sentencing on july 11. that verdict sentencing onjuly 11. that verdict coming down as he was exiting the courthouse and only saw him getting to trump tower, waving at his... raising his fist rather, i people gathered there. wejust fist rather, i people gathered there. we just heard from nancy closing ranks behind the speaker of the house. republicans calling this a disgrace, a rigged trial in a sad day for america. eric, just going back to you. from what you've heard from donald trump, he very much sees this, what we heard right after the verdict, very much sees this as an opportunity for the american voters to cast their verdict on november five.— november five. that is ultimately _ november five. that is ultimately what - november five. that is ultimately what you i november five. that is | ultimately what you will november five. that is - ultimately what you will think of it. he thinks if he becomes present, he couldn't escape the trappings of having to go to the legal system. they won't be able to see is sent him if he's president, he thinks he can squash the charges. the number one solution for him in terms of his freedom and future, is simply winning the election. nancy, what do you make of the statement. nancy, what do you make of the statement-— nancy, what do you make of the statement. , ., statement. some believe some of the commentators _ statement. some believe some of the commentators believe - statement. some believe some of the commentators believe this - the commentators believe this will for— the commentators believe this will for the biden—harris campaign to comment. i think they— campaign to comment. i think they have _ campaign to comment. i think they have to come out. i think it would — they have to come out. i think it would have been hard for them — it would have been hard for them to— it would have been hard for them to avoid it. week we did see them _ them to avoid it. week we did see them start to dip their toe the actor— see them start to dip their toe the actor robert de niro giving the actor robert de niro giving the press conference. two of the press conference. two of the officers who served on january— the officers who served on january the 6th as well. they are starting to comment on this or get— are starting to comment on this or get a — are starting to comment on this or get a little bit involved and — or get a little bit involved and they're going to turn the fact that _ and they're going to turn the fact that trump is a convicted felon — fact that trump is a convicted felon to— fact that trump is a convicted felon to their event as well. they— felon to their event as well. they have been really stagnant in polls — they have been really stagnant in polls and they are losing swoon— in polls and they are losing support with black men and hispanics in particular. i think— hispanics in particular. i think they think they have to id think they think they have to go atter— think they think they have to go after trump more. and nancy, remind us — go after trump more. and nancy, remind us what _ go after trump more. and nancy, remind us what the _ go after trump more. and nancy, remind us what the polls - remind us what the polls say about perspective voters and how they feel about possible convictions for donald trump. there will polls taken about whether he would be a candidate he would prefer before and they have to find out what happens after. ., , ., , ., , after. polls have shown trump and biden _ after. polls have shown trump and biden in _ after. polls have shown trump and biden in a _ after. polls have shown trump and biden in a really— after. polls have shown trump and biden in a really tight - and biden in a really tight race _ and biden in a really tight race. there are some holes in bloomberg that shows that voters _ bloomberg that shows that voters would not be willing to sopport — voters would not be willing to support him if he's a convicted felon — support him if he's a convicted felon and _ support him if he's a convicted felon. and i think we have to see — felon. and i think we have to see how— felon. and i think we have to see how that pans out for the summer— see how that pans out for the summer because voters are concerned about a raft of things _ concerned about a raft of things. we have to wait and see which _ things. we have to wait and see which issue outweighs the other~ _ which issue outweighs the other~ i_ which issue outweighs the other. i think it this outweighs the conviction. | outweighs the conviction. i also want to bring out our correspondent nada tawfik. we are still seeing pictures. bring us up and was happening. . yeah, bring us up and was happening. .yeah, sumi, bring us up and was happening. . yeah, sumi, there are a number of new yorkers to the right of me have come to this park to protest against entente, and there is a very celebratory mood — sans saying "lock him up, donned the felon and trunk convicted." really just moments after the verdict was read out inside of the crowd here erupted in cheers. and there are so many onlookers who are still here. one man has turned up in a donald trump prisonjumpsuit turned up in a donald trump