opens up as never before. >> i'm intrigued by you and i'm someone who watches your show almost every night. >> gloria allred, a passion for women's rights. >> it matters if any man hurts any woman. >> her daughter, lisa blume. >> my mother is brilliant and passionate and tenacious. >> and the moment i never saw coming. >> i have a little gift for you. it's actually a subpoena. this is from your audience. whom i am representing. it's to you, piers morgan. i want you to tell us under oath how many times you have been properly in love. under oath. >> i'm not objecting there. piers morgan interview starts now. one woman strikes fear into the hearts of powerful men from herman cain to tiger woods. if you've got a secret to keep, you do not want to hear that gloria allred is on the case. she's the most famous female attorney in the country. she's been making headlines for years. what matters to her most is her crusade against victim rights. i was trying to think of the last time you actually sat to do an interview by yourself and not one of your clients. when was it? >> just like this? never. >> really? >> yes. >> why are you doing this? >> well, you invited me. and i'm intrigued by you. and i'm someone who watches your show almost every night. and i'm just intrigued and also, of course, it's an opportunity to talk about empowering women, empowering minorities and the fact that we still have not won complete equality in this country. >> here's the fascinating thing about you. i've been immersed in all things gloria allred. for a couple of days. because i knew you'd be a tricky one to interview. you'd be trying to push me away from anything that's remotely sensitive about your life and we'll come to those juicy bits a bit later. here's the thing. there are two gloria allreds. there's the one that's done the following. forced the l.a. county sheriff's officers to abandon the practice of shackling women in prison in hospitals as they went through labor and childbirth. you argued for people with aids who have been let go from jobs. you won a settlement against holocaust deniers on behalf of a survivor of auschwitz. you chipped away at the l.a. district attorney to the endorsed a program to collect from deadbeat dads and so on. all of these incredibly important, ground breaking, courageous actions that you've fought that are absolutely in keeping with the positioning of gloria allred as this crusading campaigning attorney. then there's the other side. which is, i don't know, some would argue slightly more trivial. in 1980, you went off to the elisiam fields nudists colony. for charging men more for love making classes than it tid women. and you raged a public campaign against madonna claiming she record a pro-choice song to make amends for "papa don't preach." which gloria allred are you? >> i'm the gloria allred who is an attorney and part of our law firm. i've been practicing law for 36 years. we are a civil rights law firm. we have won more women's rights cases and civil rights cases than any other private law firm in the nation. we've won over $250 million for victims just in the last ten years alone. and we believe that women and minorities are entitled to equality, to liberty, to freedom, and to dignity. to equal rights in every way. and you take that yellow balloon case, for example, piers, that you just mentioned. that was a form of economic equality. for little girls to be charged more for their haircuts than little boys. and in that case we represented a sister and a brother. and that was a case of economic inequality because it took the same level of education and experience and time, we alleged, to cut that little girl's hair as it did to cut the little boy's hair. and, therefore, they should have not had separate pricing for little girls and little boys. >> do you believe that men and women should be absolutely equal in everything? >> i do believe that under the law, under the constitution of the united states and under our public policy that women deserve and should have a right to enjoy equal employment opportunity. >> i agree with a lot of what you've done. i agree with 90% of what you've done. some of the more trivial ones make me laugh. they're probably publicity seeking because it's good for business. i get that. >> i don't agree with your assumption. >> really? >> what we do -- >> do you ever do anything for publicity? >> we do cases of public interest and importance. we believe that women who are discriminated against and minorities, for example, people who are gay, people who are lesbian, people who are transgender, bisexual, minorities who have been discriminated against, racial minorities, that they should have a voice. >> i agree with all that. >> that their cases matter. >> how far does equality go? i come back to if a man is able to do it -- i'm not saying i agree with this. i'm throwing it out. if a man is able to do something better than a woman, should he be entitled to be paid more money or should there be equality because simply because a woman may not have the power of a man to play to that ability? >> it really depends on the particular facts. what we're talking about is -- >> what do you think? i have 80% female staff, for example. >> but, of course, it's better than it used to be. but, you know, often people who are conservative -- i'm not saying you're one of those people -- will look back and say -- >> did you call me a conservative? >> no. i'm not saying you're one of those people. i'm not interested in characterizing it. i'm saying some people look back and say, it's better than it used to be. well, yes. but i look forward. have we achieved equality under the law? the answer is clearly no. and i want our daughters to enjoy equal rights under the law. i don't