back at war. after hamas breaks the seven-day truce, israel steps up attacks on southern gaza and the u.s. offers a warning. >> as israel defends itself, it matters how. >> how should israel respond? >> a war to eliminate hamas. nothing else will stop us. >> south carolina lindsey graham will join us. and as progressis split with president biden over the war and other priorities -- >> they won't vote. it's 2016 all over again. >> how much could that hurt biden in the fall? progressive caucus chairwoman pramila jayapal is here exclusively. and teflon don? six weeks before the iowa caucuses and drmonald trump is trying to flip the script. >> this campaign is a righteous crusade. >> can anyone counter him? our panel will discuss. hello. i'm dana bash in washington where the state of our union is six weeks from the iowa caucuses, but this election cycle already feels a long time coming. in iowa this weekend, former president donald trump is trying to turn to the general election, with a brazen yet not surprising new claim that actually president biden is a threat to american democracy, not him. even as trump faces charges that he tried to overturn the 2020 election. president biden's general election campaign was complicated again this week by the resumption of the israel/hamas war. overseas yesterday, vice president kamala harris offered words of caution for israel as it picked up its bombing campaign, in an already devastated gaza, where israel is warning palestinians who have already evacuated to the south to move again after the u.s. says that hamas reneged on its deal with israel to release the women they are still holding hostage. here with me now is republican senator lindsey graham. thank you so much for joining me this morning, sir. let's start with the hostages. hamas still has more than 130 hostages, includeing the u.s. government believes eight americans. what should the u.s. and israel do right now to get them out? >> i guess just keep talking and i would put more pressure on iran. hamas doesn't exist without iranian help. our soldiers are being hit in syria and iraq by shiite militia controlled by iran. so what i would do is flip the script here. i would go to iran and say, listen, you need to tell hamas to let these hostages go. if you don't, you're going to start paying a heavier price. >> and you think that just that pressure on iran will actually produce hostages in return? you think it's potentially as simple -- i mean, there's nothing simple here. i don't want to oversimplify it, but that is -- >> no, no, you're right. here's what i believe. if iran felt they were threatened by hamas' behavior, they would have hamas change their behavior. but israel is going back to the fight so here's the big qu question. vice president harris has said, israel has a right to defend themselves. how you do it matters. the secretary of defense said it would be a strategic period for israel to have killed too many palestinians. i don't want any palestinian to die, but how do you do this? vice president harris, tell israel how to destroy hamas in a way not to hurt innocent palestinians and i'll pass it along. i don't know how to do this. because hamas is integrated into the apartments, the schools, and the hospitals. they have tunnels all over the pl place. the reason so many palestinians are dying, i think, is because hamas wants them to die. if you have ideas about lessening civilian casualties, let me know, i'll tell israel, but the idea of hamas still standing when this is over would be the ultimate strategic failure. >> the reason xi said that, obviously, and what secretary austin said, which is what i'll get to in a minute, is that they believe that too many palestinian civilians have been killed. do you agree with that? >> well, tell us how to do it differently. you know, what is too many people dying in world war ii, after pearl harbor? did the american public worry about how many people were dying to destroy tokyo and berlin? i know this is not the same, but it's similar. i mean, after october the 7th, israel's at total war with hamas. what they did, you won't even show on television, probably because you can't. so the bottom line here is, is no republican believes this, by the way. no republican is telling israel to change their military tactics, because i don't know how to change them. i think the goal of destroying hamas is important for israel, really important for the palestinians, and hamas is making it impossible for israel to fight without hurting innocent people. >> there's the humanitarian aspect, which we were just talking about, then there's the strategic question, which you have experience with in other parts of the world, when the u.s. has been in conflicts. and so i want to go back to what you alluded to, which is what the defense secretary lloyd austin said yesterday. he said, if you drive civilians into the arms of the enemy, you replace a tactical victory with a strategic defeat. which he's saying that civilian casualties could create even more enemies. does he have a point? >> no. he's so naive. i mean, i just lost all confidence in this guy. how about focusing on protecting our soldiers, men and women in syria and iraq. strategic defeat would be enflaming