prison jumpsuit costume. this along with the stepped—up security just along with the stepped—up securityjust milling about to take in this moment. but of donald trump's supporters left after the verdict was read —— but most of. it is a very calm scene right now, but you can probably see behind mejust scene right now, but you can probably see behind me just the amount of security that has surrounded this part of rural manhattan. late surrounded this part of rural manhattan-— surrounded this part of rural manhattan. ~ , ., , manhattan. we 'ust saw images ofthe manhattan. we just saw images of the gentleman _ manhattan. we just saw images of the gentleman in _ manhattan. we just saw images of the gentleman in the - manhattan. we just saw images of the gentleman in the orange | of the gentleman in the orange jumpsuit. i also want to get your take on what we've heard from alvin bragg. you could hear a note of relief there. absolutely, and i really clocked that large smile on joshua stein's, standing there behind alvin bragg, as he noted just how long his closing arguments were. but absolutely, relief there, sumi. he repeated a comment he made when he first announced this indictment against donald trump, the first against donald trump, the first against a former president. he said these white—collar crimes are the core of what our office does. it's really trying to hit back against any kind of criticism that his office took this decision just out of a political motive. he is really defending the work they did, saying they acted without fear or favour. saying they acted without fear orfavour. but i saying they acted without fear or favour. but i agree with what katty said earlier, that it was a measured term from alvin bragg. he knows what a moment this is in the nation, the gravity of what has just happened with donald trump being convicted. so, time and time again in this comments, he came back to this being about the rule of law. it was the jury the rule of law. it was the jury performing the civic duty, thanking all who secured the courthouse and emphasising that while this defendant may be like none other in american history, they arrived at a verdict in the same manner that they would in any other case. i thought it was interesting, sumi, to see that measured reaction. sumi, to see that measured reaction-— reaction. while i have the opportunity. _ reaction. while i have the opportunity, give - reaction. while i have the opportunity, give us - reaction. while i have the opportunity, give us a - reaction. while i have the i opportunity, give us a sense reaction. while i have the - opportunity, give us a sense of what it has been like covering this trial over the last six weeks. ,, ., , , ., weeks. sumi, it has been a consuming _ weeks. sumi, it has been a consuming process, - weeks. sumi, it has been a i consuming process, covering this trial. this is a case that was complex legally. it was important to get the facts right and to try to explain it to the american public in a way that they could understand. and so, many of us out here broadcasting would take the chance to run into the overflow court room and to listen to the testimony. i was able to hear from every key witness — portions at least — but what jurors did not see inside was everything happening here. while they were focused on the evidence, they had to reflect on the moment. there were some really key moments. high—powered republican allies of donald trump coming here and trying to show how loyal they were to him. but in the process, really undermining trust in the courts in the criminaljustice trust in the courts in the criminal justice system trust in the courts in the criminaljustice system in this country. i had a chance to ask speaker mikejohnson, second in line to the presidency, about what he was doing not deleting it to the jury. he insisted was a threat to the rule of law in this country. it was also interesting to just speak to the number of people who came down here every day, members of the public and wanted to hear the public and wanted to hear the case themselves, along with those who are just so politically invested in this. donald trump's supporters, his opponents. i thought it was extremely interesting to see towards the end, the biden campaign decided to have the actor robert de niro turn up. they have really been frustrated at the amount of media coverage around this trial, and the fact thatjoe biden the president isn't getting as much coverage in his events. it's interesting to see the campaign trying to engage on that front. there was just so much to taken on a daily basis to both inside and of this courtroom. for americans now, it will be interesting to see how this affects the race, of course. i think that's the next step from all of us covering the trial — to see how much it translate into everyday americans' decisions.