility. governor christie, i think, you know, half that audience probably broke out in a cold sweat, the other half in hives, when you said that. do you really think that could happen? >> sure. it absolutely is a possibility. look, the country's been very clear, kaitlan, you know, a lot of times polling that's close, you can wonder whether it's really true or not. but i've seen, you know, the polling that you've seen, which is 75% or more of the people in the united states don't want it to be a trump/biden matchup. and if that's what it turns out to be, you know, you would be a situation where i think for sure you would see these no labels folks coming in, joe manchin, or some other candidate would come into a race, and you really could have a situation where no one gets to 270. i think that's another risk that run can voters have to consider when you're considering whether or not to vote for donald trump. >> well and i mean, there is a plan for what would happen there. and basically each state would get a single vote. and right now if you look at republicans control 26 state delegations, democrats have 22. i mean, this is obviously farfetched, i should note, but given the presence of these third party candidates and potential candidates right now, how destabilizing do you fear that scenario would be? >> well, look, i think the country would be, you know, horribly divided by that kind of result. and let me make