the palestinians. they're already enflamed. they're taught from the time they're born to hate the jews and to kill them. they're taught math, if you have ten jews and kill six, how many would you have left? this is like is a tranquil population that's only enflamed, is really naive. i don't want to kill innocent people, but israel is fighting not just hamas but the infrastructure around hamas. look at what happened to the israeli hostages when they were presented to the palestinian population. it's beyond naive. strategic failure is letting hamas stand. but here's the question for the world. when hamas is defeated, what happens next? that's when i want the arab world, the united states, and the western world to come in with a governing plan different than we have today for the palestinian people. i want to come no for a better life for the palestinian people, after you destroy hamas. >> a couple things there. one is, you said you've lost confidence now in secretary austin? >> total. >> but you've been a supporter? >> well, i like secretary austin, but this war has shown to me, if we were attacked like this, which we were on 9/11, if somebody called for us within two months to have a cease-fire against al qaeda, we would have laughed them out of town, we would have run them out of town. secretary austin is telling israel things that are impossible to achieve. secretary austin, the reason palestinians are dying, gaza is so condensed, hamas has tunnels under apartments, under schools, under hospitals. if you've got a better idea of how to destroy hamas, pass it on! quit criticizing israel in public. >> i want to move on, but just to quickly follow up, you well know that general stanley mcchrystal ain another war has called i think what secretary austin was referring to insurgent math. each innocent person that is killed ultimately creates new insurgents. you agree with that? >> i get the theory. but i would say that the population has been radicalized for decades. do you not get that? do you know what they teach in the schools? the idea that somehow we're -- israel is radicalizing the people in gaza is ridiculous. they've been radicalized by hamas for years. >> okay, senator, i want to talk about what you and the congress will do. as you well know, there's a big tug-of-war over foreign aid to israel and ukraine. you and your fellow republicans want to include border security and new immigration restrictions. you haven't been able to make a deal yet. would you still vote for that foreign aid if immigration is not includeincluded? >> no. i think their votes for israel apart from the package. republicans overwhelmingly support israel, so do most democrats. republicans are divided on ukraine. republicans are 100% behind strong border security. if you want aid to ukraine, we need to control our southern border. we're having, dana, # 9,000 peo a day come through the last week. you have to change your asylum laws and parole laws to stop the flow. i will not vote for any aid until we secure our own border. reform asylum, reform parole. it's possible to do. democrats don't want to do it, all republicans want to do it. i'm in the helping ukraine until we help ourselves. >> senator, you said this week that texas governor greg abbott should send migrants to states like rhode island and oregon and connecticut where democratic senators oppose this new stricter asylum provision that you want. have you heard back from governor abbott? >> no, i'm going to go visit. here's the problem. you have 11 democratic senators signing a letter resisting changing the laws that attract so many illegal immigrants. 6 million people were encountered in 2023. texas has been overrun. the democratic position is remain in texas. i'm telling governor abbott, why don't you send thousands of these illegal immigrants to the states where senators wrote the letters, rhode island, massachusetts, connecticut, oregon, and let them understand what it's like to live with a broken border. the towns along the border in texas are basically being sold. 6 million people have come into our country illegally in fy23 with no end in sight. >> and what do you say to those who say these are humans and they're not pawns on a chess board and moving them to different states may not be the most humane move if you want to make a political point. >> yeah, well, it is inhumane to live in massachusetts, connecticut, rhode island? it's about making it real to people who refuse to fix the problem. i've been involved in immigration reform for decades. this is a national security problem. this is not about fixing a broken immigration system. it's about fixing a broken border. to my democratic colleagues, if you don't understand what it's like from illegal immigration overwhelming effect on your communities, you need to experience. look at what happened in new york. the governor and mayor of new york are begging for help. so to my democratic colleagues who want texas to bear this burden, forget it. they should be sending them to you. it's not inhumane to live in connecticut. >> let's talk about the 2024 campaign trail. donald trump called obamacare a disaster last night in iowa after reiterating his calls to repeal it. you, sk on voted to appeal obamacare