— much it translate into everyday americans' decisions. thank you for our americans' decisions. thank you for your brilliant _ americans' decisions. thank you for your brilliant reporting - for your brilliant reporting from manhattan over the last six weeks. thank you, nada tawfik, and i also want to thank my guests. great to have your insights with us on this historic evening. just to remind all of our viewers who have beenjoining us to remind all of our viewers who have been joining us to the course of the evening, donald trump convicted on all 3a counts of falsifying business records just after that criminal case in new york. the first case of president of the us has been convicted of a crime. we saw him speaking after the verdict and he has made it clear that he continues to fight on for the presidency. a historic night here at the us. we will hand over to our team in london. iamor i am or lodge -- rajini —— rajini vaidyanathan. it's been an extraordinary moment. let's go straight to brian stelter. as a journalist and a new york juror, what your take away? i'm a roud what your take away? i'm a proud new— what your take away? i'm a proud new yorker - what your take away? i'm a proud new yorker and - what your take away? i'm a proud new yorker and i'm. what your take away? i'm a - proud new yorker and i'm proud of this system. this 12 jurors were probably able to do that without fear. i'm at the denver airport. it's in contrast to the protesters. most americans are tuned out from this. many americans just don't care. i think that's an important part of the context for this decision today by the jury. people are going to hear about this slowly but surely on their smartphones and televisions. some might change their mind, but many will not about donald trump. in some ways tuning out has also a price. this struggle over the rule of law in the united states is just beginning. rule of law in the united states isjust beginning. we heard the verdict, but the battles by the republicans especially to use the court and the law to punish opponents, thatis the law to punish opponents, that is just the law to punish opponents, that isjust beginning. the law to punish opponents, that is just beginning. that's what they believe the democrats have just gone. what they believe the democrats havejust gone. ifear we what they believe the democrats have just gone. i fear we are heading into very uncharted waters in the united states, but i do reflect on the idea that this moment in time, a lot of people don't actually feel that invested in the outcome. they've made up their mind about donald trump a long time ago. in about donald trump a long time am, ., , ., , , about donald trump a long time auo. ., , �* ., about donald trump a long time auo. . , �* ., , ago. in many ways, brian, this reminds me — ago. in many ways, brian, this reminds me of _ ago. in many ways, brian, this reminds me of the _ ago. in many ways, brian, this reminds me of the ongoing - reminds me of the ongoing divisions when it comes to america and american politics. they are either people who are firmly in mr trump's camp and nothing can change that, and people who firmly oppose him. as we head into election later this year, this will define the outcome in many ways. the - led . e outcome in many ways. the pledge of— outcome in many ways. the pledge of the _ outcome in many ways. iie: pledge of the allegiance outcome in many ways. ti;e: pledge of the allegiance —— pledge of allegiance provides liberty and justice for all, so was justice achieved today? that is the argument. many will choose not to fight about it at all or talk about it, but there are some who are quietly celebrating. the woman next to me was texting quietly celebrating. but there are an equal number who feel depressed by this. nothing prevents a convicted felon from running for office. we are now headed for this environment — notjust today, but so are the next five and half months. in but so are the next five and half months.— but so are the next five and half months. . , ._ , half months. in many ways, the whole trajectory _ half months. in many ways, the whole trajectory of _ half months. in many ways, the whole trajectory of donald - whole trajectory of donald trump's career defies expectations and what anyone could have predicted. i remember i was in america when he first glided down that escalator in the summer, saying he was going to run. since then, a lot has happened — the russia investigation, 2020, january the 6th, and now this — a convicted former president. this is a moment in history, but really one that no—one would have ever predicted. find would have ever predicted. and this is what _ would have ever predicted. and this is what i _ would have ever predicted. and this is what i fear. _ would have ever predicted. fific this is what i fear. he undermined the american media, calling real news fake. what he's doing now is calling real law fake. calling it a sham, calling the system rig. he's undermining the rule of law and thejustice undermining the rule of law and the justice system, undermining the rule of law and thejustice system, and undermining the rule of law and the justice system, and that will have very unpredictable consequences.