good evening, everyone, i'm erin burnett live tonight from rwanda where i spent the day with former president bill clinton. we talked about a lot of things. he spent some time visiting some projects. some farms and some factories where he had spent a lot of time over the past few years. with the likes, in fact, of nascar famous driver jeff gordon. also i saw the president at a soy factory he's bringing in the countryside. he arrived with his daughter chelsea. shaking everybody's hand and taking pictures with everybody who asked. and he asked a lot of questions himself. >> whenever i hear somebody say oh, these small farmers, they're just inefficient, they can't generate income, i just decided to see if that was not necessarily true. and so we get 'em cheaper and better seed and fertilizer, get their crops to market so they don't lose half their income taking it to market. >> reporter: the president told me that he blew it here. nearly 1 million people died in a horrific genocide in just three months while bill clinton was president of the united states. the blame ill haunts him and so he comes back again and again and again. tonight, you're going to hear him talk about mitt romney, barack obama and the women in his life. but we begin with the threat of al qaeda right now. and the reason that the president loves africa so much. >> first of all, i like it here. and i think it's important that the rest of the world know, especially america. that it's a continent, not a country. and that with all the troubles in various african countries, 6 of the 10 fastest growing economies in the world in the last decade were here. the growth opportunity act which i believe is about to be ek extended by congress leads to jobs here. >> a lot people have this image of africa -- horrible images of a child with a distended belly or children with flies in their eyes. the horrible pictures people are used to seeing. the last thing americans expect to hear is africa is sort of the farm fertity capital of the planet which it's become, right? >> yes. if you look atrwanda, first time i came here, four years after the genocide, the per capita income was less than one dollar a day. today, it's five times what it was. they've averaged 8% growth. and they have good roads. they have good farms. >> the president has created a lot of growth. the statistics you talked about. supposedly this will be his last term. do you think that this country will be weaker without a leader like he is, even if he is more author tarrian leader? >> depends on who succeeds him. depends on whether they forgot what brought them this far. there are countries with incomes 10, 20 ties rwanda's, where the streets aren't as clean. >> the streets are incredibly clean here. >> roads aren't as good and where they're just so focused on future, so focused on developing the skills and abilities both women and men. this is the first country in the world to have the majority of its parliament female. when i came here, first on my -- doing my aids work in 2002, already half the governors in rwanda were women. and they had villages where they'd give you land if you agreed to live next door to someone of the other ethnic group. saw two women holding hands. one of them had lost a husband and a brother. the other one had a husband in prison, awaiting war crimes indictment, which means he was a major orderer of the killing, the genocide. they were holding hands. they were neighbors. >> when you were president, nearly 1 million people were slaughtered. a personal failure of your. do you think with all the contributions you made, things like this plant, that you have on some level sort of -- >> i don't know but i -- i remember the first time i came here to start the aids project, a reporter was riding in a cab. he asked this cab driver if he didn't resent my being here because the u.s. didn't come into the area until after the killing had been stopped to take care of the refugeeings. and he said no, i don't. because he didn't make us kill each other. that whole thing. take responsibility. and he said he's the only one how said he was sorry. nobody else has apologized to us. at the time, we were worried about getting into bosnia. we had the reaction from blackhawk down in somalia. and it was over in 90 days. we just blew it. i think had we sent 10,000 trues here and got a few more people to come, we might have been able to save one-third of the people who died. you can see what a rural country it is. >> yes. >> and most of the people who died were killed with machetes. so i don't think we could have ended the violence. but i think we could have cut it down. and i regret it. all i can do is try to help them come back. but it's very interesting. the rwandas aren't interested one way or the other about whether i'm atoning. they want to know what we're going to do now. they have this future focus that we need in america. and we need everywhere. i mean, they have young girls -- their vaccination rate against cervical cancer, against the hpv virus, is 93%. >> it's not that high in the united states. >> it's 26%. i mean, they just get the show on the road. that's what they're interested in. and it's quite stunning. >> you talk about the tough decision you regret on intervention. you look around africa right now. you see what's happening up in mali. al qaeda is rising in part because of the instability in libya and