when trump was president. do you think that this is a winning issue right now? would you like to see at vote again? >> here's what -- good question. this is what we try to do when trump was president. let's block the money. the money that we have in washington to minister obamacare is controlled by democrats you'll never meet. let's take that money, send it back to the states, make sure it's spent on health care and see if -- >> so you're okay with -- >> yeah, i'm okay -- i would like to get the money power out of washington and back to the states. i think we should block grant it back to the states and let bureaucrats in washington run our health care. socialized medicine doesn't work. get the money and power of washington and get it in the hands of the people closest to the patient. >> senator, before i let you go, i want to ask you about your fellow republican former congress wang liz cheney. she has a new book out, we sat down for an interview this week and she said she's worried that the chance of a second trump presidency means the u.s. is, quote, sleepwalking into a dictatorship. you, of course, have endorsed donald trump. what's your reaction? >> yeah, yeah. i think a continuation of the biden presidency would be a disaster for peace and prosperity at home and abroad. our border is broken. the only person really going to fix a broken border is donald trump. when he was president, none of this stuff was going on in ukraine, you know, hamas and all of these other terrorist groups were afraid of trump. i think liz's hatred of trump is real. i understand why people don't like what he does and says at times, but in terms of actions and results, he was far better president for biden and if we have four more years of this, liz cheney, then we won't recognize america and the world will be truly on fire. >> senator lindsey graham, thank you so much for joining me this morning. i appreciate it. >> thank you. and less than a year until election day and progressives have a warning for president biden. the quhchairwoman of the progressive caucus, pramila jayapal is here. and again, it's just six weeks until iowa and a lot of action there this weekend. we'll talk about that, coming up. welcome back to state of the union. with the collapse of the temporary truce between israel and hamas, here in the u.s., democratic divisions over the direction of the war and support before israel are once again on full display. here with me now is house progressive caucus chairwoman, pramila jayapal. thank you for coming. it's nice to see you in person. let's start with where we are right now with the war. the white house says very clearly that hamas is to blame for the collapse of this temporary truce for a few reasons. one is that they refuse to release the remaining women, some of whom, sounds like, most of whom are 20 to 30-year-old woman. they're hostage inside gaza. they also renewed the military attacks against israel. you have repeatedly called for israel to implement and indefinite cease-fire, but given what we have just seen with what i just described, is that realistic? >> well, it's what has to happen. and i do think it's realistic. i think what we saw is after, you know, many weeks of saying we couldn't get to a cease-fire, that was not going to happen, we did have a temporary cease-fire. and what happened? we were able to see a significant number of hostages released. we were able to get humanitarian aid into gaza. and i think the long-term plan for what happens is incredibly important. now you've seen vice president harris made a very strong statement yesterday, defense secretary lloyd austin also was very clear that if you engage in urban warfare in the way that israel did in northern gaza, what you will do is perhaps win a temporary victory or reprieve, but you're not going to win the long-term strategic war. so the only way, dana, to get through this is to make sure that we, first of all, do not have the kinds of casualties that we saw in northern gaza. there's no way to do that with the kind of war that israel is waging right now, on gaza. >> a couple of things, one is, you said it worked. yes, there were hostages who were released, but it wasn't even an actual hard cease-fire. they were just right to get another day and hamas wouldn't comply. so what makes you think that hamas would comply with the longer term cease-fire? >> well, i think this is all about negotiation. qatar has been incredibly helpful here. it's not clear to me from the reporting who was to blame for -- >> you don't believe the u.s. -- the biden administration, that hamas -- >> well, i just think it's very complicated. >> young women. >> i think it's very, very complicated. it's not -- we don't have all the information in front of us. we obviously can, you know, can rely on some statements that are made, but i think that in these negotiations, everybody wants something. and i think qatar has said that hamas is still at the table. israel should still be at the table. in fact, some of the hostages -- the israeli hostages are saying that israel should still be at table. this is a complex negotiation and it doesn't happen unless both sides are willing to come to some kind of an agreement. that's how we got the first