— will have very unpredictable consequences. brian, i'm 'ust auoin to consequences. brian, i'm 'ust going to read i consequences. brian, i'm 'ust going to read something h consequences. brian, i'mjust going to read something from consequences. brian, i'mjust. going to read something from mr trump's statement. "the real verdict is going to be november the 5th by the people, and they know what happened here and everybody does what have been here." i'm thinking back to what happened in 2020 and of course january the 6th, 2021, and wondering what people might be predicting come this winter. connecting january the 6th is relevant because that was an attack on the system itself. thus far, the institutions have held, and this today is another example of that success. but is not guaranteed in the future and i think we have to question will these jurors and i think we have to question will thesejurors be and i think we have to question will these jurors be safe, and i think we have to question will thesejurors be safe, will they feel secure, will some speak out? as a journalist, i hope they will, but they may have safety concerns at. brian stelter, thank _ have safety concerns at. brian stelter, thank you _ have safety concerns at. brian stelter, thank you very - have safety concerns at. brian stelter, thank you very much. j stelter, thank you very much. we know you're about to board a flight, so we must let you go. we appreciate you staying on and continuing coverage. thank you very much. as we have been saying, donald trump has been found guilty on 34 trump has been found guilty on 3a counts of falsifying business records. in many ways, one of the key witnesses is... michael cohen, donald trump's former personal lawyer who was a key prosecution witness in his trial, has hailed the guilty verdict, saying, "today is an important day for accountability and the rule of law." he said he was made to pay the money by his boss to stormy daniels, but in the end, the jury daniels, but in the end, the jury found that mr trump had falsified his business records and making that payment is a different expense — a legal expense rather than declaring as hush money. michael cohen has responded. he goes on to say... a response from michael cohen, who is of course a convicted felon as well. there's also been immediate reaction from the president. in a statement, joe biden says... but mr trump's fellow republicans have quickly condemned the verdict. house of representatives speaker mikejohnson said... those reactions there. just a reminder of howjust how divisive american politics is. let's focus on the legal fallout. we can speak to former us federal prosecutor, sarah krissoff. welcome to our rolling coverage. one question people want to know, a lot of people e—mailing asking this question — what happens now? what are the possible penalties that mr trump could face. could he end “p trump could face. could he end up behind bars? i trump could face. could he end up behind bars?— up behind bars? i think it's uuite up behind bars? i think it's quite possible _ up behind bars? i think it's quite possible that - up behind bars? i think it's i quite possible that happens. i was sceptical a few weeks ago, if you asked me that question. i probably would have said even if convicted, he probably is not going to prison. but now thejudge is going to not going to prison. but now the judge is going to sentence him after sitting through all of this evidence at the trial. the sentencing is set forjuly. whether that will hold, we shall see. both side will marshal all of their evidence of the mitigating evidence, all of the mitigating evidence, all of the mitigating evidence, all of the supporting evidence on the defence and prosecution side and argue what they think is the important sentence. ultimately, it's in thejudges' hands on what to do. pare ultimately, it's in the 'udges' hands on what to do. are you surprised _ hands on what to do. are you surprised this _ hands on what to do. are you surprised this verdict - hands on what to do. are you surprised this verdict wasn't l surprised this verdict wasn't relatively quick? 50. surprised this verdict wasn't relatively quick?— surprised this verdict wasn't relatively quick? so, the quick verdict usually _ relatively quick? so, the quick verdict usually is _ relatively quick? so, the quick verdict usually is a _ relatively quick? so, the quick verdict usually is a good - relatively quick? so, the quick verdict usually is a good sign i verdict usually is a good sign for the prosecution, and i'm sure when the note came in this afternoon that the jury had reached a verdict, the prosecution gave some internal size and thought it would probably turn out in their favour favour and they're right favour favour and they�* re right favour favour and they're right —— internal sighs. the longer the revelations have gone on, the revelations have gone on, the defence would have been more comfortable at the end of the day. they were going to get an acquittal or a hung jury. the day. they were going to get an acquittal ora hungjury. i think if i had to put some money on it, i would've put money on it, i would've put money on it, i would've put money on a verdict today or tomorrow. thisjury has been away from their families, away from the drugs for a long time. they want to finish this up —— away from theirjobs they want to finish this up —— away from their jobs for a they want to finish this up —— away from theirjobs for a long time. i think they're chomping on the bit to deliver eight. one of the options in terms of any sort of appeal now for donald trump? i any sort of appeal now for donald trump?