u.s. involvement in libya that allowed some of the weapons to come over the border and some people are saying it could be the next afghanistan. >> could be. i hope not. i mean, you know, mali has quite a hold on the imagination of people who understand africa. and when i saw that destruction, religious political violence in timbuktu, it was very sad to me. but there are always unintended consequences to events that upset the established order. and what happened in libya i think will probably work out to be positive for the libyans. and eventually in all probability, mali's probably not a big enough base for permanent destruction. but a lot of people could get hurt in the meanwhile. and we just have to try to help the africans to resolve this as quickly as possible. >> i mean, there's been reports of afghan fighters, pakistani camps. obviously it's very difficult to tell what's happening in mali. >> whole group of people now associated roughly with al qaeda who have never made a living any other way. so they -- they're basically itinerant fighters. they go where they can make a living and fight and pretend it's some sort of religious struggle, which is isn't. and so i think it's the leave of the instability. we have to be prepared for it. but it's almost like herding cats, you know, because it's such a decentralized operation. >> a sales tip for barack obama from president bill clinton. that coming up next. plus, these baby gorillas. they love having fun. they're insanely amazing to watch. but their lives are in danger tonight. 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[ heart rate increases ] woman #2: but i don't even live near the water. what you don't know about flood insurance may shock you -- including the fact that a preferred risk policy starts as low as $129 a year. for an agent, call the number that appears on your screen. our second story "outfront," i asked former president bill clinton about the election. we talked a whole lot about tt romney. that's coming up. it sounds a little bit like he's on the campaign trail himself here. >> i think there's an enormous case for president. for example, this economic crisis which he inherited didn't bottom out till the middle of 2009. then they passed the bills. they didn't take full effect till 2010. 2010, 2011, 30 months. we had 4.5 million jobs. is that enough for a full recovery? no. but governor romney recommends that we go back to the bush economic policies. more tax cuts for upper income people. and less regulation. which is what got us in trouble in the first place. now, in the seven years and eight months before the financial crash, under the previous administration, we had 2.6 million private sector jobs. so obama's last 2 1/2 years have produced 40% more jobs than the 7 years and 8 months of the previous administration before the meltdown. >> it's interesting though when you talk about it like this. and you give the example of how many jobs president obama's created compared to president bush. he doesn't talk about it like that. it's not nearly as clear. a lot of what he talks about is more about fairness. it has created the perception among some voters and independent voters that there's a class warfare sort of ageagenda. what could he do to shift it so that's not what people hear coming out of his mouth? >> first of all, i don't think -- when he talks about fairness, he means that if we have prosperity it ought to be broadly shared. but he hasn't done anything to hurt upper income people. so i don't buy the class warfare thing. >> you're saying it's rhetoric? >> it's more perception than reality. warren buffett once said we had a class warfare and my class won. americans don't resent success. we're a society about aspiration. and reward for work. we don't care how many millionaire, and billionaires there are. as long as the middle class people can support his or her family. and believe that they'll be rewarded for work. and as long as poor people who work have a chance to become middle class people. >> michael was a speechwriter for the former president. joins me tonight. along with john avalon from the daily beast. john avlon, why is it we haven't heard the current president of the united states come out with such clarity and precision in laying out the difference between himself and his competitor? >> look, i think in many respects, bill clinton is the great communicator. he's got this ability to make an economic argument that really resonates with main-street middle class voters. and that's something that president obama has struggled with. really distilling economic ideas in the way that resonates beyond the democratic base to the key constituencies. that's what bill clinton is the master of. even off the cuff. >> michael waldman, then when he went on to say, look, what i want is more prosperity, distributed more fairly, so we hear that from president barack obama a lot. then president bill clinton says that americans like millionaires and they like billionaires and they don't have any problem with them. they just want to be able to become them. how come we don't have that sort of rhetoric from barack obama? >> well, this is geographic proof it's not because he has speechwriters. president clinton is very distinct in being able to make arguments about policy in values terms. when he talks about economics, yes, he usings the statistics and he uses the facts, but