seven days. >> that's a really important point about both sides being willing to come to an agreement, because regardless of what has happened last week, and let's just say there is a more permanent cease-fire, you are hearing from hamas leaders over and over again that the brutal massacre of the 1,200 israeli civilians was just the beginning, just a rehearsal. and that they want to continue to do it over and over again. so a cease-fire would keep that brutal terrorist regime in place in gaza. >> i don't think that's true. i think that what is true is that hamas needs to be taken out. it is a terrorist organization. >> how would you do that? >> but i think the way to do that, as many terrorism experts have said, is to create a durable and strong coalition of allies within the middle east, with the united states, with israel, to make sure that we have a long-term political solution, that there is an alternative to hamas to lead in gaza, and to establish a state for palestinians. this is -- i mean, we cannot -- we have to condemn what hamas did on october 7th. we cannot allow for 15,000 palestinians to date to have been killed. three quarters of whom are women and children, and say that that is going to help us in the long-term. morally, dana, morally, but also, strategically, for israel, the only way through this is to create a situation where there is a political solution that involves a palestinian state and an israeli state. >> i think ideally, what you're talking about could make sense. it's just unclear how you get from here to there. who's going to get rid of hamas if -- i mean, if -- if there's no continued war and i think what you're relying on is the pressure from arab states, and they haven't been willing to do that. >> well, part of the reason they haven't been willing to do that is because we have been allowing israel to really indiscriminately bomb hospitals, violate international humanitarian law sand so we are creating -- >> okay, pre-october 7th -- can i ask you one more thing. you have seen the information and intelligence that hamas have used their own civilians. the death of civilians are, it's horrendous, but hamas has used its own civilians as human shields. those hospitals and so forth are places where hamas keeps weapons and keeps its hamas leadership, that they have their headquarters there. >> dana, international humanitarian law says that you cannot attack a hospital unless there is some circumstances, if rockets are fired from that hospital, that is one thing. but hospitals are protected. we have had refugee camps that are bombed. right now, there are -- the only pediatric hospital in gaza is not operating. if we want to defeat terrorists, we have to abide by international humanitarian law. that is just my fundamental belief. and that at the end of the day, what we need is a lasting coalition. that is not going to be formed if israel continues to do what they are doing. and the united states cannot be backers of this kind of indiscriminate bombing. that is my firm belief. we should have conditions on military aid, in the same way that we do for every other country. >> i want to ask you about sexual violence and the -- it's kind of remarkable that this issue hasn't gotten enough attention, globally. widespread use of rape, brutal rape, sexual violence against israeli women by hamas. i've seen a lot of progressive wo women, generally speaking, they're quick to defend women's rights and to speak out against using rape as a women of war. but downright silent on what we saw on october 7th. and what might be happening inside gaza right now to these hostages. why is that? >> i don't know if that's true. we always talk about the impact of war on women in particular. in fact, i remember 20 years ago, i did a petition around the war in iraq. >> have you talked about it since october 7th? >> absolutely. and i've condemned what hamas has done. >> specifically against women? >> absolutely. the rape, the -- of course. but i think we have to remember israel is a democracy. that is why they're a strong ally of ours. and if they do not comply with international humanitarian law, they are bringing themselves to a place that makes it much more difficult strategically for them to be able to build allies, to keep public opinion with them, and morally, we cannot say that one war crime deserves another. that is not what international humanitarian law says. with respect, i was just asking about the women and you turned it back to israel. i'm asking you about hamas, in fact -- >> i already answered your question, dana. i said it's horrific and i think that rape is horrific, sexual assault is horrific. i think that it happens in war situations. terrorist organizations like hamas obviously are using these as tools. however, i think we have to be balanced about bringing in the outr outrages against palestinians. 