want them to be sexually harassed on the job. and we have done many cases where women have been sexually harassed. >> do you feel there's a grief for men who get treated badly by women bosses? do you feel angry for the men or all women against men? >> actually, we have had a number of cases where we represent men who have been discriminated against in employment on account of their gender. but we've had those cases in the past. i objected many years ago, this was a well known case towards the beginning of my career where there was a commission on the status of women created in santa monica and they excluded men from being able to participate. and i went before the court and i argued that that was discrimination against men. that men have a stake in the equality for women. and that men should not be excluded from that conversation and especially not from a governmental entity that was going to opine about that. >> does it worry you that for all the very good cases you fight, where there's clear evidence of dit crimination or harassment or whatever it may be, does it worry you that you have almost single handedly created an atmosphere, a culture, perhaps, where people who want to try it on and who want to make a few quick bucks by claiming discrimination and harassment can now do that because of this atmosphere that you have help eed prop ul gate? does that worry you? >> no. not at all. because we are a plaintiffs law firm. we screen our cases very, very carefully. we make sure that we have the facts. we've investigated the facts. and, you know, we can only take a small number of all of the cases that people ask us to take. so, no. the weak cases we are not taking. but i'm happy when women who believe they have been discriminated against on the account of their gender seek the advice of any attorney whether it's myself or anyone else in the country. and say i feel that i've been discriminated against on the job or sexually harassed. is there something i can do about it? do i have a strong enough case? i don't want them to judge that themselves. we act like private attorney generals. in enforcing the rights. and we look forward to women standing up and asserting their rights and protecting their rights and vindicating their rights in a court of law. we're very proud of those women who have the courage to do so. >> and men? >> and men as well. >> occasionally. take a little break. come back and get into some of the high profile cases you've taken on. >> love it. >> because you seem to be popping up with almost all of them, gloria. one of the more predictable elements in any scandal, gloria, is you in that little red top of yours. that the university of phoenix has we have a very progressive online learning environment. we have something called phoenix connect that allows students to have a social network. you can post discussion questions. we have more than twenty thousand faculty members, chances are one of them is online when you need some assistance. i'm ron gdovic, i'm committed to providing my students with a twenty-first-century education and i am a phoenix. is moving backward. 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[ male announcer ] with wells fargo advisor's envision plan, you always know where you stand. in fact, 93 percent of envision plan holders say they will retire on their own terms. get started on the plan you need today -- wells fargo advisors. together we'll go far. will be giving aways. passafree copies of the alcoholism & addiction cure. to get yours, go to ssagesmalibubook.com. mr. powe polanski was able to victimize another child while he was a fugitive from justice. i think we're beginning to unmask scott peterson. we'll find out who he really is. it is time for tiger woods to take responsibility for the deep pain he has inflicted on veronica. >> some of the high profile cases that had gloria allred all over our tv screens and she's back with me now. you do pop up when you're, i guess, taking on -- and for that reason, you've become the kind of legal counsel. do you like that? >> i like empowering my clients. i like providing them with a voice that they otherwise might not have. because i think they matter. the typical person matters. not just celebrities in our culture matter. and this is what we do. we go up against the rich, the powerful, the famous, big corporations, government, celebrities, batterers, wrong doers, killers. wrong doers of all kind, sexual harassers. and we allow that individual person to fight that -- i'll call it a davita and goliath battle or david and goliath battle and often win. and, yes, people say oh, my god. how could you go up against them? i mean these celebrities often they have their entourages and they have their pr people and army of lawyers and their managers and everybody else. who does that individual person have? they have us. and they get to have a voice. >> roman polanski, that i get. there you have serious allegations of serious sexual misconduct. tiger woods is an interesting case to me. because he's a golfer. what really is the public interest in exposing tiger woods when it comes down to, yes, there's the role model argument. and he's making money from whoever. gillette or whatever it may be. but actually does it matter what tiger woods does in his private life? why did you feel compelled to expose him? >> well, it matters if any man hurts any woman. and in the case of jocelyn james whom i represented, she was hurt. she was deceived. she was lied to. and he never even offered her an apology. >> she was a porn star, right? >> she was an adult film star, yes. >> and she went on to make an adult movie based on tiger woods' text messages. >> well, you know, she has a right to have a career. she gave it up for him. >> but