he roots it in a kind of core sense of opportunity for all and responsibility from all. as he said when he ran for president. president obama has been brilliant as a communicator in many ways about larger american themes. about the country's history. about his own history. but has often fallen flat when he comes to these policy things. so, you know, we all can learn from bill clinton on that. >> i'm just curious, because it's interesting, we're going to hear bill clinton later on in the hour talk about mitt romney. there's some really good in there, there's also some really bad for mitt romney. what can -- how effective is bill clinton now, campaigning for president barack obama? he says he's in camp. then he says good things about mitt romney. how effective is he? >> he's his own man. i think that can be a liability for the president. for example, i just want to reinforce michael's point. he's his own man so he gave the story about how obama created more be j jobs than bush. obama was dealing with a much bigger jobs hole than bush was. for example, reagan and the reagan recovery after that massive recession. the job growth was much, much faster. the thing is, bill clinton is such an artful communicator that he's able to take an idea that's frankly pretty silly when you take it outside of that real context of how big was that initial jobs hole and make it sound very clever and sensible. another thing we need to remember is that in 2008 when barack obama was runninggainst hillary clinton, he was very pointed in saying that, hey, ronald reagan was a very consequential president. help was trying to separate and distance himself from clinton democrats. that's a wedge i think republicans are trying to use. and they're not always successfully using it. but it's certainly something they're trying to use and they should try to use because there's a difference between obama democrats and clinton democrats. >> right. there sure is. you keep hearing it in this rhetoric. final question to you, michael. one thing the president said today, i never heard him say before, was he thought with a mere 10,000 american troops he would have saved 300,000 lives in this country. people were massacred and hacked to death with machetes. horrific genocide. how much does that haunt him? you know him personally. >> i think he thinks about it a lot. i think it is one of the things he's written about, about his own presidency. and certainly in his post-presidency. he's focused so much effort on places like africa. on bringing them forward in terms of economic development. but i think it's also the case that if you look at the evolution and maturation of his military and foreign policy in his second term, something like kosovo, where the united states intervened to stop a genocide before it happened. to stop ethnic cleansing. was the kind of thing that he became quite skilled at and it's something that america -- that our country has had an important role to play in doing throughout the years. >> all right. well, thanks very much to michael. john, appreciate you taking the time. the real hotel rwanda was once a besieged safe haven for rwandas who were fleeing. plus, why bill clinton likes the mormon church. this is rwanda's genocide memorial center. there's big news. presenting androgel 1.62%. both are used to treat men with low testosterone. androgel 1.62% is from the makers of the number one prescribed testosterone replacement therapy. it raises your testosterone levels, and... is concentrated, so you could use less gel. and with androgel 1.62%, you can save on your monthly prescription. 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this is big news. what are you waiting for? with two times the points onake lunch dining in restaurants,ch? you may find yourself asking why not, a lot. chase sapphire preferred. there's more to enjoy. mine was earned off vietnam in 1968. over the south pacific in 1943. i got mine in iraq, 2003. usaa auto insurance is often handed down from generation to generation. because it offers a superior level of protection, and because usaa's commitment to serve the military, veterans and their families is without equal. begin your legacy, get an auto insurance quote. usaa. we know what it means to serve. this is rwanda's genocide memorial center. these are some of the mass graves for the million people who were slaughtered here in 1994. there have been 2 million jen sipd cases tried in court with 37,000 convictions. we stayed last night at the hotel known to america as the real hotel rwanda. in the movie depiction, the hotel manager, played by don cheadle, tried to save tootsies who sought refuge from hutsi slaughter. the hotel, which was looted, just finished a major renovation. and, frankly, the whole country feels clean and new. there are no plastic bag, allowed. there's no trash in the villages. every citizen is required to clean up. a sort of national adopt a highway program. the country feels industrious. which brings me to tonight's number. 26%. that's how many businesses in rwanda are run by women it like lucille who sells potatoes. her hard work is one of the reasons why rwanda is one of the fastest growing economies in the world. another reason is the regime of president paul gagandi. there have been costs to his leadership and he'll be my guest tomorrow on "outfront." baby gorillas are a lot more human than you could even imagine but they are at risk tonight because of a war in the neighboring democratic republic of the congo. a special report. and president clinton on mitt's taxes. >> whatever it is, it couldn't be as bad as not doing it. well hello, welcome to hotels.com. summer road trip, huh? 