15,000 palestinians have been killed in israeli air strikes, three quarters of whom are women and children. >> and it's horrible, but you don't see israeli soldiers raping palestinian women. >> well, dana, i think we're not -- i don't want this to be the hierarchies of ooppressions. >> it shouldn't be. >> i think 15,000 people have been killed. and 2.2 million palestinians live in 140 square-mile area, which is about the size of las vegas with a population that is four times that of las vegas, and 1.8 million palestinians right now are displaced. they are living in shelters. they are being told to move to south gaza, then south gaza is being bombed. they're being told to move to north gaza. there are no homes left. the vast majority of infrastructure has been destroyed. this is not the way that we are going to beat terrorism, whether it's hamas or future iteration of hamas. >> on that note, i want to talk about what this means domestically more president biden. you've warned that the way that the biden administration, the president himself, is handling this war, jeopardizes his support among progressives and muslim american voters. and that they could actually stay home. do you think that that is -- how big of a threat, political threat is that to president biden? in particular, when it's possible, at this point, probable, that donald trump would be his opponent? and he's not exactly warm when it comes to muslims. >> that's an understatement. look, i am a supporter of president biden. i have been out there for the president. and i will continue to be, even though i think that the way that this -- the handle of this war started was unfortunately such that it has alienated huge communities. we have to be realistic about that and do work right now to address that, not just with outreach here, but actually looking at the situation in the middle east and recognizing that palestinians deserve the same respect, innocent palestinians deserve the same respect as innocent israelis. and we've got to talk about that. we've got to get to that long-term solution. and at the end of the day, the united states has its reputation to think about globally and if we alienate all of our allies in the middle east, that is not going to help us ensure that president biden wins domestically at home. >> before i let you go, i have to ask you about immigration. you just heard lindsey graham saying that he's not going to support any aid to israel or ukraine without what republicans want, which is not just border security, but chapgs to the asylum laws and so forth. how is that going to get resolved? >> i don't know other than the republicans will be have been called out by putting a bill on the floor that includes that aid, but does not include decimating the asylum system, does not include going back to trump. e era, what are called safe countries. we called it the trump transit ban, without decimating parole. they are holding aid for israel and ukraine hostage to changes to the asylum system that would destroy the asylum system. i think we need to put our foot down and say, no. vote on the aid package without those border policy changes. and recognize that some of the things that the biden administration have been doing have really been working. like the parole system, which has dramatically reduced the numbers of people from the four countries that have just recently been granted parole to -- by 90%. that is the kind of thing establishing legal pathways is exactly the kind of thing that will address the border. putting more money into asylum officers, into judges, those are all things that the biden administration has asked for in its supplemental funding, that republicans are saying, no, we don't want to do. this is not about addressing the border. this is about destroying the immigration system, something they have not opibeen able to d through regular order. that's just stroutrageous. we should say "no" and force them to vote against this critical aid if that's where they want to be. >> this is going to be coming to a head very soon. >> thank you so much. >> thank you, dana. >> thank you. are we missing one of the biggest reasons republican voters may be drawn to nikki haley? we'll talk about that with my panel, next. but joe biden is not the defender of american democracy. joe biden is the destroyer of american democracy. if joe biden wants to make this race a question of which candidate will defend our democracy and protect our freedoms, i say to crooked joe, and he is crooked, the most corrupt president we've ever had, we will win that fight and we're going to win it very big. very big. welcome back to "state of the union". my panel joins me now. alyssa, this is probably one of the most surprising thing you've seen donald trump do, right? i don't want to call it evil genius, but it's so classic. he has something wrong with him, a negative and he says, no, it's the other guy. >> and tries to flip it on its head and you hear the audience eat it up. it's kind of remarkable. i've been watching the clips from trump's visit to iowa. i'm stunned having spent a lot of time with him in 2020 and years before, he is slowing down. there's a lack of sharpness in what he's saying and a lack of clarity. there's clip where he basically says he's going to overturn obamacare, but also says that he'll fix it. complete inconsistencies. and for republicans, our strongest case against joe biden is the age and decline and if i'm being honest, head-to-head, i wouldn't say which is struggling more. >> if i'm the biden campaign, i would say, bring it on. bringing the fight to a place that is good