how -- >> let me just say, he asked her to give up her career because he was jealous that she would be with anyone else. she did at great economic sacrifice to herself. >> yes. >> and then -- >> she doesn't seem to have been -- >> after the scandal, yes, she had to go and make a living. >> she went and made a porn movie starring tiger woods' text messages. how hurt could she have been if she felt able to do that? that's my point. >> those of us who lead a more privileged life and are able to make a very nice living the way you are and the way i am, i don't think we should look down our nose and other people who have to make difficult choices about how they make a living. it's not for me to sit here and judge or second guess how anybody makes a living. >> whoa, whoa, whoa. >> i'm so glad anyone is able to work. >> remind. i wasn't making any moral judgment about her career. she's perfectly entitled to be in the entertainment industry. my point is how hurt could she have been by tiger woods if she then just the moment it was over went out and made loads of money making porn movies starring his text messages? it seemed to me that she was one of the cases where you were at your weakest. you've had some where you've been very strong. i just wonder sometimes when you watch what she did afterwards, do you slightly sit back and go, maybe i should have left that one alone? >> not at all. >> really? >> no. >> because i did for you. >> i'm not a politician that sits there and puts my finger in the wind, sees which way it's blowing. i'm going to stand up for women. i stood up for women that are adult film stories, judges, secretaries, factory workers, farm workers. you name it, we've had it just about. and i -- >> do you ever regret afterwards taking on cases because of the way that, perhaps, the person you've been defending or prosecuting on behalf of, because of their behavior afterwards? do you have moments of self-reflection afterwards? >> no. i'm so proud of my clients and the courage they've shown. you have no idea. we are a living -- i feel i live in a war zone every day for women where we are fighting for their rights against very powerful, very well-funded forces. i'm so proud of the courage of my clients. they come in and often crying on a glass table like this, tears all over the place. and then i see them evolve from victims to survivors to fighters for change and standing up and being empowered and then going on and empowering children and co-workers and other people in their community. >> where does, for example, the rights of tiger woods' wife override the rights of the adult entertainment star who has been having an affair with him who just feels a bit, you know, aggrieved by the fact he isn't actually going to stay with her? where do the rights of his wife come into that in terms of your moral compass? >> i wouldn't characterize the fact that ms. james was upset that he wouldn't stay with her. okay? it was his lying. it was the deception. it's the way he treated her after three years of an intimate relationship, over 1,000 text messages and flying her around and making her feel that she was the only one. as to his wife, of course she has rights. and i assume that she asserted them. and i'm glad that she did so. because that would be her right. >> you know the point i'm getting at, though? you sort of paint a very compelling picture. because you're very eloquent about this. of this poor, unsuspecting adult entertainment star who got duped by tiger woods. >> would you think it's okay for men to lie to women and break their hearts? i don't. i make no apology for that. >> no. what i wonder, though -- >> i don't think men should be able to hurt women and then just walk away and throw them out like a piece of garbage. >> but she knew he was married. >> of course she knew he was married. >> does she not care about mrs. woods? >> of course she did. but do you care about women being hurt by men whom they trusted, whom they loved, who they had every reason to believe loved them. >> i hear that. >> that's it. do you care about the rights of women? do you care about all those women across this country who are being hurt and men treat them like oh, that is just an afterthought. they can walk away after being in a long-term relationship with them. >> i'm not condoning it. but if you're mrs. woods and you see this adult entertainment star claiming my life's been ruined. then she just goes out and starts making movies. >> she didn't say my life's been ruined. those of us that have a lot of opportunities shouldn't look down on those who are trying to make a living. >> no. no. you keep trying to paint me as a -- >> i don't represent his wife. i don't know what her thoughts were. i'm glad she stood up for herself. >> i'm not making any moral position or argument about what she does for a living. what i'm saying is if you go out after all this, after you've gone out and said tiger woods treated me really bad to me. he lied to me. he broke promises. but if you then go and make movies based on text messages, all that's going to do is really add to the hurt and humiliation and public shame of tiger woods' wife. and i'm curious as to where you representing that client would have a view about that kind of behavior and say maybe that's not a good idea. >> you know, i just don't sit in judgment of my clients. they have to -- >> ever? >> they have to survive. they have to make a living. i'm proud of her that, you know, she's trying to make a living. you know, not everybody has a lot of options to make a living like you do and like i do. >> let's come back after the break and talk about the political cases. because there i have a little bit more sympathy. 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