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>> i have no idea. but whatever it is, it couldn't be abad as not doing it. i mean, you know, in his first tax return, the one year he did release, all of his income was taxed at 15% capital gain. but he can honestly say he wasn't drawing a salary. all of his income was investment income. that was the law. whether people like it or not, that was the law. he also gave away 16% of his inco. and presumably most of it to the mormon church. but it didn't hurt -- i mean, i think, you know, with everyone else being so much more forthcoming, it raises the question of whether he thinks it should be a different set of rules for him than everybody else and that's a problem for him. but i don't know enough about it. he's obviously concluded the damage he's taking from not doing it. >> giving money to the mormon church, it was about 51%. for the estimated numbers, about 80% for the mormon church. presuably people already know that and are all right with that. >> i think that's commendable. they do -- they do a lot of good work around the world. you know, hawaii, for example, is the only state in america that has totally equal public school funding. but they only have about two-thirds to 70% of their kids in public schools. because before hawaii was a state, the mormons and others, but primarily mormon, came there and set up these schools. i remember when i was president, i helped secure the release of some mormon missionaries who were in peru and had been apprehended and imprisoned by a radical group. so i just can't figure out why he doesn't do it. i think it's a mistake. he ought to do it. >> just deluge the press with all 50,000 pages or whatever it might be. >> that's what i think. >> should anything be off the table when you run for president? i guess that's the question. he said, i'm going to draw the privacy line here. do you think there's anything to that? or in this day and age, everything, whatever it might be, that you just have to accept that and put it in the public eye? >> i think that the press now, much more than in the '80s and '90s, is somewhat more sensitive to the purely personal aspects of a person's life. but things that relate to your business activities or your public activities, governor romney's case, his governorship of massachusetts, the olympics and bain capital and the taxes that are heavily related to all that, i don't think you could say you think they should be off the table. if the law doesn't require you to disclose something, you can gut it out. he's defended the work that he' done. he's talked about his pride in the olympics. he's had to explain the law he signed. it's hard to -- again, may change a little bit from election to election. when it's thingses that are right at the core of what your public philosophy is, think that's always going to be relevant. >> you talked about him being qualified. certainly he is when you look at his background. you're not going to vote for him obviously, right? >> no, i'm not going to vote for him. >> okay, just making sure. some people had indicated he might think that way at certain moments so it was important to ask. "outfront" next, the woman who was with bill clinton today. and she asked just as many questions as he did. plus, teenage silverback gorillas. they're playful hey, they're teenagers. now they are fighting an even bigger battle. they're in the middle of a civil war. sarah... will you marry me? i think we should see other people. in fact, i'm already seeing your best friend, justin. ♪ i would've appreciated a proactive update on the status of our relationship. who do you think i am, tim? quicken loans? at quicken loans, we provide you with proactive updates on the status of your home loan. and our innovative online tools ensure that you're always in the loop. one more way quicken loans is engineered to amaze. ♪ i want to go ♪ i want to win [ breathes deeply ] ♪ this is where the dream begins ♪ ♪ i want to grow ♪ i want to try ♪ i can almost touch the sky [ male announcer ] even the planet has an olympic dream. dow is proud to support that dream by helping provide greener, more sustainable solutions from the olympic village to the stadium. solutionism. the new optimism.™ ♪ this dream is non-stop to seattle? just carry preparation hotables. discreet, little tubes packed with big relief. from the brand doctors recommend most by name. preparation h totables. the anywhere preparation h. trouble with a car insurance claim. 