for joe biden, about who's protecting your freedoms, your rights. i think one thing that trump doesn't seem to understand is, he also spent a lot of time about tearing down obamacare. that falls under the banner of taking away people's rights and freedoms. i don't think he understands that that's the way voters see it. they see it as him trying to take away a right that he's had over a decade. >> and republicans also tried over 60 times to do it, and every time it failed, because the american people overwhelmingly support obamacare and want access to more affordable health care. i sometimes wonder if trump knows the definition of democracy, because he might be getting it confused with another "d" word, mean dictator. because if he actually -- i agree -- he does the bait and switch, let me say i'm one thing and blame it on the other person, but to kate's point, if he wants to make this about democracy, it's going to backfire in his face. there will be not just campaign ads run against him, he will be in trial about right to overturn our democracy circa january 6th. so this is good for the biden campaign in the long-term. >> this is not what the campaign should be about. this is the anecdotal one-off. the campaign is going to be -- if trump has his way, if he's the nominee, it will be about joe biden's weak and the economy was better when i was president. it's going to be that simple and postcard-sized. he'll have a lack of discipline and throw things like this every once in a while, but that's not what the campaign will be about. >> i'm not sure that i agree with that. >> i think it's what we want the campaign to be about, utterly undisciplined. >> we need to slow our roll a little bit, because there hasn't been any votes taken on the republican side. and on that, yesterday, ron desantis completed the full grassley and for the uninitiated, that means that he visited all 99 counties in iowa. but his campaign is -- well, his numbers are falling, but the super pac that his campaign has relied really heavily on to do a lot of the leg work and a lot of the tough work, it's in turmoil. another leader in the super pac has left. >> this is a classic case of -- a good example of his campaign in general. like, they have a big news day for the iowa caucus, complete every county thing, and the staff becomes the story. s this it is a rule in professional campaigning, never become the story when you're the staff. but in ron desantis' world, from the very beginning of his campaign for governor for the first time, the staff always ends up being a story. because when things don't go well, ron desantis blames his staff, and his staff is always infighting. this has his campaign in a microcosm. and he was head by 11 points last february. he's behind by a cab ride right now. it has been a terribly run campaign. they still have time to get it together, but execution wise, there's been very little done right. >> and the desantis folks will tell you, they expect to overperform in iowa. they think that they're going to outperform where the polls have had them. i actually think that that is true, except the problem is, he's in fourth place in new hampshire, even lower in south carolina. the game plan, even if he pulls off a miracle in iowa, it's looking like a thinner and thinner. >> but things change in iowa. iowa picks the final two republicans. so overperforming in iowa will have down-stream consequence ifs he does it. >> but the stakes are higher for him in iowa than anyone. he's said he expects to win, and the narrative has built up over the last six months that iowa is the last gasp for him. unless he dramatically overperforms, he's not going to have a lot of momentum coming out of iowa into new hampshire where he's struggling. >> we've got to talk about the republican candidate, not trump, who is doing well and doing better. and of course, that's nikki haley. there was a story and a quote that really caught our attention about whether nikki haley is not getting enough attention herself, because she's a woman. this is a quote that i want to read from lauren leader, ceo and cofounder of all in together, which is a non-partisan, non-profit group. the mission is to engage women in politics. in any other world where you could potentially have the first republican woman nominee in history, this should actually be garnering out-sized coverage. >> and a woman of color. >> i would agree, women in politics have a steeper hill to climb. we had our first black president, but never a woman president. there is a reason because of that. when hillary clinton was running for president, the coverage that she got was overwhelmingly negative. it was, she was too cold, she was -- she was not likable, right? the term likable. nikki haley, some would argue, might get the different coverage, but if it helps her, oftentimes the media doesn't cover her. now, kamala harris, he is a history maker also, and we see this type of coverage. all three of these women are imperfect as every one is. it's not just the same or fair. >> and nikki haley is the most underestimated politician. she leans into that. she's tended to perform best in the debates and afterwards, she got this huge boost from thethe koch network, which means money