— any sort of appeal now for donald trump? i am confident that trump's _ donald trump? i am confident that trump's team _ donald trump? i am confident that trump's team will - donald trump? i am confident that trump's team will appeal| that trump's team will appeal this. the basis for the charges are really rather novel legal theories. i know many pundits have pointed them out that particular issue. the trump team is going to push this all the way, as far as they can, at the way, as far as they can, at the appellate level, to challenge the verdict. it's hard to do that. the juries are rather sacrosanct and that doesn't mean they aren't overturned, but it will be an uphill battle for him. just overturned, but it will be an uphill battle for him.- uphill battle for him. just to clear this — uphill battle for him. just to clear this up, _ uphill battle for him. just to clear this up, people - uphill battle for him. just to clear this up, people have l uphill battle for him. just to - clear this up, people have been asking, mrtrump can clear this up, people have been asking, mr trump can remain in the presidential race despite having this conviction. but can he actually vote in the election?— he actually vote in the election? ~ . ., election? well, the conviction is not final — election? well, the conviction is not final yet. _ election? well, the conviction is not final yet. he _ election? well, the conviction is not final yet. he needs - election? well, the conviction is not final yet. he needs to i is not final yet. he needs to be sentence first and have a conviction. that depends on which state he is voting in and with the rights of voters in those particular states, so that's really a state—by—state issue. there's been a trend recently to restore voting rights for people convicted of felonies. perhaps he will be able to vote even after the conviction here.— able to vote even after the conviction here. 0k, thank you very much _ conviction here. ok, thank you very much for— conviction here. 0k, thank you very much for taking _ conviction here. 0k, thank you very much for taking us - conviction here. 0k, thank you | very much for taking us through all of that. former us federal prosecutor sarah krissoff. i'm joined by jacob eisler. he's a professor at florida state university college of law. thanks very much forjoining us. we touched on some of the questions that now remain following the vertex today by the courts. —— the verdict. you're in florida so i'm keen to find out your reaction and what you're hearing down there, because it's a state that mr trump called his second home. there's clearly a great deal of interest in this. i believe the real interest in this case is going to be political. will large swedes a vote or trump? —— large swabs. among lawyers, this is fascinating. but i don't think we can disentangle the law from the politics in this situation. going all the way back to trump reaping what he said "lock her up" in regard to hilary's ingle know my e—mails. this is a mission about if he behaves correctly during his campaign in 2016. —— hillary's e—mails. how are voters going to react to this. it's very difficult to say. it's very difficult to say. it's certainly going to be a challenge for trump. if he was exonerated, it would be a tremendous victory for him. i just want to read a message i got from one of his supporters that i kept in touch with when i covered the 2016 election. she's a young woman and i asked her what she made. "my reaction is that this is a complete kangaroo court. voters should decide, not crooked judges." there will be a lot of his supporters — we heard from others as well on bbc news who are adamant that their man is innocent, despite what the jury and the court has decided. that could well pay into how not just the election campaign runs, but also what happens after the presidential result comes in, whatever way that goes. i comes in, whatever way that noes. ~' �* , comes in, whatever way that ioes, ~' �*, ., comes in, whatever way that oes. ~ 2 ., ., goes. i think it's important to kee it goes. i think it's important to keep it mind _ goes. i think it's important to keep it mind that _ goes. i think it's important to keep it mind that all - goes. i think it's important to keep it mind that all the - goes. i think it's important to | keep it mind that all the judge did was preside. all he... he had a great deal of incidents, but ultimately, the jurors decided if the facts supported the conviction. to keep the jurors focus on the straight and narrow. did trump satisfy the requirements for convictions? is there much more at work here? obviously. the decision is probably the most politcised element of this. of the president aspect is you've never had an intersection of a presidential candidate with the criminal justice system presidential candidate with the criminaljustice system in this way before. obvious