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know it's an awkward question because people's lives are at stake too. >> i think the two things can be put in one basket as it were. the chief warden has been working for some 20 years protecting these gorillas. he says if you protect the gorillas, you protect the people. there's many people living on the outskirts of the park. the rangers are helping those people to secure their live hi pd. >> some of those pictures, it's unbelievable. it's like you're watching children. certainly they seem to have some sort of soul. what was it like spending time with them? >> it's a great way to spend it. in fact, they have a very deep soul. our cameraman was spending time with one of the older ones at the end. he said, look how deep its eyes are. how the connection is so real. mountain gorillas share more than 98% of our dna. the orphans coming up to us and clamoring all over us. it was really a unique experience. these gorillas are just really special. i think you should take an extra day in rwanda and go see them in the west of the country. >> i would love to do that and i can't wait to see them. thanks so much to david mckenzie. our fifth story "outfront." bill clinton talks about his vices. yes, he still has some. his next act, his wife and his daughter, chelsea, who was actually with him today. everyone else asks you about your health and your regiment. i know it's rather draconian. >> not too bad. >> i mean, no big macs. >> no big macs. >> so what are the vices you have left? i mean, you're a guy, let's be honest, people loved you because of your vices. >> well, once in a while, i break my diet and eat french fries. that's about it. i'm trying to live to be a grandfather. that's my goal. and i've already lived longer than all the men in my family on both sides. till you get to my maternity great grandfather. me lived to be 76. he never got out of overalls. he lived in an old wooden house up -- he basically built up off the ground with a storm cellar that was a hole in the ground to guard against the tornadoes. so i just decided that i would be healthier doing this. >> you allowed to have a glass of wine? >> yeah, i do. that's -- once in a while, i have a glass of wine, but only one. especially on these trips. i'll keel over. just fall asleep. >> you know, it's funny. you talk about your age. my dad's 12 years older than you. well, you know how it is when you get older. mother's not doing as well but my father, he is going strong. and so you could have so much longer. >> i hope i do. >> you've already had this entire life after being a president. you're doing all these things. you look at president taft. he became a supreme court justice. is there a whole nother stage to your life or your ambition that you think sometimes, oh, i'll do this? >> maybe, but i like what i'm doing now. because i can drill down in a way i couldn't when i was president. you know, by figuring out, you got all these small farmers all over the world. and right now they're not producing enough food or enough income to take them or us where we want to go. so i decided i'd come to africa and figure out whether we can raise farm production enough to prove they can make it. >> after talking with the former president about what's next for him, i also asked him about the two women in his life. you're here with chelsea. it's so nice when you get out of the car together. she was asking for questions than you were asking. >> she loves this stuff. she's on -- chelsea's on my board. she's on the foundation board. on the cgi board for the global initiative. and on my health care board. she teaches in public health at columbia. she's interested in all this stuff. >> is it a mazing father/daughter time? a lot of people look at this and they're jealous. >> can't tell you how much fun it is. she knows a lot more about some of this stuff than i do so i'm always learning from her. i'm getting back the investment in her education. she's just filling my brain with things. >> one final question, your wife is -- well, she's gone all the time, you're gone all the time. soon she's going to be home a lot. you're both going to be home a lot. that's a big transition in any marriage. but let me ask you this question. >> yes, she'll be bored with me. >> you have a big vacation or surprise planned for her when she's done this fall? >> well, actually, i haven't made it a surprise. we do get -- we're taking two weeks in august and our family's going out to long island and we're going to bring our relatives in, our friends, and just veg out. when she gets out, i want her to go climb mount kilimanjaro with me. i'm working on that. >> and, john, you know, john avlon's with me. he had a whole list of places. i'm thinking to myself, okay, you want to take hillary clinton here, here and here and she probably just wants to sit on a beach after traveling to 100 countries over the past few years. but of all the things we talked about tonight, i really wanted to get you to weigh in on what he said about mitt romney and his taxes. that he think, he should release a dozen years. >> yeah, you know -- >> what do you think? >> first of all, it's the way he talks about mitt romney and his taxes. when bill clinton talks about policy, he always roots it in values. he does it in a very commonsense, almost offhand way. saying i can't imagine whatever's in there could be worse than the heat he's taking. then it's almost like he thinks there should be one rule for himself and one rule for everyone else. those are value statements. it's just about fairness without using the word "fairness." all throughout this interview, you see the touches he has. the interview's been fascinating to watch, erin. to see just the intellectual curiosity of a former president. his knowledge about agriculture and africa. sincere humanitarian streak. when he does talk about domestic politics, he's always careful to make a rationale point but not take it too far to polarize. making the point about the great work of