and ground game. that will help her rise her numbers in iowa. she's not banking purely in iowa. new hampshire expects big things. if governor sununu ends up throwing his wait behind her, that could be a tipping point. everybody, stick around bech more to talk about. the house speaker believes he'll have the votes to launch a biden impeachment inquiry. we'll talk about that, next. you want me to say that i lost, that i'm humiliated? fine. so i'm no longer congressman santos. i'm just regular old professor major general reverend astronaut santos. protector of the realm. princess of genovia. >> that, of course, was "saturday night live" last night. what was with the cape? i don't remember him wearing a cape. but you know, it works. it works. welcome back. we are back with our panel, obviously. and the question is, jokes aside, what do we think the fact that santos was expelled and mike johnson, right beforehand, made a pretty rare move, because the speaker usually doesn't vote, to vote against expulsion and got the rest of the leadership to do it, and he was still expelled? >> to be a republican speaker, you are running a stable of wild horses. and you have to let the horses run some. you don't get to dictate everything they do. and i think mike johnson understands that. he knows that his big fight with the right flank of his party will be over budgetary means. he knows his moderate -- he's going to fight with moderates over budgetary things. a lot of these things like the expulsion vote on george santos, he'll let the will of the conference dictate what happens. >> do you think it shows how much the speakership has been diminished? under john boehner, i'm, george santos would have resigned. he would have known there was not an option to stay in congress and walked out the door, but it's after the kevin mccarthy, 15 votes, and now being the fourth choice for speaker, he doesn't pack the same power. the real test is going to be able, are you able to get through ukraine aid, are you able to fund the government? >> talk about the stable of wild horses, one other way that he's trying to let them run a little bit more is on the question of impeaching your former boss. i want you to listen to what he -- speaker johnson said on fox about this. >> a formal impeachment inquiry vote on the floor will allow us to take it to the next necessary step. and i think it's something we have to do at this juncture. >> do you have the votes to actually formally start an impeachment process? >> yeah, i believe we will. >> well, if he's going to let them run, i think this is not going to work out the way he wants to work out. you have republicans in biden districts who have said, this doesn't make any sense, this isn't what my constituents want, this isn't focusing on their needs. so if he's going to make this a test of their leadership, we'll see how little power there is behind the throne. i think it's a strategic mistake for republicans. >> it's an inquiry, though. >> but it takes up time and headlines. at the end of the day, people want their members of congress to be doing things to make their lives better. they are not interested in a political witch hunt, essentially, to borrow from donald trump. and i think -- and i think that shows. we've seen that frankly on both sides of the aisle. >> that's what we said when they impeached donald trump. here we are again. >> but if donald trump is the nominee, this is exactly what donald trump wants. it does feed his 35% of the base. it doesn't feed those independent voters who are saying, move on. impeachment is not a very popular thing against joe biden. they did a whole inquiry and it fell flat on their face. i think if the republicans do it again, this will backfire and it's donald trump 2.0. like a campaign -- mike johnson is running a shadow campaign >> it is dead on arrival in the senate. >> but it is also, there is a slim house republican majority. there is a boost to the d triple c. if you're mike lawler, you're talking about losing in districts. but it is what donald trump wants and what they're going to do. >> what do you think about that? >> some republicans will vote against it. and it is an inquiry. this would mean that every future president has an impeachment inquiry. and here we are. >> will it hurt some republicans. >> some get distance from other republicans that way. this will be something that will not determine the election, once again. it is about the economy. >> that and of itself does a hyperpartisan -- just because we impeach donald trump doesn't mean that republicans will in turn impeach joe biden. that is the kind of -- >> that is wasting votes on constituents. >> and this not just about scoring points. >> and keeping the government open, because that is going to come back -- >> well we have found an issue that animates people. thank you very much. we appreciate it. don't go anywhere. we'll be right back. on july 15th, 1976, in chowchilla, california, a school bus carrying 26 children disappeared. who could be responsible and why? cnn films presents the most unbelievable crime story you've never heard. chowchilla premieres tonight at 9:00 on cnn. thank you for spending your sundayay morning w with us. fareed zakakaria picks it t up .