analogue is richard nixon, but that involves a sitting president who chose to ultimately leave politics before the mental justice system could be brought against him. trump is going to fight through this. in a month, he'll be anointed the republican nominee for the presidency. we're going to see how much the criminaljustice system affects the qualities and political viewpoints. what worries me is that there's going to be a great deal of tact directed against of parties who didn't have much to do with the situation. i think sean was dropped to fear the law in the right direction. they were trying to parse the facts as they were given to them. politicising that does not make sense even though it's going to happen. not make sense even though it's going to happen-— going to happen. jacob, of course this _ going to happen. jacob, of course this was _ going to happen. jacob, of course this was the - going to happen. jacob, of course this was the case . going to happen. jacob, of i course this was the case that donald trump faced. he also has a few other high—profile cases, including one about election interference. , another one on the state of georgia in 2020. there's more to come, isn't there? , ., ., there? there is, and i would sa the there? there is, and i would say the case _ there? there is, and i would say the case that _ there? there is, and i would say the case that really - there? there is, and i would| say the case that really bears on his... what's going to come in if he participated in insurrections. only so far as it was a relatively technical charge that related to his attempts to maintain the viability of a candidate in 2016. i'm going to use the word, a very boring crime, in the way. it's important because it spoke to how he conducted himself as a candidate. january the 6th will be this time is 100. orthe the 6th will be this time is 100. or the trials. the 6th will be this time is 100. orthe trials. it's the 6th will be this time is 100. or the trials. it's going to be very difficult to avoid politicising those charges because those are going to speak to fundamental questions of what makes treason treason. i don't see how that's going to be advanced without touching on the ability to be present. thank you forjoining us. just a reminder of falsifying accounts, it's been a trial, the first time a we are told he will be sentence on the 11th ofjuly. he could face a time in prison, although experts say a fine is more likely. as in all these things, we just don't know until it happens. let's get a sense of the reaction of the reaction let's get a sense of the reaction among those gathered outside the court as the news broke. cheering there was some clapping and cheering from the crowd and some people hugged, while trump supporters who've gathered daily near the courthouse to watch his motorcade pass murmured in disbelief as news of the verdict appeared on their phones. and let's hear a couple of views from new yorkers about the outcome of the trial. i have to say, i did not think this was actually going to happen. and i'm just... i can't believe it. it's about time he was held accountable for something. i can't believe it, it's amazing. it was not a good decision. but, uh... it may help him. this might help trump. some of the people gathered outside the court thanks for waiting for us. american university — allan lichtman. thanks for waiting for us. this is a real moment for the history books, isn't it? it is a reat history books, isn't it? it is a great victory _ history books, isn't it? it is a great victory for - history books, isn't it? it 3 a great victory for democracy and for the rule of law. i couldn't disagree more with your last commentator who said this was just a technical trial. it really doesn't matter that much. nonsense. trump was not convicted just to falsifying business records or paying hush money. he was convicted of illegally corrupting the 2016 election. that is of the fundamental importance to our democracy. it's not a minor matter, the fact that there may be more important matters later to come does not detract from the enormous significance of what we've seen tonight. we've seen trump and his allies coming on and saying this is read, it was unfair — have they pointed to one thing, one aspect of this trial that was rigged? the judge was eminently fair, trump and his lawyers had a chance for questioning everyjuror, to strike them, to prolong defence, to put on one witness who turned out to be a disaster. republicans once stood for law and order. they were the party of law and order. they screamed during the clinton monica lewinsky scandal, no one is above the law. residents must be held accountable and they are now complicit in subverting the rule of law. trump was not convicted byjoe biden, by his political enemies, he was convicted by a jury of 12 ordinary americans. voltages can wash that way. professor, i wanted to _ can wash that way. professor, i wanted to ask you _ can wash that way. professor, i wanted to ask you this. - can wash that way. professor, i wanted to ask you this. i've - wanted to ask you this. i've asked you several times ahead of presidential elections,