the mormon church in hawaii. those gestures really make it easy to take a partisan point when he kind of slips it in there. >> yeah, i thought that was a very interesting point. he did go out of his way to give several examples as we were talking about how he liked the mormon church. last but not least, interesting, what he said, so different than barack obama. i wanted to bring it up to you again. he says americans don't resent millionaires and billionaires. they just want to be able to become them. why is it barack obama doesn't feel comfortable speaking in those direct terms? >> it's funny because barack obama does say occasionally, look, i went to a country where everyone can do well. when bill clinton articulates the same point, he does it in this sort of folksy way. look, we celebrate the most successful among us. we want to make sure it's broad. we want to make sure the focus is mobility and opportunity. it goes back to that initial agreement he made. about both sides. that has a way of really resonating. it's not about fairness. it's about responsibility and opportunity. and that goes down particularly well i think. >> certainly does. especially with that 40% of the electorate who are independents that john talkses about. next, a boy whose six brothers were slaughtered in the rwandan genocide. 18 years later, that boy is going for gold at the london olympics. his story is next. last season was the gulf's best tourism season in years. in florida we had more suntans... in alabama we had more beautiful blooms... in mississippi we had more good times... in louisiana we had more fun on the water. last season we broke all kinds of records on the gulf. this year we are out to do even better... and now is a great time to start. our beatches are even more relaxing... the fishing's great. so pick your favorite spot on the gulf... and come on down. brought to you by bp and all of us who call the gulf home. you walk into a conventional mattress store, it's really not about you. they say, "well, if you wanted a firm bed you can lie on one of those. if you want a soft bed you can lie on one of those." what we do is, we provide the exact individualization that your body needs. never tried this before. this is your body there. you can see a little more pressure in the shoulders and in the hips. now you can feel what happens as we raise your sleep number setting and allow the bed to contour to your individual shape. oh wow, that feels really good. it's hugging my body. take it up one notch. oh gosh, yes. when you're playing around with that remote, you get that moment where you go, "oh yeah" ... oh, yeah! and it's perfect. they had no idea that when they came to a sleep number store, we were going to diagnose their problems and help them sleep better. once you experience it, there's no going back. wow. wow. right now, save $500 on our exceptional p6 bed set. and hurry in for the final closeout of our 2011 flexfit adjustable base. only at the sleep number store, where queen mattresses start at just $699. today, we heard a lot about rwandan's olympic dreams. there are four rwandans who are competing. this is one of them. what i'm told his name means is "my friend." he's 25 years old. he's competing in cross country mountain biking. stereotypically you might say, rwandan, well, they're going to be great runners. we saw bike taxis. this was pretty cool. my take about this is if you can do a bike taxi and get through the hills which are everywhere in this country and the potholes which are deep enough to eat a car on some of these roads and you do that on a bike, you should be olympic bound. these guys were amazing. they have a little pad on the back of the bike, you jump on. his family still lives in this house. we drove out to see the house. many people should be alive in that house today who are not alive. adrian was 7 years old during the rwandaen genocide. he had six brothers who were massacred. 60 members of his extended family lost their lives. now adrian's entire village is rooting for him. we were out sort of in the front of the village where the roads were all paved and asked people. everybody knew him or knew of him. his big smile said it all. >> translator: i am proud. when he wins, it makes me proud to be rwandan. >> now, adrian only got his first bike when he was 16 so that was only nine years ago and he's going to the olympics which is a pretty incredible statistic. we're rooting for him. who can't root for that incredible story. his victory will be even more incredible because he's a devout muslim. it's ramadan now. he will fast during the day, not even drinking water. incredible feat for someone competing in the olympics. today we went to see something in rwanda. you see people walking down the dirt streets. the town was called rambania. people running with machetes and killing people. it is impossible to comprehend. at the genocide center in those mass graves we saw, there were 250,000 people who were buried right there. it really is something that was very difficult -- it is impossible to understand but truly touching to have been there. tomorrow, we'll bring you an interview with rwanda's president. he has been credited with the great economic success here. he has been also criticized for something we saw evidence of. his picture up, sort of like a middle eastern leader, not a democratically elected one. he's going to be our guest